853 replies to this topic

[bsavoie]

I fell in love with 'astronomy' two years ago, now at 69, in fact, today, astronomy seems bigger. Three days ago (Monday 6/1/15) I bought a used Vixen SG 2.1x42 super wide field binoculars. I learn about astronomy by following classified ads. I did not know about low power (2.1x) wide field (26 degree) binoculars. I just didn't know. I have Vixen Ascot 10x50 with 8.5 degree field of view, and I love them. Thought I knew this part of astronomy.

 

Then I saw the ad, and googled. Wow, I found it very interesting. Something very different. I am planning to solo drive (Prius) from Alabama to San Francisco in about 7 weeks. I can imagine myself driving in the middle of no where, in the middle of the night. Wow to be able to pull of the road, and use these 26 degree binoculars. All I need is a fold down lawn chair!

 

So I clicked. Today, Thursday, it arrived in the mail. I spend a few minutes walking around in my backyard, around noon with lots of clouds, but I can get a sense of how wonderful these will be.

 

Astronomy is constantly changing, new equipment, new perspectives, new travels, and all that happens with used equipment. We know the past of astronomy but we don't know its future. What I can say, is praise be!

 

Bill

[csrlice12]

So, once you've got all the scopes packed, where's everything else gonna go?

[jrbarnett]

I fell in love with 'astronomy' two years ago, now at 69, in fact, today, astronomy seems bigger. Three days ago (Monday 6/1/15) I bought a used Vixen SG 2.1x42 super wide field binoculars. I learn about astronomy by following classified ads. I did not know about low power (2.1x) wide field (26 degree) binoculars. I just didn't know. I have Vixen Ascot 10x50 with 8.5 degree field of view, and I love them. Thought I knew this part of astronomy.

 

Then I saw the ad, and googled. Wow, I found it very interesting. Something very different. I am planning to solo drive (Prius) from Alabama to San Francisco in about 7 weeks. I can imagine myself driving in the middle of no where, in the middle of the night. Wow to be able to pull of the road, and use these 26 degree binoculars. All I need is a fold down lawn chair!

 

So I clicked. Today, Thursday, it arrived in the mail. I spend a few minutes walking around in my backyard, around noon with lots of clouds, but I can get a sense of how wonderful these will be.

 

Astronomy is constantly changing, new equipment, new perspectives, new travels, and all that happens with used equipment. We know the past of astronomy but we don't know its future. What I can say, is praise be!

 

Bill

Bill, I like both your attitude and style.  Since you've recently joined the ranks of the backyard astronomers, you're proof positive that the hobby is alive and well, and merely overflowing the banks of its more traditional course in terms of who participates and why.

 

(I'd actually step back another 20,000 feet and characterize what's happening as stargazing is finally eroding the artificially rigid flood control that has hampered and defined it for the last hundred years or so, and returning to it's broader, more inclusive, less rigidly defined borders that predominated during the twelve thousand or so years that preceded the present.   )

 

EDIT:  Also thanks for the tip on those Vixen 2.1x42, 25-degree TFOV  binoculars.  After a little poking around I found a pair in stock and ordered them for a dark sky trip coming up later this month.  I'm even mulling over using them to do next March's Messier Marathon.  A great companion Atlas for these binoculars ought to be Birren's Objects in the Heavens.  Peter's limiting magnitude for the guide is 10, so from a dark sky site a large percentage of the targets in the book should be detectable using these binoculars.   

 

- Jim 

Edited by jrbarnett, 04 June 2015 - 03:40 PM.

[Bomber Bob]

Bill & Jim, I try to be optimistic, and see the present as transition, because... here & now, on the ground, in the real world, I don't see Young People in the same numbers in the US as in decades past interested in stargazing.  It may be different in other countries, and that would be a good thing.

 

It's been a while back, but I think a CNer published figures on the Global sales volume for telescopes, and those numbers were promising.  So, if the decline is more of an American phenomenon, then I guess WE have to do better at recruiting the youths.

[Mr. Bill]

Bill & Jim, I try to be optimistic, and see the present as transition, because... here & now, on the ground, in the real world, I don't see Young People in the same numbers in the US as in decades past interested in stargazing.  It may be different in other countries, and that would be a good thing.

 

It's been a while back, but I think a CNer published figures on the Global sales volume for telescopes, and those numbers were promising.  So, if the decline is more of an American phenomenon, then I guess WE have to do better at recruiting the youths.

