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Night Vision changes everything

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#76 Sarkikos

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:01 AM

What amateur astronomy needs is a book like, "Choosing and Using Night Vision Equipment for Astronomy."  Right, Bill? 

 

:grin:

Mike



#77 Jim4321

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:09 AM

OK, a maybe-odd question.  How do NV devices respond to green laser pointers?  If I want to hand my hand-held NV device to someone and use my GLP as a pointer to show them where to look, are they going to be able see it at all, or have their dark adaptation wiped out, or something in between?

 

Jim H.



#78 Doug Culbertson

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:16 AM

 

Now everyone is going to say "Hey this is to compicated?"  

What astronomy purchase is not complicated????

 

That is not an excuse for the continuation of over complication.  My goodness, if I said that to my customer base at where I work I would be relieved of duty at a minimum.  And no, basic astromical visual observing is not very complicated...scope, eyepiece, mount, star chart, practice.  And all these are typically available bundled so nothing to piece together and plenty of folks spend years with just the two eyepieces supplied.

 

I think all you EAA guys are forgetting about all the frustration you had to go through when you were first embarking on your journey...it is WAY MORE complicated than visual observing complications.  Way more, specifically because none of the learning curve is really astronomy centric but more involved with the II technologies and such and mostly buying used because new the prices truly are ASTRONOMICAL!. 

 

At any rate, as Mike has expressed so will I (again), it is not productized for astronomy, so one has to hobble it together (atm), whether that means going adapter crazy or having to find appropriate parts to interface.  It is undocumented and not productized.  Until such time that it is, then it will remain basically an atm-like pursuit. 

 

So here's the challenge I will give this forum...

 

Configure a checklist for three capable systems for astronomy (beginner, intermediate, advanced), with all necessary vendor specific items and vendor specific components and adapters, with pricing and urls of where to get as new products.  Can this forum community agree of what a good beginner-intermediate-advanced collection of products?  If so, then you might get some more interest from the rest of us.  I dip into this forum semi-often and each time it really is a nightmare of complications that I read.  Even the OP of this thread pointed out appreciation for all the help, but he still has shortcomings...and it is not like he went to the Astronomics site to find everything.  So please all of you, make it simple and give us who are wondering three good examples of a fully capable system with all components necessary.  That would be a proper "start". :grin:  Otherwise, this NV concept gets un-inspiring real quick!

 

 

Bill, if you have not yet done so, I suggest that you start with the CN article "Night Vision 2015: Three Perspectives" as it will give a lot of good information to digest, including links to vendors, various filters that may or may not be needed, and various techniques from unity observing to observing through a large dob. That article, along with personal advice via PM from Eddgie and Ray (The Ardent) really saved me a lot of the frustration that I could have encountered.

 

IMO, there is no distinction between beginner and intermediate as this arena is, frankly, expensive. There is no starter level, as anything less than Gen 3 NV tubes simply are not suitable for astronomy. The main thing to start with is, do you prefer single eyed observing, i.e a NVD Micro type device, or two eyed, i.e. the PVS-7. Once that's determined you need to decide if giving up a small amount of sharpness for two eyed observing is worth it. FWIW, I have found  that it is much easier to find a used high quality PVS-7D than it is to find a used monocular like the Micro at all. There are a lot of good deals to be found in used PVS-7s on Ebay, and a lot of them have very good tubes, but it is on the buyer to ask the seller about the tube specs, spot sizes and locations, obtaining photos through the tube, etc.

 

Other than that, the filter and adapter requirements are going to be the same regardless of which device you choose, or what your level of experience may be. Once you decide that you want to go NV, you can count on spending some real money.

 

The next level, IMO, is once you gain the experience and start thinking in terms of WP devices, or the MOD 3 true bino type devices. These are a real commitment, and cost a whole lot more than the basic NVD Micro or PVS-7 setups. I am not experienced enough to address capturing video or stills through these devices, so if cnoct or JDBAstro want to pipe in here that would be great. As I said though, that's a whole different level that I really do not aspire to achieve.

 

Bottom line: IMO, the basics that you need to start with are the NV device itself, a RAF 1.25" filter adapter for the objective, and a 610nm red and a 12nm Ha filter. That will set you up for some great 1x observing; that lying on a blanket and looking up that you referenced earlier. Add a 1.25" nosepiece from Scopestuff and, in the case of a PVS-7, a c mount adapter you are ready to drop that NV device into the telescope of your choice. It really doesn't have to be as complicated as it may sound.

 

I hope that this post is as coherent in writing as it was in my mind as I was typing it...


Edited by Doug Culbertson, 13 July 2016 - 11:37 AM.

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#79 Sarkikos

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:24 AM

Once you procure the NV equipment, it would be a good idea to get SkySafari Pro on tablet or SmartPhone.  Then you can easily look up on-the-fly all the objects you'll be able to see with NV.  

 

Personally, I'd immediately start an object list of all the DSO I bag with the Night Vision gear.  Then I'd post the list here on CN.  But should that go in the Deep Sky Forum, or here in EAA? :thinking:

 

:grin:

Mike


Edited by Sarkikos, 13 July 2016 - 11:25 AM.

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#80 Doug Culbertson

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:33 AM

Mike, I have Sky Safari Pro, and I have downloaded lists of all of the Sharpless Objects from the Eastern Missouri Astronomical Society's website. As to where to post observations, I would think that either place would be appropriate. The mods here on the EAA forum are very tolerant of EAA observational posts.


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#81 Eddgie

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:35 AM

OK, a maybe-odd question.  How do NV devices respond to green laser pointers?  If I want to hand my hand-held NV device to someone and use my GLP as a pointer to show them where to look, are they going to be able see it at all, or have their dark adaptation wiped out, or something in between?

 

Jim H.

I really have no interest in being an enabler past the point that I have already gone.

If someone has a lot of objections and chooses not to do it, I have no horse in that race.

 

But when someone says "I want to get a telescope, but I don't know what to get" and they get 20 pages of opinions on what is best and what equipment is needed, I see that as being zero difference to doing the same thing with Night Vision.

 

I am not at all twisting anyones arms and it simply may not be for everyone.  I respect that a lot.

 

But these challanges are in my opinion, quite lame.   The exact same challenges face anyone entering into traditional astronomy, but these posts make is sound like the entry bar is higher here than there...

 

If anything, entry here is easier. I can buy a Micro and a filter and see a sky blazing with stars and nebula...


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#82 Sarkikos

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:38 AM

Bill, if you have not yet done so, I suggest that you start with the CN article "Night Vision 2015: Three Perspectives" as it will give a lot of good information to digest, including links to vendors, various filters that may or may not be needed, and various techniques from unity observing to observing through a large dob. That article, along with personal advice via PM from Eddgie and Ray (The Ardent) really saved me a lot of the frustration that I could have encountered.

 

Actually, these PVS-7 Goggles cited by Ray in the CN article are at least worthy of consideration for an early Christmas present to myself.  http://nait.com/prod...vision-goggles/  $1850.  

 

It's when an item slips into the multiple thousands of dollars that I really start to sweat.   :doah:

 

Mike


Edited by Sarkikos, 13 July 2016 - 11:39 AM.


#83 Doug Culbertson

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:42 AM

 

Bill, if you have not yet done so, I suggest that you start with the CN article "Night Vision 2015: Three Perspectives" as it will give a lot of good information to digest, including links to vendors, various filters that may or may not be needed, and various techniques from unity observing to observing through a large dob. That article, along with personal advice via PM from Eddgie and Ray (The Ardent) really saved me a lot of the frustration that I could have encountered.

 

Actually, these PVS-7 Goggles cited by Ray in the CN article are at least worthy of consideration for an early Christmas present to myself.  http://nait.com/prod...vision-goggles/  $1850.  

 

It's when an item slips into the multiple thousands of dollars that I really start to sweat.   :doah:

 

Mike

 

 

:waytogo:



#84 Sarkikos

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:42 AM

Mike, I have Sky Safari Pro, and I have downloaded lists of all of the Sharpless Objects from the Eastern Missouri Astronomical Society's website. As to where to post observations, I would think that either place would be appropriate. The mods here on the EAA forum are very tolerant of EAA observational posts.

