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What to do? Windows 10 or new OS for 4k and astro

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#26 Steve Cox

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 06:34 PM

  Thanks to all of you for your insights.  I have to agree that learning a new system is not in the cards for me...........this old dog is getting too old to learn too many new tricks.  I will agree that the linux os seems to have a lot of potential and can be refined for guys like me.  I just wish that it could be brought down to a level that is understandable for the average windows and mac user.

 

  All of this said,  I have a question about a mac.  I had one years ago and as I remember, it seems that vmware had the ability to operate a windows environment for my windows based programs.  Is that still true today?  I'm guessing that they're may have been improvements since?

 

  As others have stated, I'm not looking forward to moving from 7 to 10.  

When I was on Mac, I did use VMWare a lot to run SkyTools and a couple other Windows only pieces of astro-software.  SkyTools runs quite well, but... a word of caution here if you're considering this... ASCOM would not run under VMWare for me, nor could I find anyway to trick SkyTools to recognize and connect to my scope using INDI or anything else other than ASCOM.  I suspect most astro-software that is Windows only will be like this.  So if you want to use the system to run a scope, you're going to have to purchase and convert to Mac (or Linux) astro-software.



#27 BlueGrass

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 08:52 PM

  Astronomy software, particularly imaging acquisition and device control software, are complex pieces of code in how they operate compared to general word processing, email or other standard office / home functions. The release by ASCOM of the Alpaca interface would seem to eventually lead to an interface standard where using a mixture of systems, each dedicated to a specific role can be used. 

 

 Many of the folks here are already moving in that direction. Having Linux or Win10 run the actual hardware interfaces on the mount, as a small, fast much less power hungry I/O controller connected via a network to a more powerful GUI based system for monitoring and image download. From what I understand of Alpaca? ..  it will hopefully lead to a standard where the ability to connect your particular piece of software to any ASCOM supported device on your network is possible.

 

Interesting times .. grin.gif


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#28 gregj888

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Posted 13 March 2019 - 11:21 PM

Gunny,

 

On my portable rig I'll probably stay with Win-10 though I would prefer Win 7 to be honest. 

 

I have dislikes and concerns about Win-10 in a remote/automated setup.  That is with an observatory at the end of a network link and doing a fully automated capture run.  I've probably expressed this a bit too much lately so will leave it at that.

 

If you need Win-10 for other reasons, I would go for it with no real angst.

 

All the best.



#29 gunny01

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Posted 14 March 2019 - 05:48 AM

  All good information folks.  I've wanted to build my own spec. computer and there are youtubes out there that make it look pretty simple to do, so the hardware part doesn't really bug me too much.  I have a shuttle computer that another guy put together and it works flawlessly with win 7.  I figure this might be a good way to learn a little more about computers and get over it with respect to win 10.

 

  I guess the Mrs. got tired of me complaining about win 10 and talked to the i.t. guy, he said it would be no problem to help with the win 10 install on the computer.  That's good news for me.  



#30 BlueGrass

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Posted 14 March 2019 - 11:13 AM

Gunny,

 If I'm not mistaken, you can still put 10 on the 7 machine for free .. The IT guy just needs to download and create a 10 install disk using the media creation tool from MS .. He's probably already familiar with this. Hopefully your version of 7 installed is Pro so the upgrade will install 10 Pro...  The latest release build of 10, 1809 seems stable although in another thread here, some have reported problems upgrading their systems. I've upgraded 5 systems so far, 2 laptops and 3 desktops  three with the previous 1803 build that were eventually upgraded by 10 itself to 1809 and the other two with 1809 directly. I've only had one system reboot abnormally, an ancient Dell D630 laptop with 10 32bit .. not sure why it crashed since the system logs didn't capture the actual failure other than logging an unexpected power event.  Anyway, good luck on the upgrade ..   


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#31 Noah4x4

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Posted 14 March 2019 - 04:24 PM

I kicked and screamed and moaned when my Win 7 machine gave up the ghost, and finally had to go with a Win 10 Pro,,,,, but I have more problems/glitches with SGP than I do with Win 10 Pro. 

Pay the extra few bucks for the Pro edition to help control the updates, and don't look back.... 

Windows 10 Pro is just awesome. Retaining Windows 7 is only a benefit if you have a tonne of legacy equipment like serial devices. But even they are not a problem in Windows 10 given compatibility modes and PL2303 drivers.