 

Why?

[whosthebadman]

 

I fell in love with 'astronomy' two years ago, now at 69, in fact, today, astronomy seems bigger. Three days ago (Monday 6/1/15) I bought a used Vixen SG 2.1x42 super wide field binoculars. I learn about astronomy by following classified ads. I did not know about low power (2.1x) wide field (26 degree) binoculars. I just didn't know. I have Vixen Ascot 10x50 with 8.5 degree field of view, and I love them. Thought I knew this part of astronomy.

 

...

 

So I clicked. Today, Thursday, it arrived in the mail. I spend a few minutes walking around in my backyard, around noon with lots of clouds, but I can get a sense of how wonderful these will be.

EDIT:  Also thanks for the tip on those Vixen 2.1x42, 25-degree TFOV  binoculars.  After a little poking around I found a pair in stock and ordered them for a dark sky trip coming up later this month.  I'm even mulling over using them to do next March's Messier Marathon. 

 

 

 

Anyone wanting to know more about these can reference two lively, active, ongoing threads in the Binoculars forum.  Here are some links for you, if you're inclined:

 

http://www.cloudynig...ield-binoculars

 

http://www.cloudynig...he-vixen-21x42/

Edited by whosthebadman, 04 June 2015 - 04:26 PM.

[Bomber Bob]

For the reason I encourage literacy, or math skills - benefits the individual and society.  Because IME, for every large number X that are introduced to something like stargazing, the percentage who continue in that activity on their own is small.

[JayinUT]

My answer to this is who cares? Some go, some don't, that is what happens. I have never lost my personal excitement for amateur astronomy or the "hobby" but I have had times in my life when the weather, or personal health or family health or career obligations have to come first. Astronomy is a love of mine, but it is that, a hobby. So though I may wane from time to time, I always come back to it because I have unfinished business as I call it and that unfinished business calls to me.  So are people leaving? Yep, sure are. Are some coming into it? Yep, sure are. Are some coming back to it? Yep, sure are. Again, what someone does or doesn't do is their business in accordance with their life and choice. I don't have time to evaluate that or determine the causes, nor does it deeply matter to me.  In the end, much like most things in this hobby, the hobby is done alone and the experience is usually a deep personal one for why someone does what they do, be that personal observing, outreach, solar, deep sky, planetary, double star, etc. That to me is what is fascinating most about this hobby. Is how individuals have their own thing they follow in it and how they pursue it in the most human of ways.  I also think there are far more into the hobby then post here or online. They simply read and then head out to do their thing. YMMV of course and opinion differ from mine, but that is fine also. The hobby is big enough for a variety of interests I believe.  

[bsavoie]

OK, back to the start of this thread 'Are Amateurs leaving astronomy hobby?'

 

We might look at 'astronomy hobby'. To me it is not a hobby. It is the fact of how we got here. We are looking back into time, millions of years, to the building of iron molecules. Those molecules allow us to breathe.

 

Two little oxygen molecules are holding each other, floating in front of our mouths. We open and inhale them. But it is the iron molecule, that convinces them to leave the air and go into the blood.

 

Why does that happen?

 

It might be because of history. The journey of that iron molecule, in leaving an exploding star, gives it a charisma that the oxygen molecules can't resist. After all, molecules start from hydrogen and work their way into bigger and bigger molecules. They all start the same, but some have more interesting stories.

 

So perhaps history is recorded in some way. In the testable properties of the molecules themselves.

 

Is this a hobby, this breathing of air? Does it have no other meaning than to organize into the words of Greek star constellations? I hope not.

 

The question, can be rephrased. What is the meaning of matter? What is it, and how does that knowledge inform us in how best to live life?

 

We have seen the stars, but we have not recognized them yet. They are our mother, the intermediate step between the big bang and this moment now. We are their children, and we are now on the path of learning about the totality of everything. This learning is not a hobby, it is more important than that.

Edited by bsavoie, 04 June 2015 - 07:55 PM.

[Sloan]

People not interested in Astronomy, think again. Just setup your telescope in any public spot and watch them line up.

Edited by Sloan, 04 June 2015 - 08:32 PM.

[Mr. Bill]

bsavoie, bit metaphysical for me.....