 

Yes, I figure they would be accepted here on EAA Forum.  The problem is the object posts tend to be lost among all the techie posts.  On the other hand, there might be some grumbling if posted in Deep Sky Forum.  Not so different I suppose from when many observers first started using goto.  

 

I think it is instructive and useful to accumulate lists of objects that have actually been seen with specific instruments.  I'm doing that now for my C80ED and Canon 10x42 IS, with separate lists for DSO and double stars.  

 

Mike


Edited by Sarkikos, 13 July 2016 - 11:47 AM.


#85 Jim4321

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:45 AM

 

OK, a maybe-odd question.  How do NV devices respond to green laser pointers?  If I want to hand my hand-held NV device to someone and use my GLP as a pointer to show them where to look, are they going to be able see it at all, or have their dark adaptation wiped out, or something in between?

 

Jim H.

I really have no interest in being an enabler past the point that I have already gone.

If someone has a lot of objections and chooses not to do it, I have no horse in that race.

 

But when someone says "I want to get a telescope, but I don't know what to get" and they get 20 pages of opinions on what is best and what equipment is needed, I see that as being zero difference to doing the same thing with Night Vision.

 

I am not at all twisting anyones arms and it simply may not be for everyone.  I respect that a lot.

 

But these challanges are in my opinion, quite lame.   The exact same challenges face anyone entering into traditional astronomy, but these posts make is sound like the entry bar is higher here than there...

 

If anything, entry here is easier. I can buy a Micro and a filter and see a sky blazing with stars and nebula...

 

 What the heck?  I was only asking an honest question, not trying to trigger a defensive wrant.  

 

Jim H.



#86 dtripz

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 12:09 PM

What amateur astronomy needs is a book like, "Choosing and Using Night Vision Equipment for Astronomy." Right, Bill?

:grin:
Mike


https://www.amazon.c...s/dp/1852339012 This book talks about using an image intensifier to view deep sky objects.
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#87 Eddgie

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 12:57 PM

 

 

OK, a maybe-odd question.  How do NV devices respond to green laser pointers?  If I want to hand my hand-held NV device to someone and use my GLP as a pointer to show them where to look, are they going to be able see it at all, or have their dark adaptation wiped out, or something in between?

 

Jim H.

I really have no interest in being an enabler past the point that I have already gone.

If someone has a lot of objections and chooses not to do it, I have no horse in that race.

 

But when someone says "I want to get a telescope, but I don't know what to get" and they get 20 pages of opinions on what is best and what equipment is needed, I see that as being zero difference to doing the same thing with Night Vision.

 

I am not at all twisting anyones arms and it simply may not be for everyone.  I respect that a lot.

 

But these challanges are in my opinion, quite lame.   The exact same challenges face anyone entering into traditional astronomy, but these posts make is sound like the entry bar is higher here than there...

 

If anything, entry here is easier. I can buy a Micro and a filter and see a sky blazing with stars and nebula...

 

 What the heck?  I was only asking an honest question, not trying to trigger a defensive wrant.  

 

Jim H.

 

I am so very sorry!!! This was my bad.. I had started to respond to your post but got sidetracked and did not realize I copied you quote into this response.

 

Please forgive me!

 

NV sees in green unless you have an H-a filter, in which case you use a red laser.

 

Again my apologies!!! Bad mistake on my part to have included your question in my post!!!!


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#88 Sarkikos

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 01:20 PM

Mike, I have Sky Safari Pro, and I have downloaded lists of all of the Sharpless Objects from the Eastern Missouri Astronomical Society's website. As to where to post observations, I would think that either place would be appropriate. The mods here on the EAA forum are very tolerant of EAA observational posts.

 

Thanks.  That's a good list of SSP object lists.

 

Mike



#89 Eddgie

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 01:24 PM

About two weeks ago, I posted a buyers guide on Equipment forum, so the basics of the entry point are found there.

 

http://www.cloudynig...-for-astronomy/

 

The whole purpose of that guide was to kind of get people that have heard about using NV a simple basic entry guide.  

 

Beyond this, there are of course a lot of questions just as there would be for someone entering into traditional astronomy.

 

My "Rant" (and it was indeed a rant")  was against the notion that this was in any way difficult to figure out and that this would pose a meaningful barrier to entry..  Getting started in conventional astronomy has a far higher learning curve. 

