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Review of the new ZWO Narrowband filters - comparison to the old ZWO and Astrodon filters

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#51 BoskoSLO

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 01:40 PM

I received a the new set of ZWO 31mm NB filters. I think I got faults ones. Ha and OIII have a large amount of light leakage at the edges or is that normal.

Anyway can't confirm since I have absolutely no idea which side is camera side. I'm not color blind and I was testing it under white color light (LED) and there is absolutely no difference or similarities which side is the right one. SII is obvious but Ha and OIII they both have exactly the same reflections on both sides and the colors are inverted. There is no purple or gold color like shown on the ZWO website.

 

Tried looking at the filter at different angles at different light source with complete confusion. Maybe they are really faulty. Tested all 3 filters on VEGA star and SII is great but Ha and OIII have a huge reflection issues.

 

OIII:

https://i.imgur.com/7FgHfyV.jpg

 

Ha:

https://i.imgur.com/QvwFbnl.jpg

 

SII:

https://i.imgur.com/13XZBCb.jpg



#52 cfosterstars

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 01:58 PM

I received a the new set of ZWO 31mm NB filters. I think I got faults ones. Ha and OIII have a large amount of light leakage at the edges or is that normal.

Anyway can't confirm since I have absolutely no idea which side is camera side. I'm not color blind and I was testing it under white color light (LED) and there is absolutely no difference or similarities which side is the right one. SII is obvious but Ha and OIII they both have exactly the same reflections on both sides and the colors are inverted. There is no purple or gold color like shown on the ZWO website.

 

Tried looking at the filter at different angles at different light source with complete confusion. Maybe they are really faulty. Tested all 3 filters on VEGA star and SII is great but Ha and OIII have a huge reflection issues.

 

OIII:

https://i.imgur.com/7FgHfyV.jpg

 

Ha:

https://i.imgur.com/QvwFbnl.jpg

 

SII:

https://i.imgur.com/13XZBCb.jpg

Where did you get these from? It sounds like you got the OLD Ha and OIII, but the new SII. You should be able to tell since the new filters should be coated to the edges. The SII should look very different than the Ha if this is the case and it looks like that is what you are saying. The new OIII will still have halos since it is basically the old filter with better edge coating the the new Ha is as good as the new SII.



#53 BoskoSLO

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 03:19 PM

Where did you get these from? It sounds like you got the OLD Ha and OIII, but the new SII. You should be able to tell since the new filters should be coated to the edges. The SII should look very different than the Ha if this is the case and it looks like that is what you are saying. The new OIII will still have halos since it is basically the old filter with better edge coating the the new Ha is as good as the new SII.

Ordered from teleskop service germany. regarding the coating. when I point the filter towards a light bulb I can see a thin bright ring at the edge of the filter indicating a light leakage then I made a paper ringthat I put on top of the filter edges but still there are reflections.

 

https://www.cloudyni...s/#entry7963691

 

Also I was wrong about the SII. It has reflection rings too but they are much fainter but still PIXINSIGHT can pick them up by doing the flatcontour script. Might as well return all filters at that point. Mine are not even remotely as good as in your review.



#54 cfosterstars

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 05:30 PM

Ordered from teleskop service germany. regarding the coating. when I point the filter towards a light bulb I can see a thin bright ring at the edge of the filter indicating a light leakage then I made a paper ringthat I put on top of the filter edges but still there are reflections.

 

https://www.cloudyni...s/#entry7963691

 

Also I was wrong about the SII. It has reflection rings too but they are much fainter but still PIXINSIGHT can pick them up by doing the flatcontour script. Might as well return all filters at that point. Mine are not even remotely as good as in your review.

Can you take some photographs of the filters? It sounds like you got a set of the GEN1 filters and not the new GEN2 filters.



#55 BoskoSLO

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Posted 22 September 2019 - 06:19 AM

Can you take some photographs of the filters? It sounds like you got a set of the GEN1 filters and not the new GEN2 filters.

https://i.imgur.com/sQgXsDD.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/rLTUzi7.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Wgarjbs.jpg

 

1 L

2 R

3 Ha

4 SII

5 OIII

 

camera side:

Ha

https://i.imgur.com/dSISQok.jpg

 

SII

https://i.imgur.com/MPoAhpj.jpg

 

OIII

https://i.imgur.com/yNgHLYX.jpg

 

I also did a flat test on SII and can confirm it has strong reflection rings so essentially all 3 filters are probably GEN1.

 

post edit: I tried 1 more thing and that's flipping the filter wheel and the reflections in the flats are gone. It seems like the "ledge" where the filters sit provide a direct blocking effect on the filter edges.

Now if there are no noticeable reflections in the flats can I be sure there won't be any in the stars? Well I need to test that at night pointing at a distant light source.