 

My comment above was a response to outreach.....as I've said before in this and other related threads I don't think it's incumbent on me to promote the hobby like some huckster selling patent medicine.

 

Those that are interested in astronomy will always gravitate to it like I did 30 years ago. 

Edited by Mr. Bill, 04 June 2015 - 08:34 PM.

[Kidastronomer]

02:27:15-2d.jpg People not interested in Astronomy, think again. Just setup your telescope in any public spot and watch them line up.

Probably not a dob, the police will think it's a cannon.

[BrooksObs]

02:27:15-2d.jpg People not interested in Astronomy, think again. Just setup your telescope in any public spot and watch them line up.

 

Quite honest any distraction that offers the opportunity of momentary amusement in an urban setting will always draw a crowd, be it in the form of a street magician, dancing dogs, or a man with a telescope. I'm afraid such situations don't reflect anything like an actual public interest in astronomy. There were fellas hawking $0.25 a view through big refractors set up in Times Square and on Boston Commons a century ago without stimulating any rise in the hobby's numbers. It's really nothing new.  

 

BrroksObs 

Edited by BrooksObs, 04 June 2015 - 09:08 PM.

[jrbarnett]

02:27:15-2d.jpg People not interested in Astronomy, think again. Just setup your telescope in any public spot and watch them line up.

Um, that's Texas.  How come those street lights are still intact?  Oh, I see.  You're not in Texas.  You're in Austin.  

 

It also helps that the scope is burnt orange.  Go Longhorns!

 

- Jim

Edited by jrbarnett, 05 June 2015 - 09:50 AM.

[bsavoie]

Sloan, I see much more in that photo than astronomy, and the call of metaphysics. I see a beautiful lady, and a telescope owner with a big smile. It looks like a classical courtship ritual. Put out a beautiful telescope and watch who shows up. Many of the bird species use this technique. They build a beautiful nest, and if they get lucky in a few months eggs are found in that nest.

 

This might be the only way for an excellent student, who fully learns math, to actually produce some eggs. No time for dating in the normal way, but successful none the less, with just a telescope and smile.

 

One way to get new people into astronomy is to let the eggs learn from the start as children.

 

Efficiency has no finer point..

 

 Bill

[csrlice12]

I see a lady with super strength..she's able to hold up and move that SCT with two fingers by the eyepiece alone.  Rumour has it, she's a solid mount up to 800X.

 

That ladder's gotta be uncomfortable though....

Edited by csrlice12, 05 June 2015 - 12:29 PM.

[schang]

 

02:27:15-2d.jpg People not interested in Astronomy, think again. Just setup your telescope in any public spot and watch them line up.

 

Quite honest any distraction that offers the opportunity of momentary amusement in an urban setting will always draw a crowd, be it in the form of a street magician, dancing dogs, or a man with a telescope. I'm afraid such situations don't reflect anything like an actual public interest in astronomy. There were fellas hawking $0.25 a view through big refractors set up in Times Square and on Boston Commons a century ago without stimulating any rise in the hobby's numbers. It's really nothing new.  

 

BrroksObs 

 

 

 

 02:27:15-2d.jpg People not interested in Astronomy, think again. Just setup your telescope in any public spot and watch them line up.

 

Quite honest any distraction that offers the opportunity of momentary amusement in an urban setting will always draw a crowd, be it in the form of a street magician, dancing dogs, or a man with a telescope. I'm afraid such situations don't reflect anything like an actual public interest in astronomy. There were fellas hawking $0.25 a view through big refractors set up in Times Square and on Boston Commons a century ago without stimulating any rise in the hobby's numbers. It's really nothing new.  

 

BrroksObs 

 

There is some truth to it...

 

I took my wife twice (spanning some 25 years) to university observatories when they were opening to the public for viewing.  My wife has yet to develop an interest in this hobby.   

[Sloan]

Tsk, tsk such cynical people. Many people are very thankful that they had an opportunity to see the planets. I make it very easy for them. No need to go to the local university on a certain date and time or wait for a local star party that they might not hear about until its too late. Some people hang around for a good while to talk about astronomy. Surprisingly lots of people have astronomy apps on their smart phones. Many people with kids want them to see what's up in the heavens, maybe spark a life long interest in science. What got me into it was a small reflector when I was around 10. Even with that small scope I could the see ice cap on Mars and that got me hook on astronomy. Will everybody who looks in my telescope become interested in astronomy, of course not, but some will and that what matters. The word I hear the most is "WOW".

