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How many earths in our galaxy .....

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#376 astroneil

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 01:16 PM

I believe I understand the phrase "non-invasive techniques/procedures".  However, in the context of investigating the origin of life on earth, I do not know what this means.  When I think of origin of life research, I am imagining laboratory experiments in mixing together chemicals and applying various forms of energy.  And having that imagine in my mind I can't understand what would necessitate "non-invasive techniques/procedures".

 

Therefore, I conclude I do not understand the context of research in which is is suggested that "non-invasive techniques/procedures" be used in investigations of the origin of life.  Could you help me understand that context, Neil, fitting the value "non-invasive techniques/procedures" into that explanation?

 

Otto

Again here, I would suggest you speak with Dr. Tour on these matters. He is better qualified than I to elaborate on this and I'm not here to discuss details. But what I will say is the popular science/astronomy magazine  articles and their editorial teams should stop flogging lies to the general public, who have swallowed this claptrap hook line and sinker, based on their pagan ideologies.


Edited by astroneil, 01 January 2019 - 01:18 PM.


#377 astroneil

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 02:12 PM

In summary, I would like to leave you all with these provocative statements by Dr. Tour to contemplate;

 

"Life should not exist. This much we know from chemistry. In contrast to the ubiquity of life on earth, the lifelessness of other planets makes far better chemical sense..........We synthetic chemists should state the obvious. The appearance of life on earth is a mystery. We are nowhere near solving this problem. The proposals offered thus far to explain life’s origin make no scientific sense.

Beyond our planet, all the others that have been probed are lifeless, a result in accord with our chemical expectations. The laws of physics and chemistry’s Periodic Table are universal, suggesting that life based upon amino acids, nucleotides, saccharides and lipids is an anomaly. Life should not exist anywhere in our universe. Life should not even exist on the surface of the earth."

 

Source: https://inference-re...o-my-colleagues

 

Have a great 2019!



#378 llanitedave

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 02:48 PM

I believe I understand the phrase "non-invasive techniques/procedures".  However, in the context of investigating the origin of life on earth, I do not know what this means.  When I think of origin of life research, I am imagining laboratory experiments in mixing together chemicals and applying various forms of energy.  And having that imagine in my mind I can't understand what would necessitate "non-invasive techniques/procedures".

 

Therefore, I conclude I do not understand the context of research in which is is suggested that "non-invasive techniques/procedures" be used in investigations of the origin of life.  Could you help me understand that context, Neil, fitting the value "non-invasive techniques/procedures" into that explanation?

 

Otto

It doesn't mean anything.  It's another back-handed way of claiming that if there are minds involved in trying to understand it, that demonstrates there must have been a mind involved in creating it.  All of these gibberish criticisms amount to one non-sequiter after another.



#379 gavinm

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 10:39 PM

astroneil - now blocked


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#380 ColoHank

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Posted 02 January 2019 - 10:13 AM

Nota bene:

 

In light of these revelations, Dr.Tour calls for a complete moratorium on origin of life research in this talk given at Syracuse University in April 2018:

 

https://www.youtube....58Rm8Sk&t=4456s

I wonder how many serious research efforts concerning the origins of life a complete moratorium would actually affect?  I can't imagine too many.  It's not like medical research where an urgency for cures drives interest and attracts large-scale funding.  But if a few scientists are interested and have institutional support, what's the harm?  Why not inquire and learn?

 

Dr. Tour is apparently a respected chemist, he's on faculty at a prestigious school, and he's probably addressed and no doubt overcome many difficult challenges in his research efforts.   Why would he suggest that others not go where their passions and knowledge lead them?

 

Someday, someone may stumble on at least a partial answer to our questions regarding the origins of life.  And then another and another...

 

Their discoveries may be inadvertent and serendipitous rather than directed because, again, there probably aren't a lot of scientists whose careers are dedicated solely to origins-of-life inquiry.  Let's keep open minds, folks.  If such findings give some people discomfort, perhaps they should consider the origins of their beliefs and look for flaws.