 

By comparison, the conversion to NV astronomy is downright easy....


Edited by Eddgie, 13 July 2016 - 01:31 PM.


#90 BillP

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 01:33 PM

My "Rant" (and it was indeed a rant")  was against the notion that this was in any way difficult to figure out and that this would pose a meaningful barrier to entry..  Getting started in conventional astronomy has a far higher learning curve. 

 

By comparison, the conversion to NV astronomy is downright easy....

 

While it may be an easier process for you, that does not mean it will be easier universally.  What makes something easy or hard has a lot to do with the familiarity a person has with similar technologies.  For me getting into visual astronomy was as simple as could be as optics are no stranger to me having been involved deeply with photography all my life.  But NV and Astrophotography and EAA are completely different things as they rely heavily on various electronics and on extensive software intricacies with complicated post processing.  These animals are not so comfortable.  Always best to assume EVERYTHING one is wanting to explain is hard for others.  KISS.

 

btw - Appreciate the new posting you just put up on NV Buying Guide :waytogo:  :waytogo:



#91 Sarkikos

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 01:36 PM

OK, I'll start my own list of equipment for setting up PVS-7 NV googles for astronomy.  Included are the sources and prices.

 

PVS-7 Goggles, NAIT, $1850.

http://nait.com/prod...vision-goggles/  

 

1.25" to C Mount, Chinese on eBay, $12.89 

http://www.ebay.com/...s&ul_noapp=true

 

1.25" astro filter (M28.5x0.6) to 1.2"-32tpi (ENVIS lens) adapter, RAF Camera, $24.95 

http://www.rafcamera...38c8e5577c54af9

 

1.25" T-adapter for direct photography, ScopeStuff, #TADP, $11 

http://www.scopestuff.com/ss_tadpt.htm

 

Fast SLR Lens, eBay, various prices.  I have no idea what is good and what isn't and what I should be looking for, except maybe a low f number.

http://www.ebay.com/...lr lens&_sop=12

 

Baader Planetarium Red 610nm Long-Pass 1.25" Filter, Adorama, $38  

http://www.adorama.c...CFYMehgod6RwJMg

 

Astronomik H-Alpha 12 nm CCD 1.25" Filter, High Point Scientific, $129.95

http://www.highpoint...CFRRZhgod9SUFCA

 

So far the total is about $2067 plus whatever I pay for the SLR lens.

 

Corrections, additions and suggestions would be appreciated.

 

Mike


Edited by Sarkikos, 13 July 2016 - 01:58 PM.

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#92 pwang99

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 01:45 PM

OK, I was starting to type up a response a few hours ago and then came back to this thread and it's got a whole nother page of responses.

 

Ed's buyers guide is very comprehensive, and the "three perspectives" write-up is a very good resource.  But I can appreciate that people want an easy step-by-step that's short and sweet.

 

So, for reference for other people, and since Mike is asking, here is my "night vision" build-out/journey.

 

Step 1. Getting Started - Total cost $1700

 

This filter just fits inside the objective lens on the PVS-7, but does not thread into the PVS-7. So you have to hold it in with your finger, which is a little ghetto.

 

In order to solve this thread mis-match, you should get this 1.25" to PVS objective adapter from RAFCamera which is about $25.

 

So, to get started with NV, I spent less than $1700.

 

 

Step 2. Next, I wanted to put the goggles into my telescope - Total cost ~$150

 

Scopestuff sells 1.24" and 2" adapters to "C-mount" thread:

In order to use C-mount on the PVS-7 goggles, I had to get an adapter like this one off eBay, which costs about $70.  To use this adapter, I have to unscrew the entire 1x objective lens assembly off the front of the PVS-7, and then screw on this C-mount "nose".

 

So, now I can stick the goggles in my C11.  But the C11 is a bit PITA to drag out and set up.  How do I get somewhat more zoom, but still have the portable convenience?

 

 

Step 3. More zoom, but handheld - $100

 

After doing some reading here on CN and research, I decided to get the 3x afocal lens that fits over the objective of the PVS-7.  I found a decent used one ebay for about $80.
 