Edited by Sloan, 09 June 2015 - 11:01 AM.

[schang]

No argument from me about public events for a good cause...I tried, and but none of my immediate family members are interested...  

[GilATM]

I started looking at the planets and moon when I was 11, built my first telescope when I was 13, and still observe and make my own scopes.   I have built telescopes with both of my kids, done public observing, shown the stars to my clients, to people in group homes, to neighbors, and people that stop when they see me at road pull outs.   I am not aware of anyone that took up the hobby due to my efforts, but then again, how would I possibly know???    (My daughter is studying astrophysics though.)

 

Part of my interest is in telescope making - now THAT is a part of the hobby that has shrunk over the last 20 years - but I'm ok with that.  It is a hobby - a hobby that does not require group effort - so more or fewer in the hobby doesn't interrupt my own pursuits. 

 

Also, it is a hobby that does not require constant purchases - I have eyepieces that are 50 years old that work just fine.    What I see in a simple 6" scope looks pretty much the same as what I see in virtually any telescope - and I could easily continue in the hobby for a lifetime with a very modest investment.   

 

If anything, I think a focus on equipment can put people off.   Focus on the experience, the esthetics, the philosophical wonder it generates, and some will connect and include it as part of their life - which may only mean they will download a phone app.  I'm OK with that.   In my book, they too are amateur astronomers.  

 

Gil

[Ghostpaw]

For what it's worth...

 

New planet discovered by 15-year-old intern

http://www.cnn.com/2...anet/index.html

[GilATM]

So as luck would have it, yesterday I was at a graduation reception and talked a bit to Caltech's president, physicist Dr. Rosenbaum.   My daughter mentioned I was an amateur astronomer, and built my own scopes.   He asked if I used the computerized "goto" mounts.   I said "no, it isn't as much fun."    He responded that he had a star phone ap that he likes.    I agreed that they were "great!".

 

It got me thinking that perhaps we need to adapt to the more modern experience of astronomy - though it may be regrettable to those of us that love telescopes and raw photons on our retina.   But astronomy is about the universe, not the equipment we use to enjoy it.    Lets include our phone ap brothers and sisters into the hobby - our ranks will swell.

 

- Gil

[csrlice12]

well, since they're using small screens, the IAU has determined they can be called "dwarf-astronomers"....not to be confused with dwarfs who do astronomy...when asked for clarification, the IAU got short with me.....

[thehand]

So as luck would have it, yesterday I was at a graduation reception and talked a bit to Caltech's president, physicist Dr. Rosenbaum.   My daughter mentioned I was an amateur astronomer, and built my own scopes.   He asked if I used the computerized "goto" mounts.   I said "no, it isn't as much fun."    He responded that he had a star phone ap that he likes.    I agreed that they were "great!".

 

It got me thinking that perhaps we need to adapt to the more modern experience of astronomy - though it may be regrettable to those of us that love telescopes and raw photons on our retina.   But astronomy is about the universe, not the equipment we use to enjoy it.    Lets include our phone ap brothers and sisters into the hobby - our ranks will swell.

 

- Gil

 

I have to disagree with your point on equipment.  Part of what makes this field intersting and fun is the equipment.  If it was all about the view I would just spend time looking at HST photos and the like and never exposing myself to mosquitos or the occasional inquisative wet dog nose in the dark.

 

As to goto being boring, I think it depends what you are trying to do.  If locating the object is part of the fun then yes I could see how it would be a let down.  On the other hand if locating the object is tedious or neigh impossible due to light pollution, then it enhances the ecperience.

 

Finally, being relatively new, the phone apps are helpful tools.  It may not be a full star atlas but it helps wiyh oriontation and planning, especially when it's the middle of the day and you're wondering where something is and when it will be above the horizon.

[Bomber Bob]

"If it was all about the view I would just spend time looking at HST photos and the like and never exposing myself to mosquitos or the occasional inquisative wet dog nose in the dark." 

 

I'm glad I started the hobby in the pre-digital age.  The focus (pun intended) was on equipment, charts, and techniques for visual observing.  Had to learn celestial mechanics and setting circles, and translating the dots on the chart to the star fields in the eyepiece, which gave me an appreciation for the vastness of space.  Does go-to or interactive apps give the same experience?  I hope so.