Return to the Cloudy Nights Telescope Reviews home pageAstronomics discounts for Cloudy Nights members
· Get a Cloudy Nights T-Shirt · Submit a Review / Article

Click here if you are having trouble logging into the forums

Privacy Policy | Please read our Terms of Service | Signup and Troubleshooting FAQ | Problems? PM a Red or a Green Gu… uh, User

Equipment Discussions >> Refractors

Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | (show all)
Dave Lee
sage


Reged: 02/14/13

Loc: Pinehurst, NC USA
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6135663 - 10/13/13 07:16 PM

A related question. Am I correct that when I encounter a used NEO140 model that the 'SS' model was built in Japan and the SSf model was built in China (for better or worse).

Thanks.

dave


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Eddgie
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 02/01/06

Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6135681 - 10/13/13 07:29 PM

From my first post to you on this topic:

Quote:

The truth is out there, and a credit card will get it for you.. LOL.




It may take several transactions.. That was implied.

LOL.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
fred1871
professor emeritus


Reged: 03/22/09

Loc: Australia
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6135763 - 10/13/13 08:20 PM

Quote:

A related question. Am I correct that when I encounter a used NEO140 model that the 'SS' model was built in Japan and the SSf model was built in China (for better or worse).

Thanks.

dave




Mine has 'SSf' on the same label that says 'made in Japan'.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
jrbarnett
Eyepiece Hooligan
*****

Reged: 02/28/06

Loc: Petaluma, CA
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: fred1871]
      #6136003 - 10/13/13 10:38 PM

I've been enjoying the Astrotelescopes 152mm f/5.9 achromat for quite some time now. I think I'll sell it and try one of the latest crop of Vixen NA140s as an alternative.

- Jim


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
russell23
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 05/31/09

Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: jrbarnett]
      #6136059 - 10/13/13 11:06 PM

Quote:

I've been enjoying the Astrotelescopes 152mm f/5.9 achromat for quite some time now. I think I'll sell it and try one of the latest crop of Vixen NA140s as an alternative.

- Jim




Jim,

If you do or even if you don't get the Vixen 140, you should pick up the Baader 495 Longpass filter and see how it improves the sharpness of views provided by the achromat. I know you have or had a TEC 140. It certainly would be interesting to do a comparison between the TEC 140 and the Vixen 140 with the 495 longpass since some people seem to think the value (or lack of value) of a large achro comes from its inability to match an equal aperture APO.

Dave


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
jrbarnett
Eyepiece Hooligan
*****

Reged: 02/28/06

Loc: Petaluma, CA
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: russell23]
      #6136077 - 10/13/13 11:19 PM

That's part of the plan.

The other piece of the plan is to pair it up with the C9.25 Edge HD and my CGE mount as my travel ensemble. Both are flat. One goes deep but is narrow. One less deep but wide. Neither is crazy expensive, either.

- Jim


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Dave Lee
sage


Reged: 02/14/13

Loc: Pinehurst, NC USA
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6136577 - 10/14/13 10:23 AM

Well, folks. I just bit the bullet and bought on ebay a Vixen NA140SS described as four years old and never been used. Reputable seller but I guess you never know. At $1k it was too good to pass up.

This discussion (and others) has convinced me that I will probably end up with a couple of refractors before I end up with 'the one' (or maybe 'the none'). However this seemed like a scope (if it is as described) where I can recover my investment.

This is the a very good scope for one of my stated interests (better star images and background contrast vs. a C11) but somewhat less than optimum for my other stated interest (double stars). But hardly a terrible choice.

Plus this scope should have the minor advantage of being better balanced than the typical refractor (rear lens elements) as I have a permanent pier/G11 in my back yard and don't currently have an easy way to raise the head.

I'll report back when I have first light. I am a star hopper and am really looking forward to star hopping through a primary objective!! And maybe some day I will buy a dual saddle for my G11 and use both scopes at the same time.

Thanks again for everyone's input.

dave


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
fred1871
professor emeritus


Reged: 03/22/09

Loc: Australia
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6137671 - 10/14/13 07:04 PM

All the best with the new scope, Dave. I hope it's a good copy of the model. If it is, I suspect you'll find it better for double stars than you expect. I did, so I use it much more often for doubles than my C9.25.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Dave Lee
sage


Reged: 02/14/13

Loc: Pinehurst, NC USA
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: fred1871]
      #6137772 - 10/14/13 08:11 PM

Quote:

All the best with the new scope, Dave. I hope it's a good copy of the model. If it is, I suspect you'll find it better for double stars than you expect. I did, so I use it much more often for doubles than my C9.25.