For better viewing of the Milky Way, there's also these cheap 55mm infrared filters that fit inside the 3x afocal lens.  This is about $10.

 

Since I'm an SLR photographer, I also got a C-mount to EOS adapter, so I can screw my camera lenses into the night vision goggles.  It costs $20.

 

 

Step 4. Move to C-mount for the 1x objective - $100

 

So, you can see from the above that C-mount is the primary thread for switching out various adapters for the goggles.  However, the default 1x objective is not C-mount.  I am tired of switching between the 1x objective "nose" and the C-mount "nose", because this exposes the PMT tube, and potentially introduces dust onto the tube.  So, I have ordered an ENVIS objective, which is basically a 1x objective that threads into the C-mount.  Got this from NVdepot, for $98.  (Sorry, no web link - you have to call them to order it.)

 

 

Beyond this, I'm getting a few more filters and a 1.25" filter wheel.  We'll see how that works out!


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#93 Eddgie

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 01:49 PM

I am in the process of having a Night Vision binocular made.

 

I sold my NVD Micro to a CN member on a trail basis to raise the funds.

I included a 1.25" nose.  

 

He was observing the day he got it.  He just plugged it into his telescope and away he went.   

 

He got an H-a filter just in time for a very dark sky trip three days after he got the Micro.

 

At all he had at this point was the Micro, the 1.25" nose, and an H-a filter and he was using his big dob.

 

I asked him how it was and this was his response:

 

"It was wonderful, absolutely amazing. My friend who came along said it was like cheating".

 

Easy as pie.... Screw on the nose, add an H-a filter if nebula are the target, plug it into the focuser, turn it on focus, and prepare to be quite surprised at what you can now see., 

 

A couple of days later he sent a more detailed write up to me.  I wish he would have posted it here, and if he is reading, I hope he will cut and past form his PM.   It is a delightful set of observations.

 

 

 

.



#94 pwang99

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 01:54 PM

FWIW Mike, the SLR lens thing is entirely optional.  The lenses that are good for my camera are pretty heavy, and their optics are optimized for a bunch of stuff I don't really care about in astro.  That's why even though I have a top-notch Canon zoom and I have the EOS-to-C-mount adapter, I'm not planning on using it that much, and am hunting around for some other wide and fast optical system.

 

I would definitely recommend the 3x afocal lens before trying out (and being underwhelmed) by a bunch of SLR optics.  I think that finding good, cheap, older SLR lenses will continue to be an active area of "research" for the NV community.  However, the rapid increase in popularity of Micro Four Thirds is a very promising development, because Sony or Olympus or Canon or somebody may build a really nice optical system that's perfect for NV.

 

As an aside, I found a used Edmunds Scientific astroscan in a local thrift shop and decided to get it.  I've always wanted one, and who knows, maybe its 4" f/4 optics will be good enough for NV.  (If nothing else, my kids will certainly get a kick out of having a spherical telescope!)  Will report back on what I figure out... although it looks like my new 3D Spacewalkers binos have shown up, so I might be preoccupied with that this weekend... :-D


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#95 Eddgie

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 02:32 PM

 I like Peter's step by step and I will try to compliment it with a "Field Size" approach.

 

!x Viewing.

From bright sky you need:

 

 

 

Device (PVS-7 or Micro with ENVIS are most popular I think)

Filter Adatper from RAF Camera

610nm for less light polluted, 680nm or heavier light pollution

H-alpha narrow pass.  12nm for less light polluted, narrower for heavy light pollution.

 

 

What can you see?  Lots of stars.  Stars everywhere.  M45 is amazing even at 1x an even under heavy light pollution.   Constellations turn into giant star clusters in their own right.   Big closters like Beehive are visible and partly resovled even at 1x.  Most of the Messier are easily visible directly but of cousre not well resolved, though the Starfish shape of M38(?) is easy to see.

 

With H-a?  Even form a light polluted sky, it is possible to see the North American Nebula, the California Nebula and many man more and at 1x, these are amazing sights to see because you not only see them, you resolve considerable detail in them, even under light polluted skies.

