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My peak observing time is running out :(

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#26 star drop

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Posted 14 February 2018 - 07:53 PM

I like standard time. Set it and forget it.


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#27 Tony Flanders

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 09:19 AM

To my mind, the DST debate sometimes seems like a debate between morning-people (anti-DST) vs. evening-people (pro-DST).


That does tend to be true, in my experience. But that in turn reveals a very interesting fact. Pretty much every late-bird that I know loves daylight-saving time. But if you told those same people that from March 11 to November 4 of this year they would have to go to work (or school) one hour earlier every day, but be allowed to leave one hour earlier, those same daylight-saving-time lovers would scream bloody murder.

Yet viewed in terms of Universal Time or local mean solar time, those two scenarios are precisely identical! One way of looking at daylight-saving time is that it is a government decree that all activities should take place an hour earlier than usual -- with the sop of changing the clock time so that people don't really know that this is what's happening.

This suggests that what late-birds really like is not so much the fact of going to bed late as the idea of going to bed late. Or perhaps what they really like isn't going to bed late in absolute (nature-based) terms but going to bed late in social terms. Later than most other people, in other words.
 

DST means summer to me, and summer is my favorite time of the year.


Right, it's very hard to separate loving or hating DST from loving or hating summer. Truth be told, one hour here or there isn't much. Regardless of DST, it would still get light way earlier by clock time in the summer than in the winter, and stay light a lot later.

Personally, summer is my least favorite of all the seasons, for a whole slew of reasons. A big part of that is that the weather tends to be really uncomfortable here in the East during the summer.

However, despite being my least favorite, I still adore summer. In fact, I adore all the seasons, not just the four big divisions but the subdivisions within each. Like right now in February when the birds are suddenly starting to sing like crazy and the buds on the early-blooming trees are getting huge.

Most of all, I love the fact that the seasons are constantly changing. But when all is said and done, like it or not, summer is the season that makes all the other seasons possible, at least in the temperate zones and cooler. Summer is when things grow.


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#28 Slartibartfast

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 12:16 PM

This suggests that what late-birds really like is not so much the fact of going to bed late as the idea of going to bed late. Or perhaps what they really like isn't going to bed late in absolute (nature-based) terms but going to bed late in social terms. Later than most other people, in other words.

Everyone is different, but for me, I agree that I enjoy staying up late (social aspect). But also, most of the time I can't get my mind to shut down at night and sleep doesn't come easy. So, astronomy is a good match for me! smile.gif

I adore all the seasons, not just the four big divisions but the subdivisions within each. Like right now in February when the birds are suddenly starting to sing like crazy and the buds on the early-blooming trees are getting huge.

Me too! I noticed the birds just this morning, while walking my younger daughter to the bus stop. They have begun their spring songs. I always look for the first crocuses pushing their way out of the soil, first blooms on the forsythia bushes, and the first arrival of a honey bee. Not to mention the arrival of the spring galaxies in Virgo and Ursa Major, and M3 in Bootes.  All good stuff!



#29 Starkid2u

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 06:52 PM

 

This suggests that what late-birds really like is not so much the fact of going to bed late as the idea of going to bed late. Or perhaps what they really like isn't going to bed late in absolute (nature-based) terms but going to bed late in social terms. Later than most other people, in other words.

Everyone is different, but for me, I agree that I enjoy staying up late (social aspect). But also, most of the time I can't get my mind to shut down at night and sleep doesn't come easy. So, astronomy is a good match for me! smile.gif

I adore all the seasons, not just the four big divisions but the subdivisions within each. Like right now in February when the birds are suddenly starting to sing like crazy and the buds on the early-blooming trees are getting huge.

Me too! I noticed the birds just this morning, while walking my younger daughter to the bus stop. They have begun their spring songs. I always look for the first crocuses pushing their way out of the soil, first blooms on the forsythia bushes, and the first arrival of a honey bee. Not to mention the arrival of the spring galaxies in Virgo and Ursa Major, and M3 in Bootes.  All good stuff!

 

Yeah, well, they haven't started in Upstate NY yet, I can tell you that...

 

STARKID2U



#30 jrbarnett

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 09:11 PM

Orion is the King, no doubt. The whole Gemini, Orion, Taurus, Auriga region is just stunning on a clear frosty night. But summer means Scorpius, Sagittarius, and Cygnus. Plus, a lot more clear nights than in winter, at least in Ohio. 

I actually prefer the lesser traveled paths through Canis Major, Monoceros, Puppis, Canis Minor, etc.  There are an incredible number of interesting clusters and a few overlooked but stunning nebulae in that region.  Hubble's Variable Nebula, the Rosette, M46 with its interloping planetary nebula, and one of my favorite open cluster, NGC 2369 surrounding Tau Canis Major.  Those are only just getting good in the mid-evening.

