Jump to content

  •  

CNers have asked about a donation box for Cloudy Nights over the years, so here you go. Donation is not required by any means, so please enjoy your stay.

Photo

A question about Carl Zeiss JENA Deltrintem 8X30

equipment binoculars
  • Please log in to reply
17 replies to this topic

#1 Redgrave

Redgrave

    Lift Off

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 3
  • Joined: 17 Jul 2017

Posted 17 July 2017 - 09:31 AM

Hello guys,

 

I have a Carl Zeiss JENA Deltrintem 8X30 binoculars. It's serial number is 1169204. According to this form http://www.europa.co...pe/zeissbin.txt it should be made between 1921~1922. But it also has a mark "Germany"on it. As I know only post war made had "Germany" mark. Is it genuine or a copy?

 

Can anyone tell me anything about it? Any information would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

 

14063914_10153964490194624_4634106668469359549_n.jpg

14021552_10153964490424624_3730095088696854835_n.jpg

14045994_10153964490659624_3407320175670094999_n.jpg

14039973_10153964490309624_6140321316211303189_n.jpg

14034759_10153964490859624_6883536291792818074_n.jpg


Edited by Redgrave, 18 July 2017 - 07:00 AM.


#2 jtsenghas

jtsenghas

    Gemini

  • *****
  • Posts: 3321
  • Joined: 14 Sep 2014
  • Loc: The flatlands of Northwest Ohio --Bloomdale

Posted 17 July 2017 - 11:55 AM

The only info I can help you with on this one is instructions on posting photos:

 

Your image must be less than 500 kB. In fact the total of all attachments must be less than 500kB, so you may have to reduce a high resolution photo even if you simply open it in Microsoft's Paint and resize it to 10-30% and resave it. (That program will show the file size after you resize it ONLY after you resave it).

 

Choose the "More Reply options" button on the bottom of the post you are composing, click the "Browse..." button under attach files, select your file, and choose "Attach this file". It will then appear with your post.

 

If you want it to appear in a specific place within the text of your post, insert your cursor there, and click the "Add to post" button to the right of the file thumbnail.

 

You can always see how the post will apper by by clicking "Preview Post" at the bottom of your screen before actually posting to verify.



#3 Mad Matt

Mad Matt

    Vanguard

  • *****
  • Posts: 2042
  • Joined: 20 May 2003
  • Loc: Frankfurt, Germany

Posted 17 July 2017 - 01:25 PM

Is the focusing knob plastic or metal? Here is a little info on the official Japanese Zeiss 8x30 had 6https://www.flickr.c.../in/photostream

#4 Foss

Foss

    Messenger

  • *****
  • Posts: 427
  • Joined: 20 Feb 2012

Posted 17 July 2017 - 04:37 PM

For reference, here's a pair (circa 1922) I once owned with "Germany" stamped on the IPD scale. Yours look genuine to me.

Attached Thumbnails

  • Z1193924bSM.JPG

Edited by Foss, 18 July 2017 - 08:17 AM.

  • Frankastro64 likes this

#5 Redgrave

Redgrave

    Lift Off

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 3
  • Joined: 17 Jul 2017

Posted 18 July 2017 - 07:03 AM

Ok, photos upload

 

Focusing knob? I'm not sure, I need to check it. What's different between plastic and metal?



#6 FrankL

FrankL

    Viking 1

  • -----
  • Posts: 528
  • Joined: 30 Jul 2009
  • Loc: Winnipeg, Manitoba Canada

Posted 19 July 2017 - 08:28 AM

It's genuine.

 

Some 1920's - 1930's Zeiss are marked "Germany" and some are not. My Delactis made in 1926 is marked Germany while my Deltrintem made in 1936 is not. 

 

The focus knob on my Deltrintem and most if not all others from this period is plastic (or possibly Bakelite) with an inset metal disc with focus settings which is retained by 3 screws along the edge of the focus knob.