#381 llanitedave

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 01:22 AM

I wonder how many serious research efforts concerning the origins of life a complete moratorium would actually affect?  I can't imagine too many.  It's not like medical research where an urgency for cures drives interest and attracts large-scale funding.  But if a few scientists are interested and have institutional support, what's the harm?  Why not inquire and learn?

 

Dr. Tour is apparently a respected chemist, he's on faculty at a prestigious school, and he's probably addressed and no doubt overcome many difficult challenges in his research efforts.   Why would he suggest that others not go where their passions and knowledge lead them?

 

Someday, someone may stumble on at least a partial answer to our questions regarding the origins of life.  And then another and another...

 

Their discoveries may be inadvertent and serendipitous rather than directed because, again, there probably aren't a lot of scientists whose careers are dedicated solely to origins-of-life inquiry.  Let's keep open minds, folks.  If such findings give some people discomfort, perhaps they should consider the origins of their beliefs and look for flaws.

The only reason I can think of for such a moratorium is to prevent the discovery of things someone might not want us to know.


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#382 Astroman007

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Posted 17 January 2019 - 01:52 PM

astroneil - now blocked

Indeed.



#383 Astroman007

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Posted 17 January 2019 - 02:01 PM

The only reason I can think of for such a moratorium is to prevent the discovery of things someone might not want us to know.

Absolutely. Likely things that may clash with their preconceived and deeply cherished, yet scientifically baseless, ideas regarding the origin of life.

 

Worse still, these Stalinistic individuals wish to, with an iron hand, impose their nonsense and curious thought patterns upon the minds of others and rule their actions to be in agreement with theirs (so stifling opposition), which is unconscionable.

 

Let us not forget the fate of Giordano Bruno, and let us not once again give power or acknowledgement (which is the same thing, for one leads to and becomes the other) to those who wish to do away with inquiry into the cosmos and its secrets, both of which they attempt to veil from us, knowing that our knowledge of the true world is power against them.


Edited by Astroman007, 17 January 2019 - 02:10 PM.

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#384 llanitedave

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Posted 17 January 2019 - 03:22 PM

Welcome back, Martin!  I wondered where you'd been off to.


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#385 Astroman007

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Posted 17 January 2019 - 09:38 PM

Welcome back, Martin!  I wondered where you'd been off to.

Course readings, exams, more readings, exams, other reading, snow shoveling (lots lately), biking when the roads are good, guitar experimentation at night if cloudy, if clear out under the lovely dark skies...and did I mention exams?

 

In other words, same place I have always been. smile.gif I just take a step back from things once in a while.


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#386 ColoHank

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Posted 20 January 2019 - 06:29 PM

Absolutely. Likely things that may clash with their preconceived and deeply cherished, yet scientifically baseless, ideas regarding the origin of life.

 

Worse still, these Stalinistic individuals wish to, with an iron hand, impose their nonsense and curious thought patterns upon the minds of others and rule their actions to be in agreement with theirs (so stifling opposition), which is unconscionable.

 

Let us not forget the fate of Giordano Bruno, and let us not once again give power or acknowledgement (which is the same thing, for one leads to and becomes the other) to those who wish to do away with inquiry into the cosmos and its secrets, both of which they attempt to veil from us, knowing that our knowledge of the true world is power against them.

One of Bruno's inquisitors has a university named after him.


Edited by ColoHank, 20 January 2019 - 06:29 PM.


#387 llanitedave

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Posted 21 January 2019 - 12:52 AM

One of Bruno's inquisitors has a university named after him.

Oral Roberts?

 

 

get-em.gif



#388 astroneil

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Posted 16 December 2020 - 06:46 PM

nota bene:

 

https://www.nature.c...247-020-00057-8

 

 

Some discussion on said paper:

 

https://newatlas.com...imulation-luck/



#389 boxcorner

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Posted 17 December 2020 - 07:10 AM

I have just finished reading an excellent book by Colin Stuart, called:

The Universe in Bite Size Chunks, published by Michael O'Mara Books.