 

Dark Sky a 1x.  Same thing, but you don't need the 610nm or 680nm filter

 

What can you see?  From a really dark site, it is staggering.  All of Barnard's loop, Horsehead, Flame, Orion and Anglefish in the same low power field of view. OMG!!!  Structure in the Milk Way that is better than you can see in many pictures because of the enormous scale.   Stars.. Soooo many stars that it is hard to find your way, so you wind up using nebula as reference points...

 

3x.  You  need to add the afocal lens.   This gives about 12 degrees.  Now smaller clusters and big globulars start to resolve (Yes, M22 is granular at 3x under dark skies.. it is after all the size of the full moon so 3x spreads the halo out so much that the outside halo is well resolved.  Now this does not seem like a big deal, but when you can see Nebula in the same true field, it gets really interesting.

 

 

This is the Micro with ENVIS lens, the H-a filter, and the 3x afocal

 

:1.25 filter adapter for PVS-7.jpg

 

Powers up to about 11x and about 1.6 degree (200mm lens gives 8x and 5 degrees) you typically use an SLR to C mount adapter and the lens of your choice. 

 

This shows a PVS-7 D with a variety of lenses.  You can see the C mount housing installed with the factory lens to the right of it and the ENVIS is just in front of the C mount nose.  This allows the 3x to work on the PVS 7 without having to change out the housing and gives you 1x filter use with the adapter.

 

PVS-7 configuration resized.jpg

 

 

Telescope, you need a 1.25" or 2" nose... This one is just a PVS-7 objective housing with no objective.  I think I paid $20 on Ebay.

As luck would have it, the objective housing is 2", so fits into the eyepeice holder of a 2" Barlow.    I can run a 2" filter this way (this Barlow has 48mm thread for the barlow lens).  Or I can put in the 2x barlow element.  Though to be hones, I do use a 1.25" nose, but for someone with a 2" H-a filter and a Barlow, this would be a cheap way to get H-a views.

 

Unlike a traditional bibnoviwer, there is no Barlow or OCS required to reach focus and there is no light loss to each eye the way there is with a conventional binoviewer.

 

PVS binoviewer.jpg

And here is the PVS-7 with the C mount housing and 1.25" nose.  It is threaded for 1.25" fitlers, and plug and play with just about any scope.  Again, this does not require any more in-travel than most traditional eyepieces. To install this, the PVS-7 objective/tube housing is unscrewed and this is screwed into its place...

 

PVS-7 telescope adpater.jpg

What can you see?  LIke doubling the aperture of an existing dob.   Nebula that are difficult from a dark sky are easy from even light polluted back yards.  For 40 years I have tried to get a good look at the Horsehead nebual usng a variety of telescopes from a variety of (not the best to be sure) dark sites, but the first time I ever really saw it as more than a suggestion of a horses head was this past winter from my light polluted back yard using a 12" dob... 

 

This is what I call the ultimate Grab and Go.  It is the NVD MIcro (fits in the palm of the hand) with the 3x afocal lens snapped on.   I have two PVS-7s but this was what I would take with me on trips because the Micro with 3x and a couple of fitlers will fit in the glove compartment of a car or in two jacket pockets.   

 

 

NVD with 3x afocal lens.jpg

So this is pretty much a detailed run down on how to configure the device for different uses and what you can get.   

 

And as I said earlier, this does not seem difficult at all to understand.   It is an erector set of optoins and you chose the coniguration you need and re-configure as you go.

 

 

 


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#96 Eddgie

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 02:39 PM

Comet Catcher on Minitower 2.jpg Here is the PVS-7 in my Comet Catcher.  I got a better view of the Horse Head holding this in my arms standing in the middle of the street in front of my house late one night holding the scope in my arms like a baby than I got using my C14 from the darkest site I could ever get it too!!! I could easily see the notch and the curve of the top of the head, but the angular size was too small to really separate the bottom of the nose from the nebula wall..

 

I can hand hold this and easily see great views of smaller nebula like the Lagoon or Orion (for those that think these are big nebula, trust me, they are quite small in comparison to so many other nebula in the sky) 

 

This gives 18x and 2 degrees and considering the PVS-7 was less than $2k and the Comet Catcher was $225 used, it cost less than a 5" Apo and a GEM mount, and oh my, do I see so much more with this.   It is crazy better.   Most of the things I see with this would be a struggle for a 5" Apo even under dark skies. 