 

The Deltrintem/Deltrentis eyelenses underwent several modifications. The first ones had a 5 element Erfle type eyelens; during the later 1920's a 6 element Erfle type was used; in 1932 a non-Erfle 4 element aspheric lens was introduced; and circa 1946 they reverted to a 5 element Erfle type. 


Edited by FrankL, 19 July 2017 - 08:33 AM.


#7 Redgrave

Redgrave

    Lift Off

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 3
  • Joined: 17 Jul 2017

Posted 25 July 2017 - 10:27 AM

Hi,guys

 

I've checked .The outside ring of focusing knob is looks like plastic, but inside marked with numbers it seems to be metal.

 

So, is it made by Japan?


Edited by Redgrave, 25 July 2017 - 10:27 AM.


#8 trener

trener

    Mariner 2

  • -----
  • Posts: 211
  • Joined: 19 Nov 2014
  • Loc: European Union

Posted 25 July 2017 - 02:05 PM

Do they have any AR coatings?



#9 lylver

lylver

    Messenger

  • *****
  • Moderators
  • Posts: 401
  • Joined: 15 Feb 2017
  • Loc: near Geneva but in France

Posted 26 November 2017 - 04:15 PM

It's genuine.

 

Some 1920's - 1930's Zeiss are marked "Germany" and some are not. My Delactis made in 1926 is marked Germany while my Deltrintem made in 1936 is not. 

 

The focus knob on my Deltrintem and most if not all others from this period is plastic (or possibly Bakelite) with an inset metal disc with focus settings which is retained by 3 screws along the edge of the focus knob.

 

The Deltrintem/Deltrentis eyelenses underwent several modifications. The first ones had a 5 element Erfle type eyelens; during the later 1920's a 6 element Erfle type was used; in 1932 a non-Erfle 4 element aspheric lens was introduced; and circa 1946 they reverted to a 5 element Erfle type. 

I think the Erfle were later than that (they are WWII eyepiece)

The first 3 lens EP was a Konig 2+1 55° then a 3+1 60-70° (1920-1947), it was enhanced later with an Erfle (post WWII)

Source : https://www.allbinos...intem_8x30.html

172161_del8x30b.jpg

A strange, uncommon erfle design. (field convex)

172162_del8x30c.jpg

AR coating began around 1939 for those binocular (T single layer) : increasing from 50-60% transmission to 70-80%

Starting in 1978, T3M coating increases to 90-92%, with a centered color range @550nm : it brings some yellow touch to the image

25649_zeiss_deltrintem.jpg

 

Just bought one from 1989, as a small light survey bino. (operating range 80-200m), field 12m-30m wide


Edited by lylver, 26 November 2017 - 04:17 PM.

  • Mad Matt likes this

#10 FrankL

FrankL

    Viking 1

  • -----
  • Posts: 528
  • Joined: 30 Jul 2009
  • Loc: Winnipeg, Manitoba Canada

Posted 27 November 2017 - 12:19 PM

"The Deltrintem/Deltrentis eyelenses underwent several modifications. The first ones had a 5 element Erfle type eyelens; during the later 1920's a 6 element Erfle type was used; in 1932 a non-Erfle 4 element aspheric lens was introduced; and circa 1946 they reverted to a 5 element Erfle type."

 

This information is from the book, "Zeiss Handferngläser 1919-1946. Modelle - Merkmale - Mythos" , Dr. Hans T. Seeger, Hamburg 2015, pages 150-151.

 

I am confident Dr. Seeger is correct.

 

See: https://www.cloudyni...lars-1919-1946/


Edited by FrankL, 27 November 2017 - 12:20 PM.


#11 lylver

lylver

    Messenger

  • *****
  • Moderators
  • Posts: 401
  • Joined: 15 Feb 2017
  • Loc: near Geneva but in France

Posted 27 November 2017 - 04:23 PM

It is a great information, I always believed the Deltrintem were only civilian binoculars.

But what you report, the fact Erfle worked early on this device is a mystery.

He was at the head of the telescope department in 1918 and worked for submarines optics.

