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Chances for a good C11: 50-50, 60-40, 80-20?

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#51 Axunator

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Posted 02 November 2018 - 09:17 AM

Having worked for years in a fairly thermodynamic place (nuclear power plant) I'm not going to go down the Reflectix pathway just yet. I'll keep reading. smile.gif

Well, experimenting with Reflectix is quite a bit safer and cheaper than experimenting with nuclear reactors, so just give it a try grin.gif


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#52 NMBob

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Posted 02 November 2018 - 09:42 AM

Well, experimenting with Reflectix is quite a bit safer and cheaper than experimenting with nuclear reactors, so just give it a try grin.gif

Oh, but it's WAY more exciting! :) I'll think about it. This will be a good chance since I can start from just vents and go from there. Too bad it's getting to be winter. I'll have to put the scope in the oven for a bit before going out.



#53 NMBob

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Posted 02 November 2018 - 02:25 PM

The size of things to come. Gulp. smile.gif C11 case vs C8. There is a tiny bit of extra room in the C8 case, but not that much. One thing I don't like is the strap with the buckle that is under the C8 is not long enough in this C11 case to pull up and lay over the edge of the case while you put the scope in. That will be a little inconvenient. I'll try sticking a tiny bit of velcro on the back of the buckle to keep it stuck to the inside wall for those few seconds. This was one of those Amazon Warehouse deals cases. It's in perfect condition and was about $50-125 off depending on where you look.

 

Bob

 

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#54 NMBob

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Posted 02 November 2018 - 09:48 PM

The camera adapter looks like the exhaust pipe on a big Dodge truck. That's the camera adapter from my Edge 8 inside (with a Canon T-ring on the other end).

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#55 chuckscap

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Posted 03 November 2018 - 09:11 PM

I had a very good C11.   I have a fellow club member with an AP 180 mm refractor and he thought it was very good.  Of course it didn't compare to his AP refractor.   I measure my SCTs and I've had four, by the Mewlon 250 CR I had and the TEC 7 Mak I  still have.    None of my Celestron SCTs were nearly as good for it's aperture as the Mewlon 250 or TEC but some were very good scopes.   For the price of a C11 Edge, since you have such a beautiful mount, I'd look for a mint used Mewlon 250 CR (in baffle corrector/ reducer)    I had one and it is an absolutely magical scope.   You can probably find one for about $1000 more than a new C11 Edge, and it's a scope worthy of your mount.


Edited by chuckscap, 03 November 2018 - 09:12 PM.


#56 NMBob

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Posted 04 November 2018 - 09:33 AM

I thought about a Mewlon. The only thing that bothers me about Takahashi is how proprietary they *seem* to be. I don't know if they really are or not. It just seems like it. All of the mounting stuff -- right down to the finders -- seems to be different/special/specific to them. Hole spacings. All of that kind of stuff. Maybe I've just been brain washed by Main Stream Astronomy Media. :) I suppose once you get all of the adapters you need those "problems" go away. I think I've only ever seen one Tak in person. Never have looked through one. Did I mention I live in a cave?

 

I was also seduced by Planet HyperStar for the C11...which is not currently available. The site says, "This HyperStar is currently adapting." HyperStar 4? They do currently only support APS sensors. Maybe they are going for full frame coverage. OH! None of the lenses can be purchased from Starizona. I thought it was just the C11 ones.

 

The scope is at FedEx in Albuturkey. It's supposed to be mostly clear to clear this week. That can't be right. Oh no! It must be a lemon!! :)



#57 NMBob

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Posted 05 November 2018 - 02:24 PM

Well, it's bigger. Comes with a hand grenade AND cancer causing packing. This IS the whole package! smile.gif Box didn't have any holes in it and no loose parts. Neither of the mirror locks were on, though. The "quality assurance" tape on both boxes had been cut and taped over once. I'm assuming they check things out in California when they get off the boat?

 

If someone would give me enough money to live off the interest I wouldn't have to wait until after work to play with this thing, but alas... It may actually be clear tonight. Eyepieces crossed!

 

Bob

 

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#58 Axunator

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Posted 05 November 2018 - 02:31 PM

Enjoy your new scope waytogo.gif And let us know how it performs.

 

P.S. Gotta love that warning sticker... ohmy.gif



#59 NMBob

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Posted 05 November 2018 - 02:37 PM

Enjoy your new scope waytogo.gif And let us know how it performs.