 

Win 10 Pro runs my 16 megapixel camera/SG Pro software etc at 4K resolution on my Intel I5 NUC with Iris Plus Graphics a charm. It is infinitely better than Windows 10 Home and you have superior Administrator control to shut off all the nuisance stuff in 'Home'. Win 10 Pro supports USB3, high specification graphics cards, 802.11ac wireless and all the recent advances in technology.

 

Here is a real bonus.....

 

A common route to remote control of camera/scope is use Windows Remote Desktop (or similar) and control a scope side computer from another computer indoors. A problem with this is that the transfer of 4k UHD screen data will have lag and splutter (but 1080p HD is OK). This is caused by the RemoteFX compression algorithm. But illustrative of the extra control you get in Windows 10 Pro you can reduce or even disable this compression. This will then make any 4K UHD remote system turbo -charged. It will even work fine over wireless, hence requiring no spaghetti of USB, HDMI or cat 6 cables. More information in the EAA Forum.



#32 Myk Rian

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Posted 14 March 2019 - 04:36 PM



Let me start off with my level of computer literacy....very little ( think IQ level for computer OS's of maybe 60). I've had great success with win 7, but with all of the negative reviews/problems that I see with win 10, I'm reluctant to buy/build a new computer with win 10 on it.


Never buy a version of windows that is an even number version. History has shown them to be cantankerous, and frustrating.
Stay with v7.

Myk

#33 dongallo

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Posted 14 March 2019 - 05:05 PM


Never buy a version of windows that is an even number version. History has shown them to be cantankerous, and frustrating.
Stay with v7.

Myk

Windows 10 is actually Windows 9. Some software will check the version of the OS and if it is Windows 9X (Windows 95 or 98) it will not install. To prevent this Microsoft had to skip 9 and go with 10. 

You are kinda right. Even numbers have been the technology advances which caused a few issues with some and the odd numbers were the polish and refinement. Windows 8 pushed mobile technology which was jarring to some and Windows 10 is the polish and refinement.

Windows 10 is fantastic and there is nothing to fear with it. Most of the nay say on Windows 10 is completely unfounded and FUD.



#34 makeitso

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Posted 14 March 2019 - 06:17 PM

Windows 3 was joke until window 3.11 came out.

 

Jack


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#35 gunny01

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Posted 15 March 2019 - 05:59 AM

Windows 10 Pro is just awesome. Retaining Windows 7 is only a benefit if you have a tonne of legacy equipment like serial devices. But even they are not a problem in Windows 10 given compatibility modes and PL2303 drivers.

 

Win 10 Pro runs my 16 megapixel camera/SG Pro software etc at 4K resolution on my Intel I5 NUC with Iris Plus Graphics a charm. It is infinitely better than Windows 10 Home and you have superior Administrator control to shut off all the nuisance stuff in 'Home'. Win 10 Pro supports USB3, high specification graphics cards, 802.11ac wireless and all the recent advances in technology.

 

Here is a real bonus.....

 

A common route to remote control of camera/scope is use Windows Remote Desktop (or similar) and control a scope side computer from another computer indoors. A problem with this is that the transfer of 4k UHD screen data will have lag and splutter (but 1080p HD is OK). This is caused by the RemoteFX compression algorithm. But illustrative of the extra control you get in Windows 10 Pro you can reduce or even disable this compression. This will then make any 4K UHD remote system turbo -charged. It will even work fine over wireless, hence requiring no spaghetti of USB, HDMI or cat 6 cables. More information in the EAA Forum.

  I'm just starting to look at the requirements for full 4k uhd in terms of hardware and processing software.  From the little that I have read, I don't see a lot of upside in going to full blown 4k as opposed to fhd for video as I don't do this professionally.  I have a canon 80d and the fhd from it is great and I'm happy with it.  Going to be trying a sony a7III mirrorless using fhd.  It has amazing low light capability for stills and video and can be adapted for using canon glass.

 

  The old computer is getting up there in age, so once that becomes problematic, I'll price components for a build as 4k and fhd are rather demanding in terms of memory, cooling, ram, and graphics card.  

 

  Noah, its good to know the capability of win 10 in terms of the various compression modes that are out there for video.  Bewildering to say the least with avchd, 4k, ect.



#36 ldcarson

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Posted 15 March 2019 - 06:17 AM

Windows 10 pro for the win...but,....what about the future and 8K:

 

The Red Monstro 8K VV "Brain" has a 35.4-megapixel CMOS sensor, can record 8K video at 60 fps, has over 17 stops of dynamic range, and costs -- brace yourself -- $54,500.

 

Wonder what it would costs just to buy time on the hubble...LOL




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