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Are these Solar Flares?

astrophotography imaging/sketching contest
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#1 Akshat Soni

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Posted 04 October 2018 - 11:35 AM

So I took this picture several months ago through my camera directly and tried to adjust the contrast and stuff. So is that a solar flare in the bottom-left?

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#2 BrooksObs

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Posted 04 October 2018 - 12:20 PM

No. It is not possible to image a solar flare, or prominence, in white (unfiltered) light off the solar disk except in the very rare case of when an intense white-light solar flare, appearing as an irregular-shaped but distinct brighter patch, becomes briefly visible on the bright surface of the Sun itself.

 

BrooksObs


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#3 Akshat Soni

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Posted 05 October 2018 - 06:01 AM

So Do you think its a solar flare ?



#4 smithrrlyr

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Posted 05 October 2018 - 08:50 AM

So Do you think its a solar flare ?

I would agree with BrooksObs that it is not a solar flare, for the reasons he gave.  Solar prominences, as opposed to the shorter duration flares, can be visible off the limb of the sun, but to see them one has to use an H-alpha filter or similar aid unless there is an eclipse.  Incidentally, the sun is now in a low activity part of its cycle, so both flares and prominences occur less frequently than a few years ago.  Following solar activity can be fun, but proper filters or safe projection techniques are essential.  There are amateur astronomers even today who still play an important role in tracking solar activity.


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#5 Akshat Soni

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Posted 05 October 2018 - 10:32 AM

I got so happy when I though it's a solar flare but it's not actually a solar flare XD

 

But it looks like solar flare :-/



#6 Dave Mitsky

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Posted 05 October 2018 - 01:17 PM

Here's an afocal image of a strong solar flare (the white area) that I captured through an H-alpha telescope, a Cornado PST, on October 25, 2014.  A few solar prominences around the Sun's limb are also visible.

http://spaceweather....th=10&year=2014

 

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#7 Dave Mitsky

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Posted 05 October 2018 - 01:24 PM

This solar flare occurred on November 7, 2014.

 

http://spaceweather....th=10&year=2014

 

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#8 Stardust Dave

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Posted 11 October 2018 - 03:52 AM

No. It is not possible to image a solar flare, or prominence, in white (unfiltered) light off the solar disk except in the very rare case of when an intense white-light solar flare, appearing as an irregular-shaped but distinct brighter patch, becomes briefly visible on the bright surface of the Sun itself.

 

BrooksObs

Like the carrington event ,



#9 BrooksObs

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Posted 11 October 2018 - 05:20 AM

Brother Dave, there have been a number of solar flares detected by observers in white light, but always seen in projection against the solar surface, never reported off the solar limb.

 

As to the so-called Carrington Event, that is something in my opinion that has been vastly overrated in today's literature as a result of totally different methodologies in measuring the magnitude of such events in the past and today being employed.

 

BrooksObs



#10 Stardust Dave

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Posted 11 October 2018 - 05:50 AM

Hi BrooksObs , thanks for your input - always welcome.

 

Id not expected the flares to be reported off the limb.

The carrinton event , at least the internet accounts seemed to be a real big deal.

 

"Ice core samples have determined that the Carrington Event was twice as big as any other solar storm in the last 500 years"

 The references read "The solar storm of 1859 (also known as the Carrington Event)[1] was a powerful geomagnetic solar storm during solar cycle 10 (1855–1867). A solar coronal mass ejection (CME) hit Earth's magnetosphere and induced one of the largest geomagnetic storms on record, September 1–2, 1859."

 

"A solar storm of this magnitude occurring today would cause widespread electrical disruptions, blackouts and damage due to extended outages of the electrical grid.[2][3] The solar storm of 2012 was of similar magnitude, but it passed Earth's orbit without striking the planet, missing by 9 days.[4]"

 

" Many telegraph lines across North America were rendered inoperable on the night of August 28 as the first of two successive solar storms struck. E.W. Culgan, a telegraph manager in Pittsburgh, reported that the resulting currents flowing through the wires were so powerful that platinum contacts were in danger of melting and “streams of fire” were pouring forth from the circuits. In Washington, D.C., telegraph operator Frederick W. Royce was severely shocked as his forehead grazed a ground wire. According to a witness, an arc of fire jumped from Royce’s head to the telegraphic equipment. Some telegraph stations that used chemicals to mark sheets reported that powerful surges caused telegraph paper to combust.

On the morning of September 2, the magnetic mayhem resulting from the second storm created even more chaos for telegraph operators. When American Telegraph Company employees arrived at their Boston office at 8 a.m., they discovered it was impossible to transmit or receive dispatches. The atmosphere was so charged, however, that operators made an incredible discovery: They could unplug their batteries and still transmit messages to Portland, Maine, at 30- to 90-second intervals using only the auroral current. Messages still couldn’t be sent as seamlessly as under normal conditions, but it was a useful workaround. By 10 a.m. the magnetic disturbance abated enough that stations reconnected their batteries, but transmissions were still affected for the rest of the morning.

