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Let the antique speak for itself...

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#26 John Higbee

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Posted 07 January 2019 - 09:01 PM

The focuser is in great mechanical shape, but extremely stiff. A little lubrication on the rack and pinion solved most of that issue. As has been mentioned in other threads, the focuser motion is rather coarse...a Crayford or Moonlight it is not!

20181226_154043.jpg

20181226_153918.jpg
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#27 John Higbee

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Posted 07 January 2019 - 09:10 PM

While I had the focuser off, I looked up the OTA and saw this:

20181226_154908.jpg

this is the second of two baffles I found in the tube (the other one is in the upper part of the tube). At some point it rotated into its current orientation (and may have slipped out of its original position).
Was able to rotate it back into a perpendicular position - this allowed us to do first light (day and night) last Saturday.
Will need to do a baffle calculation for a 6" f/16 to ensure it is properly placed during refurb.

Edited by John Higbee, 07 January 2019 - 09:12 PM.

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#28 clamchip

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Posted 07 January 2019 - 09:15 PM

Its interesting the focuser tube has some cuts opposite the rack and pinion, I haven't seen these

before.

I wonder if the cuts provide a strip of focuser tube acting like a spring against the wall of the focuser

to tighten things up, remove play and provide some drag to the assembly.

 

Robert 


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#29 deepwoods1

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Posted 07 January 2019 - 09:17 PM

Can't wait to see this at NEAF?



#30 John Higbee

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Posted 07 January 2019 - 09:24 PM

Back to the focuser...as previously mentioned, it came without its drawtube. The rear end of the focuser tube is about 1 7/8 inches (I.D.), and is threaded internally for 0.5" (for 10 threads). Looks like the drawtube adapter screwed into the focuser tube, and supported a drawtube for 1 1/4" eyepieces of about 8" in length.
This could be a standard drawtube for a Saturn focuser common to the range of refractors they offered...if any of you with Tinsley Saturns can prove or disprove this by looking at your drawtubes, would much appreciate it. If true, I can have this made by a local machinist.
20181226_154105.jpg

Dave (combatdad), whose help was essential last Saturday, found an odd drawtube in his Unitron parts locker:
20190105_125800.jpg
It cannot be screwed in, but it can be taped (carefully) to the focuser tube, and, with a Celestron 1 1/4" diagonal and eyepiece, gave us rudimentary operational capability.

Edited by John Higbee, 07 January 2019 - 09:36 PM.

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#31 John Higbee

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Posted 07 January 2019 - 09:51 PM

Can't wait to see this at NEAF?

I'd like to do that, but my experience with the Spacek 6" refurb last year is that what I can do with painting is going to be limited to when the temperature consistently gets above 50 degrees F (I have to paint outside).
I ended up with 10 days between that date and the start of NEAF 2018, and was only able to get the pier, legs and counterweights redone before I had to head up to Rockland. Still have to refurb and paint the GEM and the OTA on that one
This scope will require metalwork on the tube (taking the dents out) before priming and repainting; stripping, priming and repainting the mount, objective cover, finder tube and cover, rising pier outer tube, and tube rings, and refinishing the oak tripod legs. Probably won't complete this before the first week of April.
My intention, when this is done, is to offer this for display in the Antique Telescopes Society booth for NEAF 2020 (since the NEAF classics booth I support usually displays scopes from the mid '40s to ~1980). Am getting in touch with them this week.

John

Edited by John Higbee, 07 January 2019 - 09:53 PM.

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#32 Dave Trott

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Posted 08 January 2019 - 01:14 AM

My Tinsley focuser tube looks just like that. It is threaded about 1 7/8 x 24. A machinist will be able to make an adapter pretty easily. Take the focuser tube with you so he/she can verify the measurements and test fit the adapter to the focuser tube.

- Dave


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#33 rcwolpert

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Posted 08 January 2019 - 09:06 AM

What an amazing find, and such a fun project to restore it!  Congratulations!


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#34 Ken Launie

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Posted 08 January 2019 - 09:55 PM

That's a great instrument that would be wonderful to see on display at NEAF. Tinsley is best known for reflecting telescopes, though their 3 and 4 inch refractors are occasionally seen. I looked through my various Tinsley catalogs that date from the 1930's through the '80's, and didn't see refractors larger than a 4-inch in any of them. However, a later one lists a 5-inch objective, and even the earlier ones said larger objectives were available on inquiry. Be very careful when straightening the aluminum tube. Depending on the temper of the metal cracking is very possible.

 

--Ken


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#35 albert1

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Posted 08 January 2019 - 11:06 PM

That's a real stunner, John. Love the extendable Alt/Az. Any chance just cleaning it up and leaving what little original finish is left of it? I don't know, just thinking out loud . You know me, I like leaving everything original most of the time . Looking forward to seeing that one for sure. Good luck with whatever you choose to do. Enjoy it!


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#36 John Higbee

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 06:28 AM

That's a great instrument that would be wonderful to see on display at NEAF. Tinsley is best known for reflecting telescopes, though their 3 and 4 inch refractors are occasionally seen. I looked through my various Tinsley catalogs that date from the 1930's through the '80's, and didn't see refractors larger than a 4-inch in any of them. However, a later one lists a 5-inch objective, and even the earlier ones said larger objectives were available on inquiry. Be very careful when straightening the aluminum tube. Depending on the temper of the metal cracking is very possible.
 