Tonight someone will probably offer a Televue NP127is for $200 or something. Oh well

dave


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
seeindoubles
super member


Reged: 01/15/12

Loc: Pacific Northwest-Oregon
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6138135 - 10/15/13 12:01 AM


Tonight someone will probably offer a Televue NP127is for $200 or something. Oh well

dave




Mine! All Mine!


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Doug Reilly
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 07/29/08

Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: seeindoubles]
      #6140661 - 10/16/13 11:01 AM

The SSf models were assembled, or at least quality controlled, in Japan. The objective lenses were made in China. I just had to replace my front objective lens in my NA140 (don't ask, I don't want to talk about it) and I had the option of getting either a Chinese-made example mrstarguy had on hand from a demo unit, or a new Japanese made objective at significantly higher cost, including shipping the ota to Japan. I was told that the new NA140 model will be going back to these japanese-made lenses. I am assuming that the optical design will be the same since they were offering the new Japanese glass as a swap in, unless they intended to replace both lens sets in the OTA....could be. Anyway, there is a new all Japanese NA140 on the way.

I really enjoy my NA140, enough to replace the front objective! (At least i bought the original chipped at ridiculously low price so now i an up to what a good used one would cost, and I think it is still worth it. Not quite the deal of the century that it was. Interestingly the new cell is in better collimation than the one it replaced. There is variation.

I have though about how to add colliamation provision to the scope, something akin to Televue's crude but effective bolts for adjusting tilt. I now have an empty cell to play with, and a friend with a machine shop....


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Dave Lee
sage


Reged: 02/14/13

Loc: Pinehurst, NC USA
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6147100 - 10/19/13 05:21 PM

Quote:

Well, folks. I just bit the bullet and bought on ebay a Vixen NA140SS described as four years old and never been used. Reputable seller but I guess you never know. At $1k it was too good to pass up.

snip

dave




Had kind of a 'first light' today. Scope arrived so I set it up for some daylight viewing. Keep in mind here that, while I have a decent level of DSO viewing experience from back in the 80's/90's, my high mag experience is thin and refractor experience (other than a couple hours with a 6" APO 25 years ago) is nil.

The scope as represented was 4'ish years old and unused. I took that with a grain of salt (but with the expectation of very good condition). However, if the seller had told me that this was a brand new scope being drop shipped from Vixen, I would have believed that. It even had the original "plastic wrapper" around the OTA. This thing is cosmetically pristine showroom condition.

FWIW, this is a very heavy duty focuser. VERY much so. The tension knob is really nice to have (and works well) and the fine movement is going to be very important, I think. Again, most of my experience is DSO work with an 8" and 11" SCT so I don't have a good comparison base here.

Unfortunately it is cloudy now with little chance of that changing tonight. So the best that I could do was to aim at a tree branch maybe 75 yards away. And note that this was a day of full, but not really heavy, cloud cover.

The purple haze becomes obvious at 80x. I didn't buy an apo so was hardly surprised here. Next I just banged it up to 312x (2.5x power mate and 6.4mm plossl). The purple haze was not exactly worse (maybe a little). And clearly the image was darker. But finding focus was simple (thanks to the fine focus feature) and the image seemed to hold up well. If the goal had been to describe the features of the brown branch to as great a level of detail as possible, I'd probably have chosen that magnification (even at a less than 0.5mm exit pupil). BTW, there was pretty much no cool down time here but the indoor and outdoor temps were within 7 degrees or so. Of course that purple haze is visual information that is being lost - no way around that.

Two other pieces of good news.

1) My existing "14 inch SCT Telegizmo 365 cover" works fine on this scope. If the forecast is good I'll leave the scope out a few days.

2) Using my 56mm plossl EP (max 2" FOV) is quite comfortable. My plan here is to do star hopping through the main tube (no finder) and that EP will give me a better than 3* FOV (and an exit pupil that is WAY too big). This will save me the trouble of mounting a finder (I hope) and will allow me to move a better 32mm EP well down the priority list.

