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Is Sony Really Alpha?

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#2101 mmalik

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Posted 22 January 2021 - 08:40 PM

TAK/Flattener/D2/a7SIII/No Guiding...

 

 

The payload is one unit that can be lifted with one hand (...with handle...) and weighs 12.5 lbs; ~1.5 lbs. over tracker capacity. Regards

 

 

Criteria:

 

Pictured setup will have to be scrapped (...in favor of an alternative mount/scope) if un-guided performance weren't optimal. Will keep you posted if/when weather permits.

 

 

 

post-205769-0-37963800-1611224938_thumb.

 

post-205769-0-02132600-1611141857_thumb.


Edited by mmalik, 22 January 2021 - 08:48 PM.


#2102 mipblue

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Posted 22 January 2021 - 09:07 PM

Hi there. I am new to this forum. I am just now restarting my journey into astronomy and astrophotography.

I have a C8 on order with a fancy equatorial mount. 

I am searching for a camera. Thinking about a Nikon z5 or perhaps a Sony a7Riii.

Can someone please help guide me?

Thanks

Marty



#2103 mmalik

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Posted 22 January 2021 - 09:30 PM

Welcome the forum. Avoid following if you plan to mod for astro (...since internal IR pollution in these is NOT remediable post-mod). C8 is 'not' quite optimal/conducive for imaging, at least not for the start. Read here... to get some imaging perspective on things. Good luck!

 

 

  • a7S II
  • a7R II
  • a7R III
  • a9

Edited by mmalik, 22 January 2021 - 09:31 PM.


#2104 mmalik

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Posted 05 February 2021 - 02:12 AM

The Alpha game...

 

 

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#2105 mmalik

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Posted 05 February 2021 - 04:28 AM

The new Sony FE 35mm 1.4 is a incredible good lens for astrophotography. 
It is a full frame 35mm 1.4 lens almost without coma in the corner wide open.
The lens has very low distortion ideal for mosaics.
Only full frame vignetting is high, but any other comparable lens from other brand has the same issue.


Looks like a solid lens for astro:
https://www.lenstip....m_f_1.4_GM.html


Have you all done an any (astro) imaging with it; can you post results? Thx


Question: What's the difference between Sony FE 35mm f/1.4 GM Lens & Sony Distagon T* FE 35mm f/1.4 ZA Lens?


Edited by mmalik, 05 February 2021 - 04:34 AM.


#2106 mmalik

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Posted 14 February 2021 - 09:31 AM

All good but where is the 'a' version Sony?

 

 

Note: FX3; rumored to be a re-incarnation of a7SIII with no EVF and a fan built-in!

 

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#2107 garret

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Posted 14 February 2021 - 12:28 PM

 

Have you all done an any (astro) imaging with it; can you post results? Thx


Question: What's the difference between Sony FE 35mm f/1.4 GM Lens & Sony Distagon T* FE 35mm f/1.4 ZA Lens?

Sony has done it again; the FE 20mm F1.8 is (most likely) highly suitable for very wide astrophotography, given the excellent MTF diagram.

10 samples MTF chart here:  https://www.lensrent...-optical-tests/

 

I've been a Canon fan for decades, but Sony produces such good lenses lately...I should switch over to Sony...


Edited by garret, 14 February 2021 - 12:29 PM.

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#2108 tsk1979

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Posted 02 March 2021 - 06:24 PM

TAK/Flattener/D2/a7SIII/No Guiding...

 

 

The payload is one unit that can be lifted with one hand (...with handle...) and weighs 12.5 lbs; ~1.5 lbs. over tracker capacity. Regards

 

 

Criteria:

 

Pictured setup will have to be scrapped (...in favor of an alternative mount/scope) if un-guided performance weren't optimal. Will keep you posted if/when weather permits.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any updates on this? Is A7SIII astro mod friendly?