--Ken


Ken - thanks! According to a thread that Clint Whitman ( (aveman ) had on Tinsley Saturns in 2010, he had talked to a Tinsley Instruments employee who actually found the production records for Saturns. She said that the company had produced around 400 3" refractors; 100 4"; 10 5"; and 3 6"...so this is a pretty "rare bird". As for the tube dents, I intend to go to a brass musical instruments repair expert I know...he has a neat kit that uses metal balls of various sizes in the inside of the dent, with a powerful magnet on the outside of the dent...they pop right out, without the heavy radial stress that an exhaust pipe dent remover places on the whole tube. I'll be careful, in any case. John

Edited by John Higbee, 11 January 2019 - 06:30 AM.

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#37 John Higbee

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 06:34 AM

That's a real stunner, John. Love the extendable Alt/Az. Any chance just cleaning it up and leaving what little original finish is left of it? I don't know, just thinking out loud . You know me, I like leaving everything original most of the time . Looking forward to seeing that one for sure. Good luck with whatever you choose to do. Enjoy it!


Thanks, Albert...I'd normally agree on just cleaning it up, but between the large areas of no paint (no metal on the tube and the mount was primed, so the paint is literally falling off), the OTA dents, and the need to refinish the oak tripod legs, I'm going to restore it. I will (after priming the metal) use the original paint and stain colors and textures. Hope to see you at this year's NEAF! John

Edited by John Higbee, 11 January 2019 - 06:35 AM.

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#38 John Higbee

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 06:39 AM

After installing the jury-rigged drawtube:

installing the drawtube.jpg

We did initial optics checks on the finder and the main scope

Dave at the controls.jpg
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#39 John Higbee

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 06:42 AM

Despite the beat up appearance of the finder:

finder.jpg

it gave clear, sharp images!
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#40 John Higbee

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 06:48 AM

The key test was on the objective. Although it is in need of a thorough cleaning, a view of distant tree branches was sharp and clear:

20190105_124755 (2).jpg

Rough measurement when in focus(from the objective to the eyepiece) was 96"...so this is an f/16 instrument.

Star test on Capella and its star field later in the evening showed sharp pinpoints and no chromatic aberration.

John

Edited by John Higbee, 11 January 2019 - 06:51 AM.

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#41 John Higbee

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 06:50 AM

The two "hairs" on the image were on the 25mm Kellner eyepiece...not scope defects.

John

#42 TOM KIEHL

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 07:20 AM

 I intend to go to a brass musical instruments repair expert I know...he has a neat kit that uses metal balls of various sizes in the inside of the dent, with a powerful magnet on the outside of the dent...they pop right out, without the heavy radial stress that an exhaust pipe dent remover places on the whole tube. I'll be careful, in any case. John

May I offer one more suggestion that I have used in the past for your consideration ?

 

 https://www.youtube....h?v=KXmkeQhpiOY


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#43 bremms

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 08:52 AM

Problem is the thickness of the tube and that it is aluminum. Forcing a tapered wood plug down the tube is probably the way I would attempt the dent repair.  That being said, a couple more baffles would improve the contrast.

 

I love this scope by the way. Old unique scopes are my favorite. This one is so unique. Most of the time I like to keep them close to original. In this case, restoration is certainly in order.  I have a 1960 Tinsley 8" Cass that is getting refigured and coated. The figure was smooth, but had a wide zone at 70%. My only modification was proper baffling. The diagonal mounted baffle was missing.


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#44 starman876

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 10:14 AM

I see you and Dave are having a good time with the scope.  That is going to be such a great scope when you guys are done with it.  Only 3 were made.   What a great find.


Edited by starman876, 11 January 2019 - 12:45 PM.

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#45 deepwoods1

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 12:22 PM

After installing the jury-rigged drawtube:

attachicon.gif installing the drawtube.jpg

We did initial optics checks on the finder and the main scope

attachicon.gif Dave at the controls.jpg

Dave, I’m surprise the police weren’t called while doing this. Don’t change your name to Tom.


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#46 combatdad

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 01:00 PM

I see you and Dave are having a goof time with the scope.  That is going to be such a great scope when you guys are done with it.  Only 3 were made.   What a great find.

Had a great time!  I love seeing these old and rare scopes come back to life!

 

Dave


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#47 John Higbee

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 10:11 AM

May I offer one more suggestion that I have used in the past for your consideration ?
 
 https://www.youtube....h?v=KXmkeQhpiOY

Tom - thanks for the suggestion! I'll contact these folks and see if they have anyone in the local area that I can talk with on this. John

#48 John Higbee

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 10:23 AM

Dave, I’m surprise the police weren’t called while doing this. Don’t change your name to Tom.


My neighbors are used to all sorts of astronomy-related "strange behaviors" (and are eager observers whenever I roll a telescope into our cul-de-sac).
This particular evolution barely deflected the neighborhood "astro-weirdo-meter"...things like finding a laser collimator "red dot" on your front door while I collimate the Cave 12.5" are of much more interest/concern (not that that ever happened :-o )

Edited by John Higbee, 12 January 2019 - 10:53 AM.


#49 John Higbee

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 10:30 AM

I see you and Dave are having a good time with the scope.  That is going to be such a great scope when you guys are done with it.  Only 3 were made.   What a great find.


Thanks, Johann - you're welcome to come over the next time Dave and I get together! John

#50 John Higbee

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 10:51 AM

Several more views of the OTA/finder combination..."bow on" shot:

OTA bow shot.jpg

...and a "stern shot"

OTA stern shot.jpg

Again - overall length is 83" (objective cover to focuser cap). The wonderfully elegant tablecloth was a leftover from Christmas dinner (and vital when you have four grandchildren ranging from pre-school to infant at the table!) John

Edited by John Higbee, 12 January 2019 - 10:52 AM.

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