Will post more when I know more.

dave

ps. Eddgie (and others) may well be right that the best operating point for me might be a 120-130mm ED level scope. But I think that I can recover close to my expense if I decide to move on, so I am giving this a try.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
russell23
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 05/31/09

Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6147165 - 10/19/13 05:49 PM

Dave,

If you don't like the performance above 100x for your observing objectives I would suggest again that you consider the Baader 495 longpass filter. I was testing a new Barlow two days ago in daylight. I was at 120x with the Baader 495 filter on my diagonal with my Vixen 140NA and there was not a trace of CA on trees, branches or anything else I used as a test target - exactly what I have seen on the Moon, Jupiter, Vega, Altair ... That filter is a true fringe killer!

Dave


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Dave Lee
sage


Reged: 02/14/13

Loc: Pinehurst, NC USA
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: russell23]
      #6147403 - 10/19/13 08:29 PM

Quote:

Dave,

If you don't like the performance above 100x for your observing objectives I would suggest again that you consider the Baader 495 longpass filter. I was testing a new Barlow two days ago in daylight. I was at 120x with the Baader 495 filter on my diagonal with my Vixen 140NA and there was not a trace of CA on trees, branches or anything else I used as a test target - exactly what I have seen on the Moon, Jupiter, Vega, Altair ... That filter is a true fringe killer!

Dave




Dave, I will definitely be trying out your suggestion of a Long Pass 495 filter (quite inexpensive) as well as the Badder Fringe Killer (or something similar).

When I think about this issue in the context of what I just observed (tree branch with a fringe), I see (and/or expect) the following 'errors'

1) The obvious fringing. If I were to imagine a goal of seeing the detail on the branch as well as is possible, this seems to me to be a (relatively) trivial issue for the most part.

2) There must be improperly focused light spread about the target itself (inside the fringe boundaries) which smears out the image a bit.

3) Light that should have been focused properly is now 'gone' which must (to some extent) reduce the quality of the image.

It would seem to me that a proper filter can 'go after' #1 and #2, but not #3. Of course if you could go after all three of these issues effectively, you'd be seeing a lot fewer APO's and a lot more achromats.

dave


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Dave Lee
sage


Reged: 02/14/13

Loc: Pinehurst, NC USA
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question [Re: russell23]
      #6150495 - 10/21/13 07:58 PM

Had the new scope (Vixen NeoAchromat 140mm) out last night. I didn't have a ton of time here, but here are my first impressions (again keep in mind that my high mag experience is thin). The night had mostly clear skies (wispy cirrus clouds moving around randomly), 98% illuminated moon, rapidly dropping temps, and seeing that varied widely.

I spent a fair amount of my 2 hours getting accustomed to the scope and how I would use it for star hopping. I had hoped to avoid a finder scope (use a 56mm plossl in primary optical path for star hopping), just line up the tube instead of a Telrad/etc., etc. No finder is going to work just fine, I think (despite the 10mm exit pupil), but I may end up with a Telrad or equivalent.

I always have trouble when manually moving a scope on a GEM. My (non-Gemini) G11 'pushes' just fine, but I always seem to have trouble trying to find 'pure RA movement' vs. 'pure DEC movement'. My C11 has this neat little handle on the bottom/rear that is perpendicular to DEC motion. Took a while to orient myself here (this problem seems to be unique to me, BTW).

Once I got the movement (and scope balance) straightened out I decided to just turn my back to the moon and start on something familiar (the double-double, Epison Lyra). I had set the scope up a good 2 hours earlier, but had noticed that the OTA was REALLY cold to the touch (I assume that it was that OTA radiating to a dark sky). Images were literally boiling around. I'll swear that at 200x I saw the orientation of one of the double-double pairs flip 90 degrees!

So I just put the 56mm plossl on and did some experimental star-hopping to nowhere in particular. Things seemed to settle down fairly quickly, so back to the double-double.

The pair was 'suspiciously elongated' at 80x and well split at 120x. I have viewed this in my C11 a couple of times and things just looked a bit more crisp in the Vixen vs. the C11. And I don't recall an obvious split at less than 200x in the C11. I would not claim a night and day difference here, but it was real and not subtle. I did bump the magnification up to 312x, but the seeing really didn't support that magnification.