Sky on Fire
When telegraphs did come back on line, many were filled with vivid accounts of the celestial light show that had been witnessed the night before. Newspapers from France to Australia featured glowing descriptions of brilliant auroras that had turned night into day. One eyewitness account from a woman on Sullivan’s Island in South Carolina ran in the Charleston Mercury: “The eastern sky appeared of a blood red color. It seemed brightest exactly in the east, as though the full moon, or rather the sun, were about to rise. It extended almost to the zenith. The whole island was illuminated. The sea reflected the phenomenon, and no one could look at it without thinking of the passage in the Bible which says, ‘the sea was turned to blood.’ The shells on the beach, reflecting light, resembled coals of fire.”

"The sky was so crimson that many who saw it believed that neighboring locales were on fire. Americans in the South were particularly startled by the northern lights, which migrated so close to the equator that they were seen in Cuba and Jamaica. Elsewhere, however, there appeared to be genuine confusion. In Abbeville, South Carolina, masons awoke and began to lay bricks at their job site until they realized the hour and returned to bed. In Bealeton, Virginia, larks were stirred from their sleep at 1 a.m. and began to warble. (Unfortunately for them, a conductor on the Orange & Alexandria Railroad was also awake and shot three of them dead.) In cities across America, people stood in the streets and gazed up at the heavenly pyrotechnics. In Boston, some even caught up on their reading, taking advantage of the celestial fire to peruse the local newspapers."

"Ice core samples have determined that the Carrington Event was twice as big as any other solar storm in the last 500 years.What would be the impact of a similar storm today? According to a 2008 report from the National Academy of Sciences, it could cause “extensive social and economic disruptions” due to its impact on power grids, satellite communication and GPS systems"

I would feel very lucky to see something like that , in WL of all wavelengths.

 

Might be all oversold stories but I was impressed.  I may learn a little more to be 21st century in my understanding of what occurred.  Wish Id seen the eventsmile.gif    It sounded amazing.


Edited by Stardust Dave, 11 October 2018 - 05:54 AM.


#11 BrooksObs

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Posted 11 October 2018 - 04:17 PM

Yes, brother Dave, I'm well familiar with the OVERLY HYPED accounts of the 1859 event. Many of these arose in the past decade when some predicted we were about to have an incredible solar maximum with disastrous  results (what transpired was one of the lowest activity cycles ever recorded! lol.gif ).  Nevertheless, I also was a personal witness a huge geomagnetic storm, the most incredible I ever saw, or read about, that occurred around 1990 which duplicated most of the reported phenomena ascribed to the Carrington Event, but largely without the anticipated horrendous damage to the electrical grid, nor satellites, that has come to be taken for supposed granted as the result were a Carrington-scale Event to occur today.

 

During the circa 1990 event the northern auroral loop ended up overhead at least as far south as Florida, maybe the Caribbean, IIRC and strong aurora were seen in Cuba and a few of the northernmost South American countries. At my home in NY, at the maximum of the aurora display, I witnessed the entire grand display progress southward and drop entirely below my southern horizon, only to rise up again after an hour, or so. While at its peak overhead here I estimated the level of ground illumination from the brilliant aurora as likely 10 times that of the full moon! The geomagnetic storm and sky-filling auroral display ran continuously at full blast for at least 36 hours and could be note less than an hour after sunset the 2nd evening. Traffic jams occurred on major highways in my area as drivers stopped and got out of their cars to gawk at what was going on the sky above them.

 

Read enough modern interpretations of past astronomical events, especially when written by largely inexperienced or non-observer types, and the hype factor really takes over to embellish the story in every way possible so as to impress the reader. Care must be exerted even in reading original texts, since the observer's of yore themselves quite often misinterpret what the saw based on the prevailing knowledge in the field at the time. Playing detective in reading through18th and 19th century volumes can be great fun, if you already have a good solid background as an observer. smirk.gif

 

BrooksObs 


Edited by BrooksObs, 11 October 2018 - 04:30 PM.


#12 smithrrlyr

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Posted 12 October 2018 - 12:31 AM

  Nevertheless, I also was a personal witness a huge geomagnetic storm, the most incredible I ever saw, or read about, that occurred around 1990 which duplicated most of the reported phenomena ascribed to the Carrington Event, but largely without the anticipated horrendous damage to the electrical grid, nor satellites, that has come to be taken for supposed granted as the result were a Carrington-scale Event to occur today.

 

 

The event BrooksObs recalls may be the very strong geomagnetic storm of March, 1989.  That storm did knock out electrical power in Quebec and disrupted some communications, but for many it just provided spectacular northern lights.  Various researchers have attempted to compare the 1859 Carrington event to that of 1989 and other very strong geomagnetic storms in the historical record.  My recollection is that, while the Carrington event stands out, it is not head and shoulders above a number of other very strong geomagnetic storms in the historical literature.  Of course, in 1859 many of the measurements we have available for more recent geomagnetic storms were not yet developed, complicating direct comparisons.  The threat of events like the 1859 one to electricity distribution of course also depends on the general robustness of the electrical grid system.  Much could certainly be done to improve the resilience of the present grid to make it more resistant to damage from geomagnetic activity.



#13 Stardust Dave

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Posted 12 October 2018 - 03:14 PM

BrooksObs   can you re-word this?smile.gif

"Care must be exerted even in reading original texts, since the observer's of yore themselves quite often misinterpret what the saw based on the prevailing knowledge in the field at the time. Playing detective in reading through18th and 19th century volumes can be great fun, if you already have a good solid background as an observer". smirk.gif




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