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Using an iPad as a Monitor?

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#1 jloweva

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 03:05 PM

Hi:

 

I am currently a purely visual observer but am intrigued by EAA.  Is there any camera that I can hook directly to an iPad so that the iPad can be the "monitor"?  I am trying to keep things as simple as possible.  Looking more for live feed than imaging.  I have no interest in stacking, etc.  Just want to be able to increase light grasp and share view with many at once via the iPad rather than some sort of kludgy monitor setup.

 

Thanks.



#2 ccs_hello

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 06:23 PM

Simple answer: unfortunately it's square peg into the round hole.

 

Long answer: there is a really awkward method (and not so beneficial) to do that.   It's a complex topic to describe further here

(but here is the hint: UVC interface spec, FEBON100, FEBON220, MJPEG streaming over WiFi :) :)

a somewhat similar but a little bit more doable description exist for Android tablet, in CN's Software subforum...)

 

Clear Skies!

 

ccs_hello



#3 Relativist

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 06:30 PM

Did you want a wireless view?

#4 jloweva

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 07:13 PM

Doesn't have to be wireless. I have the iPad mounted to my dob/refractors so I wire into the charging port would be fine. 



#5 Relativist

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 08:34 PM

What if any cameras do you already own?

 

https://www.tethertools.com



#6 A. Viegas

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 08:53 PM

On my older Ipad1  I use this  ->http://phonepartsusa...CFYmRHwodCZsAtQ   Which allows me to stream netflix to a TV composite in.   I think you could use an app like iCam ->https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/icam-webcam-video-streaming/id296273730?mt=8    if you did not mind being tethered to the scope and camera.   Realistically you can use a cheapo 7", or 9" LCD monitor too.   

 

Al



#7 ccs_hello

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 09:24 PM

Yeah, now seeing many different responses, I guess the OP's question may need to be clarified by the OP himself...

 

I read the title and thought may be it was about how to feed the traditional analog signal (with some type of conversion) and somehow automagically, the moving images would show up on iPAD's screen, just like as if an analog video monitor is direct-tied to the output of a videocam.

 

Of course the iPAD screen can be the monitor/display unit for a data source coming from a different apparatus, say

 - an IP-camera (nannycam),

 - Nexflix streaming video (hey can't argue that the source is from a digital video origin),

 - a modern mirrorless or DSLR that can send LiveView thru WiFi

 - a modern mirrorless or DSLR that can be tethered thru USB

 - a PC that has an astro-camera connected, then you mirror the PC window or entire screen to iPAD screen

 - add more combinations and permutations

 

Certainly can be under more torturous situations:(which some can't even be fully handled by a low end PC)

 - firewire (1394) camera head 

 - USB 2.0 astrocam <-- not the classic USB 1.1 (data already processed and compressed) ToUCam type

 - 100Mbps or gigabit Ethernet industrial camera or camera head

 

 

I hope my post does not muddy the water further more as it is right now.

 

Clear Skies!

 

ccs_hello


Edited by ccs_hello, 18 May 2015 - 09:29 PM.


#8 jloweva

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Posted 19 May 2015 - 11:56 AM

Sorry - To clarify:

 

I don't own any camera.  I would like to, as simply as possible, get a video/regular camera that I could drop into my 14.5 Starmaster or NP127 and send the video to the iPad, either via a wire or wirelessly.  While cost is always a consideration, I don't mind spending money on high quality equipment that can get the job done easily.  I do a lot of observing on the sidewalk and many neighbors walk by, especially with their children.  I am looking for a way to increase my "reach" and to be able to share the video in real time or near-real time.  I doubt I will ever get into "processed" videography or astrophotgraphy.

 

Basically, I am looking for a silver bullet which likely doesn't exist, does it?

 

Thanks for your help!


Edited by jloweva, 19 May 2015 - 11:57 AM.


#9 Don Rudny

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Posted 19 May 2015 - 01:27 PM

One simple setup you might consider is a SX Lodestar coupled to a small laptop.  The software is called Lodestar Live and is a free download from it's author, Paul Shears, in the UK.  It's available for both Mac and Windows.  The LS will give you near real time images in either mono or color.  Your NP127 would be ideal and wouldn't even need focal reduction for many objects.  You could just put a little table under your mount between the tripod legs to reduce the tripping hazard.  There is only one USB wire that runs the entire setup.  Here is a link of some recent captures I got during one of my viewing sessions with my SW100ed at native F9.  The LS is $599 for either mono or color.  Unfortunately, it won't work with an iPad unless you want to use something like Splashtop, but you still need the laptop.

 

http://www.cloudynig...lery/?p=6588541



#10 De Lorme

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Posted 19 May 2015 - 11:54 PM

Well jloweva, if money is not a problem and convenience is as important as quality then I would buy the  

Sony A7s. Check out the link below.  I plan to buy the A7s unless something else comes out that's better.

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=UUzLJ-M2Z_I

 

Clear Skies,  De Lorme



#11 schwim

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Posted 20 May 2015 - 06:42 PM

Well jloweva, if money is not a problem and convenience is as important as quality then I would buy the  

Sony A7s. Check out the link below.  I plan to buy the A7s unless something else comes out that's better.

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=UUzLJ-M2Z_I

 

Clear Skies,  De Lorme

I'm looking at the a7S as well. One thing I haven't determined yet is if/how you view the output on your computer in real time. Any ideas?



#12 De Lorme

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Posted 20 May 2015 - 08:28 PM

Schwim, The A7s has a HDMI port so the computer, laptop or tablet would have to have one to.



#13 ccs_hello

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Posted 20 May 2015 - 09:13 PM

Recent SONY mirrorless and DSLRs allows for WiFi-tethered control and LiveView.

