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Almost voted off the island!

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#1 dvb

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 07:59 PM

Half a loaf is better than none -- grateful to have our own forum, but this is a pretty remote location for it!

Sort of like being at the fringe of the star party location, so our monitors don't bother the visual observers!
 

#2 midway199

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 08:07 PM

We just got moved down here today. We were way up top! But now we're "special". :jump:
 

#3 Jack Huerkamp

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 08:10 PM

We got moved to the bottom of the list some time today. I don't know why the forum name had to be changed or why it had to be taken from "Equipment" to a Specialty form as the video cameras and I3s are "equipment"

Jack
 

#4 Jack Huerkamp

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 08:12 PM

I got use to having the forum at the bottom of the Equipment section and I could not figure out why the results of the imaging and sketching contest were posted to the Assisted Visual Astronomy forum. I only became aware of the switch when someone called me to ask what happened.

Jack
 

#5 celestial_search

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 09:04 PM

I only found it by looking at every single forum title.

I will reserve comment, or self-moderation, lest my comment be moderated.
 

#6 GrassyPond

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 09:43 PM

Best new forum. Hardest to find.
 

#7 midway199

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 09:44 PM

Probably best Frank. I for one, have just been re-conditioned not to question anything anyone says or does. Besides, the bottom is really the other "top".

Positive thinking! :jump: It goes a long way!
 

#8 Douglas

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 09:59 PM

There was some static about the title of the forum, in the original thread requesting CN to create the forum, since some folks don't believe what we're doing is assisted visual observing but rather video astronomy. I guess different folks have different definitions as to what is "visual observing"

Tom posted there today stating that they were moving the forum location but expected it may move back to where it was very soon. It was post #2068066

http://www.cloudynig...ll/fpart/3/vc/1

I certainly hope it is moved back to the original location, I believe it belonged where it was.

I have to say, kind of makes one feel like Galileo must have felt when he tried to convince folks to look through his telescope but they refused calling it a trick. They subjected him to house arrest and tried to silence him when he visually confirmed the motion of the moons of Jupiter. Dare I say he was performing assisted visual astronomy by using his telescope as opposed to the naked eye!

I believe this technology is ahead of its time, so consider us all pioneers, as was Galileo. Those who choose not to look, or preach that what we're doing is destroying their concept of astronomy, can join the ranks of those who also believed the Earth was flat and the center of the Universe.

- Doug
 

#9 smokin oakum

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 10:02 PM

I, for one am just glad to have a forum for this type of astronomy. I don't care if it's all the way down here. I visit most of the other forums too. It's kind of like walking around a star party first, just to end up back at home base. No big deal. It is kind of funny though, that they are having a hard time classifying what type of astronomy this really is. I just want to say, that not only will I not intrude on some ones right to stay dark adapted at a star party, but I'm not going to be bothered by people being threatened by technology that is sure to come!!!

Clear skies, or for us video astronomers, as long as you can see some sky, go for it.

Neil
 

#10 smokin oakum

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 10:07 PM

Hey! I just noticed that we're right beside the feed back forum. Hummmmmm. :lol: :poke: :gve:
 

#11 Douglas

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 10:24 PM

I'm glad we have the forum and shouldn't complain but seriously, this is equipment which should be discussed in the equipment section.

We couldn't get placed above Pets, Gardening, and Audiophiliacs??? I wouldn't expect too many folks to find this forum where it is, I usually stop scrolling down when I see Pets and Gardening...

- Doug
 

#12 smokin oakum

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 10:38 PM

I'm glad we have the forum and shouldn't complain but seriously, this is equipment which should be discussed in the equipment section. Me, personally, if I was at a star party, I wouldn't even bring my Mallincam. I would want to be dark adapted too.

I hope they will forgive us!!!

Neil

We couldn't get placed above Pets, Gardening, and Audiophiliacs??? I wouldn't expect too many folks to find this forum where it is, I usually stop scrolling down when I see Pets and Gardening...

- Doug


I didn't think about it like that. I guess it is pretty unfair to give us this type of gift a couple of weeks ago, and then stick us in the most remote part of CN after a couple of heated threads. I hope that we are not now pegged as a bunch of trouble makers, running around at star parties shinning bright lights in every ones faces.

