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Need some advice on ES 102 vs SV 80

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#1 kreasonos

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Posted 19 June 2018 - 10:01 PM

Hey everyone, just wanted some advice on which scope would be better for me. 

 

I like the ES 102 CF because it looks cool and it's a 4" for a good price. 

$1274.99 and that includes a 2" diagonal, however no eye pieces and no mount

 

vs. 

 

The Stellarvue SV80ST Visual system for

$1561.00 and comes with diagonal, three eye pieces and a case

 

I really just want something portable I can take out and look at planets, moons, galaxies. No imaging as I don't even own a camera so just visuals. What would ya'll recommend? Thank you


Edited by kreasonos, 19 June 2018 - 10:02 PM.

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#2 Gregory2012

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Posted 19 June 2018 - 11:23 PM

What have you been using already? Why the change or is this your first scope?

 

Gregory Gig Harbor, WA.



#3 kreasonos

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Posted 19 June 2018 - 11:27 PM

What have you been using already? Why the change or is this your first scope?

 

Gregory Gig Harbor, WA.

I've been using binoculars and it's been great but I want something for the ground haha



#4 ghostboo

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Posted 19 June 2018 - 11:38 PM

I think either is fine but you'll soon want a nice wide eyepiece for the Stellarvue. Something around a 32mm. I think the 102 will show you a bit more with it's larger aperture. You'll still need eyepieces with that one. I bought a Baader Hyperion MK IV which is a high quality 8-24mm zoom. You could pick up a 32mm later on. There isn't a significant weight difference between them so a nice alt/az mount should handle either just fine.

 

For a visual mount, I would recommend the Explore Scientific Twilight I - https://explorescien...wilight-1-mount



#5 kreasonos

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Posted 19 June 2018 - 11:42 PM

I think either is fine but you'll soon want a nice wide eyepiece for the Stellarvue. Something around a 32mm. I think the 102 will show you a bit more with it's larger aperture. You'll still need eyepieces with that one. I bought a Baader Hyperion MK IV which is a high quality 8-24mm zoom. You could pick up a 32mm later on. There isn't a significant weight difference between them so a nice alt/az mount should handle either just fine.

 

For a visual mount, I would recommend the Explore Scientific Twilight I - https://explorescien...wilight-1-mount

That mount looks really nice, thank you!



#6 ZL4PLM

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Posted 19 June 2018 - 11:48 PM

to be honest .. planets moons galaxies ... I'd be buying an Edge 8 

 

the 102 will be sharp as will the 80 but the short focal length is going to make them all pretty small 

 

You can pick up an Edge 8 pretty reasonable vs the 102

 

the focal length is such that DSO will be bigger ... Omega Cen for example fills a 30mm EP - Carina Nebula shows beautiful dust lanes and the nebula is bright and crisp, planets .. Saturn rings Jupiter is awesome and GRS very visible 

 

All up one scope does well and not too heavy 

 

You haven't mentioned mounts or budgets but for visual the AVX size mount is ok - so something EQ6 or similar would also be ok 

 

I personally don't like my 102 for visual ... objects always looks too small

 

Show people Jupiter using the Edge 8 and its ... wow time 

 

:) 

 

My 8 goes to Outreach ... the 102 / 80 ... imaging only 

 

 

my 2c worth anyway :)

Cheers

Simon  



#7 gnowellsct

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Posted 19 June 2018 - 11:51 PM

Hey everyone, just wanted some advice on which scope would be better for me. 

 

I like the ES 102 CF because it looks cool 

All that glisters is not gold—
Often have you heard that told.
Many a man his life hath sold
But my outside to behold.



#8 kreasonos

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 07:40 AM

Actually, now I'm looking at their Access line because they say they're good for visuals too and for a lot less. 


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#9 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 08:15 AM

That mount looks really nice, thank you!

 

I own a Twilight 1 mount.  I consider it adequate but not ideal for an 80mm.  A no-no for a 4 inch.  That's my experience.