Since I was in the area I dialed in The Ring Nebula. It was detectable in the 56mm plossl (14X and 10 mm exit pupil, basically full moon). Structure (or at least a 'ringness' was detectable (with great effort) at 120x but things began to kind of wash out at higher magnifications.

I then moved to a couple of easy doubles (Beta/Zeta Lyra) and they were easy and very pleasant views.

Now for my general impressions.

1) I believe that I am really going to enjoy star-hopping at 140mm/f5.7. Despite having a better than typical finder on my C11 (Lumicon 80mm finder), I really somehow liked moving around through the main OTA (with around 3* FOV).

2) The scope fits fine on my existing permanent pier (designed to hold a C11). I was worried about the height, but it is fine.

3) Things do seem to be sharper in the Neo (vs. the C11). I would not claim a night and day difference, but it is real. Sky darkness is hard to judge under a full moon.

4) This thing has a nice focuser (said the guy who has only extensively used the focusers on SCT's).

5) Vega begins to show unwanted color at around 80x. Bigtime at 120x. I encountered no other color issues (not the moon comment in the ps).

6) The Televue Powermate (2.5x) seems to be a really good 'Barlow' from this limited experiment.

7) This one surprised me (a bunch). I found myself wondering if better eyepieces would be helpful. I have a kind of hodgepodge of a couple of ES 82* models, a couple old Meade plossl's, a couple of old UO's, and an ancient Orion Erfle. The answer to this question is far less interesting to me than the fact that it was a question in the first place. It had simply never occured to me before. Have no idea what to think of that.

That's it.

dave

ps. My plan was to look at the moon at the end of the session. At that point the moon had darted behind some high cirrus, so I called it an evening.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
seeindoubles
super member


Reged: 01/15/12

Loc: Pacific Northwest-Oregon
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6150669 - 10/21/13 09:45 PM

Better eyepieces will help. When I first bought my 140 and later my AT152, I used what I had. The best of the lot at the time were some run of the mill generic Plossls and the best were some old Celestron Ortho's. Later on, Teleview had a "sale" and I splurged and bought three eyepieces, a 10mm Radian, a 5mm Radian and a 19mm Panoptic. Man, do I love that Panoptic! It quickly has become my favorite eyepiece in my still fairly limited selection. The Radians are great for splitting doubles and planetary but I love the Panoptic as a "relatively" affordable eyepiece for looking at nebula, sweeping star fields. Both the 140 and the AT152 yielded nice views though I never really got to fully test the 140. I have also used all three eyepieces with my current Celestron C150R refractor and have been very happy with the views through the Panoptic. It also works very well with my C11.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Dave Lee
sage


Reged: 02/14/13

Loc: Pinehurst, NC USA
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: seeindoubles]
      #6151529 - 10/22/13 11:40 AM

Unfortunately, now that I have experienced a 3+* FOV through 140mm of aperture (albeit with a 10mm exit pupil), a really good 30'ish mm widefield EP is also now on my list. Oh well.

dave


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
russell23
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 05/31/09

Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6151621 - 10/22/13 12:36 PM

Quote:

Unfortunately, now that I have experienced a 3+* FOV through 140mm of aperture (albeit with a 10mm exit pupil), a really good 30'ish mm widefield EP is also now on my list. Oh well.

dave




The 28mm ES68 works very well with the Vixen140 NA.

Dave


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
t.r.
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 02/14/08

Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: Dave Lee]
      #6151625 - 10/22/13 12:40 PM

Quote:

Unfortunately, now that I have experienced a 3+* FOV through 140mm of aperture (albeit with a 10mm exit pupil), a really good 30'ish mm widefield EP is also now on my list. Oh well.

dave




"Ignorance is Bliss"...But now you know.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
ohioalfa64
sage


Reged: 08/16/12

Loc: Ohio (NW)
Re: Vixen NEO140 'achromat' Question new [Re: fred1871]
      #6172233 - 11/02/13 04:30 PM

When considering purchasing filters for the Vixen 140ssf, I am looking at the semi-APO or the mentioned here 495 long pass filter. Any suggestions on which is better for viewing Jupiter at a high magnification?

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | (show all)


Extra information
43 registered and 47 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:  Scott in NC, FirstSight, panhard, star drop 

Print Thread

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled


Thread views: 2433

Jump to

CN Forums Home


Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics