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GPS Rollover Problems!

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#351 Michael_Swanson

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Posted 06 September 2019 - 07:03 AM

Hey Mike, received the hand control today, that's supposed to be 4.04.  When I plug it into the telescope mount, it says "No Response".  Typical?  Or a problem?

 

I don't have a programming cable yet.  Hope to make one tonight or tomorrow, but I've got to see what this hurricane Dorian does.

 

Jeff

Yes, that would be expected until you load the NXS 4.22 firmware.  Version 4.04 was for the old NexStar GT mount.

 

Best regards,
Mike Swanson
Author of "The NexStar User's Guide II"
Author of "The NexStar User's Guide"
Author of "NexStar Observer List"
https://www.NexStarSite.com



#352 Michael_Swanson

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Posted 06 September 2019 - 07:07 AM

Also, what size connector goes into the bottom of the hand control?  RJ-45 is way too big.  But I can't even get a RJ-11 to fit it!  I don't get it.

 

EDIT:  from reading more, it seems the connector is a 232 jack.  Do you have the pin out wiring for that?  Thanks!

Hi Jeff,

 

It is an RJ-22 jack using RS-232 signalling (geek-speak). 

 

On this page of my website:

https://www.nexstars...om/Firmware.htm

Start with the article titled "How to Upgrade Hand Control Firmware - Version 4 Hand Control".  In that article, in the paragraph that starts "Updating your scope also requires the standard Hand Control RS-232 Port Cable" you will find a link to another article about that cable.  Let me know if you need more info.

 

Best regards,
Mike Swanson
Author of "The NexStar User's Guide II"
Author of "The NexStar User's Guide"
Author of "NexStar Observer List"
https://www.NexStarSite.com



#353 jeffpo

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Posted 06 September 2019 - 08:48 AM

It is an RJ-22 jack using RS-232 signalling (geek-speak). 

Thanks, Mike!  You're the man!

 

I've been reading as much of your webpages as I can.  It's a great and welcomed resource.  I'm not quite as geeky as you.  :)

I'll see if I can find the parts to make a cable this weekend, and if not, just order one.

 

Thanks again,

 

Jeff



#354 knbrown

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Posted 06 September 2019 - 12:08 PM

I have a NexStar 9.25 GPS and have updated the Version 4 hand control to 4.22 which is supposed to fix the GPS problem.  However, when I turn the GPS function on it is still setting an incorrect date and time in 2020.  Has anyone else encountered this?

 

Kevin Brown



#355 emflocater

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Posted 06 September 2019 - 03:46 PM

I have a NexStar 9.25 GPS and have updated the Version 4 hand control to 4.22 which is supposed to fix the GPS problem.  However, when I turn the GPS function on it is still setting an incorrect date and time in 2020.  Has anyone else encountered this?

 

Kevin Brown

Silly thought...did you turn the GPS back on after the Firmware update as after a Firmware update some settings revert to default and you need to go back and change them to the way you had them before. Make sure that the GPS gets linked. Keep us posted.

Cheers

Don



#356 12Bass

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Posted 07 September 2019 - 06:56 AM

Hey, I might be interested in this.  While I've never done anything like this, I'm not adverse to giving it a try.  What specifically, other than the hand control, is needed?  

What's needed is a programmer (like the TL866) along with a PLCC32 adapter and a PLCC extractor to remove the two socketed AT49F040s from the hand control board, plus the NXS 4.22 firmware binary from Celestron.  The firmware can be split into the even and odd binaries required for flashing by using the instructions here, then flashed to the two chips.  After that, press the chips back into the sockets and put the updated HC back together.


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#357 pepperonihead

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Posted 15 September 2019 - 08:27 PM

Hello folks. I just purchased a used Nexstar 8 CPC and did not know about this problem. So of course when I turned it on I had the wrong date and time etc. I upgraded the hand control from 4.1 to 4.2 and although now the date and time are correct the Lat. and Long. is sure as heck not Hawaii where I am. So rather then continuing to mess with it I purchased one of the Nexstar+ hand controls on ebay and it reads like this:

HC : NXS 5.29.6225

MC : 5.14   5.14

Is this hand control going to fix the GPS rollover issues or will I need to use Celestron CFM to upgrade it once I get it? 

