30 replies to this topic

[AnakChan]

I started this thread a few weeks back of looking at a Vixen AX103S coming from owning a VC200L for 18 years. It's clear to me now from the advice I've been given that coming from a 200mm (even with a 42% obstruction) is  to a103mm objective merely going to be unsatisfying visually.

 

I think ideally a Mewlon 250 would probably give me the best of all compromise of a large aperture but an APO-like & contrasty image which I lack on the VC200L. Unfortunately the Mewlon 250 is out of my price reach. The options narrowed down are now :-
 

1) TOA-130NS (which is on an auction expiring tonight) - priced approx USD$3935 2nd hand which seems like a good deal

   - I think decent pricing but would visually be an "upgrade" from the VC200L?

   - I don't know if I'm more tempted on this for Takahashi's reputation rather than it's capability over the other two options below. In addition, since it's on auction I'm afraid if I lose this opportunity I may not get the chance again

 

2) APM/Lunt 152 priced approx USD$4120 new

   - I read the TOA-130 vs Lunt 152 thread and although the general recommendation is the Lunt 152 for its larger aperture, I don't think any of the responders have seen both side-by-side to determine how much of an improvement of the Lunt 152 is over the TOA-130.

   - It's a doublet and some posts seem to say there's a little CA. Whilst another review I read that there's no CA when in focus.

 

3) VMC260L priced approx USD$2600 2nd hand

   - currently product is not available and being sent back to Vixen for maintenance.

   - concerned if it has the same low contrastness of the VC200L

 

The TEC140 is not an option as I'm not prepared to wait 6 months to a year and it's pricer than any of the aforementioned options. I also looked at the Celestron EdgeHD 11" but with mirror shift, dew, and weight it's not for me. My mount is a Vixen SXP so max 16kg OTA, and personally I think I'd take a 12kg weight max. I will need to transport my gear for a minimum 2 hr drive out of Tokyo everytime I want to view and in addition my car is small - I think I can handle a max 1000mm length OTA.

 

So should I jump on the TOA-130NS tonight or am I misprioritising owning a Tak over more practical visual purpose?

[SpooPoker]

I, until recently, owned the TOA - great scope, but 5" is still 5".  Great for AP, but visually, I was begging for more aperture.  Did great on Planets and 1" or wider doubles though. 

 

The Lunt ED has a more meaty apeture, images will appear roughly 50% brighter.  The little CA it has will prove a minor distraction but if the lenses are well figured, it should produce a small bump up on the TOA visually on just about most objects. 

 

The VMC260L has three slight niggles for me - ridiculous focal length / ratio, huge whopping obstruction @ 34% and multicoatings on the corrector lenses that give objects an interesting hue.  It will definitely be go deeper and dimmer than the other two as well as splitting tighter doubles.  On planets / moon, tougher to tell.  The optics are much larger than the ED/APO's you looking at - resolution will be nearly twice that of the 130TOA, but a lot of that will be fuzzed up a little by the large obstruction.  Case of dirtier but potentially more versus cleaner but potentially less. 

 

I vote for the 6" Lunt ED - it will probably be better on planets than the VMC260L, and there is nothing stopping you getting a 12" DOB in future which to complement the ED.  What could be more perfect?  A classic medium refractor and a classic large reflector side by side to make that night sky yours to own.   I personally would run a mile from most Cassegrains. 

[dweller25]

SpooPoker has this spot on, of the three scopes you mention I would also buy the 6" Lunt ED -  but a 12" Dob will beat it.

[samovu]

You didn't mention what kind of viewing you are most interested in.  

 

And try not to get caught up in the excitement of an auction. If you think you "need" the TOA you may bid more than you want in the last few minutes. Been there with another type of item. Done that.

 

Also, if you are willing to buy used, will a Mewlon (non-s) work? Although it was through AM, one sold not long ago for something like 3.9k and that was with a ScopeGuard case and also the CR corrector. 

 

Cheers,

John

[AnakChan]

Thank you for the responses folks and good question John. I've been into primarily DSOs - the planetary nebulae, galaxies, etc. Tentatively the VC200L will stay for AP (may need an overhaul first though - 18 yrs is a long time). This is where I do get a little education of mid-focal length of 1000mm + high powered eyepieces vs a long focal length of 2000-3000mm + mid powered eyepieces. I actually don't know which way to go in that respect.
 

It seems with the advice given, aperture seems to win regardless of doublets vs triplets, and in the case of the APM/Lunt 152, no one seems to highlight of CA being a concern.