Neil
 

#13 ccs_hello

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Posted 22 December 2007 - 11:17 PM

If I have a vote, I would say this forum should go back to the Equipment branch. On the other hand, I feel the passion and the urge to share from some posters might be a little bit too much a heavy burden. My observation has always been people adapt (in the field and in the forum land.) If we stay that way, we are happy family. After all, for the time being (until everything is remoted), we are all watching/observing/imaging/enjoying the nightsky :) :)!

Clear Skies and Happy Holidays!

ccs_hello
 

#14 b1gred

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 12:02 AM

Well folks,

I was surprised about the move, also, but it's NOT a demotion, just a reclassification. The techniques discussed in this forum are truly a "specialty".

Let's just enjoy having the forum and not ruffle the admins' feathers by griping about where it is...

Remember, "The Admins giveth, the Admins can Taketh away!"
 

#15 Bowmoreman

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 07:05 AM

Totally understood... but... to be fair...

by my count (on that disputed thread), there was precisely...

two folks who were disputing the name... I'm pretty certain from the content and tone of the related posts, at least one of whom has never used a MallinCam... (If that is incorrect, it is "auto-retracted")

Now I don't care what the name is (and the new name IS more accurate truthfully), and I am wicked, super grateful that we have this forum...

But, having this located at the very bottom, below many threads that have NOTHING to do with Astronomy in any way, shape or fashion... well, that is clearly sub-optimal.

Either Imaging Major category, or Equipment Major category - es macht mir nichts,...

But the bottom below Pets? Everyone knows what is UNDER pets, yechhh :sick:

Again, the tone here is grateful appreciation... but I don't think this should be treated as if it were as much of an outlier as it is being treated.

I would just ask that those who are making these decisions consider whether or not any pre-conceived notions might be creeping in - if, and ONLY IF, they haven't already used/been exposed to, these devices...

I think it is (probably) fair to say that ALL (virtually?) of those of us who own/use these devices would classify them as NOT "classic" IMAGING!

To me it isn't imaging in any way/shape/form - its too easy! :roflmao:

Anyhooow... we got the forum, I figure, like cream, it'll eventually rise to the top!

clear skies
 

#16 Peter Argenziano

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 10:56 AM

I don't see why this forum isn't in the Equipment section. Most of the threads deal with the cameras and their associated gear and techniques.
 

#17 mclewis1

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 02:53 PM

Dave,

That's the best response and comments to this uh topic that I've read ... many thanks.


Some other (but not as good as Dave's) comments ...

a) any piece of hardware is "equipement" ... but if we followed that criteria for everything that section would be unmanageable
b) just about any "equipement" can be used for imaging (eyepieces, filters, or diagonals for example) but that doesn't mean it needs to be associated with the imaging forums.
c) while there is indeed a difference between photons that started light years away and those that are generated a few inches from your eye IMHO when you're at the scope and looking at something that is constantly changing your viewing not imaging.
d) where are all the Stellacam owners?

Merry Christmas
 

#18 Bob S.

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 04:18 PM

I don't watch "reality shows" but I do feel like we are kind of "survivors". I mean for crying out loud, placed below gardening? What is interesting about this "newfangled" aspect of the hobby is that I think it is threatening some traditionalist to the core for some unknown reason. Granted, we are now able to see in real-time things that had never been seen in large land-based telescopes with conventional eyepieces. We are also able to view virtually any object better than at any dark site I have ever had the pleasure to visit. By Tom T's admission, he is having a time figuring out where to put us. I certainly understand this. But down in the basement below the gardening section seems a bit odd :lol:
 

#19 1965healy

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 04:20 PM

I'm going to play Mom here for a minute and remind everyone that it's better to be ANYWHERE on the island than in a leaky boat offshore. We've got a forum to post to on THE BEST astronomy site on the internet. That's a wonderful thing and something that happened very quickly thanks to the efforts of our Admins and Mods. We can holler about where we THINK we should be or ENJOY the place that we HAVE. Eat your vegetables, people are STARVING out there. :4
 

#20 Tom T

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 04:59 PM

I don't see why this forum isn't in the Equipment section. Most of the threads deal with the cameras and their associated gear and techniques.


Frankly, I'm confused as to classify you guys as imagers or visual. My first thought was equipment too. Then it was pointed out to me that it might be a better fit under imaging - but the Collins is the exception to that. It is a fairly specialized topic, hence the move down here till I can justify/figure out where else.... Equipment does seem the natural place, and it will probably wind up back there. (One thing's for sure, somebody will be ticked no matter what I do. :lol:)

Seriously tho, I'm suprised at the reactions I'm seeing. in some ways, this whole debate reminds me of the old "goto vs starhop" arguement from years ago.

