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help identify this old refractor

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#51 Joe1950

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Posted 25 November 2018 - 11:58 PM

I'll measure the actual diameter with my digital calipers of both lenses.



#52 Astrolite

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Posted 26 November 2018 - 01:00 AM

 

ASTROLITE, I may have a 50mm focuser.  Y'all remember the very old Royal spotter that Brian sold me for the Tinsley?  

 

attachicon.gif Finderscope - 50mm Paint Complete 2.jpg

 

Got a quarterly FJI treatment in the morning, so I'll be home tomorrow.  It's somewhere out in the shed.  If I can find it, the focuser is available.  I'm going to swap its excellent F5 lens with the cheap lens in my GSO RACI finder -- upgrade the plastic diagonal, too.

 

So, no need to part out your rare kit.  ** Look at the aluminum knobs on that Royal 50.  Can we say, All In The Family?  **

Thanks Bomber Bob, that would be great. I just sent a text to the woman to make sure the scope is still available.

 

37195269_1947189068905477_1897319609942409216_n.jpg


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#53 Bomber Bob

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Posted 26 November 2018 - 07:34 AM

Is that scope missing just the knobs & pinion shaft, and the cover?



#54 terraclarke

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Posted 26 November 2018 - 09:28 AM

J

The 50mm F12 lenses are easier to find -- TOWA sold a ton with the tabletop tripods.  

 

I'd check with Sheldon (MASILMW) & Joe (starbird) -- they may have an F10 tucked away.

 

A Bushnell Sky Rover lens would work -- and is most likely an Astro Optical.

 

ASTROLITE, I may have a 50mm focuser.  Y'all remember the very old Royal spotter that Brian sold me for the Tinsley?  

 

attachicon.gif Finderscope - 50mm Paint Complete 2.jpg

 

Got a quarterly FJI treatment in the morning, so I'll be home tomorrow.  It's somewhere out in the shed.  If I can find it, the focuser is available.  I'm going to swap its excellent F5 lens with the cheap lens in my GSO RACI finder -- upgrade the plastic diagonal, too.

 

So, no need to part out your rare kit.  ** Look at the aluminum knobs on that Royal 50.  Can we say, All In The Family?  **

Could add a focal extender to accommodate an F12 objective if an F10 could not be found. I did that for the Monolux 4380 I used to own. I put one of Sheldon’s excellent 60mm x 1000mm Carton objectives in it and used a Vixen-type thread on focal at was a perfect-fit go-between. The extender threaded into the read of the drawtube and the visual back (or a Vixen 1.25” visual back) threaded into the focal extender. It worked like a charm, looked like it belonged, and produced superb images. I gave the scope to a dear friend who didn’t have a telescope and always wanted one and he uses it all the time.

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#55 Russell Smith

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Posted 26 November 2018 - 10:35 AM

At work now but just wanted to jump in and say thanks to everyone for posting options for this project. I'm getting excited about what it will become.
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#56 Joe1950

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Posted 26 November 2018 - 01:15 PM

I tested the lenses and here is what I found:

 

 

The 50x500 with the unblackened edge...

 

Measures 50.8 mm full glass diameter.

 

lite edge lens.png

 

DPAC using a 150 LPI etched glass Ronchi grating, green LED @ appx 570 nm

 

 

 

The 50x500 with the blackened edge...

 

Measures 51.3 mm full glass diameter.

 

dark edge lens.png

 

DPAC using a 150 LPI etched glass Ronchi grating, green LED @ appx 570 nm

 

 

 

 

It appears the blackened edge achromat has a better figure than the unblackened one, the latter having an edge issue and a center zone. Remember, the DPAC is very sensitive and doubles the actual error.

 

What I would do, if you feel they will fit the cell without falling out and want to try these, is send both to visually inspect each on a real target. I will not be needing either so you can keep them or pass one on to someone else.

 

I don't have the ability to read DPAC tests quantitatively unless the lines are jailbar straight. The blackened edge lens comes close to that.

 

Let me know, by PM if you want to give them a try.

 

joe


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#57 Astrolite

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Posted 26 November 2018 - 01:41 PM

Is that scope missing just the knobs & pinion shaft, and the cover?

Those parts are missing for sure along with the screws, but I also did not see any type of engagement teeth on the focuser tube. Frankly I have never had a focuser apart before so I am not sure if anything else should be in there like a spring clip to keep tension on the system.



#58 Bomber Bob

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Posted 26 November 2018 - 06:26 PM

PM your mailing info, and I'll send you a focus tube with rack, shaft with pinion & knobs, and cover with screws.


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#59 Astrolite

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Posted 26 November 2018 - 06:41 PM

PM your mailing info, and I'll send you a focus tube with rack, shaft with pinion & knobs, and cover with screws.