 

I think the Mewlon you're referring to on AS is the one Dr. Who is buying. It's a µ-210. I had an opportunity to pick up one of those a few weeks ago but let it go 'cos it was marginally bigger than my VC200L, and thought if I were going to spend that amount of $$, use it to contribute for something bigger. Sadly an available µ-250 in Australia is a considerable jump to ~USD$5700 pre-shipping back to Tokyo.

 

I truly appreciated the advice given so far and welcome more suggestions including "way of thinking" 'cos I'm still learning.

[SpooPoker]

My thoughts:

 

If you intend to keep your 8" Vixen modified MAK and DSO's are your main targets, you may be dissapointed in the 6" ED/APO.  It will not really be a quantum jump on some deep sky objects, while on others it could actually be a step backwards.  It will do much better on planetary detail and low contrast doubles (bright primary, dim secondary) over what you have, but that is about it.

 

TBH, if DSO's form your main observing, look no further than a DOB of 12" to 16" aperture.  While a 6" APO / ED is a fantastic instrument to own, a 12 - 16" DOB would present a huge step up in DSO observing.  And with a halfway decent mirror, they are not too shabby on planets either.   If one were to use a scope mainly for planetary observing and doubles, a strong case could be made for the 6" APO.  Throw DSO's in the mix, the DOB would be a wiser purchase IMO. 

 

If your heart is set on a Takahashi / Vixen Scope, a used Mewlon may be the way forward. 

[samovu]

Thank you for the responses folks and good question John. I've been into primarily DSOs - the planetary nebulae, galaxies, etc. Tentatively the VC200L will stay for AP (may need an overhaul first though - 18 yrs is a long time). This is where I do get a little education of mid-focal length of 1000mm + high powered eyepieces vs a long focal length of 2000-3000mm + mid powered eyepieces. I actually don't know which way to go in that respect.
 

It seems with the advice given, aperture seems to win regardless of doublets vs triplets, and in the case of the APM/Lunt 152, no one seems to highlight of CA being a concern.

 

I think the Mewlon you're referring to on AS is the one Dr. Who is buying. It's a µ-210. I had an opportunity to pick up one of those a few weeks ago but let it go 'cos it was marginally bigger than my VC200L, and thought if I were going to spend that amount of $$, use it to contribute for something bigger. Sadly an available µ-250 in Australia is a considerable jump to ~USD$5700 pre-shipping back to Tokyo.

 

I truly appreciated the advice given so far and welcome more suggestions including "way of thinking" 'cos I'm still learning.

 

Is the Mewlon for sale in Australia a Mewlon 250S? The S versions seem to sell for more than the non-S versions. The former has the double rings and is the newer model. Over here in the US the Mewlon 210 sell new for $3,560. The 3,900 price I recall was for a Mewlon 250. Perhaps it was a very god deal considering it came with the CR attachment that sells for over $1,000 new.

 

Good luck with whatever you decide. 

 

Cheers,

John

[maadscientist]

 

The VMC260L has three slight niggles for me  resolution will be nearly twice that of the 130TOA, but a lot of that will be fuzzed up a little by the large obstruction.  Case of dirtier but potentially more versus cleaner but potentially less. 

 

 

This is INCORRECT and gives people the impression that the increase in aperture is mostly offset by the central obstruction.

 

The VMC260 gives tack sharp images of the moon and planets, and at 22 pounds WITH a carry handle is easy to move around.

 

Dan L

[AnakChan]

The one in Oz just says 250...no S nor CRS designation. A µ-210 2nd hand sold for approx USD$1647 in excellent condition. Very tempted to buy but thought if it was more worthy to use the same $$ to contribute to something bigger. A 2nd hand µ-250 CRS sold for approx USD$5856, whilst a normal µ-250 went for USD$3385. It's a pity I missed the boat on that one.

 

Back to the TOA-130NS, somehow I'm still itching to pick that up. I'm actually not certain if there's room for a 1000mm length OTA. There's no away I can squeeze in a DOB in my car (def not 16" anyway, 12" maybe?). Here's how my car is packed when I have to transport my telescope. This is about all the space I can play with :-

 

[maadscientist]

I started this thread a few weeks back of looking at a Vixen AX103S coming from owning a VC200L for 18 years. It's clear to me now from the advice I've been given that coming from a 200mm (even with a 42% obstruction) is  to a103mm objective merely going to be unsatisfying visually.

