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Technical Instrument Corp. 76.2x1000mm

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#51 Chuck Hards

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Posted 11 March 2019 - 12:47 AM

Awesome work so far Chuck! I'm glad you ended up with it instead of me, you're much more equipped to handle the care that scope needs.

 

Thanks!  At least I can get it up and running again.


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#52 Kasmos

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Posted 11 March 2019 - 01:07 AM

waytogo.gif Great work Chuck!

 

Interesting focuser and cell/dewcap assembly. All of the features seem both different and more handsome than the norm. 


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#53 clamchip

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Posted 11 March 2019 - 08:16 PM

Oh, Robert was my first thought.  lol.gif

I somehow missed all this clam talk.

I absolutely love clams and my wife can't stand'em so I hardly ever get'em.

When we go to Ivar's the Fish & Chips is more bang-for-the-buck so I get the

Pollock and my wife goes for the Cod. My recommendation? don't be a pig

and get the Cod.

I've only met 3 clamchips that were trouble makers: 

 

1) my Lower 4.25", the chips reflect light internally right though the core of the

element. I will stone the edge chips to kill their ability to reflect these beams

thru the element.

2) my Swift 831, there are so many chips I can just barely find a spot for the

three spacers 120deg apart. But what a killer lens.

3) A Edmund 3" f/15 lens with a huge surface clamchip. There is so much real

estate missing when next to the same lens with no chips it's obviously dimmer. 

 

Otherwise I don't mind the clamchip. 3 out of dozens of lenses and mirrors with

clamchips of every species isn't bad.

 

Robert


Edited by clamchip, 11 March 2019 - 08:20 PM.

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#54 Chuck Hards

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 06:54 AM

The clam on this one is very small, I'm estimating less than 0.5% obstruction.  

 

I had some clear skies yesterday but my wife had other plans for my time.  I'll post more pics and updates as the stars align.


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#55 CharlieB

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 11:34 AM

If you ever get around to it, check the back side of that focuser label.  Just in case...


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#56 Chuck Hards

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 05:56 PM

If you ever get around to it, check the back side of that focuser label.  Just in case...

 

The back side is blank.



#57 CHASLX200

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 06:42 PM

Looks to be a mid 60's scope.



#58 Chuck Hards

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 07:03 PM

Stargoat dates it to '58 to early '60.  



#59 CHASLX200

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 07:39 PM

Never saw one like it or the finder.



#60 starman876

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 09:04 PM

I finally have a couple of days off, it's been three weeks since my last time-off.  Kelly got a new toy to help her do her nails so I took advantage of the time to do some work on this scope.

 

TECH. INST. CO.  It carries the Infinity maker's mark.

 

attachicon.gif 006.jpg

 

One of the handles was missing, just a few pieces of plastic still stuck to the threaded insert.  The other one has been broken several times and crudely re-glued, though it's functional.  I decided to make a new pair of handles from Delrin block.

 

attachicon.gif 012.jpg

 

I removed the plastic from the shattered one and am saving the insert for a faithful reproduction when I have time.  I can cast new handles using resin tinted to match the faux ivory of the originals.  In the meantime, the Delrin knobs will look appropriate.  They look good but are just too "white" to pass for stock.  

 

The insert, and removing the remnants with a sharp chisel.  It's a metric M7 thread so I want to save these for the eventual ivory knobs.

 

attachicon.gif 009.jpg

 

attachicon.gif 010.jpg

 

 

 

I cut sized blocks from the Delrin I had on-hand.

 

attachicon.gif 013.jpg

 

 

 

Rough-shaped on the disk sander to save time and chatter on the lathe.

 

attachicon.gif 011.jpg

 

 

 

Bored a hole and tapped it for the M7 threads for the control rod.

 

attachicon.gif 007.jpg

 

 

 

Here's the first one just about ready to come off the lathe, with an original for comparison.

 

attachicon.gif 005.jpg

 

 

 

Threaded onto the control rod.

 

attachicon.gif 002.jpg

 

 

 

Control rods attached to the mount.  I managed to remove much of the corrosion and dirt from the rods themselves, they look pretty good with just a quick polish.