PM sent. Thank you very much. I'll be sure to update the gang on my progress!


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#60 Russell Smith

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Posted 26 November 2018 - 06:54 PM

I sent Joe a PM about an objective lens to help make this a working scope.

The more I take things apart the more it seems that there is lots of life left in it.

I have the glass out of the eps and letting some penetrating oil work o  the stuck ep housings.

Focus assembly is just filthy,  no damage.

 

Astolite, I'm very happy you have found what you need.

Looking forward to seeing photos.


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#61 DMala

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Posted 27 November 2018 - 09:37 AM

Joe1950, how did you blacken the lens edges? Thx
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#62 Joe1950

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Posted 27 November 2018 - 12:24 PM

I didn’t. It came that way. The one without anything on the edge came from the Galilioscope. When I tested the lenses that one fit the tube perfectally.

 

And the blacking is not totally opaque. It’s kind of a 75% thing you see on some lens edges.


Edited by Joe1950, 27 November 2018 - 12:27 PM.


#63 DAVIDG

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Posted 27 November 2018 - 01:08 PM

 I blacken the edges of my lens with  a Sharpie marker.

 

                     - Dave 


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#64 Astrolite

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Posted 27 November 2018 - 01:17 PM

 I blacken the edges of my lens with  a Sharpie marker.

 

                     - Dave 

Is it the general consensus that blackening the edge should reduce light scatter? I would think that if you have to remove it anyway it would probably be worth it to blacken it.



#65 Bomber Bob

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Posted 27 November 2018 - 02:33 PM

I blackened the lens edges on a couple of fracs in my Collection.  It's like flocking, on some scopes, you can see a difference -- but less so with others.  As long as you don't stray onto the polished surfaces, it's worth a try.

 

My Ralph Dakin 4" F10 is a very fine frac, but Dakin didn't blacken the edges -- but he did build & install a complex baffling assembly -- a scope within the scope.

 

I blacken the edges of my lens with  a Sharpie marker.

 

Same here.  On one lens, I tried a wide-tip (like a brush!) Sharpie.  Had to use more care, but it seemed to leave a thicker darker layer.

 

First time I took the Mogey lens out to clean it, I thought the edges were blackened...  Chuck (as usual) popped that bubble:  Informed me it was very old oxidation... rust.  What a let-down!


Edited by Bomber Bob, 27 November 2018 - 02:38 PM.

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#66 DAVIDG

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Posted 27 November 2018 - 04:36 PM

There is a debate if blackening the edge helps or not since if you raytrace the light it is difficult for any from the edge to actually get down into the focal plane.  But military optics and I also believe TeleVue use blacken edges so 2 minutes with Sharpie is what I do  after  I pull a lens apart for cleaning/testing.  

   The pro's put the lens on a  turn table and  as it is slowing rotates apply the flat black paint to the edge with a fine tipped brush. 

  If you have an older Questar, you can see the paint swirls in the black spot on the corrector from how it was applied when the correct was slowly  rotating on the turn table.  The paint of choice was 3M Nextel Velvet black which is no longer made. 

 

              - Dave 


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#67 Russell Smith

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Posted 01 December 2018 - 11:37 AM

First off, a big thank you to all for your input.

Thank you Joe for sending a lens to make the OTA whole again.

My plan is to take a boatload of photos to document how everything goes together and start to disassemble.

Also to go back to prior threads and make a list of products needed to strip everything down and repaint.

It seems that the tripod is missing a tray(if it had one)and the tabs? Photos of what others look like would be very helpful.

Hope everyone has a great weekend.

Russ


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#68 CharlieB

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Posted 01 December 2018 - 12:41 PM

Here's mine with the safety chain (which is too long in the photo).  These scopes never had a tray.

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#69 Russell Smith

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Posted 01 December 2018 - 12:43 PM

Thanks Charlie. 

That looks to be an easy fix.

Beautiful little scope.



#70 shredder1656

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Posted 01 December 2018 - 02:15 PM

Glad you are restoring this one, Russell.



#71 Russell Smith

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Posted 09 December 2018 - 05:25 PM

So, I think we know something about this scope. Today I had hoped to start tearing down and documenting things but life happens and I have been at the ER with Shawn. She is ok but will follow up with the heart Doctor in the morning. I may have time still to get started.
If there is interest I will post updates and a few photos as I go. I will be needing advice along the way I am sure, so if you nice people would like me to continue to post I would ask the moderator to re-name this thread and I will keep on keeping on.
I did blow the cobwebs out of the OTA put a 1.25 visual back, diagonal, 32mm ep on and took it out back in daylight.
So far looking good. (Thanks Joe)
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