Although the cord is cut, the throughput is perfectly fine when used to deliver camera's captured (L.V.) images to remote Android/IOS devices.

 

Clear Skies!

 

ccs_hello



#14 jloweva

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 04:49 AM

Thanks all.  Very helpful.  In terms of quality of video/still output, which is better, a Lodestar product or A7s, and if so, by how much? Just trying to understand the relative value of two very differently priced products. 



#15 ccs_hello

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 07:56 AM

Do not forget that when passing the classic design using a rather small type 1/3" or 1/2" image sensor <-- big pixel thus lower resolution,

the large sensor such as used in A7s (full frame sized) requires fast lens with long focal length and large image circle.

 

The high cost of such optical system cannot be ignored.



#16 Relativist

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 09:38 AM

Since we are not doing imaging, and can have less stringent requirements, a Newtonian can be used to fully illuminate such a camera. Typically such Newtonians are on par or cheaper than other designs, like SCTs or RCs. In addition, I would not fret to much about the edges, just like we don't really worry about amp glow in some cameras.

#17 donald41

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Posted 24 May 2015 - 03:37 PM

jloweva, get a 7" haier lcd tv. they have a rechargeable battery and video and audio inputs. you can find them on ebay for $95 new. donald41

#18 HxPI

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Posted 17 September 2015 - 06:17 PM

I use RDClient on iPad Air 2 over Airport Express 802.11n wireless hub. Connect camera to laptop, run appropriate software, connect iPad and laptop to wireless hub, then establish a Microsoft Remote Desktop session. It's actually fast enough to watch video. Works great!

 

Ciao,

Mel


Edited by HxPI, 17 September 2015 - 06:23 PM.


#19 Censustaker

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Posted 17 September 2015 - 06:55 PM

There are a number of tablets that are the same size/weight/price as an ipad out there that can run Windows that could give you what you're looking for. I personally use a Dell 2-in-1 laptop/tablet combo thing. The Dell Venue 10 Pro is $329 with a 10" and would have no problem running a easycap to use with a video camera.


Edited by Censustaker, 17 September 2015 - 06:56 PM.


#20 Astrojedi

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Posted 17 September 2015 - 07:09 PM

jloweva,

 

No such solution exists yet but I use a wireless setup with my Surface Pro tablet that may be of interest to you. It may look a little complicated but it does the job. I am free to walk about the yard/house with the tablet and am not tethered to the telescope. I enjoy showing what I am seeing to my family and friends.

 

I use a Raspberry PI 2 with a small battery pack (both attached to the mount). The camera and the telescope RS232-USB cables plug into the USB ports on the Raspberry PI 2 (I use both Lodestar X2C and the ASI224 cameras - not at the same time though). Then on the Raspberry PI I run VirtualHere which essentially virtualizes the USB port over Wi-Fi. The VIrtualHere client on the tablet connects wirelessly to the VirtualHere server on the Raspberry PI and exposes the telescope and camera as USB devices just as if they were connected directly to the tablet's USB ports. Then on the tablet I can use any SW I like. If you want to keep it simple you can just use SW like SharpCap or FireCap to view the live feed.

 

I have attached a diagram which hopefully makes it clearer. Happy to answer any questions.

 

Hiten

 

Attached Thumbnails

  • Presentation2.png

Edited by Astrojedi, 17 September 2015 - 07:10 PM.


#21 Censustaker

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Posted 17 September 2015 - 07:14 PM

That's an awesome use of the Raspberry Pi, AstroJedi.



#22 Astrojedi

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Posted 17 September 2015 - 07:23 PM

Thanks. It is a pretty cost effective setup too plus I have velcroed the PI and the battery pack to the mount, so I avoid hanging wires or cordwrap issues.



#23 ccs_hello

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Posted 17 September 2015 - 07:48 PM

Re: VirtualHere (basically a USB over IP scheme)

 

When using USB 2.0 High Speed isochronous mde, please be careful.

 

See its FAQ:

https://www.virtualhere.com/oem_faq

 

Look at this title "My webcam is not working with the Raspberry Pi using VirtualHere?: 

 

P.S. not just that, depend on the actual bandwidth need, the IP network (wired or wireless) may not be able to fit.

 

Clear Skies!

 

ccs_hello


Edited by ccs_hello, 17 September 2015 - 07:50 PM.


#24 Astrojedi

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Posted 17 September 2015 - 07:55 PM

Re: VirtualHere (basically a USB over IP scheme)

 

When using USB 2.0 High Speed isochronous mde, please be careful.

 

See its FAQ:

https://www.virtualhere.com/oem_faq

 

Look at this title "My webcam is not working with the Raspberry Pi using VirtualHere?: 

 

Clear Skies!

 

ccs_hello

 

css_hello,

 

Note that the link to the FAQ you have provided pertains to the original Raspberry PI NOT Raspberry PI 2 which is what we are discussing here. Raspberry PI 2 is significantly more powerful and does not have the limitations of the original PI. I have been using it with the Lodestar and the ASI224 for a while now without any issues.

 

In fact I have also done a custom build of KDE Stars on the PI 2 and it runs very well with a remote VNC client. Note that VirtualHere is not processor constrained on the PI 2 (it was on the original PI).

 

Hiten


Edited by Astrojedi, 17 September 2015 - 07:58 PM.


#25 drmikevt

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Posted 18 September 2015 - 08:02 AM

Hiten

 

Impressive work!  I am wanting to go in a similar direction.  Can I ask - Do you know if something similar is possible using iOS? And, do yo know if something similar is possible using an Arduino, or is the Pi community out in front for this sort of thing.  Feel free to expound at will.  

 

Thanks

Mike




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