#2109 mmalik

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Posted 03 March 2021 - 12:23 AM

I have not been able to test due to severely cold weather, snow, and all. Yes, a7SIII is quite astro friendly; best of all, 'Removed LPF-2' is possible which otherwise in un-heard of in the latest alphas. Regards



#2110 MarkKrowd

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Posted 04 March 2021 - 04:51 PM

https://github.com/m...weak/issues/400

 

Hi! I'm using a ILCE-7RM2, full spectrum mod... I had noticed some little glows before my full spectrum mod but didn't know what was the problem... Now I see the problem. Clearly. Can't miss it.

 

So these guys have done reverse engineering to access the camera parameters (about 15000 parameters, not all of them are clearly known), I've opened an issue in their project about the famous IR LED, do you think it would be possible to do? (Turn shutter OFF with silent shutter, why is this **** LED activated? And then, break the limitation about BULB to be able to shoot in BULB and silent...)

 

Thanks!

 

PS: Sorry for my english, not my native language :p



#2111 SandyHouTex

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Posted 04 March 2021 - 06:36 PM

Sony has done it again; the FE 20mm F1.8 is (most likely) highly suitable for very wide astrophotography, given the excellent MTF diagram.

10 samples MTF chart here:  https://www.lensrent...-optical-tests/

 

I've been a Canon fan for decades, but Sony produces such good lenses lately...I should switch over to Sony...

Okay so Canon doesn’t make a mirrorless 20mm lens yet, but here’s a 35mm f/1.8 that’s better than this Sony lens from an MTF curve standpoint:

 

https://kenrockwell....8.htm#sharpness



#2112 mmalik

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Posted 05 March 2021 - 12:35 AM

I'm using a ILCE-7RM2, full spectrum mod...

Nothing will work on the following in term of internal IR pollution post-mod. Best would be to dispose of yours. Get a7III or a7S III instead. Regards

 

  • a7S II
  • a7R II
  • a7R III
  • a9


#2113 Dagryl

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Posted 05 March 2021 - 06:01 AM

Okay so Canon doesn’t make a mirrorless 20mm lens yet, but here’s a 35mm f/1.8 that’s better than this Sony lens from an MTF curve standpoint:

 

https://kenrockwell....8.htm#sharpness

Take a look at these images:

http://www.jordanste...0/rf35_coma.jpg

https://4.img-dprevi...f8b15564657296f

from this topic:

https://www.dpreview.../thread/4508594

It looks to me that the RF lens is terrible for astrophotography and Sony lens, even though it's way wider, performs way better.


Edited by Dagryl, 05 March 2021 - 06:01 AM.


#2114 SandyHouTex

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Posted 05 March 2021 - 11:05 AM

Take a look at these images:

http://www.jordanste...0/rf35_coma.jpg

https://4.img-dprevi...f8b15564657296f

from this topic:

https://www.dpreview.../thread/4508594

It looks to me that the RF lens is terrible for astrophotography and Sony lens, even though it's way wider, performs way better.

The images you posted were at f/1.8, and if you read the comments, some question if the images were even focused properly.

 

Here’s another Canon lens that better even though it’s a zoom:

 

https://kenrockwell....mm-f28.htm#perf


Edited by SandyHouTex, 05 March 2021 - 11:07 AM.


#2115 MarkKrowd

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Posted 08 March 2021 - 07:30 AM

 

Nothing will work on the following in term of internal IR pollution post-mod. Best would be to dispose of yours. Get a7III or a7S III instead. Regards

 

  • a7S II
  • a7R II
  • a7R III
  • a9

 

Hi!

 

I had contact with Sony support, explained the problem to them and showed them that it already appears with the original filters. They replied that they were passing the information, which they considered important, to the department responsible for software maintenance. Here is the message, translated from French:

"By your email, you are telling us about your ILCE-7RM2.

Thank you for your interest in Sony.

The suggestions and observations you make are very useful and I pass them on immediately to the department concerned.

Indeed, innovation in the service of consumer satisfaction is a priority for Sony, which enables progress and offers increasingly high-performance devices at the cutting edge of technology.

Before marketing each new product, Sony's Marketing Department carefully studies market trends. Each of the products therefore responds to a configuration that is as faithful as possible to consumers' expectations. .

Please accept, expressing our best regards. "

I don't think it will get things done but at least I can't say that I didn't pass the information on to them. My suggestion to them is to turn off the shutter completely in silent mode. This limits the exposure times to 30s but the improvement would already be considerable ...