 

P.S. Gotta love that warning sticker... ohmy.gif

Thanks! Those Californian's are always entertaining. There's another one that says it is designed and intended for those 13 years of age and older. Checked my driver's license. I'm good to go.

 

Bob


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#60 NMBob

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Posted 06 November 2018 - 04:00 PM

Well...the jury brain cells are still out deliberating.

 

Broke the three-arm plastic cover over the collimation screws. It...would...not...budge...unitl it twisted off. I think the central screw that it is supposed to spin on was either too tight, or some of the thread glue on the screw got loose and made it stick. It didn't take a lot for it to break, but I did take the secondary out while trying to get it to move so I wouldn't spin the holder in the corrector plate or the plate itself. It was that stuck. Yes, I was turning it the right direction. smile.gif The plastic may have been crushed by the screw being over-tightened. It mostly just makes the secondary mirror difficult to remove. It was the handle.

 

The secondary mirror is hard to remove/install. It's a way tighter fit than my Edge 8 secondary and now has no handle. smile.gif

 

The little set/grub screw that indexes the secondary cell in the holder is crazy short and was loose and was barely sticking out into the slot in the holder. You could almost put the secondary in rotated the wrong way. I'll try and get a longer one. The threaded hole is quite deep.

 

It needed to be collimated. Not surprising, except I don't know how the collimation screws ever jiggled loose from their factory setting. They are very difficult to turn and I was close to wiping out the Phillips slots on one of them. No, I wasn't trying to tighten them past all of the way tight. smile.gif I'll replace them with hex head screws. Bob's Knobs won't do much good since I can't adjust and look through this scope at the same time.

 

The collimation doughnut initially had a spike in it, but that went away after fiddling a bit, or with time. I don't know which (I was a bit miffed at the non-spinning cover breaking off) but one out of focus direction there were rings, but the other way was just a quivering blob. Could have been just temperature, but the scope spent all afternoon in my office at 70F, set up at about 68F, and then was taken down a couple hours later at 64F, so not a lot of delta T there. The seeing wasn't great, but not real bad. Maybe it just has to be a lot better.

 

All of the screws on the thing are very tight/glued in place. That made putting a Vixen bar on the top and installing a finder bracket a small adventure.

 

M31 looked quite a bit "larger" than I'm used to, but nothing else was really too impressive. Mars. Saturn. Other random things. Didn't get to try the Luminos 23mm eyepiece. There's a little bit of focuser mirror shift. You'd think after 40 years...

 

I'll be able to get out again this evening, or maybe I'll just work over the secondary cell and replace the screws to get it more easily adjustable. Wouldn't want the screw driver to slip off of one of the Phillips screws and poke a hole in the corrector!bigshock.gif I may be able to figure out how to repair that plastic bit somehow. It's not a normal repair part. I'm waiting to hear from Celestron. They better not make me buy a 3D printer! smile.gif

 

It's always something. smile.gif

 

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#61 NMBob

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 01:42 AM

For 3500 bucks, and it being in the optical train, I expected better.

 

http://www.greschke....e/20181106.html

 


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#62 Procyon

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 08:21 AM

Crazy. I got my scope (CPC 1100) delivered from California, been to dark sites, etc, etc, now about 2 years later I'm thinking of collimating, it hasn't needed all this time. Where'd you order it from?

#63 NMBob

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 09:11 AM

Crazy. I got my scope (CPC 1100) delivered from California, been to dark sites, etc, etc, now about 2 years later I'm thinking of collimating, it hasn't needed all this time. Where'd you order it from?

Astronomics, but it ships straight from Celestron, so they never get to see it. As long as the glass is good I guess it'll all work out. We shall see.



#64 Peter Besenbruch

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 10:29 PM

Astronomics, but it ships straight from Celestron, so they never get to see it. As long as the glass is good I guess it'll all work out. We shall see.

You might want to let Astronomics know that there are some initial issues. That's disappointing.



#65 NMBob

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 12:18 AM

I told them that the plastic bit on the front broke. They told me to call Celestron. :)

 

Tested the rebuilt secondary assembly. It couldn't have worked better. I'll try to get out some more this weekend if the weather behaves, but it was looking way better than the other night until the clouds moved in.



#66 CHASLX200

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 06:13 AM

For 3500 bucks, and it being in the optical train, I expected better.

 

http://www.greschke....e/20181106.html

Don't shock me at all.


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#67 aa6ww

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Posted 09 November 2018 - 03:14 AM

Why are you disassembling your brand new scope? 