Edited by BoskoSLO, 22 September 2019 - 07:59 AM.


#56 cfosterstars

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Posted 22 September 2019 - 02:30 PM

https://i.imgur.com/sQgXsDD.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/rLTUzi7.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Wgarjbs.jpg

 

1 L

2 R

3 Ha

4 SII

5 OIII

 

camera side:

Ha

https://i.imgur.com/dSISQok.jpg

 

SII

https://i.imgur.com/MPoAhpj.jpg

 

OIII

https://i.imgur.com/yNgHLYX.jpg

 

I also did a flat test on SII and can confirm it has strong reflection rings so essentially all 3 filters are probably GEN1.

 

post edit: I tried 1 more thing and that's flipping the filter wheel and the reflections in the flats are gone. It seems like the "ledge" where the filters sit provide a direct blocking effect on the filter edges.

Now if there are no noticeable reflections in the flats can I be sure there won't be any in the stars? Well I need to test that at night pointing at a distant light source.

Yes those are GEN1. 



#57 Tom K

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Posted 22 September 2019 - 07:47 PM

If you like the image that is all that counts. If you are into this hobby for the sake of getting likes on astrobin or likes of you image in CN, then the halos may matter. But for me, I am into this hobby to get images that please me. Do I like to get 'likes" on CN or AB, yes I do, but that is not the reason I do this.

 

This is spot on - apparently a tendency toward the pedantic runs deep in AP circles....


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#58 BoskoSLO

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Posted 23 September 2019 - 01:36 AM

This is spot on - apparently a tendency toward the pedantic runs deep in AP circles....

Yeah I'm started to think about this as soon as I tried to process the data I've gathered with those filters (except Ha).

The results are stunningly beautiful:

 

https://i.imgur.com/zk9WdYg.jpg

 

So I just might hold on, on those filters for now. If I think about that. The issue is only going to be on the bright stars which there aren't that many around to image anyway.

If the filters capture what I want (the narrowband data) then why should I be worried? "pedantic" is like a natural thing that cast's a shadow on the hobby.


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#59 tsk1979

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Posted 02 May 2020 - 05:22 PM

Really informative thread. I guess its better to go with smaller 31mm filters if you are planning to image with a small sensor like QHY183. Would a larger 36mm filter give any advantage when used with a small sensor?

Secondly, does it make sense to mount the filter closer to the camera or closer to the eyepiece?



#60 OldManSky

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Posted 03 May 2020 - 09:27 AM

Really informative thread. I guess its better to go with smaller 31mm filters if you are planning to image with a small sensor like QHY183. Would a larger 36mm filter give any advantage when used with a small sensor?

Secondly, does it make sense to mount the filter closer to the camera or closer to the eyepiece?

The 1.25" mounted or 31mm unmounted filters are plenty big enough for the 183 sensor.  There's no benefit to using larger filters other than "future-proofing" your filter setup in case you get a larger sensor in the future.

You really want the filters to be as close to the imaging chip as possible.  The further away you put them, the more chance there is of vignetting.  And if you have a camera mounted...there shouldn't be an eyepiece to move closer to (unless you're doing eyepiece projection for planetary imaging)...



#61 maxmir

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Posted 12 May 2020 - 04:12 PM

Are the halos on the current ZWO LRGB filters ?

 

Max



#62 Jon2070

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Posted 25 May 2020 - 01:21 PM

Are the halos on the current ZWO LRGB filters ?

 

Max

I imaged The Horsehead Nebula a while ago and got severe halos around Alnitak on the G and B, slight halo on the L and no halo on the R. I managed to remove all in PixInsight, but it took some doing.



#63 cfosterstars

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 01:29 PM

I imaged The Horsehead Nebula a while ago and got severe halos around Alnitak on the G and B, slight halo on the L and no halo on the R. I managed to remove all in PixInsight, but it took some doing.

Just FYI. Even with the best Astrodon filters, Alnitak and sigma Orionis will still produced halos in G and B. 


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#64 sn2006gy

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 03:27 PM

Just FYI. Even with the best Astrodon filters, Alnitak and sigma Orionis will still produced halos in G and B. 

I saw earlier that you were testing Baader - do you have a link to that? BTW, Hello from another Austinite :) I live up north - would love to see what your set up one day when this virus stuff is history



#65 cfosterstars

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Posted 28 May 2020 - 03:56 PM

I saw earlier that you were testing Baader - do you have a link to that? BTW, Hello from another Austinite smile.gif I live up north - would love to see what your set up one day when this virus stuff is history

Once the world is back together, I would happy to have you over to see my rig. I just ordered a new camera:

 

ASI6200MM-PRO

Chroma 50mm LRGB, Ha, OIII, SII (3nm), 

Astronomiks 50mm IR 602, 742, and 807 filters for IR imaging

Optic HSFW - two 5 position 50mm interchangeable wheels

Optic Sagitta OAG with motor focus

 

This is for my SCT currently, but I got my wife to agree for me to save up for my ultimate rig - Planewave 17" CDK with an AP1600 mount.

 

I have tested out the Baaders and they are very similar to the Astronomiks in many ways. I have not done any sort of comparitive testing. I may do that once I get the Chroma filters. I will then have a full set from each vendor.


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#66 Sealyons

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Posted 09 June 2020 - 11:27 AM

I got my set of ZWO narrowband filters (1.25") in May of 2019.  Are they most likely GEN1 or GEN2?  I haven't used them yet but am hoping to use them soon.  I have the ZWO 1600mm Pro and an Altair 183M PRO TEC camera.  

 

On the ZWO website, they have a write-up for the new narrowband filters that shows how the new ones look compared with the GEN1.  Mine look like the GEN2.  They are showing a specific side of each that is supposed to be going towards the TELESCOPE or the CAMERA.  Do the filters have to be installed in the filter wheel just like they are showing?  For example, currently the purple side of the SII is facing the TELESCOPE not the CAMERA.  Seems weird because the filter instructions for the EFW8 didn't mention any directional orientation for the filters when installing.  I believe there was only 1 way to screw these in.  Appreciate any guidance.


Edited by Sealyons, 09 June 2020 - 11:55 AM.


#67 mstrieber

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Posted 18 November 2020 - 11:59 AM

Excellent review and discussion.  Thanks for posting this.  It was extremely helpful.



#68 sl-he

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Posted 21 November 2020 - 11:39 AM

I will then have a full set from each vendor.

Do you planned to comparison review with Chroma?



#69 cfosterstars

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Posted 23 November 2020 - 11:37 AM

Do you planned to comparison review with Chroma?

That is the plan at this point. I am just starting to install them and I have a lot of other things on the plate, but I will at some point.


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#70 sl-he

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Posted 24 November 2020 - 03:51 AM

That is the plan at this point. I am just starting to install them and I have a lot of other things on the plate, but I will at some point.

Ok, thank you )

#71 cfosterstars

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Posted 24 November 2020 - 09:43 AM

Ok, thank you )

One issue, I cant do a direct apples to apple comparision. My Chroma filters are 2" and are on my ASI6200MM-P camera and all my other filters are 36mm on ASI1600MM or ASI294MM-P cameras. So there will be some confounding issues associated with the comparisons.



#72 sl-he

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Posted 24 November 2020 - 12:38 PM

One issue, I cant do a direct apples to apple comparision. My Chroma filters are 2" and are on my ASI6200MM-P camera and all my other filters are 36mm on ASI1600MM or ASI294MM-P cameras. So there will be some confounding issues associated with the comparisons.

I'm more likely to be interested in the absence (or presence of glare) on the Chroma filters, I plan to buy the full LRGBHaOIIISII set, but so far I doubt whether to take Astrodon or Chroma. Yes, I will also take 2" cells.



#73 cfosterstars

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Posted 25 November 2020 - 09:57 AM

I'm more likely to be interested in the absence (or presence of glare) on the Chroma filters, I plan to buy the full LRGBHaOIIISII set, but so far I doubt whether to take Astrodon or Chroma. Yes, I will also take 2" cells.

I am installing my 50mm Chromas into the filter wheel tonight and will be doing my first testing. Astrodons are very good filters, but I just got some new 3nm bandwidith Ha, OIII and SII 36mm ADs and they have edge leakeage and reflections in my new QHY filter wheel. I used some ZWO filter masks to cover the edges and they work fine. I actually think that Astronomiks are the best filter for the money, but if you want the narrowest band pass, you have to go Astrodon or Chroma. However, I so far see only very subtle differences between 5nm and 3nm bandpass filters. Its all in what you are willing to spend and do you really value it. I think many filters will make nice images and I think that Astronomik and Baader are good compromises especally if you are going to 50mm filter. AD and Chroma are a big price premium but only you can make the value judgement for yourself. I personally am not a equipment snob, but I do have a very bad case of GAS - gear acquisition syndrome. :)


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#74 nfotis

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Posted 26 November 2020 - 06:11 PM

I am researching on the matter of NB filters, and I admit that I got enough of a headache already (thinking about a 294mm or 2600mm sensor at the moment).

If I understand correctly, the current SVBONY and ZWO NB filters are the budget version, the Baader the medium price and Astrodon/Chroma the high end/high price?

N.F.

#75 A. Viegas

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Posted 26 November 2020 - 11:01 PM

There are also Antlia filters which are also very good quality and they have narrow band pass too.  My O3 Antlia is 3.5nm band pass and there are no reflections with the 1600mm which I did used to get with my ZWO and Orion O3 filters.

 

Al




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