I kind of like the idea of having two hand controls in the even one fails so I not a big deal that I purchased another one. Hopefully the 4.2 version will correct itself after that Oct. date.  



#358 Michael_Swanson

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Posted 15 September 2019 - 08:33 PM

Hello folks. I just purchased a used Nexstar 8 CPC and did not know about this problem. So of course when I turned it on I had the wrong date and time etc. I upgraded the hand control from 4.1 to 4.2 and although now the date and time are correct the Lat. and Long. is sure as heck not Hawaii where I am. So rather then continuing to mess with it I purchased one of the Nexstar+ hand controls on ebay and it reads like this:

HC : NXS 5.29.6225

MC : 5.14   5.14

Is this hand control going to fix the GPS rollover issues or will I need to use Celestron CFM to upgrade it once I get it? 

I kind of like the idea of having two hand controls in the even one fails so I not a big deal that I purchased another one. Hopefully the 4.2 version will correct itself after that Oct. date.  

Hi,

 

The GPS rollover issue did NOT affect location data in any way.  It seems most likely that you didn't wait long enough for a GPS link. 

 

What exact version does your version 4 HC report?  The NexStar+ HC you see on eBay will need updated via CFM.

 

Instructions for upgrading the version 4 and NexStar+ HCs can be found in the articles at the bottom of this page of my website:

https://www.nexstars...om/Firmware.htm

 

Best regards,
Mike Swanson
Author of "The NexStar Users Guide II"
Author of "The NexStar Users Guide"
Author of "NexStar Observer List"
https://www.nexstarsite.com


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#359 pepperonihead

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Posted 15 September 2019 - 08:47 PM

Hi,

 

The GPS rollover issue did NOT affect location data in any way.  It seems most likely that you didn't wait long enough for a GPS link. 

I was inside the house and waited for a very long time. I have a feeling the GPS battery is shot on this. So that is another story.  

 

What exact version does your version 4 HC report?  The NexStar+ HC you see on eBay will need updated via CFM. My version 4 hand control was at version 4.21 I used the firmware update software from Celestron to upgrade it to Version 4.22. The version now reads HC 4.22 MC 5.07  5.07. 

I will take it outside tonight and see if I can get the GPS to give the proper Lat. and Long. for Hawaii. It gives the correct time and date but is showing 33 50' 41 N and 118 20' 17 W for Lat and Long when Maui is 20 48' 07 N and 156 20' 43 W. Sounds like it is giving me Torrance, Ca. Lat and long where Celestron is.  

 

 

Instructions for upgrading the version 4 and NexStar+ HCs can be found in the articles at the bottom of this page of my website:

https://www.nexstars...om/Firmware.htm

 

Best regards,
Mike Swanson
Author of "The NexStar Users Guide II"
Author of "The NexStar Users Guide"
Author of "NexStar Observer List"
https://www.nexstarsite.com



#360 mclewis1

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Posted 15 September 2019 - 08:47 PM

I'm going to guess that you might not have your time zone set correctly (the GPS won't set this).  Time zone and DST settings are political and the Celestron GPS doesn't have the additional smarts to handle all the variations, so it must be done manually. Doing a firmware upgrade would have wiped out the existing settings.

 

Yes the 5.29 xxxx firmware is not anywhere near the latest firmware version and does not have the GPS rollover fix. Follow the guidelines on Mike's website and upgrade your "new" hand controller using the latest version of the CFM utility.


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#361 pepperonihead

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Posted 15 September 2019 - 08:57 PM

I'm going to guess that you might not have your time zone set correctly (the GPS won't set this).  Time zone and DST settings are political and the Celestron GPS doesn't have the additional smarts to handle all the variations, so it must be done manually. Doing a firmware upgrade would have wiped out the existing settings.