 

In the meantime, I will take my old Canon 5D (first generation) apart to see if I had left the LPF filter there, in which case I could try to install it in front of my sensor. The infrared sensitivity interests me but if it is at the cost of an internal light leak I will largely be satisfied to see only the Ha and SII.

 

I could see that you have disassembled your device several times and fixed the problem, would you be willing to make the same change on other devices (paid, of course)?

Thank you in advance.



#2116 MarkKrowd

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Posted 08 March 2021 - 07:37 AM

 

Nothing will work on the following in term of internal IR pollution post-mod. Best would be to dispose of yours. Get a7III or a7S III instead. Regards

 

  • a7S II
  • a7R II
  • a7R III
  • a9

 

Sorry, I had misread your message and I had not seen your profile, indeed I would be happy to send you my device for modification but I am in Switzerland, I think I would have to separate myself from the device for months to send it to you ...
Maybe I'll find someone near me who can fix this.

And, A7iii or A7siii are not in my budget right now :p



#2117 xonefs

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Posted 15 March 2021 - 02:10 PM

Ok so I managed to attach a ballhead off the front of my scope to piggyback a camera on the bottom. Now I'm using my sony a7riv with a lens along with my astro cam/refractor.

 

 

Really liking it but I've come to hate my lenses I've had for a widefield astro with my new standards.

 

So what are some good E-mount lenses that are good for astro and have perfect pinpoint stars to the edge of the frame wide open or close? I'm thinking in the 24 to 60mm range...

 

I tried my sony zeiss 55 1.8 and I'm pretty disappointed in its performance even stopped down a bit. also the tiny front element doesnt seem good for this. Have also tried my tamron 17-28 and 28-75 and also kind of disappointed- stars get bad on the edges and these all seem to have some CA that makes focusing hard. they are good enough for landscape astro but I would like to be able to do some long tracked widefield and be able to pixel peep and be very sharp at that resolution.


Edited by xonefs, 15 March 2021 - 02:11 PM.


#2118 erictheastrojunkie

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Posted 15 March 2021 - 02:47 PM

Okay so Canon doesn’t make a mirrorless 20mm lens yet, but here’s a 35mm f/1.8 that’s better than this Sony lens from an MTF curve standpoint:

 

https://kenrockwell....8.htm#sharpness

I'm sorry, but what are you looking at, because the computed MTF curve for the Canon 35mm f1.8 certainly is NOT better than the actually measured (with 10 copies) MTF from the Sony 20mm f1.8 by Roger. The 10mm san/tag lines from the Sony are substantially better than the Canon, they also show no separation out to the full frame corner while the Canon has substantial separation (hence, the awful aberrations you see in the example images as posted in the various threads linked to the Canon user reports). The 30mm tan/sag lines are sharper for the 20mm before falling off to similar levels, the 20mm lines are help show the lack of distortion and again have virtually no separation. 

 

FWIW there's really no point in comparing MTF charts from such different focal lengths, especially ones provided from a manufacturer which are computed and those from a private tester which are "real". Based on reports (and my own personal experience with the Sony 20mm) it's quite apparent that the Canon 35mm can't be used wide open unless you are ok with pretty bad coma and LoCA, the 20mm on the other hand can be used wide open with virtually no coma and LoCA. 

 

