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How much rebar in my 16" 12' concrete pier?

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#51 rboe

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 09:12 AM

I'd be partial to remodeling grenades - if they made them. Kinda close to the house though.

Did you build the house? It would be nice to know what the builder ran into when the house was put up. Could give you a hint on the rock situation.

#52 Guest_**DONOTDELETE**_*

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 09:35 AM

Sounds like a job for Mr. Track Hoe :smirk:


Yeah, that would be the easiest for sure, but I was hoping to keep this project around $500, but that is starting to look unrealistic. I can rent a jr. back hoe for about $180/day, but I don't have my trailer available right now to pick one up with. Delivery is going to cost quite a bit extra. It might have to come to that if the rocks won't budge. It will still be cheaper than a jackhammer and tow behind compressor.

#53 Guest_**DONOTDELETE**_*

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 09:41 AM

Did you build the house? It would be nice to know what the builder ran into when the house was put up. Could give you a hint on the rock situation.


The house was built in '97. I purchased it in 2000. I do have a lot of exposed cliff face in various spots around the property. In some places, the rock sticks out about 10 feet. I think the previous owner did mentioned something about them having to dynamite quite a bit during the excavation.

I'll go at it with the tamper bar for a couple of hours this afternoon when I get home from work and then decide if that is going to work or not. If I have indeed reached the cliff face or something, then drilling might be the way to go.

#54 rboe

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 09:56 AM

Hmm. My untrained opinion, if it's bed rock, anchoring the pad to it may not be a bad idea. After all, it's only a deck extention. If you free float it from the existing deck so it's free to move then no harm done to the attached deck.

Just a thought. Maybe a better trained opinion will pop up.

#55 Guest_**DONOTDELETE**_*

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 10:17 AM

I should know pretty quickly if its bed rock or individual pieces tonight. I just got off the phone with Sunbelt Rentals. They will rent me a 180 CFM compressor, air hammer, hose and chisels for $161/day. So maybe I'll do that if need be.

#56 EdZ

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 10:20 AM

Think of rock like icebergs, likely you're only seeing the tip.

I'd be giving a lot of thought to drill and dowel, especially if you know the area has ledge. You could be there a long time trying to rip out rock.

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#57 John Jarosz

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 10:47 AM

If you decide to drill holes and insert rebar, an air powered hammer/drill is infinitely better than electric. Maybe you can get a deal from the rental place to let you bring back the jackhammer and replace it with a drill all in the same day. Just maybe you could save some $$.

John

#58 Guest_**DONOTDELETE**_*

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 11:30 AM

I can rent a jr. back hoe for about $180/day, but I don't have my trailer available right now to pick one up with.


hmm...the smaller ones go for about $140 a day here and thats with a trailer. Hopefully you will be able to get down where you need to be without having to rent one.

#59 StarWars

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 12:27 PM




Simply lay a small 5" deep concrete slab where the pier will be. Next build the pier with (4) 6X6 or 4X4 treated lumber posts tied together with long bolts forming a square. Attach the wooden pier to slab with (L) brackets using bolts and anchors. :grin:



#60 Guest_**DONOTDELETE**_*

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 07:52 PM

Hey Apollo, now you're talking! Sure would have saved a lot of diggin' and cement!

I actually did pretty good tonight. With the tamper bar, I was able to break the rocks loose little by little once I was able to locate the seams around each rock and go at it from all angles. Them suckers are packed in tight!

Here's a shot from when I got to about 2 1/2 feet and was ready to pry loose a good size rock.

Posted Image

And here's a shot at 3 feet deep.

Posted Image

Hopefully I'll be able to do the final foot tomorrow.

#61 Guest_**DONOTDELETE**_*

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 08:29 PM

Oh, and look what the UPS guy dropped off today:

Posted Image

(the pier plate, not the kitten) :grin:

Is that how I should point the 'fingers'? Being a 16" pier, I should be able to get away with pointing them out as well. This way the top rebar ring (tied to the 10 rods) could be above the fingers.

