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My OSP 2018

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#1 hakann



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Posted 14 August 2018 - 02:21 AM

My OSP 2018 !


Writing a review on the plan back home…


Went from Stockholm/Sweden into Portland on Monday the 6’th at lunch.
As it is my third OSP I know what camping gear I need to get etc.
I fixed that and went up north some hour’s drive to Carl Zambuto to see my new 18” f/4 mirror in Quartz that was just fresh coated, plus a 4” diagonal also in Quartz.
The mirrors did look fantastic.
Next time I will see it will be in spring 2019 in Australia at SDM telescopes at first lights.
As Carl not use IF I saw some of his test that will match up to his ’criteras’ for a good mirror.
My plan was to has it tested at QED on surface smoothness and figure ( great to know in latest IF technology ) but I will not do that at least know.


I had 4 things to do at the OSP trip and first thing was visit CZ and next thing was to see the early first lights in Mel Bartels new fast real cool 25" I had following since some years, and No 3 was let Howard Banich test a Nikon EP for me, and last thing ( not the least ) was to has a great time and talk telescopes and observe !


I headed down for OSP southeast from Portland just outside Prineville.
Mr Hood is stunning wievs as the nature along the road.
I did arrive on Wednesday at afternoon and Dan from SITEC invited me on a really nice steak and a cold IPA.
In his mobile home I meet Howard, so it was a nice OSP fire up.
My plan for Howard was to test the Nikon HW 17/14 mm EP ( vs how it effected coma less a coma corrector on a f/4 and his way look at it vs colour etc )


Weather the first days was really warm ( even at night ) so we had around 110 one afternoon and my guess it was mid 80’s at night.
Bad thing was the smoke from California that did strike us hard, but it was told be cooler/clearer at the weekend.
But even so the sky was working ok ( or decent ) at zenith the first nights.

I brought my Zeiss 2060 bino and got a pin for make the level 0 observing list ( I shore did see all objects but not M44 in Cancer ;-)
For me it was a nice pin ( well deserved ) as I has only around 3-4 years in astronomy - but has been worked hard in both observing & tech !
I started from absolute zero December 2014.


It was great see objects in Sagittarius again that is not possible from mid Sweden.
Bad thing first nights they was in the smudge.
But it was many objects that was great for observe.

First night I had the opportunity to be in Dan’s 28” low rider scope for several hours.
Dan has recently installed a new azimuth drive ( direct drive ) and gee, that scope went like in butter to object and stand still in the EP !
I had great memories from that scope at 2015 where I first saw M27/M57, Andromeda etc and could change EP that fitted objects.
I really like to thank Dan for great hospitality.

I saw that 28” scope at internet and wow that was a brutal as coming in from almost zero in hobby and use that thing 2015.


-We went over many eye candy objects night one.


Day after Mel arrived so I could see the f/2.62 scope live !

The ’walkabout’ is always nice.
I was there in collimation and he showed me how to do that less a tublug.
It shore look odd as stubby as it is ;-)


At dark Mel showed me Saturnus at 91X but I let him do what he feel to do first and thought to get back later on.


I saw a very nice 22” scope whit a Kennedy f/3.3 that had SITECH on and the owner Steve was friendly to let me use the scope.
He had Ethos 21 in it and I took it to objects I l knew, so I swinged the scope ( very funny & nice ) and also used the E13 EP.
I let Steve continue on the advanced observing list in his scope but his buddy Dave had also a 22 incher.

I went over to Chris as I meet him earlier that day, as he had a Zambuto 20” at f/4.
( Chris has a big project ongoing whit a 36 incher ! )
We went into several objects and to Blue Snowball and saw some nice structure.
Contrast was nice.
Chris was waited for his 'midnight hot-dog' so I went to Steve again.

I wanted to compare the Blue Snowball in a 22”.
But where was it ;-)
At Chris we used the SITEC system, and Steve had the system to, but was like me a fan of star hopping, but I had to give up after around 40 minutes..