In the section about exoplanets, he explains about the habitable zone, or Goldilocks Zone.

In the section about galaxies, concerning the Milky Way, he covers this topic:

"Estimates based on Kepler space telescope data suggest there could be 60 billion planets ..."

Also, he covers Frank Drake's Equation and the Search for ExtraTerrestrial Life (SETI), etc.

The book's chapter titles are:

(1) Early astronomy (2) The Sun, the Earth, and the Moon (3) The Solar System(4) Stars (5) Galaxies (6) The Universe

I enjoyed reading it very much. It filled some gaps in my knowledge and is reasonably up-to-date (published in 2018).

I would thoroughly recommend this book to anyone who wants a good overview.

Colin Stuart is an astronomy journalist and author. He has written for the Guardian, European Space Agency and New Scientist and is a Fellow of the Royal Astronomical Society. He has recently had an asteroid named afer him.

He is also the author of 13 Journeys Through Space and TIme: Christmas Lectures from the Royal Institution, published by Michael O'Mara Books in 2016.

Disclaimer: I have no connection with the author, or publisher; I admire Colin Stuart's communication skills.


Edited by boxcorner, 17 December 2020 - 07:18 AM.


#390 BillP

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Posted 03 January 2021 - 02:28 AM

Of course adding a divine creator in the mix does NOTHING to resolve the something from nothing problem.. ...

 

Life is, and always has been, an eternal "feature" of an infinite, cyclical universe, just as has other forms of matter, energy, etc.  ...

The something from nothing problem is a consequence of a limited intelligence trying to resolve questions that are outside its capability to reason.  As simple as that.  If one believes that the human brain is capable of reasoning everything the universe has to offer then it necessarily follows that the human mind is the pinnacle of intelligence.  So there can be no higher intelligence because if there were, then that intelligence would be thinking of things beyond the ability of the human mind to reason. 

 

I feel fairly confident that the universe is a bit more complex than the human mind can ever understand, mainly because I feel fairly confident that the human intellect, you know, the one that cannot even muster processes to effectively thwart a new disease, is not near the highest intelligence possible.  Therefore, given the reality that the human mind is not the pinnacle of what the universe can produce, that necessarily means that how we think things are, is yes the best that we can understand, but it is far from the correct understanding as that is well beyond our capability.  The human brain is the "box" and no, you really can't think outside the box because you have no way of comprehending anything outside the box, so all that you do discover can only be related in the very limited understanding and reality that is within the very tiny human "box". 

 

As the saying goes, you cannot know the mind of God.  Likewise, you cannot know the mind of Oz, and you cannot even know the mind of homo sapiens 2.0 or any alien equivalent, and any of those levels above the human level have a truer understanding of the universe than we can ever have.  So from our little box of a mind, all we can come up with is hey, something came from nothing.  That of course makes God, Oz, future Homo Sapiens 2.0, and any alien that outclasses our mind break out into just enormous laughter rofl2.gif

 

So you see, adding a divine creator in the mix actually does resolve the something from nothing problem, because it reminds you of your limitations and gently lets you know that it is a problem homo sapiens can never reason from within the very limited box of their puny intellect.


Edited by BillP, 03 January 2021 - 02:35 AM.


#391 BillP

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Posted 03 January 2021 - 02:37 AM

Anyone's guess how many have evolved life and likely not many will have "smart" inhabitants , even fewer will have inhabitants at least as well developed technologically as us or have been colonised by nonindigenous spacefaring beings .

My guess is 1, then at some point in the future well before Sol swallows us up, 0 lol.gif



#392 bcgilbert

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Posted 03 January 2021 - 09:28 AM

How many earths in our galaxy .....?

 

One I think?!?!!




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