 

...Ralph

 

 

Well...the jury brain cells are still out deliberating.

 

Broke the three-arm plastic cover over the collimation screws. It...would...not...budge...unitl it twisted off. I think the central screw that it is supposed to spin on was either too tight, or some of the thread glue on the screw got loose and made it stick. It didn't take a lot for it to break, but I did take the secondary out while trying to get it to move so I wouldn't spin the holder in the corrector plate or the plate itself. It was that stuck. Yes, I was turning it the right direction. smile.gif The plastic may have been crushed by the screw being over-tightened. It mostly just makes the secondary mirror difficult to remove. It was the handle.

 

The secondary mirror is hard to remove/install. It's a way tighter fit than my Edge 8 secondary and now has no handle. smile.gif

 

The little set/grub screw that indexes the secondary cell in the holder is crazy short and was loose and was barely sticking out into the slot in the holder. You could almost put the secondary in rotated the wrong way. I'll try and get a longer one. The threaded hole is quite deep.

 

It needed to be collimated. Not surprising, except I don't know how the collimation screws ever jiggled loose from their factory setting. They are very difficult to turn and I was close to wiping out the Phillips slots on one of them. No, I wasn't trying to tighten them past all of the way tight. smile.gif I'll replace them with hex head screws. Bob's Knobs won't do much good since I can't adjust and look through this scope at the same time.

 

The collimation doughnut initially had a spike in it, but that went away after fiddling a bit, or with time. I don't know which (I was a bit miffed at the non-spinning cover breaking off) but one out of focus direction there were rings, but the other way was just a quivering blob. Could have been just temperature, but the scope spent all afternoon in my office at 70F, set up at about 68F, and then was taken down a couple hours later at 64F, so not a lot of delta T there. The seeing wasn't great, but not real bad. Maybe it just has to be a lot better.

 

All of the screws on the thing are very tight/glued in place. That made putting a Vixen bar on the top and installing a finder bracket a small adventure.

 

M31 looked quite a bit "larger" than I'm used to, but nothing else was really too impressive. Mars. Saturn. Other random things. Didn't get to try the Luminos 23mm eyepiece. There's a little bit of focuser mirror shift. You'd think after 40 years...

 

I'll be able to get out again this evening, or maybe I'll just work over the secondary cell and replace the screws to get it more easily adjustable. Wouldn't want the screw driver to slip off of one of the Phillips screws and poke a hole in the corrector!bigshock.gif I may be able to figure out how to repair that plastic bit somehow. It's not a normal repair part. I'm waiting to hear from Celestron. They better not make me buy a 3D printer! smile.gif

 

It's always something. smile.gif



#68 BillP

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Posted 09 November 2018 - 10:14 AM

I heard that Company Seven tests all their celestrons before they ship them to customers. If I was buy new I would give them a call first.

 

Company Seven is a resource for the international amateur and professional astronomy community, and a registered U.S. Department of Defense contractor.

 

http://www.company7.com/

 

When I sold my astro-physics F9 180 EDT they acted as the intermediary.

 

Very true.  I buy from them.  And they do not update their website much...just the way they are.  For a very small fee they guarantee the sample you get will be within spec both optically and mechanically and test in house with their interferometer.  Well worth it because you would gasp if you saw how many of the SCTs are out of spec optically!


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#69 NMBob

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Posted 09 November 2018 - 10:16 AM

Why are you disassembling your brand new scope? 

 

...Ralph

Because it was built badly, in my opinion, and there's no other recourse. They aren't going to start building them better just because I don't like it, there's no "upgrade" option for a better secondary, and there's nothing else I want to buy. I started out just wanting to adjust the collimation, because it was way off, and it escalated from there. :) The fix works 100% better. I think the optics are pretty good, but I haven't had the weather to test some more. I just got Round 1 of collimating done and the clouds moved in.

 

Bob



#70 CHASLX200

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Posted 09 November 2018 - 10:22 AM

Very true.  I buy from them.  And they do not update their website much...just the way they are.  For a very small fee they guarantee the sample you get will be within spec both optically and mechanically and test in house with their interferometer.  Well worth it because you would gasp if you saw how many of the SCTs are out of spec optically!

I would say 80% are.  The last two C6's i had could not be used they were so bad.