 

In this picture, you can see that the C mount is on the PVS-7 and the 1.25" nose is in the eyepiece holder.   As I mentioned, no need for Barlow for telescope use. Power is same as monocular view..

 

 

Comet Catcher on Minitower 2.jpg

 

 

 


Edited by Eddgie, 13 July 2016 - 02:41 PM.


#97 Eddgie

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 02:50 PM

And a couple of more pictures:

 

Micro in hand.  I can do astronomy when I take out the trash and I am a hit at dinner parties... 

 

Micro in hand.jpg

 

Here is the PVS-7 shown next to a 7x by 42mm Bino.  About the same weight as shown.    Even at 1x, the sky is pretty freaking amazing while at 7x in the binocular, it is in a lot of spots on a lot of nights kind of empty in the field.  As long as there are not clouds, there are alwas form a few dozen to many hundreds of stars in the field at 1x.

 

PVS-7 vs 7x42.jpg

 

And here is the PVS-7 with the 3x.  This just snaps over the ENVIS lens or the PVS-7 objective so nothing to thread or untheread.  The 3x is super light and hand holding is easy even for extended periods. The low magnifcation is (by comparison to a big binocular) rock solid.  No need for image stabilization at 3x.

 

Binoviewer.jpg

 

See, there really is not that much too it.  The biggest decision to me is whether to go with one eye or two, and my buyers guide gives the pros and cons.

 

I have both so I am very lucky.

 

 

 

 

 

 



#98 PEterW

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 02:55 PM

As Eddgie says you use nebulae as guides as NVD see stars differently so star hopping is harder... Red Carbon stars confuse you!
The Cooke book is not so good, there are 2 versions. I started a list of objects already.. Happy for others to add to it... http://www.cloudynig...observing-list/. Drop me a PM so we can maintain and update the list, I can't see very far south, so there are PLENTY of missing objects!
I have filtered out all the Small and faint sharpless... There are limits even for NVD.

Cheers

Peter
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#99 Eddgie

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 02:55 PM

And this.  The magic is not at all in the device.  Given the same performance tube, the views will be very similar but that is covered in the above linked buyer's tutorial.

 

The magic is in the tube, and tubes differ greatly.

 

This is where it gets complicated, but mostly you pay a linear price for performance  The PVS-7 takes one kind of tube, and the Micro takes another, but the tubes are similar in format and size, but vary greatly in performance.

If someone is seriously considering the move, they should read up on tube specs and buy a tube with the highest performance they can afford.

 

Here, the difference of 6 in signal to noise will be much easier to see than the color difference between a 4" triplet with FPL53 vs a 4" triplet with FPL51.    

 

It is all about the tube in terms of how much performance you get, and not about the body at all.  They are pretty similar in performance from one to the other and goggle to mono.   The tube is the heart and the true cost of the device.

 

Tube should have a minimum of 21 S/N and 64 lines per mm, adn tubes come with up to 35 S/N and 72 lines so the cost differential between them goes up at a couple of hundred dollars per 3 steps of S/N 

And other parameters like Halo, EBI, Photocatode response are important as well, but as a somewhat loose rule, the higher the S/N, the better these other figures will probably be because in the end, these other things are the kind sof things that stop the tube from being a higher S/N (loose but a good way to think about it).   

 

I would look for SN of 25 or better, and 30 is pretty great.  Not that there is no benefit to going higher, but this kind f tube (30 SN with photocathode of 2500 or so) is not hard to get, and once you go past this, it gets a bit harder.  

 

There is also the choice between using WP and Green, but PVS-7 users don't really get this choice and half to use green.


Edited by Eddgie, 13 July 2016 - 03:02 PM.


#100 Solar storm

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 03:47 PM

Mike, I have Sky Safari Pro, and I have downloaded lists of all of the Sharpless Objects from the Eastern Missouri Astronomical Society's website. As to where to post observations, I would think that either place would be appropriate. The mods here on the EAA forum are very tolerant of EAA observational posts.

 

Doug, that link rocks!  I never new I could import lists in to Sky Safari!  This will make for more fun out with the PVS!


Edited by Solar storm, 13 July 2016 - 03:57 PM.

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