Another fact to consider : Germany was very poor after 1918 till 1930, pressed they were due to the Versailles treaty. They were costly products for common people.

 

Perhaps at start, the fact that Erfle equiped them with his lenses probably means they were used as military devices on submarines U35 during ww1 as an officer light spotting/survey bino.

The 5 lens is the classic wide field EP, not center sharp. The 6 lens may be sharp in center. (not a Kaspereit I believe)

Then why such a model could'nt go to the public market after war as a surplus ?

 

It is interesting to search in this book about an initial a waterproof military version, could be a nice historic discovery.



#12 dmorrow

dmorrow

    Explorer 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 70
  • Joined: 24 Dec 2010
  • Loc: North Carolina

Posted 20 May 2018 - 09:22 PM

I just picked up a pair of Deltrintems with serial number 1548071, which puts them around 1930.

 

really nice binoculars, esp considering the age.  These have some sort of streaks on the back of the objectives.    Any opinions about/experience with sending old optics like this to Zeiss for cleanup?  

 

Thanks for any any info you can provide.


Edited by dmorrow, 20 May 2018 - 09:23 PM.


#13 Rich V.

Rich V.

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 5760
  • Joined: 02 Jan 2005
  • Loc: Lake Tahoe area, Nevada

Posted 21 May 2018 - 12:33 PM

Any opinions about/experience with sending old optics like this to Zeiss for cleanup?

 

Perhaps a short trip to Suddarth Optical in Oklahoma would take care of any issues you may have without the shipping and likely higher repair cost of sending them to Zeiss.  Many members here have had work done by Cory S. on a wide variety of binos, large and small, new and vintage.

 

Rich


  • dmorrow likes this

#14 FrankL

FrankL

    Viking 1

  • -----
  • Posts: 528
  • Joined: 30 Jul 2009
  • Loc: Winnipeg, Manitoba Canada

Posted 21 May 2018 - 02:38 PM

The only older binoculars Zeiss may service are those made by West German Zeiss, not Zeiss Jena.


  • dmorrow likes this

#15 dmorrow

dmorrow

    Explorer 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 70
  • Joined: 24 Dec 2010
  • Loc: North Carolina

Posted 21 May 2018 - 07:20 PM

RichV and FrankL - Very helpful information.  Will check with Suddarth Optical.  Thank you,  



#16 Mad Matt

Mad Matt

    Vanguard

  • *****
  • Posts: 2042
  • Joined: 20 May 2003
  • Loc: Frankfurt, Germany

Posted 21 May 2018 - 11:55 PM

The only older binoculars Zeiss may service are those made by West German Zeiss, not Zeiss Jena.


Here in Germany, the Zeiss service department will not even touch the vintage stuff they no longer have parts for. I asked them if they could clean and service my vintage Zeiss West 8x30 porro's and that was their response.


Edited by Mad Matt, 22 May 2018 - 03:55 AM.


#17 PEterW

PEterW

    Surveyor 1

  • -----
  • Posts: 1525
  • Joined: 02 Jan 2006
  • Loc: SW London, UK

Posted 22 May 2018 - 03:20 AM

Get all your vintage stuff serviced whilst we still can.

Peter

#18 Gordon Rayner

Gordon Rayner

    Gemini

  • *****
  • Posts: 3187
  • Joined: 24 Mar 2007

Posted 28 May 2018 - 01:00 AM

Do you mean  while such parts as may yet be findable   are available?    Or, that  persons with skills, tools, patience,   and experience to qualify  may  cease to offer service, from age or  boredom?    

 

Or, that  offering such service  will cease to   become  a worthwhile  commercial activity?  

 

Kamakura Koki   were  one, if not the only,   Japanese subcontractor   for  CZ  Jena   during the   DDR   period.  




CNers have asked about a donation box for Cloudy Nights over the years, so here you go. Donation is not required by any means, so please enjoy your stay.


Recent Topics





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: equipment, binoculars



Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics