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Baader Hyperion eyepieces in fast scopes

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9 replies to this topic

#1 Shanmac

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 09:53 AM

Hi Guys, I’m new here waytogo.gif

 

Are the Baader Hyperion eyepieces really that bad in a fast f/5 Dobsonian?

if so,

In what department does it fall short?

and

What is the cause of the problem?

btw, I have the 13mm Hyperion that works great in my 5” f/11 Mak, but haven’t had a chance to try with the f/5 Dob yet.



#2 chrysalis

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 09:57 AM

I think Hyperion are similar (or even more than similar wink.gif ) to Orion Stratus. These EPs work nicely in my f/4.9. I have owned the 21, 13, and 5 mm versions. And - extra bonus! - if you unscrew the Smythe lens from the bottom of the 21 mm, it becomes a very nice 32.2 mm EP!! (P.S. - this does not work as well with the others :( ).


Edited by chrysalis, 22 November 2018 - 09:57 AM.

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#3 db2005

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 09:58 AM

I have tried my 21 mm and 8 mm Hyperions in my 6" f/5 Newt and I wasn't at all happy with their performance. I found off-axis sharpness and overall image quality to be lacking. The Hyperions work better in slower scopes.

 

EDIT: And welcome to the forum!


Edited by db2005, 22 November 2018 - 10:06 AM.


#4 25585

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 10:07 AM

FYI https://www.firstlig...ion-review.html


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#5 dtsh

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 10:59 AM

I've been pretty hit and miss with the Hyperions. I used to own several of them, but traded them off over the years for other eyepieces and have kept only the 24mm. It was a decent eyepiece in my F6 scope, but in the F4.9 it needs a CC as the coma is quite noticeable.



#6 Shanmac

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 11:43 AM

Thanks for the informative reply’s guys, much appreciated.

 

Mmmm, as stated, I do have the 13mm BH but haven’t had a chance to try it out yet with my 10” f/5 Dob yet. I guess I will have to wait and see how well it performs. At least after doing some research and getting some user reviews I am now expecting it to be a slight disappointment. But there is light as some have said they where happy with the Baader Hyperion’s In their f/5, so how knows confused1.gif

No big loss I suppose, all though I do have the 13mm eyepiece and 28mm Tuning Ring which would give me a lot of options if I find the 13 workable in my f/5. I would probably invest in the 8mm which would give me a total of-

 

13mm

9.2mm

8mm

5mm

 

Fingers x’d



#7 Starman1

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 06:44 PM

They vary.

The 24 has the simplest optics and works the poorest of all at f/5.

The 21mm and 17mm are very good, with only a very mild astigmatism in the outer field (I think the design was optimized for f/8+).

The 13mm is the weakest of the series, contrast-wise, and has some edge of field brightening, though it is better than the 24mm at the edge of the field.

The 10mm is a bit newer design and better-optimized for f/5 than the 8mm or 5mm.

The 8mm and 5mm both have smaller field stops and function OK at f/5--about like the 13mm, but a trace better at the edge.

 

In general, how they fare in the f/5 scope is the presence of a bit of lateral field astigmatism.  This is very common in eyepieces from many companies--many of which are more expensive.

I think the Vixen LVWs (now discontinued) were the inspiration for many lines of 65-70° eyepieces on the market today.  The Hyperions are the equal of most of them.

My comparisons were all made at f/5 with a coma corrector, so coma did not enter the picture.

With no coma corrector, the edges might display a bit more aberration because the coma will add to the astigmatism.

 

And they do have issues with short focal lengths due to field curvature.  I think they may have a tiny bit of inherent field curvature that adds to the large amount of FC in short focal length scopes.

In a 10" f/5, though, FC won't be much of an issue.  In most refractors or short reflectors (like the aforementioned 6" f/5), FC can be obtrusive.

My dob has a focal length of 1825mm, so FC wasn't noticeable.

 

These are quite comfortable eyepieces to use.  You might find the Fine tuning Ring makes the exit pupil a bit harder to acquire, but this is not an issue in seated observing.

After all these years on the market, I still think they're OK as a step up from entry-level eyepieces, though I don't usually recommend the 24mm.

 

But how many other widefield eyepieces accept camera adapters directly, or use both 1.25" and 2" filters?  And have long enough eye relief for glasses?  Not too many


Edited by Starman1, 23 November 2018 - 06:47 PM.

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#8 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 25 November 2018 - 05:53 AM

My comparisons were all made at f/5 with a coma corrector, so coma did not enter the picture

 

Don:

 

Does that mean the comparisons were actually made at F/5.75?  

 

My only real experience with eyepieces of this type was with an 13mm Stratus.  At that same time, I also owned a 16mm mm Type 6 Nagler and the two eyepieces are very similar physically so I would get them mixed up.

 

It was great for doing a true blind test,.  I would put the Nagler in, thinking I had the Stratus.  My first thought was always:  "Wow, this eyepiece is much better than I thought." It is evenly illuminated and sharp across the field.  A second or two later I realized, "Oh, that's the Nagler."  I think that would have mostly been with my 12.5 inch F/4.06 which operates at F/4.67 with a Paracorr, which I was using.

 

At the time, probably 10 years or more ago, Edge of Field Brightening was not on the radar in this forum but it was so apparent with the accidental blind test that when I reported it here, others chimed in that they had seen it in the Stratus/Hyperion line. 

 

That's my two cents.  

 

Jon



#9 Shanmac

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Posted 25 November 2018 - 09:04 AM

Well, I got to try my 13mm Hyperion out tonight. Moon was the focus as it was full and drowned almost everything else out. The Hyperion performed poorly in my Dob. Brightness was poor, and there was an obvious glow around the outer 20%. It would seem that all the advice given to avoid these in a fast scope is very good advice indeed. 

I compared every eyepiece I had, even the stock EP’s that came with my mak performed better than the Hyperion @ f/5.

My personal experience with the Hyperion in an f/5 Dob was not a good experience at all.


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#10 Starman1

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Posted 25 November 2018 - 11:08 AM

Well, I got to try my 13mm Hyperion out tonight. Moon was the focus as it was full and drowned almost everything else out. The Hyperion performed poorly in my Dob. Brightness was poor, and there was an obvious glow around the outer 20%. It would seem that all the advice given to avoid these in a fast scope is very good advice indeed. 

I compared every eyepiece I had, even the stock EP’s that came with my mak performed better than the Hyperion @ f/5.

My personal experience with the Hyperion in an f/5 Dob was not a good experience at all.

True for the 13mm, but one important lesson to learn is that any eyepiece range where the eye relief is the same on all focal lengths

means the internals are different (slightly) in every focal length, so you cannot extrapolate from one focal length to the other.

The EOFB you saw in the 13 is just at the very edge in the 17 and absent in the 21, for example.


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