 

Thanks, but I changed it after the upgrade to Standard time and Hawaii time zone. Still not getting the correct Lat. and Long. Like I said I am pretty sure the GPS battery is dead. I parked the telescope and turned it on to charge the GPS for two days and it is inside my house but I think it still should get a fix if the GPS is working and it is not changing Lat. and Long. 

 

Yes the 5.29 xxxx firmware is not anywhere near the latest firmware version and does not have the GPS rollover fix. Follow the guidelines on Mike's website and upgrade your "new" hand controller using the latest version of the CFM utility.

 

Yeah. As soon as I get that new hand control I will upgrade it. I downloaded the CFM and understand how it works so it should not be a problem. 

 

It appears I am going to have to turn off the GPS and enter every thing manually so I can view the stars. I don't think I will be trying to unsolder the battery and replace it nor will I send it back to Torrance to get it fixed. It was nice when I used to live in San Pedro and could drive every thing up there! Now that I live in Maui I am not going to ship stuff to be fixed and incur the ridiculous Rip off shipping prices.    



#362 Michael_Swanson

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Posted 15 September 2019 - 09:12 PM

Even if the battery is dead it should provide correct date/time/long/lat after a few minutes (once it reports it has linked) - monitor for link status in the menu item "View Time-Site".  If it never links then you likely have one of the somewhat defective GPS modules as discovered by David Craig a couple of years ago.  In this article at my website:

https://www.nexstars...nds/GPSLink.htm

read through the 3rd paragraph for more details.

 

Oh, and when you use the "quote" feature here on Cloudy Nights, please type your reply outside of the quote box to make it easier for us to find your response.

 

Best regards,
Mike Swanson
Author of "The NexStar Users Guide II"
Author of "The NexStar Users Guide"
Author of "NexStar Observer List"
https://www.nexstarsite.com


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#363 pepperonihead

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Posted 15 September 2019 - 09:47 PM

Thanks Mike. I will check on the link you provided. I have the hand control on time site now and it says GPS linking at the top. I will wait and see what happens. The person I bought it from stated that the GPS linked for her, but she has not used the scope in a long time. So I have no clue if that would be the issue or not. Shoot, I got this CPC 8 scope from her for only $500 so if the GPS is faulty it ain't gonna kill me, it was still a steal. Its clean and in good condition! I'm happy.  



#364 pepperonihead

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Posted 15 September 2019 - 10:41 PM

Wow. The GPS linked. It took about an hour but it finally linked! LOL! So now I am showing all correct info. including the Latitude and Longitude. Hopefully when I take it outside it will not take that long to link.


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#365 Michael_Swanson

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Posted 16 September 2019 - 08:23 PM

Oh yes, often times it simply won't link inside a building.

 

Best regards,
Mike Swanson
Author of "The NexStar Users Guide II"
Author of "The NexStar Users Guide"
Author of "NexStar Observer List"
https://www.nexstarsite.com



#366 jeffpo

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Posted 20 September 2019 - 10:16 PM

Well, I thought I had the firmware updated for my Nexstar 11 GPS.  The hand control reports:

HC:  NXS 4.22

MC: 4.06  4.06

 

It now reports the correct date.  But it no longer offers GPS alignment.  Is offers SkyAlign instead. 

Did I use the wrong firmware?

 

I was able to use the scope, though pointing accuracy was abysmal.  While it did okay in the southern sky, once I ventured away nothing was in the eyepiece.



#367 12Bass

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 04:42 AM

Well, I thought I had the firmware updated for my Nexstar 11 GPS.  The hand control reports:

HC:  NXS 4.22

MC: 4.06  4.06

 

It now reports the correct date.  But it no longer offers GPS alignment.  Is offers SkyAlign instead. 

Did I use the wrong firmware?

That's the most recent firmware with the GPS rollover fix.  GPS alignment was removed from v4 firmware due to a lawsuit with Meade regarding the use of north and level.  Try using Auto Two Star... the most similar alignment routine available in the newer firmware.