 

I think ideally a Mewlon 250 would probably give me the best of all compromise of a large aperture but an APO-like & contrasty image which I lack on the VC200L. 

 

 

 

The VC200L was designed as a imaging scope. If I may ask, why did you acquire it for visual?

 

Dan L

[AnakChan]

I started this thread a few weeks back of looking at a Vixen AX103S coming from owning a VC200L for 18 years. It's clear to me now from the advice I've been given that coming from a 200mm (even with a 42% obstruction) is  to a103mm objective merely going to be unsatisfying visually.
 
I think ideally a Mewlon 250 would probably give me the best of all compromise of a large aperture but an APO-like & contrasty image which I lack on the VC200L.

 
The VC200L was designed as a imaging scope. If I may ask, why did you acquire it for visual?
 
Dan L

I bought the VC200L back in 1996 from Oz when I was looking for something more portable than the Meade DS-10. It was advised to me back then it would have been fine for visual and AP. Bear in mind that back in 1996 the VC200L was very new and unknown.

[maadscientist]

A DK of 10 inches, or VMC 260 will both excel on galaxies and planetary nebula. The step up in aperture will be noticeable, but not the punch you will get from a 16 inch dob as SpooPoker has suggested.

 

Dan L

[BillP]

I read the TOA-130 vs Lunt 152 thread and although the general recommendation is the Lunt 152 for its larger aperture, I don't think any of the responders have seen both side-by-side to determine how much of an improvement of the Lunt 152 is over the TOA-130.

   - It's a doublet and some posts seem to say there's a little CA. Whilst another review I read that there's no CA when in focus.

 

I have not compares side-by-side the Lunt152 with a TOA130.  I have compared it to a TSA-102 to assess color differences.  Tonally the TSA is just a smidgen whiter.  I could coax some miniscule CA on brightest targets out of the Lunt152 but it took work to do it!  So that is no visual CA in my book.  I've been running with the Lunt152 for over 6 months now and nothing changed from my original write up so it is holding steady as an excellent performer.

 

Now I have compared the Lunt152 to a Meade 8" SCT and basically as expected...8" SCT goes a tiny bit deeper on DSO, not enough to matter...in fact, the more precise star points of the unobstructed APO pretty much cancel out any DSO depth advantage the 8" SCT has IMO.  Contrast is another difference, so when doing planetary the contrast loss was obvious comparatively with the SCT, so on good evenings and when all the thermals were tamed in the SCT, planetary views were identical between the two instruments.  So IMO, whatever resolution gain the SCT should have had, was leveled by the contrast loss it had - that is my posit for why I was seeing what I was.

 

Of the scopes you mention, they are wildly different in aperture...130 vs 152 vs 260!!  The 260 will absolutely kill the others on DSO...hands down.  And for me personally, 130mm is just not sufficient light gathering to feel good when observing difficult DSO like globs.  My personal preference on that class of targets is 6" minimum, so it would be a deal breaker for me anything less than 6" if I wanted the scope to be good enough for my tastes across all targets.  So I think you will need to do more soul searching as to exactly what you are looking for and the priority differing features/apertures/aspects have for you before you can make a choice you will be happy with.

[AnakChan]

Thanks for the advice again. So it looks like the Lunt 152 does really keep the CA under control. That's good to know. It's also good to know about the Lunt152 comparison to the Meade 8" SCT. I was advised that a general rule of thumb of when comparing a reflector/SCT to a refactor is the size of the primary of the reflector minus the size of it's secondary obstruction. I guess that was one of the primary reasons why I looked at the TOA-130 in the first place since my VC200L has a 42% obstruction which would make it comparable to a 116mm refractor. Therefore thought the TOA-130 would be a decent step up from it.

The other Lunt152 & VMC260L scopes were thrown in more from the perspective of "what else could that same money can buy" - as such the wide varying in aperture sizes.

Anyway, I've let the TOA-130 go. Funnily at $3935, there were no bids. It'll probably come back up again for a slightly lower price should I change my mind again.

Also your comment of the Lunt152 giving similar views to an 8" SCT would put me in the same situation as the Mewlon 210 I let go a few weeks back - that it's quite a bit to spend for something that's probably going to give me similar views to my current VC200L. I guess truly no refractor for me then and it's sitting patiently for a Mewlon 250 + CR upgrade or VC260L.

Honestly thank you all for helping me to go through the thought process as it has been educational and invaluable. I was thinking that maybe there were cases where aperture doesn't always win but looks like not to be the case with the specific models I have interest in.

[BillP]

When doing the numbers on various scope designs, a lot more than just obstructions to factor.  You also need to factor in transmission efficiency of the various surfaces involved.  Other things impossible to model well are scatter differences as mirrored surfaces have more of this than glass.  At any rate, an 8" SCT is theoretically going to give you 30-40% more light gathering than a 6" APO...but at the eyepiece it does not come across near that much, so un-modelled variables are impacting.  Visually comes across something akin to a 20% difference (based on my tests using a fixed scope and masking it to various apertures).  Resolution of course going to stay the same and have a 34% advantage.

 

But yes, if you are looking to get improved views over the VC200L, then IMO you need to be looking at a 10" or 12" Dob.  And if you go the Dob route, get one where you can cap the mirror easily as they gather dust like magnets otherwise and you lose that high contrast views you like.  Only time I get a nice killer contrast view from my 10" is for the 1st week post cleaning.  It is astoundingly refractor-like for that week.  So I would say stay away from solid tubes since easy access to the mirror is impossible.

[jrbarnett]

I started this thread a few weeks back of looking at a Vixen AX103S coming from owning a VC200L for 18 years. It's clear to me now from the advice I've been given that coming from a 200mm (even with a 42% obstruction) is  to a103mm objective merely going to be unsatisfying visually.

 

I think ideally a Mewlon 250 would probably give me the best of all compromise of a large aperture but an APO-like & contrasty image which I lack on the VC200L. Unfortunately the Mewlon 250 is out of my price reach. The options narrowed down are now :-
 

1) TOA-130NS (which is on an auction expiring tonight) - priced approx USD$3935 2nd hand which seems like a good deal

   - I think decent pricing but would visually be an "upgrade" from the VC200L?

   - I don't know if I'm more tempted on this for Takahashi's reputation rather than it's capability over the other two options below. In addition, since it's on auction I'm afraid if I lose this opportunity I may not get the chance again

 

2) APM/Lunt 152 priced approx USD$4120 new

   - I read the TOA-130 vs Lunt 152 thread and although the general recommendation is the Lunt 152 for its larger aperture, I don't think any of the responders have seen both side-by-side to determine how much of an improvement of the Lunt 152 is over the TOA-130.

   - It's a doublet and some posts seem to say there's a little CA. Whilst another review I read that there's no CA when in focus.

 

3) VMC260L priced approx USD$2600 2nd hand

   - currently product is not available and being sent back to Vixen for maintenance.

   - concerned if it has the same low contrastness of the VC200L

 

The TEC140 is not an option as I'm not prepared to wait 6 months to a year and it's pricer than any of the aforementioned options. I also looked at the Celestron EdgeHD 11" but with mirror shift, dew, and weight it's not for me. My mount is a Vixen SXP so max 16kg OTA, and personally I think I'd take a 12kg weight max. I will need to transport my gear for a minimum 2 hr drive out of Tokyo everytime I want to view and in addition my car is small - I think I can handle a max 1000mm length OTA.

 

So should I jump on the TOA-130NS tonight or am I misprioritising owning a Tak over more practical visual purpose?

While it's the smallest scope you list, and you've specified visual, I'd have a hard time NOT jumping on the Tak at that low price, assuming it's in decent well-maintained condition.

 

But if you'd consider buying a TOA-130NS used, why not a TEC 140 used?  Used there is no wait for the TEC (just as there's no wait for the TOA-130).  The TEC is actually a little lighter than the TOA, too, so slightly easier on your mount.  TECs do come up used for under $5k too.  The lowest I've seen is $4500 which is higher than the Lunt, but not by much, and you'd get that beefy 3.5" Feathertouch in the bargain.  

 

But if TEC used isn't in the cards, then get that TOA.

 

- Jim

Edited by jrbarnett, 28 September 2014 - 07:39 PM.

[orlyandico]

tan14.com has the 210 for 17300 hkd / 2230 usd and that's new. FOB Hong Kong.

[AnakChan]

While it's the smallest scope you list, and you've specified visual, I'd have a hard time NOT jumping on the Tak at that low price, assuming it's in decent well-maintained condition.
 
But if you'd consider buying a TOA-130NS used, why not a TEC 140 used?  Used there is no wait for the TEC (just as there's no wait for the TOA-130).  The TEC is actually a little lighter than the TOA, too, so slightly easier on your mount.  TECs do come up used for under $5k too.  The lowest I've seen is $4500 which is higher than the Lunt, but not by much, and you'd get that beefy 3.5" Feathertouch in the bargain.  
 