 

Best,

 

Jim  


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#31 bumm

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 10:29 PM

I've always been a night owl, just because I love the night.  And I've always HATED daylight savings time, ever since it started.  Like the OP, as soon as the weather started getting nicer, it started getting dark an hour later.  I'd have several weeks of pleasant scope time, then have to start staying up later.  In the middle of the summer, when the rare transparent night would come along, it wouldn't get fully dark until 11:00, and when I was working and had to be sharp the next morning, this pretty much put a stop to my hobby.  I felt very little joy for those who wanted to play golf an hour later.

     Having retired this year, DST won't be the disaster it used to be, but I still hate it.  There's nothing wrong with night, and I still like it.

                                                                                                                   Marty


Edited by bumm, 15 February 2018 - 10:31 PM.

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#32 erick86

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 11:59 PM

Recently there was a big push by the government in Alberta, Canada to kill DST so that the time stays the same all year long.  The only problem is that their terminology was incorrect -- they weren't proposing to "kill DST" like everyone kept saying, but rather to essentially keep Alberta on DST permanently all year long by adopting Central Time rather than Mountain Time.  I was all for them "killing DST", until I discovered that they actually meant the very opposite.

 

I never get to see the summer sky, as the sun doesn't even set until after 10pm in June this far north with DST.  At least I still have half the year in the winter when the sun sets early enough to see the night sky, although 10000000 layers of clothing are required to stay out longer than 30 minutes.  



#33 earlyriser

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 05:57 AM

 

Orion is the King, no doubt. The whole Gemini, Orion, Taurus, Auriga region is just stunning on a clear frosty night. But summer means Scorpius, Sagittarius, and Cygnus. Plus, a lot more clear nights than in winter, at least in Ohio. 

I actually prefer the lesser traveled paths through Canis Major, Monoceros, Puppis, Canis Minor, etc.  There are an incredible number of interesting clusters and a few overlooked but stunning nebulae in that region.  Hubble's Variable Nebula, the Rosette, M46 with its interloping planetary nebula, and one of my favorite open cluster, NGC 2369 surrounding Tau Canis Major.  Those are only just getting good in the mid-evening.

 

Best,

 

Jim  

 

There are a lot of treasures in that region. It's enough to make wish for a more southerly observing site. I've been known to spend an hour just going back and forth between M46, M47 and NGC 2423. M41 is a great cluster, and NGC 2369 is also one of my favorites. Sometimes I'll start at Tau Canis Major and drift north and east as the Earth rotates things into my observing window to the south, stopping at various clusters along the way to M93 and beyond. Observing objects in this area can get dicey for me due to the low altitude and light dome south of me, however. 


Edited by earlyriser, 16 February 2018 - 05:58 AM.


#34 Tony Flanders

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 06:13 AM

 

I actually prefer the lesser traveled paths through Canis Major, Monoceros, Puppis, Canis Minor, etc.  There are an incredible number of interesting clusters and a few overlooked but stunning nebulae in that region.  Hubble's Variable Nebula, the Rosette, M46 with its interloping planetary nebula, and one of my favorite open cluster, NGC 2369 surrounding Tau Canis Major.  Those are only just getting good in the mid-evening.

There are a lot of treasures in that region. It's enough to make wish for a more southerly observing site ...

 


Indeed! Monoceros is wonderful; it's hard to think of any constellation so inconspicuous to the naked eye yet so rich in deep-sky objects. To say nothing of what's arguably the very best triple star in the sky.

As for Puppis, it's just the very tippy top of the great ship Argo. It gets better and better the farther south you go. Southern Puppis and Vela have an unbelievable number of bright, splashy star clusters. As for Carina ... words do not suffice to tout its glories. We have nothing like it in the Northern Hemisphere.


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#35 ascii

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 07:36 AM

Recently there was a big push by the government in Alberta, Canada to kill DST so that the time stays the same all year long.  The only problem is that their terminology was incorrect -- they weren't proposing to "kill DST" like everyone kept saying, but rather to essentially keep Alberta on DST permanently all year long by adopting Central Time rather than Mountain Time.  I was all for them "killing DST", until I discovered that they actually meant the very opposite.

 

I never get to see the summer sky, as the sun doesn't even set until after 10pm in June this far north with DST.  At least I still have half the year in the winter when the sun sets early enough to see the night sky, although 10000000 layers of clothing are required to stay out longer than 30 minutes.  

Wow!  That would have been a nasty bit of bait and switch.



#36 t_image

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 08:38 AM

I don't really notice DST except it gives me more time to prepare after work before a session.

 

FWIW,

If we all move to Arizona,

there won't be any complaints about DST (state does not observer DST, except the Navajo reservation.

Here's a fun article on the matter and more DST history:

https://www.usatoday...-time/98964644/

 

Also no complaints about extended terribly cold weather.

Also lots more clear skies out there....

Just saying.....

 

Depends on the trade-offs you're willing to deal with I guess...



#37 BGazing

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 09:01 AM

Here's my winter: clear and nice around full Moon, clouds and rain any time it looks like it might be good for DSOs.

Rinse and repeat.

My total time with M42 - one hour during first Moon quarter. Everything else was a complete waste.

I hope spring cannot be any worse than this.



#38 SeaBee1

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 09:24 AM

I couldn't care less about DST vs ST... just pick ONE and leave it alone...

 

YMMV

 

CB



#39 earlyriser

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 10:08 AM

Here's my winter: clear and nice around full Moon, clouds and rain any time it looks like it might be good for DSOs.

Rinse and repeat.

My total time with M42 - one hour during first Moon quarter. Everything else was a complete waste.

I hope spring cannot be any worse than this.

Sounds a lot like Ohio.



#40 REC

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 12:22 PM

 

 

I actually prefer the lesser traveled paths through Canis Major, Monoceros, Puppis, Canis Minor, etc.  There are an incredible number of interesting clusters and a few overlooked but stunning nebulae in that region.  Hubble's Variable Nebula, the Rosette, M46 with its interloping planetary nebula, and one of my favorite open cluster, NGC 2369 surrounding Tau Canis Major.  Those are only just getting good in the mid-evening.

There are a lot of treasures in that region. It's enough to make wish for a more southerly observing site ...

 


Indeed! Monoceros is wonderful; it's hard to think of any constellation so inconspicuous to the naked eye yet so rich in deep-sky objects. To say nothing of what's arguably the very best triple star in the sky.

As for Puppis, it's just the very tippy top of the great ship Argo. It gets better and better the farther south you go. Southern Puppis and Vela have an unbelievable number of bright, splashy star clusters. As for Carina ... words do not suffice to tout its glories. We have nothing like it in the Northern Hemisphere.

 

Hmmm, where is that triple, never heard about it?



#41 Szumi

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 12:36 PM

The one thing I miss about Indiana is they didn't do that DST thing when I lived there.  Practical people those Hoosiers.


Edited by Szumi, 17 February 2018 - 12:37 PM.

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#42 jrbarnett

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 01:32 PM

The one thing I miss about Indiana is they didn't do that DST thing when I lived there. Practical people those Hoosiers.


Or maybe just easily confused. grin.gif DST is an hour. Unless you work and are observing midweek, who cares what the clock says? The sun still sets and rises. The number of hours of darkness remains unchanged. I never notice DST to be honest. On work days it is dark when I go in an dark or dusk when I go home year round. I just put on my big boy pants and observe when it is dark and I have the time.

- Jim


Edited by jrbarnett, 18 February 2018 - 10:37 AM.

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#43 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 01:56 PM

Hmmm, where is that triple, never heard about it?

 

 

"Beta Mons"

 

jon



#44 REC

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Posted 18 February 2018 - 11:54 AM

I think I may have jinxed myself with this post? It's been cloudy everyday since I posted it. Today we have a real nice sunny day, but then the prediction for tonight shows clouds moving in right after sunset....boo:(

 

The next week don't look too good either and March 11th. is coming on quickly. Sorry I messed up anyone's skies nearby.



#45 geoffl

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Posted Yesterday, 07:06 AM

Here in the UK, there are still arguments for keeping GMT all year round (mostly farmers, particularly in Scotland); or adopting Central European Time, GMT + 1 in winter & GMT +2 in summer (mostly businesses with strong European links, and the Royal Society for the Prevention of Accidents [80 fewer road deaths]).

 

Whatever time it says on my watch, in London, about the same latitude as my garden, for the whole of June and early July, there is zero astronomical darkness (astronomical twilight starts at 01:00:01 BST, and ends at 01:00:01 [the centre of London is slightly west of Greenwich]). I hate to think what it is like in northern Norway/Canada - solar observing only for almost half the year.

 

Geoff


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#46 david-p

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Posted Yesterday, 08:02 AM

The one thing I miss about Indiana is they didn't do that DST thing when I lived there.  Practical people those Hoosiers.

I also lived there in those days, and agree. One never noticed any disadvantage. But being approximately 12 degrees west of NY, EST was one hour out from the sun, and so effectively most of Indiana was on summer time (DST) all through the year until 2006 -- except from some parts of Indiana: near Chicago and south of Paoli (Marengo comes to mind) that were on different time zones -- not always predictable before you got there!

 

David


Edited by david-p, Yesterday, 08:02 AM.


#47 david-p

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Posted Yesterday, 10:38 AM

I like standard time. Set it and forget it.

Yes. I have at least 9 timepieces that need to be reset twice a year -- one being this Win 10 laptop, which resolutely refuses to change into or out of summer time automatically. This requires searching for the user manuals. In fact, in the case of more than one of them, I dont bother and just remember that they are an hour out of step with their colleagues during the summer.

 

David


Edited by david-p, Yesterday, 05:26 PM.

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#48 payner

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Posted Yesterday, 04:32 PM

We have had heavy rainfall for the 10 days or so.  It is predicted to start raining again by Wednesday, with some areas to reach several inches by the time it ends.  The streams are above bankful with many having flooded over the last week.  Prediction for more flooding on the way.

 

Randy




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