Quintessence
Vendor
Reged: 06/03/07
Posts: 149
Loc: Austin, Texas
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I've been curious about the following and wondered if anyone else is thinking about it too:
With gas prices maybe going to $6 per gallon or more within the next year or so (especially if new taxes are imposed), will your observing habits and choices of equipment change? It's also likely that ALL manufactured goods will rise in price dramatically with increasing energy costs. What will the combined effect of these ecomomic factors be on the types of equipment we use in amateur astronomy?
(Please note: I'm not trying to solicit political comments about gas and energy costs. I'm only interested in how you think these rising costs, if they occur, will affect eqiuipment choices for amateur astronomy.)
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Half Hitch alt-az mount
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Luigi
Postmaster
Reged: 07/03/07
Posts: 5272
Loc: MA
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Won't affect my choices of astro equipment.
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17.5" f/5 Dob. IM-715 MCT. 120ED. Lunt 60mm Ha.
Zeiss, Leica, Fujinon, Nikon, Pentax, Bushnell bins
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Jim7728
Postmaster
Reged: 04/10/05
Posts: 5182
Loc: Stoop Landing Observatory, NYC
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Maybe. I do not live near any dark skies and would have to travel at least 1 hour or about 60-70 miles to get someplace decent. Next big purchase maybe for better Ha solar observing equipment. Road trips not necessary for observing the sun.
I do expect moderate increases in the shipping prices maybe not so much in astronomy equipment itself. 
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Jim
TV-85~NP-127~12.5" dob project
Telepod~Gibralter(5)~GIROIII
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Deep13
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 01/25/05
Posts: 2038
Loc: NE Ohio
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Already have all my stuff. The few times per year that the weather lets me get away to a dark site will not be effected by fuel costs.
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That which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
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bsim
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 01/04/08
Posts: 1208
Loc: New York City
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I don't plan on getting a bigger SUV anytime soon and I certainly won't be changing my driving habits to observe at dark sites which are one hour or more away.
As for equipment, In the future I will be upgrading to a 18"-20" scope. I don't think I can fit a 20" truss dob in my current SUV. So, I may have to opt for an ultra-compact like the one from Obsession.
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Teeter's 15" f/4.5, Teeter's 10" f/6.0
Sundry Reflectors, Refractors, and Binoculars
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Catapoman
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 06/06/03
Posts: 821
Loc: VA
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Ummm, good question. Now that you've pointed out that gas prices will continue to increase maybe I should buy that last scope while I can afford to. Hey, this just might be my justification for doing it now 
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Pernel
Nexstar 11 GPS
Takahashi TSA-102
Mewlon 210
GM-8
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Protheus
Vaguely offended
Reged: 09/01/07
Posts: 5315
Loc: Illinois, US
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Well, no. There's no way I could afford (in terms of time or money) to do anything more that what I do now. That is, mostly observe from the yard at home, and once or twice a month at one of the local observatory sites. One of those sites is within easy walking distance, so I often do -- of course, this means it's not at all dark...
Chris
Edit: I also meant to say, I don't expect any increased cost to be a factor here in my continuing to be able to do any of this.
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"To tread the sharp edge of a sword;
to run on smooth-frozen ice,
one needs no footsteps to follow..."
"Well, people sometimes ask me 'how did you get involved in astronomy?' I said 'I got born, what's your problem?'" -- John Dobson
"In discussing the large-scale structure of the cosmos, astronomers sometimes say that space is curved, or that the universe is finite but unbounded. Whatever are they talking about?" -- Carl Sagan
Edited by Protheus (05/12/08 02:33 PM)
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docmusolf
member
Reged: 09/06/07
Posts: 93
Loc: port austin, mi
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no I observe in my front yard. If my neighbors continue to keep the mercury vapor lights off I may get a larger scope. One that has a focal length that would allow me to stand not bento over to observe
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J_D_Metzger
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 05/13/04
Posts: 1495
Loc: Tucson, AZ
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My equipment will not change because of gas prices, but the vehicle I use to haul it to dark sites and star parties may change dramatically...15 miles per gallon won't hack it much longer... 
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Clear skies,
J.D.
32°15'16.96"N 110°47'39.24"W
Celestron C11 & C6
Explore Scientific 127ED, TeleVue TV-76
Celestron CGEM, iOptron MiniTower, Vixen Porta
Canon 10x30 IS Binoculars
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Al Canarelli
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 12/06/07
Posts: 2622
Loc: Central New Jersey
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Jim7728 wrote,
Maybe. I do not live near any dark skies and would have to travel at least 1 hour or about 60-70 miles to get someplace decent. Next big purchase maybe for better Ha solar observing equipment. Road trips not necessary for observing the sun.
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We are on the same page of the same chapter of the same book and we live close to the same city. I just ordered an H-alpha solar telescope today for exactly the same reason you ordered yours. Much like you, I have to travel about 90 minutes to a dark sky area, which translates to at least 8 gallons of gas in my SUV for the round trip. With the solar scope, I can get my "telescope fix" before it even gets dark. 
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DaemonGPF
Post Laureate
Reged: 03/22/08
Posts: 4040
Loc: New Mexico
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No change here. I live out of civilization as it is. 99% of my viewing is done from my back yard. And if civilization moves in around me, I'll move further and buy more land next time.
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-Josh
http://cleardarksky.com/c/AlbuqNMkey.html
My AP Gallery
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RAKing
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 12/28/07
Posts: 2525
Loc: West of the D.C. Nebula
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My observing equipment should not change because of any external influences. My observing equipment seems to change on a weekly basis depending on what I have and what I want. 
On a more serious note - my observing equipment mostly reflects my observing tastes and desires -- but it's tempered somewhat by my physical condition and ability to load, setup, and use this equipment on a regular (sometimes nightly) basis. Carrying a very heavy mount and/or scope a short distance every night adds up. I'm still trying to sort this out.
Ron
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Time spent looking at the stars is added to your life.
Favorite Stuff: Astro-Physics, Baader, Celestron, Pentax, Takahashi, Televue, Zeiss, and .....
a beautiful wife - plus two furry cats who rule the world! 
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skypilgrim
professor emeritus
Reged: 12/25/06
Posts: 634
Loc: PNW, US
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Good question.
About 2 months ago I sold my 12.5" dob since it wasn't getting much use. I thought I'd be more anxious to replace it than I am. Oh sure, I think about a bigger scope like everyone else but when weighed against everything else going on (gas prices are just part of the equation), I just don't see me popping for something that is really only appreciated a long drive away.
It wouldn't surprise me if some excited emails about some great star party this summer change my mind for now now I'm sitting tight.
Sam
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Cave 8" F/7
Stellarvue 80mm F/6
Area of interest: Cultural Astronomy
My Blog: http://fathersky.wordpress.com/
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alienux
professor emeritus
Reged: 02/17/08
Posts: 678
Loc: Dayton, Ohio
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It won't affect my equipment choices. When I bought my Mak, I had already planned to wait about a year and buy a 10" or 12" inch DOB as a second, less portable telescope. I'm still planning on doing that.
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Brian
Orion SkyView Pro 127mm EQ Mak
Meade 60mm Push-To TeleStar
Phillips SPC900NC
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RogerRZ
Whatta you lookin' at?
Reged: 01/09/06
Posts: 2709
Loc: West Collette, NB, Canada
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Quote:
My observing equipment should not change because of any external influences. My observing equipment seems to change on a weekly basis depending on what I have and what I want.
Ron
Sounds like me... 
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-Roger Pitre-
1 X 7 binocular
Genesis SDF Starblast guidescope
EQ6 Pro, HEQ5, Canon 50D, 70-200 f/4L
"He's got shoulders on him like a smelt..."--Anonymous
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=10723&id=509325956&l=79d06a1d10
http://ajpobservatory.isgreat.org/
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Quintessence
Vendor
Reged: 06/03/07
Posts: 149
Loc: Austin, Texas
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For some of you who say your observing habits and equipment choices won't be affected, it would be interesting to know why. It's clear that some of you only observe from your home -- so transporting your gear is not a factor for you. Others may already own compact, lightweight equipment that can be transported in small, fuel-efficient vehicles. Other cases are somewhat more interesting. How many of you are willing to pay any price to carry a large scope to a dark sky? Also, it's been my experience that even if a particular scope might FIT in a smaller vehicle, it might also be more time consuming and a general pain in the butt to do so. Would this be enough of a factor to switch to more compact equipment?
For those who would downsize for more portability, what equipment would you replace and what would the likely replacements be?
Also, would you consider using observing sites that are closer to home but less desirable in some way than your preferred site? Would you, for instance, replace an "all night" site with a less secure or less private "half night" site? Would such a change in observing site cause you to use different equipment (maybe easier to set up and take down more quickly)?
It seems to me that there could be many subtle facets for amateur astronomy to the rising energy costs. One I would hope to see would be less outdoor lighting -- but I won't hold my breath for that change!
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Half Hitch alt-az mount
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cuzimthedad
Just Be Cuz
Reged: 04/09/06
Posts: 3856
Loc: Sonoma, Northern California
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What changed for me is moving up the purchase time for my Obsession from late this year to now. I was going to hold on to my LX200R but decided against it. I figure delivery costs will rise as will the cost of doing business in general and coupled with the Pyrex shortage it became a no brainer for me.
However, my viewing habits won't change as my little Toy gets great gas milage and my main viewing site is only 150 yards away!
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Dan
20" f/5 Obsession
Antares 1529
Various Naglers, Ethos, UO Orthos
Gone but not forgotten: Meade 5K UWAs & Plossls, WO UWANs, TV Plossls & T6 Naglers, Tak LEs, 13 & 17 Ethos, Vixen LVWs, Orion Stratus, Meade 12" LX200R, TV Genesis and TV102, Meade AR6, WO 80SD. All these helped to get me to what I own today.
The Off Fisher Lane Irregulars
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Paul G
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 05/08/03
Posts: 2475
Loc: Freedonia
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I have to travel about 30 miles to observe but the gas prices won't affect my observing habits at all, cheaper than going with my wife to the movies or to a restaurant.
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Gus
Tasco 4.5 Reflector EQ Telescope
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Nick Lloyd
He asked for it
Reged: 10/24/06
Posts: 2187
Loc: cincinnati
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If it is clear and moonless, I'd sell my blood and plasma to pay for a roundtrip drive to my observing site. Even at $6 a gallon gas, it's not even $20 roundtrip. I can think of other things to cut back in my budget before not going out to a star party.
Observing is what keeps me from going completely insane. A four-hour session comes out to $5 an hour. That's cheap therapy!
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"The best scope is the one you use." -rcg
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Protheus
Vaguely offended
Reged: 09/01/07
Posts: 5315
Loc: Illinois, US
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Quote:
It seems to me that there could be many subtle facets for amateur astronomy to the rising energy costs. One I would hope to see would be less outdoor lighting -- but I won't hold my breath for that change!
Well, if that happens, it _will_ change my viewing habits. I'll start looking for dim objects more at home. 
Chris
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"To tread the sharp edge of a sword;
to run on smooth-frozen ice,
one needs no footsteps to follow..."
"Well, people sometimes ask me 'how did you get involved in astronomy?' I said 'I got born, what's your problem?'" -- John Dobson
"In discussing the large-scale structure of the cosmos, astronomers sometimes say that space is curved, or that the universe is finite but unbounded. Whatever are they talking about?" -- Carl Sagan
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RAKing
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 12/28/07
Posts: 2525
Loc: West of the D.C. Nebula
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Quote:
For those who would downsize for more portability, what equipment would you replace and what would the likely replacements be?
That's a very good question and one I am wrestling with daily.
I have already downsized my telescope from the C11 to a C925. I still have the C11, but don't feel like hauling it around as much.
I would like to downsize my mount, but have not been able to find anything with the capacity of my Atlas for the same price. With the smaller OTA, I may be able to get by with a Sirius - or may spend more (a lot more ) and get a GM-8.
Quote:
Observing is what keeps me from going completely insane. A four-hour session comes out to $5 an hour. That's cheap therapy!
Excellent observation, Nick. That is exactly how I feel. I love to sit under the stars and unwind after a tough day at the grind. Thanks for the thought. 
Ron
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Time spent looking at the stars is added to your life.
Favorite Stuff: Astro-Physics, Baader, Celestron, Pentax, Takahashi, Televue, Zeiss, and .....
a beautiful wife - plus two furry cats who rule the world!
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Rusty
Postmaster
Reged: 08/06/03
Posts: 17903
Loc: Brooker, FL
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I expect no changes in my equipment; the last scope I bought was over two years ago, and its choice was evolutionary. Since I'm a star party junkie, my motorhome is an integral part of the astro-gear. For a medium-sized RV, it has very good fuel economy, and even with fuel prices higher than now, it's more economical to travel with my dogs and live in it than it is to use my car, board the dogs, and camp or stay in motels and eat in restaurants.
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N11GPS Fastar
TOA-130S
MK66 Std
Vintage C5
Megrez II 80mm ED Triplet APO
SolarMax 40
NJP Temma II
Sirius EQ-G
ST8XE/CFW-8(LRGBHa)/AO-7/DF-2/STV Dlx/ST237a/350D (Unmodded)/Mallincam Color Hyper Plus/DSI III Color/DSI II Pro
Two not-spoiled Golden Retrievers - Maggie and Casey
Sometimes I think we're alone in the universe, and sometimes I think we're not. In either case the idea is quite staggering. - Arthur C. Clarke
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o1d_dude
o1der than dirt
Reged: 10/03/07
Posts: 2275
Loc: The TV/SV Wolfpack
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Not so much a change in equipment but more of a change in location. The cost of fuel is annoying but for us the real reasons are the cost of living in California as well as the ever growing problem of light pollution.
Since I retired, we've been thinking about moving a bit further away from civilization. The kids have all moved away and we have family down in Arizona, southern Nevada, and SoCal. I'm thinking somewhere within an hour or two of Tucson.
It will be nice to see blue skies during the day instead of the pale washed-out white skies we have here during the day and the gray skies at night.
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Kit
'Don’t worry about what telescope you own, or its quality. Just get out under the night sky, and enjoy God’s wondrous universe.' - Thomas M Back
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half meter
Postmaster
Reged: 05/05/04
Posts: 12899
Loc: Great Lakes
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I'll be pulling the trailer containing my 30" dob for a long time to come. Diesel would have to go up a lot to make me think twice about going to star parties or to dark sites once a month. For me, free weekends are harder to get than diesel fuel. If fuel ever did get to be a burden, I'd buy a couple of acres in a dark site and build an observatory, and then drive there in my electric car fueled by nuclear power. And solar observing is a good way to fit observing time into a busy schedule.
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Gary
Collins I3 (Thin Film) Image Intensifying Eyepiece
Coronado Maxscope Double Stacked 90mm <0.5A w/BF30
6" f/8 TMB/A&M Carbon Fiber APO; f/5 with 4" Borg ED Field Flattener/Reducer
8" f/5.6 Starmaster Versa V8/Zambuto Mirror/ServoCat Jr dob
30" f/4.5 Obsession/OMI Mirror/ServoCat/Argo Navis dob
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F.Meiresonne
Post Laureate
Reged: 12/22/03
Posts: 3634
Loc: Eeklo,Belgium
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Not anymore. I have the scopes i want, and my 'dark' site (m5.5-m6) skies are only 18 miles away...
I am done...
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Freddy Meiresonne
Obsession 18 inch #1638
Orion Optics 8 inch F/4.5 -1/8 wave optics -Vixen GP-E
22x85 Helios Apollo (=GO SS)
15x70 TS Marine (=Obie Ultra)
10x60 Helios Quantum 4(= Obie Mariner)
10x50,8x40 Helios Nature sport plus
Eyepieces in use :Pan 35,24,19, N13T6, Pentax 10 XW, N9T6, Ultrascopic 7.5, TV2, BGO 12.5 and 9 mm
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Alvin Huey
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 10/18/05
Posts: 1871
Loc: NorCal
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No. I have everything I need, I can fit my 22" in the my Bug that gives me 32+ mpg. I am trying to get rid of my 30" Starmaster as I'm not using it anymore.
My dark site is an hour away, so it is not that bad...20 bucks of gas @ $6/gallon rate is not bad.
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Clear Skies,
Alvin #26
22" f/4.0 reflector and 30" f/4.3 StarMaster
FaintFuzzies | TAC | TAC-Sac
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edwincjones
Postmaster
Reged: 04/10/04
Posts: 5957
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Not much for me-I have more equiptment than I need, encluding an observatory where most of my observing is done.