 

80mm and 102mm refractors are great but they have a limited reach,  limited resolution.  Lots of choices out there.  SCTs, Maks, Newtonians, Dobsonians.. 

 

Jon


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#10 IMB

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 09:37 AM


<...> For a visual mount, I would recommend the Explore Scientific Twilight I - https://explorescien...t-1-mount <...>

Absolutely no! This is a horrible shaky mount.



#11 IMB

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 09:38 AM

Actually, now I'm looking at their Access line because they say they're good for visuals too and for a lot less. 

You're right - you don't need a triplet for visual. There are many good ED doublets to choose from.


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#12 IMB

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 10:11 AM

Hey everyone, just wanted some advice on which scope would be better for me. 

 

<...>

 

I really just want something portable I can take out and look at planets, moons, galaxies. No imaging as I don't even own a camera so just visuals. What would ya'll recommend? Thank you

My path in the hobby is similar to yours - I also started with binocular observations. I still do dedicated binocular sessions, and even if I observe with a telescope, I always have a pair of binoculars at hand.

 

My suggestion is to start with the aperture in the range of 72 - 80 mm. This is what a small aperture telescope is good for:

- as a grab-n-go, you can start observing in less than a minute; this is very valuable when your astronomical weather is bad and you have to deal with clouds and low temperatures

- as a travel scope, it will enable you to do observations under breathtakingly beautiful skies - I traveled with my 72 mm to Arizona, Hawaii, and Chile

- mounting requirements are modest; with a proper mount you'll be able to achieve very steady views while keeping the mount light

- when time comes, it will be a good companion for your large-aperture instrument

 

med_gallery_264243_7874_670515.jpg

 

Best of luck with your decision!


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#13 Binojunky

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 10:13 AM

Take a look at the Synta made 80mm ED doublets, F7.5, I have had several pass through my hands over the years, Celestron, Orion, the mechanics work fine for visual, the optics were consistently good and the longer focal length helps with balance and jacking up the magnification when needed, Skywatcher do a version with a two speed focuser, 50mm finder, two inch diagonal and an eyepiece all in a fitted case for a very reasonable price,D



#14 kreasonos

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 11:30 AM

What do you guys think of this deal? It comes with two eye pieces, diagonal, a case, and a finder scope. 

 

SkyWatcher has this advertised: 

 

EvoStar 80ED / ProED 80mm Doublet APO Refractor
$765.00

80 mm apochromatic Refractor with Schott BK-7 and FPL-53 ED glass
600 mm focal length (f/7.5)
Dual-speed 2″ Crayford-type focuser with 1.25″ adaptor
8×50 RA erect-image finderscope
2″ dielectric diagonal
20 mm and 5 mm 1.25″ eyepieces
Tube-ring attachment hardware and Aluminum carry case

 

http://www.skywatche...-apo-refractor/


Edited by kreasonos, 20 June 2018 - 11:30 AM.


#15 IMB

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 11:47 AM

What do you guys think of this deal? It comes with two eye pieces, diagonal, a case, and a finder scope. 

 

SkyWatcher has this advertised: 

 

EvoStar 80ED / ProED 80mm Doublet APO Refractor
$765.00

80 mm apochromatic Refractor with Schott BK-7 and FPL-53 ED glass
600 mm focal length (f/7.5)
Dual-speed 2″ Crayford-type focuser with 1.25″ adaptor
8×50 RA erect-image finderscope
2″ dielectric diagonal
20 mm and 5 mm 1.25″ eyepieces
Tube-ring attachment hardware and Aluminum carry case

 

http://www.skywatche...-apo-refractor/

This scope has a good reputation on CN. As for the package, all items, except the two eyepieces, are probably quite decent.

 

Not sure about your budget for eyepieces. Relatively inexpensive, but quite good are eyepieces in the Meade HD-60 line. If you can budget slightly more, consider the Explore Scientific 82 degree line.

 

Don't forget about mount. This is the most important part of your telescopic setup, even if you're a visual observer.


Edited by IMB, 20 June 2018 - 11:48 AM.


#16 Peter Besenbruch

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 03:45 PM

For a visual mount, I would recommend the Explore Scientific Twilight I - https://explorescien...wilight-1-mount

Gah! The Twilight 1 is marginal for an 80mm, and out of its league on a 4". I used to own one and mounted an 80mm on it. Note the past tense.


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#17 Peter Besenbruch

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 03:49 PM

This scope has a good reputation on CN. As for the package, all items, except the two eyepieces, are probably quite decent.

Actually, the 5mm is the only "kit" eyepiece I have kept. It's quite good. The 20mm is OK. I had problems with the diagonal.



#18 kreasonos

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 04:01 PM

Lots of great advice and tips here, thank you all! It's nice to see there are so many great options at reasonable prices. 


Edited by kreasonos, 20 June 2018 - 04:01 PM.


#19 SteveG

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Posted 20 June 2018 - 11:16 PM

I personally would want the 4" scope, which is my minimum.

I also agree that for visual you should be looking at ED doublets, if you want a refractor. You'll need a descent mount though.


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#20 nicoledoula

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Posted 21 June 2018 - 08:32 PM

I'm just going to go ahead and recommend a 6" F/8 Dob. Not an 8" or 10" Dob, a 6" Dob. For $300 . Buy a cheap 40mm/33mm Erfle for widefields and spend decent money on a 16-18mm EP and the TV 3X barlow for planets. Use it, go to star parties held by your local astronomy club and THEN decide IF you need to upgrade and how. Read these threads. Use the index. I'm here to help you not waste money/get the best bang for the buck. They'll tell you 8" & 10" but then you have to pay more for corrected EP's and coma correctors. Also have to wait longer for the mirror to cool down and be more touchy/needy when it comes to collimation accuracy. No, a 6" F/8 Dob is the perfect beginners scope still. No matter what Uncle Al would have us think. Almost no investment gets you 6" of aperture. $300 to see if you like telescope astronomy. 



#21 Peter Besenbruch

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Posted 22 June 2018 - 02:52 PM

I'm just going to go ahead and recommend a 6" F/8 Dob. Not an 8" or 10" Dob, a 6" Dob. For $300 . Buy a cheap 40mm/33mm Erfle for widefields...

This assumes that the 6" accepts 2" eyepieces. They almost never do. Low power is typically a 32mm Plössl. Why is this? It's a geometry thing mostly. Play around with any Newtonian secondary size calculator, and you will realize two things: The smaller the primary mirror, the harder it is to get a proportionately small secondary that works. The longer the f-ratio, the faster light falls off toward the edge of the field.

 

6", f8 Dobs are good, because they are cheap, their mirrors are relatively easy to make, they aren't too heavy, and they are pretty forgiving of beginners when it comes to collimation.



#22 IMB

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Posted 22 June 2018 - 03:37 PM

Solid-tube dobs even of small aperture are quite bulky. If portability is important (think of air travel), a dob would be a wrong choice.


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#23 kreasonos

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Posted 22 June 2018 - 05:39 PM

Solid-tube dobs even of small aperture are quite bulky. If portability is important (think of air travel), a dob would be a wrong choice.

Yea, a Dob doesn't really work for me. I live on the 5th floor of a huge building, lot of walking just to get to my car. Plus I have a 4 year old usually in tow. I need something super portable. I'm leaning toward an 80mm honestly. 


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#24 IMB

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Posted 22 June 2018 - 05:58 PM

Yea, a Dob doesn't really work for me. I live on the 5th floor of a huge building, lot of walking just to get to my car. Plus I have a 4 year old usually in tow. I need something super portable. I'm leaning toward an 80mm honestly. No one

No one knows your personal circumstances better than you, so only you can decide what's best for you. I'm glad that you're thinking through your use case. Different people could decide differently based on their priorities.

 

You know that you've picked the right instrument, if you enjoy it and observe with it frequently.


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