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Samsung SDC-435 = 8.5 seconds integration @ $153

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#51 greg

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 01:30 PM

Well that's GOOD to know..... Thanks Guys

So can the SSNR be turned off?
Of course you would have noise at X512, But I'm wondering if SSNR may see some of our Faint detail as Noise and try to remove it.

I think that SSNR off and cooling the ccd will probably result in the best image, especially in the summer when it's warmer, But I don't know this because I don't even have the camera yet.... :cool:

For those interested in this camera, I will test it in these scopes:
16" F/3 with focal reduction it will be around F/2
10" Meade F/4 S/N probably around F/2.5
Celestron ST 102mm F/5 , around F/3
And I have a 50mm finderscope set up as a guide scope, it has a 1.25 adaptor so I may be able to get the Samsung 435 to come to focus with it so we can see if the camera will work as an E-Finder.


GregW :imawake:

#52 ngchunter

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 02:25 PM

Yes, SSNR can be turned off at any time. You can also adjust the amount of SSNR noise reduction when it's turned on.

#53 scout72

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 02:28 PM

Gain has to be on for SSNR to function.
With Gain On, SSNR is OFF or ON and level from 1-31

I have to do some more testing to determine the best settings for the faint fuzzies, but with no IR filter on camera and no filter on the scope on m51 at x512, SDR on 4, I had to use the SSNR pretty high to get a usable image, but mostly due to light pollution.

I was surprised that with gain on HIGH, brightness turned up all the way, SSNR on 31, SDR on medium, I was able to get some nebulosity on m42 at 1/60th of a second, without too much noise ,with the neb filter on scope - granted it was in the mid 40's here last night, but that is pretty good at 1/60th of a second without being totally washed out in noise.

#54 scout72

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 02:33 PM

ps- the image at the beginning of the thread of the pleiades stars I took with this camera before I took the filter off was through a 50mm finder, after filter removal all of the stars have big ole halos through the finder.

#55 donnie3

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 03:14 PM

my camera should be here tomorrow. i located a real small fan that I'm sure would set on top of the camera with no side overlap. would like to use a external power supply like a battery pack with a off on switch. does anyone know where i could get something like this. would be nice if i could solder the lines somewhere internally then to a off on switch but I'm not sure i have the skills to do this, if i had the knowledge i would probably try it knowing me. don

#56 ngchunter

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 03:53 PM

Gain has to be on for SSNR to function.

Oh yeah, that, forgot to mention that part. Sorry. SSNR would be rather pointless with gain off since the noise is virtually non-existent with gain off.

#57 scout72

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 04:17 PM

i located a real small fan that I'm sure would set on top of the camera with no side overlap. would like to use a external power supply like a battery pack with a off on switch. does anyone know where i could get something like this.



What voltage is the fan?

#58 donnie3

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 04:56 PM

scout72, its a 12 volt.

#59 scout72

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 08:26 PM

A small 12v fan like that is going to have such low draw that I would think you could wire it in line with the terminals for the camera coming from the power supply- that is what I would do but proceed at your own risk. That way you wouldn't need a separate power switch.

#60 donnie3

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 08:45 PM

thanks scout72, thats a real good idea. don

#61 ngchunter

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 11:31 PM

That's what I did with my fan; worked great tonight for the first couple hours until the positive wire to the fan became dislodged. I'll have to fix it later when I have some time.

#62 donnie3

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 07:30 AM

just one more question. might be a dumb one but i would rather be safe then sorry. when installing the fan externally, do you place the fan where the air is being drawed out of the camera or in. don

#63 Jamie

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 08:09 PM

NGChunter:
How are you attaching the mini fan to the camera?
Jamie

#64 Sky Captain

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 09:20 PM

just one more question. might be a dumb one but i would rather be safe then sorry. when installing the fan externally, do you place the fan where the air is being drawed out of the camera or in. don


The main goal is to evacuate the hot air out of the case.

If the fan is blowing air IN-TO the case, you need to provide an exit for the hot air.

If you are sucking the hot air OUT of the case, then you still need to provide a way to draw cooler outside air into the case, and then out the fan.