#71 WadeH237

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Posted 09 November 2018 - 03:59 PM

Because it was built badly, in my opinion, and there's no other recourse. They aren't going to start building them better just because I don't like it, there's no "upgrade" option for a better secondary, and there's nothing else I want to buy. I started out just wanting to adjust the collimation, because it was way off, and it escalated from there. smile.gif The fix works 100% better. I think the optics are pretty good, but I haven't had the weather to test some more. I just got Round 1 of collimating done and the clouds moved in.

 

Bob

For what it's worth, the spring loaded screws seem like a definite improvement over stock.

 

I had a Meade OTA with spring loaded collimation screws and it was easier to work with than the Celestron arrangement.  Since I have the collimation screws pretty tight right now, and keep them that way, any change to the collimation pretty much involves 3 screws:  loosen the opposite screws a bit before tightening the one I'm interested in.  With spring loaded screws, you can keep them from getting fully tight, and adjusting a single screw works great.

 

That's a mod that I might consider for my Celestron SCTs the next time that I have the secondary mirrors out.



#72 NMBob

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Posted 09 November 2018 - 05:00 PM

For what it's worth, the spring loaded screws seem like a definite improvement over stock.

 

I had a Meade OTA with spring loaded collimation screws and it was easier to work with than the Celestron arrangement.  Since I have the collimation screws pretty tight right now, and keep them that way, any change to the collimation pretty much involves 3 screws:  loosen the opposite screws a bit before tightening the one I'm interested in.  With spring loaded screws, you can keep them from getting fully tight, and adjusting a single screw works great.

 

That's a mod that I might consider for my Celestron SCTs the next time that I have the secondary mirrors out.

Yeah, I'm going to start looking at my other C's. I don't think I've ever had to take them all apart, but now that I know what's in there I ain't scared anymore.

 

Once I got the mirror set where I wanted it I tightened each screw and brought the mirror back "up"all of the way until they were all tight, so, like you, they shouldn't move. With springs is normal for reflector telescope mirrors, isn't it? I still have to keep going to higher power eyepieces, but Saturn at about 6deg elevation and sandwiched between two clouds looked almost as good as my C8 on a good night. Kinda sorta mostly. :) It looked like a comet when I started.



#73 Procyon

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Posted 10 November 2018 - 01:44 PM

Once you get it sorted out, have you tried Celestron btw? Maybe they can send you a brand new one with 90%+ strehl ratio. :)

Probably will ask you to pay for shipping, may be worth it, best to bite half a bullet, get it settled quickly than forget about the incident and enjoy. I'm surprised also why Celestron would not check collimation before sending it out, unless it happened during shipping.

You will see a big difference on planets vs the 8", that was the first thing I noticed when I viewed through mine. A darker and better field overall as well and see Galaxies, PNe's, Clusters and others better even from a Bortle 8 zone, although a lot of my city skylight is kind of hidden.

Edited by Procyon, 10 November 2018 - 01:52 PM.


#74 NMBob

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Posted 11 November 2018 - 01:02 AM

Can you ask them for a specific Strehl scope?? I missed that option. smile.gif They should do that.

 

It's a little strange. The screws were pretty glued in place, but the collimation was way off. I don't know what happened. I may get one of the Hotech collimation systems for it, since I may have it for a while.

 

If things don't look good through the scope I'll be making calls to Celestron. I think it might snow tomorrow. That doesn't count. smile.gif

 

Hmmm. Never thought of using my C8 as a guide scope! They just fit next to each other, but I've no idea how I would get it all balanced by myself. smile.gif

 

Bob

 

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#75 starman876

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Posted 11 November 2018 - 11:21 AM

Can you ask them for a specific Strehl scope?? I missed that option. smile.gif They should do that.

 

It's a little strange. The screws were pretty glued in place, but the collimation was way off. I don't know what happened. I may get one of the Hotech collimation systems for it, since I may have it for a while.

 

If things don't look good through the scope I'll be making calls to Celestron. I think it might snow tomorrow. That doesn't count. smile.gif

 

Hmmm. Never thought of using my C8 as a guide scope! They just fit next to each other, but I've no idea how I would get it all balanced by myself. smile.gif

 

Bob

looks impressive.

 

The newer SCT from Celestron are much better. Ignore what you hear about the past from people who have no clue how to collimate an SCT.   Anyone who buys SCT after SCT and gets the same results tells me it is not the SCT's but the person that is buying the SCT.  On the other hand remember what Einstein said.  "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results”


Edited by starman876, 11 November 2018 - 11:39 AM.

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