(BTW - I know there's been some requests for multiple forums for this group, but honestly, I think that would do more harm than good at this point - keep it all together and keep the traffic up for now. Lets see what the traffic is like down the road, and then we can look at splitting it off into another group....)
 

#21 Tom T

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 05:02 PM

I'm glad we have the forum and shouldn't complain but seriously, this is equipment which should be discussed in the equipment section. Me, personally, if I was at a star party, I wouldn't even bring my Mallincam. I would want to be dark adapted too.

I hope they will forgive us!!!

Neil

We couldn't get placed above Pets, Gardening, and Audiophiliacs??? I wouldn't expect too many folks to find this forum where it is, I usually stop scrolling down when I see Pets and Gardening...

- Doug


I didn't think about it like that. I guess it is pretty unfair to give us this type of gift a couple of weeks ago, and then stick us in the most remote part of CN after a couple of heated threads. I hope that we are not now pegged as a bunch of trouble makers, running around at star parties shinning bright lights in every ones faces.

Neil


Neil,

No worries on that.

As per "sticking" you guys somewhere - this just happens to be where the specialty forums are. It had nothing to do with "heated threads" just a confusion in my mind as to where you guys are best placed.

Time is frequently needed to work things out. Patience is always appreciated.
 

#22 smokin oakum

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 05:16 PM

Take your time Tom. I'm even having a hard time figuring out a way to classify this unique form of observing. What ever we end up with, I hope people realize that we DO have a place that is easy to navigate and very well thought of in the astronomy community.

Neil
 

#23 rolandskythree

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 06:11 PM

I was an early proponent of a forum about a year ago, as Tom knows. Believe me: existing anywhere is better than abusing one or two threads to cram every problem from how to find an off/switch to monitor issues. However, the forums are not set up as a matter of importance; their positioning really does not mean much; the statistics (which are tracked) tell the real story of use; and (most important) coherent and consistent posting (activity with purpose and content) speaks louder than anything. So, folks, observe, keep posting, keep content high, be excited users with your postings, keep the fluff (lots of hot air but not much content) down. It won't take long before the newbies will find out where we are; they will find answers to questions and get excited themselves; and a high degree of technical questions and good posts will help everyone. Again, it is so so so much better than jury-rigging one post to answer everything. I did that for several months; we don't want to do that again. And, in this field, things are going to change pretty fast (read my post about the future...I was not being funny). There will be tools coming to light and improvements of existing tools that will keep this forum very busy...and help everyone.

Remember, it is self policing. Moderators do a good job, but the real responsibility of good content and an active answer-the-mail postings comes from us. If we do a good job, write our best, be as clear as possible, and be genuine in our respect as this field widens, I believe it will answer any questions by those unfamiliar or those who do not like the tools.

Clear skies.

Roland
 

#24 mclewis1

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 06:28 PM

I know it's a very abused quote but I think it applies here ... You can call me anything you like, just don't call me late for dinner!

Ho ho ho
 

#25 Chris Schroeder

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 07:55 PM

I was an early proponent of a forum about a year ago, as Tom knows. Believe me: existing anywhere is better than abusing one or two threads to cram every problem from how to find an off/switch to monitor issues. However, the forums are not set up as a matter of importance; their positioning really does not mean much; the statistics (which are tracked) tell the real story of use; and (most important) coherent and consistent posting (activity with purpose and content) speaks louder than anything. So, folks, observe, keep posting, keep content high, be excited users with your postings, keep the fluff (lots of hot air but not much content) down. It won't take long before the newbies will find out where we are; they will find answers to questions and get excited themselves; and a high degree of technical questions and good posts will help everyone. Again, it is so so so much better than jury-rigging one post to answer everything. I did that for several months; we don't want to do that again. And, in this field, things are going to change pretty fast (read my post about the future...I was not being funny). There will be tools coming to light and improvements of existing tools that will keep this forum very busy...and help everyone.

Remember, it is self policing. Moderators do a good job, but the real responsibility of good content and an active answer-the-mail postings comes from us. If we do a good job, write our best, be as clear as possible, and be genuine in our respect as this field widens, I believe it will answer any questions by those unfamiliar or those who do not like the tools.

Clear skies.

Roland

Very well put Roland, as a MOD, it's our job to keep things on track and to make sure no one is abusing the TOS. It's up to you, the users to keep it interesting, fun and non-argumentative.
 


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