If you don't want to drill anymore venting/inlet holes, then just installing the fan and having it draw OUT the hot air will work as well, but you won't get the full benefit from the fan install...it's certainly better than nothing.

#65 donnie3

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 09:31 PM

my camera arrived today, well built and my 12.5-75 lens and scope adapter fit perfect. i broke down and ordered 24volt adapter from 123 security products, nice people. i talked to one of their reps and he recommended the 24v. it comes with a 6 foot line that has a female plug in at the end of it. I'm going to mess with it for a while before i do any mods. sure would like to get an answer about the fan air flow in or out. thanks, don

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#66 ngchunter

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 09:20 AM

Externally, using some velcro at the sides of the camera and on the rubber feet of the fan, as well as a bungie cord wrapped around the whole thing. It's surprisingly stable and removable.

#67 Jamie

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 10:38 AM

Thanks - easy do.
Did you put any extra air vent holes in, and if so where?
Thanks - Jamie

#68 Waggonner

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 11:53 AM

The best way to achieve cooling with a fan that might not fit inside would be to install the fan externally on the case. Ideally a ducting system should direct the inflowing air over the chip...flexible tubing mounted over the vent hole on the inside of the case. Of course i have not seen the inside of this camera thus don't have any idea how much room there is. But with flexible tubing you could bend/turn it around components and get directed cooling with minimal space.

#69 donnie3

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 01:15 PM

if someone with this camera(sdc435) comes up with a workable cooling system, it would be really helpful and much appreciated if we could see some detailed photos of the system. thanks,don

#70 greg

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 01:16 PM

I will have my 435 today so I'm going off the pictures in the Thread about removing the filter, but if you are going to try Fan cooling only, I think I would drill the inlet holes in the Nose piece near the CCD curcuit board and even drill on an angle so as to direct the air flow to the curcuit board, then drill the exhaust holes under the fan.

I would use the fan to pull air out of the camera.

Of course this is coming from a guy that doesn't even have, and has never even seen the camera, So my thinking may change later today when my camera arives. :grin:
GregW

#71 greg

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 01:28 PM

I will be looking into TEC cooling this camera ( if its worth it after testing noise)

What ever type of cooling I choose I will post Images.

I all ready have and have been testing Fans and a TEC cooler.

The problem, as I see it for TEC cooling, is there is no access to the back side of the CCD chip.... Big Problem...

So, I will be doing a lot of testing to see if TEC cooling will benifit the image with gain on high, at 8.5 seconds, in warm weather.

After seeing uncooled StellaCam images in warm weather, I think this camera will need to be TEC cooled to get the Max out of it in Summmer if using gain on high and full 8.5 seconds.

GregW

#72 ngchunter

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 04:43 PM

I haven't put any extra holes in it... yet. I just blow air at two unused screw holes in the top of the case. The case itself warms up when you're not cooling it, so even just cooling the case will have a heat sink effect to some extent. Eventually I do plan to drill holes in the top and again in the bottom near the chip.

#73 donnie3

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 08:11 PM

has anyone taken the top case off. i took the two small screws out and tried to pull it apart, it would not budge! i didn't went to do any prying so i put the two screws back in. what did i need to do in order to get the cover off. don

#74 scout72

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 09:53 PM

all you have to do is remove those two screws then squeeze the sides towards the bottom- don't take out any other screws.

#75 donnie3

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 11:30 PM

thanks scout72, i took the camrea out last night, the temp, was about 38 degrees,no problem with noise. i wish i understood these cameras a little better. i set the camera acording to your settings for both lens and scope, i got a few stars on the screen using the lens but when i tryed my orion 80mm st refractor, nothing!!! i had the same problem with a polaris camera i had a while back. im trying to figure out what im doing wrong???? any suggestions would really be appreciated. ive tryed different settings, run the focus in and out. the sens-up dont seem to funtion, the instruction booklet states off or auto, it just has 3 dashs, no off or auto. i set it up in the house with the lens and it works great. HELP PLEASE. don


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