But if TEC used isn't in the cards, then get that TOA.
 
- Jim

 
Hi Jim,
 
Cheers for the response. The TEC-140 was out of the picture 'cos, new, wait times are long and 2nd hand they're still rare and expensive used. One in CN's classifieds just got sold quickly here for $5400 pre shipping. The used TOA-130NS that was available was in excellent condition (the only part was some green paint chipping where the finder scope screws on to - optically mint condition) was for $3935.
 
I don't think I've seen a TEC-140 for $4500! Or more than likely I wasn't looking hard enough.

 

tan14.com has the 210 for 17300 hkd / 2230 usd and that's new. FOB Hong Kong.

Wow, some of the prices there appear to be cheaper than in Tokyo!

Edited by AnakChan, 28 September 2014 - 09:07 PM.

[orlyandico]

AnakChan, yes that is correct.  I verified the price of the 210 with Peter Lee and he confirmed it.  He probably has some contacts etc.  The Tak prices on some of his stuff are unreal.  He's selling the 210 new, for less than the US used price. Ditto for the FS60.

 

EDIT: you can occasionally find the LZOS-lensed TMB 130 for $3000.  I'd wait for one of those (not the Chinese-sourced TMB130SS though!)

Edited by orlyandico, 28 September 2014 - 11:09 PM.

[jrbarnett]

 

While it's the smallest scope you list, and you've specified visual, I'd have a hard time NOT jumping on the Tak at that low price, assuming it's in decent well-maintained condition.
 
But if you'd consider buying a TOA-130NS used, why not a TEC 140 used?  Used there is no wait for the TEC (just as there's no wait for the TOA-130).  The TEC is actually a little lighter than the TOA, too, so slightly easier on your mount.  TECs do come up used for under $5k too.  The lowest I've seen is $4500 which is higher than the Lunt, but not by much, and you'd get that beefy 3.5" Feathertouch in the bargain.  
 
But if TEC used isn't in the cards, then get that TOA.
 
- Jim

 
Hi Jim,
 
Cheers for the response. The TEC-140 was out of the picture 'cos, new, wait times are long and 2nd hand they're still rare and expensive used. One in CN's classifieds just got sold quickly here for $5400 pre shipping. The used TOA-130NS that was available was in excellent condition (the only part was some green paint chipping where the finder scope screws on to - optically mint condition) was for $3935.
 
I don't think I've seen a TEC-140 for $4500! Or more than likely I wasn't looking hard enough.

 

tan14.com has the 210 for 17300 hkd / 2230 usd and that's new. FOB Hong Kong.

Wow, some of the prices there appear to be cheaper than in Tokyo!

 

If you get a second chance at that TOA-130 for less than $3950, BUY IT!  That's AT130EDT/TMB SS 130 price territory.  Tak green trim paint is fragile as dried toothpaste.  Chipping on the trim pieces is not a big deal.

 

 

- Jim

Edited by jrbarnett, 28 September 2014 - 11:35 PM.

[dr.who]

Hey mate-

 

In my mind you are coming at this the wrong way. You say small DSO's but are looking at a refractor. The refractor is a wide field instrument in the type you are looking at and any of the planetary nebulae, globulars, and smaller galaxies are going to be less than impressive in it. You want long focal length and/or aperture for the targets you are after. That means 203mm+ Dal's like the Mewlon 210, SCT's in the 235mm+ range like the Celestron Edge 9.25, or Dob's in the 300mm plus range. A couple of great Dobs that will fit your space requirement would be the Sumerian Optics Alkaid 10-14" or the a Obsession 15 ulta compact. 

 

Sumerian is now shipping to the US so he may ship to Japan as well and I believe Dave K. has someone out of Australia handling Pac Rim for him. Just think... A 10-14" Dob you can take on a plane with you as carry on! That's Sumerian.

[RAKing]

Thank you for the responses folks and good question John. I've been into primarily DSOs - the planetary nebulae, galaxies, etc. Tentatively the VC200L will stay for AP (may need an overhaul first though - 18 yrs is a long time). This is where I do get a little education of mid-focal length of 1000mm + high powered eyepieces vs a long focal length of 2000-3000mm + mid powered eyepieces. I actually don't know which way to go in that respect.

 

I agree with the good Dr. here. If you like PN and galaxies, you're going to need a much bigger refractor!  I'm sorry, but surfing through the Virgo-Coma galaxy cluster with the TOA 130 or Lunt 152 won't show any more than your current Vixen. The Messier galaxies will all look like Q-Tips and many of the NGC galaxies will still be dim gray spots.

 

You need aperture, period.

 

Hey, I started my personal "Galaxy Quest" with a 4 inch refractor many years ago.    Then I figured out what was going on and switched to a more appropriate tool for my GEM: the C-11 SCT. 

 

I loved my Tak TOA 130. It was a wonderful scope - except for the weight - and I used it for a year until I got tired of lifting it onto the mount. My TEC 140 and TMB 130SS are much better double star/variable star tools for me now. But neither of these could compete with my C925 or C11 Edge SCT for DSO. I have never had the good fortune to own a Tak 250 Mewlon, but I'm sure it would crush a 6 inch refractor on those tiny DSO, too.

 

We are in the Refractor forum, so I should recommend a refractor - but the stuff you like to observe just won't be as good in a 5 - 6 inch refractor as it would be in something much bigger. If you still want a refractor after all of this, then go for the biggest refractor you can buy.   

 

My .02,

 

Ron

[dr.who]

Cheers Ron.

 

However I would amend your post a bit to add that the best combination would be that larger aperture SCT or Dob coupled with a smaller APO or fluorite doublet refractor in the 3-4" range. Something affordable like the Explore Scientific 80mm or 102mm APO in the aluminum tube, the Skywatcher Esprit 80mm (this would double as a nice wide field AP scope), Stellarvue 80mm ED, or Williams Optics GT81. Or even something not as affordable like the Takahashi FC-100 or TSA-102 and the Televue TV85.

 

They will all ride nicely on your existing mount and were you to upgrade your mount (which you would have to if you went into the larger SCT sizes putting you in the Celestron AVX or Skywatcher HEQ5 range), then you could mount the larger SCT and the refractor on top of each other giving you a great dual purpose setup.

 

The Dob/SCT/Dal (Mewlon) will give you that up close and personal detail you want on small DSO while that small refractor will give you gorgeous awe inspiring views of wide field objects thus giving you the best of both worlds. Added bonus to the small refractor is that it will open up a whole new area of AP as well as visual observing for you that the VMC260L doesn't give you. 

[RAKing]

Cheers Ron.

 

However I would amend your post a bit to add that the best combination would be that larger aperture SCT or Dob coupled with a smaller APO or fluorite doublet refractor in the 3-4" range. Something affordable like the Explore Scientific 80mm or 102mm APO in the aluminum tube, the Skywatcher Esprit 80mm (this would double as a nice wide field AP scope), Stellarvue 80mm ED, or Williams Optics GT81. Or even something not as affordable like the Takahashi FC-100 or TSA-102 and the Televue TV85.

 

They will all ride nicely on your existing mount and were you to upgrade your mount (which you would have to if you went into the larger SCT sizes putting you in the Celestron AVX or Skywatcher HEQ5 range), then you could mount the larger SCT and the refractor on top of each other giving you a great dual purpose setup.

 

The Dob/SCT/Dal (Mewlon) will give you that up close and personal detail you want on small DSO while that small refractor will give you gorgeous awe inspiring views of wide field objects thus giving you the best of both worlds. Added bonus to the small refractor is that it will open up a whole new area of AP as well as visual observing for you that the VMC260L doesn't give you. 

 

Again - I totally agree!

 

When I had my C-11 SCT, I had an 80mm WO doublet riding piggyback all the time. The only thing better would have been something like my Traveler on top, but I didn't get it until later in the game.

 

Unfortunately, I went through a spell of medical issues and was forced to give up that bigger scope. I go in for more surgery tomorrow, so the Traveler will be my ONLY scope for the next few months! Life happens. Everyone should enjoy all they can while the good times last.

 

Cheers,

 

Ron

[Jeff Young]

If you want a Tak refractor for visual, get a doublet (FC-125, FS-128, etc.) not a triplet (TOA-130).  They're less dear as well as being less heavy, so your budget *might* even stretch to a FS-152.

 

But I have to agree with the others; if Deep Sky is your passion, then more aperture is required.  Since you have a (somewhat?) serviceable instrument now, I'd be inclined to wait it out a bit and see if you can find a used Mewlon 250 for reasonable money.  Fantastic scopes.

 

Cheers,

Jeff.