 

attachicon.gif 004.jpg

 

 

 

It works well, I didn't polish the knob as much as I should have since it's really only temporary.  When I cast the faux ivory knobs I'll polish them highly, and they should be nearly indistinguishable from the originals.

 

More to come but my wife is bugging me to come to dinner.  This scope just might turn out to be a terrific acquisition, despite my initial misgivings. 

awesome work Chuck.  Wish I had a lathe.  I do have a small mill.  


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#61 Chuck Hards

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 09:12 PM

Steve's been doing a lot of research on this scope and he's found similarities with some 60mm Sans & Streiffe as well as Swift models.  He's got me leaning toward the maker of this scope being early Takahashi, or a Tak collaborator (as if the infinity mark wasn't good enough evidence), along with some S&S models.  I had always suspected that the S&S 601 was Royal Astro, but there are too many differences between them and the Royal-made Tascos and other import brands of the same era.  It's not RA, it's Tak.

 

This would also explain why the objectives typically found on both the Royal and early Tak-made scopes such as S&S, Swift, and this little guy, test so exceptionally. 

 

Now that he's pointed it out to me, I see the S&S design and detail choices, as well as this scope, to be undeniably from the same design stable as the 800 series Swifts.

Hopefully he'll weigh-in here soon, I haven't heard from him in three weeks.


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#62 Chuck Hards

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 09:16 PM

Thanks Johann, you can get a mini-lathe and tons of tools for well under a grand these days.  I think Harbor Freight still has some pre-tariff stock.  And there's always Sherline.  A mini lathe will handle most jobs for the classic scope collector, the HF can swing a 7" diameter. 


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#63 starman876

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 09:38 PM

Thanks Johann, you can get a mini-lathe and tons of tools for well under a grand these days.  I think Harbor Freight still has some pre-tariff stock.  And there's always Sherline.  A mini lathe will handle most jobs for the classic scope collector, the HF can swing a 7" diameter. 

Thanks for hooking me up with Sherline.  Will keep them in mind.


Edited by starman876, 12 March 2019 - 09:39 PM.

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#64 Kasmos

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 09:41 PM

I was at HF the other day. The mini lathe is now $667. Seems like a jump from the last time I looked, but time flys.

 



#65 Chuck Hards

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 09:42 PM

Chris, that is a $200 jump from just a year or two ago.  I guess they are out of pre-tariff stock.

 

The Sherline has a much smaller capacity, but it's a delight to use.  Much quicker setups and use.  I've owned both and miss my Sherline, wore it out after 25 years and three motors.  Bought the HF and while it works well, the setup takes longer, I've gone through two control boards in only a few years.  It doesn't like being run at slow speeds for extended periods.  It's also laborious to set up the threading gears, though they work well are just plastic.


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#66 Kasmos

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 09:45 PM

The last time I noticed it was $550, but I can't remember how long ago? Maybe a year. Like lots of stuff, perhaps we pay more in CA? I'll go check their online price.


Edited by Kasmos, 12 March 2019 - 09:46 PM.


#67 Kasmos

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Posted 12 March 2019 - 09:47 PM

I was close. Online says $669.

 

Edit they have two. The 12" is $599, the 10" is $669. Does that make sense?

 

https://www.harborfr... Rank,f&q=lathe


Edited by Kasmos, 12 March 2019 - 09:50 PM.


#68 Chuck Hards

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 07:26 AM

I was close. Online says $669.

 

Edit they have two. The 12" is $599, the 10" is $669. Does that make sense?

 

https://www.harborfr... Rank,f&q=lathe

 

Both swing a 7" diameter but the bed length is different.  Longer gives you more options.  I have the short bed because that's all the local store had in stock at the time.

 

But we've drifted off-topic.  If anyone wants to PM me about mini lathe advice, feel free.



#69 terraclarke

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 10:25 AM

Steve's been doing a lot of research on this scope and he's found similarities with some 60mm Sans & Streiffe as well as Swift models.  He's got me leaning toward the maker of this scope being early Takahashi, or a Tak collaborator (as if the infinity mark wasn't good enough evidence), along with some S&S models.  I had always suspected that the S&S 601 was Royal Astro, but there are too many differences between them and the Royal-made Tascos and other import brands of the same era.  It's not RA, it's Tak.
 