To the other comments regarding Sony lenses, I have used quite a few now for astro, the Zeiss 50mm f1.4ZA, the Voigtlander 50mm APO, Voigtland 65mm APO, Voigtlander 110mm APO, Voigtlander 21mm Nokton, Voigtlander 40mm Nokton, Sony 24mm GM, Sony 20mm G, Sigma Art 14mm (e-mount), Sigma Art 35mm, and a few others. I would say the ones that come closest to "perfect stars to the edge" are the Voigt 50mm APO (this is the best 50mm currently available except maybe the Leica APO) and the 20mm G. The Voigt 50mm APO is a work of art, one of the few lenses capable of resolving the high resolution A7RIV sensor, no coma, very very little LoCA. The 20mm G is probably the best lens in the 16 to 24mm range, I've also used the Nikon 20mm f1.8S which is very close, but the Nikon has worse distortion and a baked in lens profile that sucks. The Sony 20mm G has very little distortion, has slight amounts of coma, but no LoCA. The 24mm GM is a little bit sharper, but has slight coma and visible LoCA, it needs to be stopped down to f2.2/f2.5 IMO. The rest of the lenses that I've used have varying degrees of coma/LoCA or sharpness fall off. The Voigt 65mm APO is also fantastic, but quite a bit heftier than the 50mm and I think the 50mm is sharper. I've been using the 110mm APO on my ASI2600mc, I'm working on a high resolution mosaic of the MW this summer with that combo. Voigtlander is going to be releasing a 35mm APO which should also be fantastic, possibly the best 35mm available based on its MTF. I tend to mostly use focal lengths wider than 35mm for time lapse, so in those instances I'm doing untracked single exposures, focal lengths 35mm and longer I use for tracking mount based nightscapes and stuff of that nature. I've got quite a few time lapse videos with my A7s and 20mm G (plus a few other lenses) here:

https://www.youtube....grjX658pmmGWaUw

 

Lots of tracked nightscape shots with various lenses here:

https://www.flickr.c...s/75706432@N02/


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#2119 SandyHouTex

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Posted 15 March 2021 - 06:21 PM

I'm sorry, but what are you looking at, because the computed MTF curve for the Canon 35mm f1.8 certainly is NOT better than the actually measured (with 10 copies) MTF from the Sony 20mm f1.8 by Roger. The 10mm san/tag lines from the Sony are substantially better than the Canon, they also show no separation out to the full frame corner while the Canon has substantial separation (hence, the awful aberrations you see in the example images as posted in the various threads linked to the Canon user reports). The 30mm tan/sag lines are sharper for the 20mm before falling off to similar levels, the 20mm lines are help show the lack of distortion and again have virtually no separation. 

 

FWIW there's really no point in comparing MTF charts from such different focal lengths, especially ones provided from a manufacturer which are computed and those from a private tester which are "real". Based on reports (and my own personal experience with the Sony 20mm) it's quite apparent that the Canon 35mm can't be used wide open unless you are ok with pretty bad coma and LoCA, the 20mm on the other hand can be used wide open with virtually no coma and LoCA. 

 

To the other comments regarding Sony lenses, I have used quite a few now for astro, the Zeiss 50mm f1.4ZA, the Voigtlander 50mm APO, Voigtland 65mm APO, Voigtlander 110mm APO, Voigtlander 21mm Nokton, Voigtlander 40mm Nokton, Sony 24mm GM, Sony 20mm G, Sigma Art 14mm (e-mount), Sigma Art 35mm, and a few others. I would say the ones that come closest to "perfect stars to the edge" are the Voigt 50mm APO (this is the best 50mm currently available except maybe the Leica APO) and the 20mm G. The Voigt 50mm APO is a work of art, one of the few lenses capable of resolving the high resolution A7RIV sensor, no coma, very very little LoCA. The 20mm G is probably the best lens in the 16 to 24mm range, I've also used the Nikon 20mm f1.8S which is very close, but the Nikon has worse distortion and a baked in lens profile that sucks. The Sony 20mm G has very little distortion, has slight amounts of coma, but no LoCA. The 24mm GM is a little bit sharper, but has slight coma and visible LoCA, it needs to be stopped down to f2.2/f2.5 IMO. The rest of the lenses that I've used have varying degrees of coma/LoCA or sharpness fall off. The Voigt 65mm APO is also fantastic, but quite a bit heftier than the 50mm and I think the 50mm is sharper. I've been using the 110mm APO on my ASI2600mc, I'm working on a high resolution mosaic of the MW this summer with that combo. Voigtlander is going to be releasing a 35mm APO which should also be fantastic, possibly the best 35mm available based on its MTF. I tend to mostly use focal lengths wider than 35mm for time lapse, so in those instances I'm doing untracked single exposures, focal lengths 35mm and longer I use for tracking mount based nightscapes and stuff of that nature. I've got quite a few time lapse videos with my A7s and 20mm G (plus a few other lenses) here:

https://www.youtube....grjX658pmmGWaUw

 

Lots of tracked nightscape shots with various lenses here:

https://www.flickr.c...s/75706432@N02/

Please use whatever you want to.