#62 Rusty

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 08:32 PM

OK, it looks like it's time for recommendations on pain-relief medicine, espcially those that can deal with back pain. :grin:

Anyway, the best part is, you've made some progress! :jump:

#63 Rusty

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 08:38 PM

Ah, The Solution emerges -

Squirt about 8 oz. of cod liver oil into the pit, then turn the kitten loose. You'll be down 5 feet in no time!

#64 John Jarosz

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 09:20 PM

You are making serious progress. :waytogo:

You'll have no problem gettin deep enough. Your first pictures sure looked like it was one rock, though.

Crank up the mixer.

Oh yeah, I would absolutely point the fingers "out".

John

#65 Tim13

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 10:58 PM

It's kind of funny how a project take an ugly turn in the blink of an eye. It looked like everything was on track until the rocks reared their ugly heads.

For me, my watch word is "just", as in "I'll just take off the old humidifier from the furnace, and replace it with a new one"...two days later, and it's finally done. Another one was "I'll just cut down these overgrown shrubs, and dig out the stumps in a couple of days." It took the full month of July to get 6 stumps dug out. So, whenever I catch myself saying that warning flag word "just", I always rethink my project...lol.

Once this project is finished, it will all be worth it based on the pics of the house and deck.

Tim

#66 Guest_**DONOTDELETE**_*

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 07:47 AM

Rusty, lol on the cod liver oil trick. That would be fun to watch! :grin:

Fortunately, my back is doing fine (knock on wood). I have a desk job by day, but spend most evenings/weekends on various projects, so I stay quite active. Livin' on the "farm" does keep you fit.

John, out it is for the fingers.

Tim, no kiddin' about being carefull about using the word "just". I know *exactly* what you're talking about.

But yes, I think this project will turn out real nice once completed and I can't wait to have my scope all ready to go at a moments notice.

#67 Guest_**DONOTDELETE**_*

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 09:34 AM

Oh, and look what the UPS guy dropped off today:


Does the new Cat have goto installed :p

#68 rboe

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 09:59 AM

Darn good job there Peter! Once in you can mount a 40" scope off that pier. Cat is too cute.

#69 John Jarosz

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 01:00 PM

Once in you can mount a 40" scope off that pier.


Yes, with pier that tall he can buy the 40" refractor from Yerkes, and observe from the ground. :gve:


No need to buy that material for the deck extension..... See, I am trying to save hime some $$ :jump:

#70 Guest_**DONOTDELETE**_*

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 03:00 PM

You mean this guy:

Posted Image

:lol: :lol:

#71 John Jarosz

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 03:29 PM

THAT'S IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tha's not Yerkes is it? It was considerably drabber and dingier when I was there last.

If you go this route, you should consider the moveable floor. :silly: :waytogo: :money:

John

#72 Don W

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 04:08 PM

Could be. Haven't been there in years myself. The floor in the image above does move up an down. The one at Yerkes crashed many years ago. Made a heck of a mess.

#73 Guest_**DONOTDELETE**_*

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 08:16 PM

I had a very hard time making any progress tonight. There isn't really any dirt anymore, just this flakey rock like material that becomes very hard in places and weak and soft in other places where you can kind of flake it with your hands.

I'm at maybe 3'4" at the deepest point. Here you can see what appear to be very large rocks running East West as before.

Posted Image

I think the frost line here in Virginia is 24", I'll double check w/ the County tomorrow. I'll see if I can manage to break something else loose tomorrow night, but I'm having a hard time getting any leverage for the tamper now that I'm below 3 feet.

#74 Rusty

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 08:32 PM

You might be able to do with a pneumatic chisel - the bits would be throw-away, but IIRC, I've seen star-pointed ones.

I still think you want to go down another foot or so. But then, all I have to do is think about it. :grin:

#75 serious_sam

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Posted 17 August 2004 - 08:50 PM

there is really only one way to know what's going on down there... contract a geotech company to drill some cores.

but that's going to cost so much that i, speaking from a structural engineer's position, would be hesitant to do if it were my own house. i'd probably just clean up the rock and pour the footing right on top. the loads are very minimal from an engineering point of view, after all.

just don't come after me if the pier doesn't perform as expected. you know, MD's aren't the only ones embroiled in lawsuits these days :(

PS: as for the pier plate, POINT THE FINGERS IN. that's how we connect base plates of columns to concrete piers.


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