Then I went over to Mel, but had gone to bed just before I arriwed.
I was in Dan’s scope for another hour as a group of funny students that had dual stars on their school program and Francisco was a funny guy to observe whit.


Next night I went to Steve and his 22” again and now I found the planetary ( I was almost there night before .. but was just little to low )
We jacked it up to 1200X just for fun and it’s great that SITEC holds it steady even at that magX.


-What now striked me was so few cooled down their mirrors even if it was huge temperature drops.
Maybe it not change as much as I thought ( in reality vs math )
Stars was great in the scops I used.


I went over to Howards and he told me he really did like the EP.
He tested it from what we discussed.

Now it was time to visit Mel and he was real pleased whit his new scope.
Howard came over so as Chuck & Julie ( great people to know and observe whit )
We went over M13 where Mel located a ’flux’ on the right side.
I saw it but in my case it could been a star glow.
Funny to see the size of M13 vs a FoV 1.1 in a 25 incher ( E21 vs 91X )
Chris came into party and said - this is not M13.. and Mel laughed and I knew he did like that one ;-)
Mel took us to Veil, Double Cluster, Andromeda, Pelican, North America.
Nice to move the scope sideways as Mel did a neat solution for the Dobson hole.
But scope might need to be little softer to move ( for my taste anyhow ) but after all, it was first light.
And as Chuck said ; nice stars and I saw no coma, no ’spikes’ as Mel has the paracorr and mount well into the primary light path.
I guess we all thought this is a nice scope and feet on ground is newer a bad thing.
A nice deal vs storage is Mel turn it like a big suitcase and carry it into the car ;-)
I hope see the scope in higher power later on, but I knew Mel builed it for max FoV/pupil ( 6.8 mm )
It’s very bright at 91X, so Mel might found some new nice fluxes. ( allot of light gets in there plus that pupil size )
Personally I like a tighter pupil observing, so I might be a ’jet-black’ background user.


After that I went to Steve again for found the ’Taffy galaxies' in Pegasus. ( hard one’s for a rooky....and Jimi Lowey showed me them last year at Steens mountain before the eclipse.


The last night it had been a way clearer that day and it was way cooler at night.
We saw the mountains for the first time that week !
I had SQM-21.75 and did the last objects on the bino list and went up to Rob and his son Quinn in their very nice string scops Rob builded ( love the family project operation program they is doing - hat off )

The late hours I spended whit Chuck & Julie.
I really like Chuck’s 25” whit a Kennedy f/4, and I had used this scope last year ( it is very smooth to move )
We was at Veil and I admire allot of details in M33 and Chuck took us to Crescent and the Cat Eye nebula, and it was stunning.
Then finally the Ring.


I had one more scope to visit and that was Chris 40”, but time was flying.

It was about to close down as it was over 3 PM but Howard had also Crescent in his 28 whit my Nikon EP.
If time, I would not leaved the scope..


It was also a nice lecture from LIGO on Saturday that filled the tent and it brought up many questions !


So that was my OSP 2018 and I like to thank ALL nice people I meet and let me used their equipment ( old and new friends )


I will has my new 18” scope for observing in Australia in spring next year … and if possible I might ship it to OSP 2019.
That shore would be fun.


I would really like to cheer this great SP for more Swedes or Nordic armature astronomers to go to OSP.


-Finally,, I has been little sceptical about faster mirrors vs contrast/tolerances that is sold on the market, but Steve’s 22 incher was shore great and almost feet on ground.

Edited by hakann, 14 August 2018 - 04:34 PM.


#2 Mel Bartels

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Posted 14 August 2018 - 11:37 AM

I discovered why the movements of my 25 inch f2.6 became so stiff...




After thorough cleaning, the scope is back to moving buttery smooth. My apologies to all who used the scope and found it rather stiff as I did too...


After the first rugged star party I always disassemble the telescope to look for maintenance tasks like tightening bolts that tend to come lose. I actually found a Teflon pad that had a tiny piece of rock embedded in it - ugh.


For the M13 view, I made a sketch




Showing the Integrated Flux Nebula that I had discovered several years ago. The cool thing is that with the 1.1 degree field of view, we could position M13 et al in order to see the far side of the IFN arc. There are more IFN near M13 that I've noted in my wider field - smaller aperture scopes.


I kept the scope at lowest power maximum field because I wanted to spend all my time viewing the 'bold and bright' objects all over again from a new perspective


Come back again and we'll do high power *if you must* <smile>


Mel Bartels

Edited by Mel Bartels, 14 August 2018 - 12:19 PM.


#3 Alex McConahay

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Posted 14 August 2018 - 02:21 PM

Good report, Hank.....


You have come a long way since we first went over to Ron's house so you could see how a dob works. Has it only been four years?


And Mel, that is quite a sketch!!!! I wish I had your talent.




#4 Starman1


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Posted 14 August 2018 - 03:38 PM

This image shows a long curved line of stars in the same place Mel drew a curved nebula.

I suspect this was a large batch of unresolved stars.


And this is a pretty deep image.


#5 hakann



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Posted 14 August 2018 - 03:53 PM


Good to hear from you.

It was Februari 15 at Ron's, and we was at one of my very first targets, M42.

It blowed sock's out of me even if we was in LA area.

We was at OSP 2015.


Sight in the EP of this object Mel drawed was pretty amazing.

It will shore comes more images !


#6 Mel Bartels

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Posted 14 August 2018 - 04:39 PM

Don, I drew the stars that you mention - there's no way that such a broad arc that we see is unresolved stars.


I took the image you mention and stretched out the levels. you can see the IFN barely as a glow from the lower left across the bottom that then curves upward, matching the sketch I made with my 13". 




Here, I searched around and found a better image of M13 that matches the visual at




For more on my IFN sketching, see here...


https://www.bbastrod...els Ghosts.html




#7 Starman1


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Posted 14 August 2018 - 06:09 PM

I see.

I wonder if a NVD enthusiast can also see it.


#8 hakann



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Posted 15 August 2018 - 03:01 PM

I need to update on Chris 20" telescope whit a Quartz Zambuto mirror, as it was a f/4.5, not a f/4 as I did write.

Just to be correct.

Carl Zambuto did like I had a chance use that telescope.

Contrast in one of his f/4.5 must be hard to beat.


Sky now at the first days at OSP was not the best seeing, and I'm aware of that.


#9 earlyriser


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Posted 04 September 2019 - 07:43 AM



Can you provide some details on your solution to Dobson's Hole? I've seen a mount that had two altitude bearings at 90 degrees to each other once, but I've been unable to find a link showing that solution. Is your solution something similar to that?




<edited to add>


Found it:


https://www.bbastrod... Telescope.html

Edited by earlyriser, 04 September 2019 - 08:29 AM.


#10 Starman1


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Posted 04 September 2019 - 01:28 PM

If you can easily turn the scope in azimuth, using whatever technique works (I can do it with hand pressure on the top ring),

then "Dobson's hole" is just not an issue.

I observe objects all the time in the 80-90° altitude range and have never experienced a problem.

It's really very simple: if the scope doesn't track smoothly enough to make that altitude usable, then work on the bearings until it does.

I've seen some expensive scopes that moved in jerks and required muscles to move them, and I've seen some inexpensive

scopes that moved easily enough that those altitudes were easily used.  It's all about the bearings.


#11 earlyriser


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Posted 04 September 2019 - 02:45 PM

Tracking isn't what bothers me, it's the rotation of the tube forcing me to keep moving around the telescope when star hopping near the zenith. I think having a third altitude axis would greatly reduce that.


#12 alphatripleplus


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Posted 05 September 2019 - 04:14 PM

This thread has moved well off topic and has run its course. If anyone wishes to continue an ATM discussion, please start a thread in that Forum.


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