 

I will continue using my superior Canon equipment.



#2120 tsk1979

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Posted 15 March 2021 - 07:34 PM

MTF is not really relevant for us unless you live at 30,000 feet. Slight differences will be irrelevant even in excellent seeing. Coma and field curvature along with contrast/aberrations and color accuracy is what you should care about more when it comes to nightscape photography.

 

Of course, you may be a MTF chart photographer, in that case MTF charts matter more :D


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#2121 erictheastrojunkie

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Posted 15 March 2021 - 08:06 PM

Please use whatever you want to.

 

I will continue using my superior Canon equipment.

You've made it abundantly clear that the only manufacturer of photography equipment you care about is Canon, I'm not trying to change your mind because there is no point in attempting to do so. I'm just going to continue providing less biased opinions with real world experience to refute your overtly biased opinions on equipment for others to read and understand, my points are for the benefit of others looking for advice based on the actual usage of a wider variety of equipment, rather than just one type. There's a whole world of photography equipment out there capable of producing great astrophotography results, people need to understand that, a variety of options is of the greatest benefit to the consumer and blind devotion to one brand is the fastest way to miss out on better equipment. There are a lot of great lenses, in this case the Canon equipment is obviously not superior. That's not to say Canon doesn't make equipment that produces great astro results, but neither the 35mm nor the 15-35mm zoom are superior to the Sony offerings. 


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#2122 tsk1979

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Posted 16 March 2021 - 07:31 PM

Ok so I managed to attach a ballhead off the front of my scope to piggyback a camera on the bottom. Now I'm using my sony a7riv with a lens along with my astro cam/refractor.

 

 

Really liking it but I've come to hate my lenses I've had for a widefield astro with my new standards.

 

So what are some good E-mount lenses that are good for astro and have perfect pinpoint stars to the edge of the frame wide open or close? I'm thinking in the 24 to 60mm range...

 

I tried my sony zeiss 55 1.8 and I'm pretty disappointed in its performance even stopped down a bit. also the tiny front element doesnt seem good for this. Have also tried my tamron 17-28 and 28-75 and also kind of disappointed- stars get bad on the edges and these all seem to have some CA that makes focusing hard. they are good enough for landscape astro but I would like to be able to do some long tracked widefield and be able to pixel peep and be very sharp at that resolution.

Very few review sites do Coma testing with pin point strars. I would suggest search with string "$lensname coma test" on google to get to a review with coma . Eg this is the first link for 20mm 1.8

https://alynwallacep...w-raw-downloads

 

 

Lenstip does coma tests, including corners

https://www.lenstip...._and_bokeh.html



#2123 Dagryl

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Posted 17 March 2021 - 06:22 AM

You can also find a lot of star image samples here:

https://www.the-digi...1.8-G-Lens.aspx



#2124 SandyHouTex

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Posted 18 March 2021 - 06:39 PM

Sony has done it again; the FE 20mm F1.8 is (most likely) highly suitable for very wide astrophotography, given the excellent MTF diagram.

10 samples MTF chart here:  https://www.lensrent...-optical-tests/

 

I've been a Canon fan for decades, but Sony produces such good lenses lately...I should switch over to Sony...

So you should check this analysis of a Sony lens:

 

https://www.kenrockw...es/50mm-f12.htm

 

The first paragraph above the MTF charts is quite telling.  Evidently they look so good because Sony didn’t actually MEASURE them, and they left out diffraction and flare.  They are “fairyland” MTF charts.

 

Probably true for the 20mm f/1.2 lens as well.



#2125 mmalik

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Posted 18 March 2021 - 06:56 PM

So what are some good E-mount lenses that are good for astro and have perfect pinpoint stars to the edge of the frame wide open or close? I'm thinking in the 24 to 60mm range...

I am no lens expert so listen to what experts have to say. What I would say is also look into scopes...; I have yet to test but effort is underway. Regards




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