This would also explain why the objectives typically found on both the Royal and early Tak-made scopes such as S&S, Swift, and this little guy, test so exceptionally. 
 
Now that he's pointed it out to me, I see the S&S design and detail choices, as well as this scope, to be undeniably from the same design stable as the 800 series Swifts.
Hopefully he'll weigh-in here soon, I haven't heard from him in three weeks.


I thought the infinity symbol maker’s mark was on the white and green Eikow Swifts? My tan and olive Swift 839 is the second oldest (#28) in the Swift registry and has been tentatively dated at 1960. It has the (AVA) maker’s mark that has been attributed to Takahashi. On the other hand, Takahashi America states that Takahashi produced their first telescope in 1967 and their first telescope branded under their own name in 1969. While granted, their are certain similarities between early Swifts and Takahashi’s (especially knobs, compression rings, and finders), those things may have actually come from just a common third party source. I think there was an awful lot of co-mingling of parts and sources in the Japanese telescope industry in the 1950s and ‘60s making us think we know more than we actually do. I’m also beginning to wonder if all this Takahashi attribution to the early Swifts isn’t just coincidence, a bunch of hogwash, or in the least, just wishful thinking.

https://www.takahash...shi-seisakusho/

Edited by terraclarke, 13 March 2019 - 10:44 AM.


#70 Chuck Hards

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 10:33 AM

Terra, what I see indicates a common design origin.  The same design team is responsible for them.  Manufacturing was probably spread out as you suggest, but I think the optical quality pretty much proves a common source at  least for the objectives.  

 

I've tested a couple of Eikows with the inverted-Y mark and they leave something to be desired.  Clearly not from the same optician as the infinity and AVA makers.

 

Steve (Stargoat) bases a lot of his research on release dates for these various designs.  When they hit  the market at  about the same time, a common source for most of each design is indicated.  It makes more sense than just "wishful thinking".  The optical quality doesn't  really leave room for wishing, it's not imaginary and not every factory could do it consistently.  Unitron, for example.  Whomever did the AVA and Infinity objectives could do it.



#71 terraclarke

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 10:53 AM

If you dig back through here Chuck, there is a green and white 60mm, (maybe it’s the one with the reversed badge with printing on both sides?) that I thought was an Eikow? Anyway, for all intents and purposes it is pretty much the same as the tan and olive Swifts. I think, more likely, Swift at the time demanded a high quality product with unique features. A group, like Nihon Sieko who did the same thing for United (Unitron) and a few others, put that product together. These folks were assemblers, just like those who created Unitrons, and they used specific suppliers. The idea was already in place in Japan and the same management/production model had been used during the war years in the highly diversified small arms manufacturing industry via cottage industry collectives. When the time came for Mr. Takahashi to make his leap to manufacturing telescopes, he pulled from that collective (that had produced the Swifts), brought those people, designs, and suppliers into his factory and began making Takahashi telescopes.

#72 Chuck Hards

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 11:12 AM

The manufacturing model is known, but plugging in who and where is all a "just so" story, unfortunately, though there are folks doing the research in Japan, hopefully they can pin things down before it's lost  for good.

 

I'm just presenting what Steve has given me in PM's.  He'll check in here sooner or later.

 

For  the record, I'm not trying to connect any particular brand with Takahashi for the cachet of it, rather, it makes sense according to optical quality, date of manufacture, and design features among certain brands.  The same reason we equate some brands with Royal Astro.  There was just no-one else capable of it at the time.



#73 terraclarke

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 11:17 AM

I’m just being the Devil’s advocate here. There is a tendency of taking the cart befor the horse in this forum. Not just this. There is a lot of it. Speculation is fun but it’s also the way urban legends and conspiracy theories are born and I have become increasingly suspect.

#74 Chuck Hards

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 11:46 AM

It's just a hobby.  No worries, nobody's defending a thesis so I'm OK with observation based speculation until something better comes along.  I'd honestly love  to know the details but am afraid too many of that generation have already passed-away in Japan.



#75 terraclarke

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 11:56 AM

Somethings are just unknowable Chuck! And I’m okay with that. I love a good mystery. Or should I say, a certain amount of mystique? wink.gif
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