I have a travel trailer for trips, but probably more short and less long trips.
edj
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n w arkansas
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edwincjones
Postmaster
Reged: 04/10/04
Posts: 5957
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but, I could be moved to buying more with a really good sale
edj
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n w arkansas
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HandyAndy
professor emeritus
Reged: 01/11/08
Posts: 687
Loc: West Midlands and around
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Hi,
I retired my 20mpg Merc estate a while ago so my 16" solid tube dob sees Orion once a year now. A shame I cannot take it to my friends dark site or star parties. Plan to convert it to a truss design and been monitoring the forums to that end.
I asked my more experienced friend to recommend the best scope, a refractor killer really, and I found a SH Intes-Micro MN78 at a good price with a new Starlight Instruments 2 speed focuser . I am really happy with it and my friend remarked last night I have done more observing recently! It just fits longways with the split back seat down in my Golf Estate so its convenient to take on hols with better half.
It is a bit heavy for a Vixen GP mount I have but I hope to get a SH Fullerscopes MK4 when someone upgrades next year. A bit of drilling and milling in prospect to lighten it!
Cheers. Andrew.
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Monarch 8x42, Zeiss 10x50 WA
10mm F2, Pentax 60mm F5
City: 7" MN78: MK4#2, 10" F6.3: MK4#1, 16" F5 ParaCorr
Country: 8" VISAC: (GP2)
Car: 6" F5 MPCC: SP, 5" 127mm F7.5 (GP2)
TV 55mm, Paragon 40mm, UO Pretoria 28mm
B&L 32 Pl, Clave's 25, 8, 6, 2x
Hyperions 5, 8, 13, 17, 24, 31
Nagler1 9mm, Meade 14mm 4000 UWA
Antares 1.6x, 0.7x, 0.5x
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Rick Woods
Postmaster
Reged: 01/27/05
Posts: 6268
Loc: Inner Solar System
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Equipment, no. I get what I want (and can afford).
Habits, yes - I'll be observing more because I won't be able to afford to go anywhere. Planning vacations will be a breeze!
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- Rick
14" LX200GPS
Dyslexics Untie!
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rodney
Vendor - Explora Dome
Reged: 03/08/05
Posts: 904
Loc: Asbury, NJ
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No effect on my observing or equipment choices. Most things I already have or need. Plus the inclusion of an observatory gives me a dark sky 50 feet away from my home.
$6 a gallon, OUCH!!
Clear skies,
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Explora Dome information can be found here:
www.exploradome.us
Rodney
Meade 10 SCT
AT 8/F4 imaging scope
13 Truss
C8-NGT
Orion 80mm/F11
Canon 300D
Canon XSi
Two AS-GT mounts
Extremely happy Explora Dome home observatory owner
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George N
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 05/19/06
Posts: 778
Loc: Binghamton & Indian Lake NY
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Quote:
For some of you who say your observing habits and equipment choices won't be affected, it would be interesting to know why. ...... How many of you are willing to pay any price to carry a large scope to a dark sky? Also, it's been my experience that even if a particular scope might FIT in a smaller vehicle, it might also be more time consuming and a general pain in the butt to do so. Would this be enough of a factor to switch to more compact equipment....
I do 50% of my observing from my rural NY yard where my Sky Quality Meter shows I have mag 5.8 sky. Much of my remaining observing is done from an observatory about 18 miles away where the SQM shows mag 6.2 sky. However, I still transport my Obsession 20 to star parties and my rented second home in the Adirondacks, were it is as dark as it gets. I’m purchasing a 5x8 trailer to make it easier, and since the trailer will give me storage space for a bigger scope, I’m considering trading up to an Obsession 25. The increase in gas price is tiny compared to cost of replacing my paid-for SUV, so I will just pay some more at the pump and keep on driving! It helps that with my retirement two months ago my typical monthly driving mileage has been cut in half – no more 50 mile daily commutes.
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George N
Obsession 20
Optical Guidance Systems 10" F/9 R-C Cass
6" F/5 & 8" F/8 home-made Newts
MI-250 mount
SBIG STL-1301E CCD
Member, International Dark-Sky Association
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