#368 astrovoyeur

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Posted 21 September 2019 - 08:34 AM

 

I was able to use the scope, though pointing accuracy was abysmal.  While it did okay in the southern sky, once I ventured away nothing was in the eyepiece.

I've found with my cpc, its more accurate if the OTA is level and pointing north before power up.   This will initialize the alt/az counters to 0,0 as they should be for a north horizon.   I then follow with.either a 2 star or auto sky align.  Generally speaking goto accuracy and tracking is quite a bit better than when I skip the level north before power up.    


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#369 jeffpo

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Posted 22 September 2019 - 03:44 PM

That's the most recent firmware with the GPS rollover fix.  GPS alignment was removed from v4 firmware due to a lawsuit with Meade regarding the use of north and level.  Try using Auto Two Star... the most similar alignment routine available in the newer firmware.

Well crap!  The whole reason I bought a new hand control and went through all this was to get the GPS working.  I guess that was a waste of money.

 

The Auto Two Star is the one I used.  It did okay for southern sky objects, but anywhere else was WAY off.  I must say that so far I've found my Meade LX200 quite superior to the Celeston Nexstars.



#370 jeffpo

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Posted 22 September 2019 - 03:45 PM

I've found with my cpc, its more accurate if the OTA is level and pointing north before power up.   This will initialize the alt/az counters to 0,0 as they should be for a north horizon.   I then follow with.either a 2 star or auto sky align.  Generally speaking goto accuracy and tracking is quite a bit better than when I skip the level north before power up.    

 

I'll try that next time.  Thanks.



#371 12Bass

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Posted 22 September 2019 - 07:09 PM

Well crap!  The whole reason I bought a new hand control and went through all this was to get the GPS working.  I guess that was a waste of money.

 

The Auto Two Star is the one I used.  It did okay for southern sky objects, but anywhere else was WAY off.  I must say that so far I've found my Meade LX200 quite superior to the Celeston Nexstars.

NXS 4.22 still uses the internal GPS to find the time/location, saving you the step of entering manually (my GPS module no longer works, so I just use my phone to upload GPS info via Bluetooth).  NXS 4.22 just doesn't have the original north and level GPS alignment routine (Meade is responsible for that); however, it does have a few other features that were not available in the older 1.6/2.2 firmware. 

 

Perhaps some tweaks to the alignment process might help GoTo accuracy?  My GPS 8 seems to be fairly decent putting objects within view with 4.22, though I've found it can help if I periodically update the alignment stars with objects that are in the same vicinity as my current observations.



#372 Michael_Swanson

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Posted 23 September 2019 - 02:41 AM

Well crap!  The whole reason I bought a new hand control and went through all this was to get the GPS working.  I guess that was a waste of money.

 

The Auto Two Star is the one I used.  It did okay for southern sky objects, but anywhere else was WAY off.  I must say that so far I've found my Meade LX200 quite superior to the Celeston Nexstars.

Hi Jeff,

 

You will probably find my "Hand Control Version 4 User's Guide" useful to learn the differences with this new version.  Available free here:

https://www.nexstars...com/Manuals.htm

 

Best regards,
Mike Swanson
Author of "The NexStar User's Guide II"
Author of "The NexStar User's Guide"
Author of "NexStar Observer List"
https://www.NexStarSite.com



#373 jeffpo

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Posted 23 September 2019 - 08:50 AM

NXS 4.22 just doesn't have the original north and level GPS alignment routine (Meade is responsible for that); however, it does have a few other features that were not available in the older 1.6/2.2 firmware. 

Hopefully the other features will make up for the loss of GPS alignment.  I bought this scope used in a package deal, and it has sat for a number of years.  I'm trying to get back into astronomy after a hiatus.  I'm used to using a classic Meade LX200, so the NexStar is new to me.  I was bummed to find the GPS not working during my first session because of the rollover problem.  I purchased a hand control off of Ebay because mine was too old to upgrade, but then got bummed again when I found that they had taken away the thing I was trying to get going!  Had I known that, I would have probably just stuck with my old hand control.  The scope is destined to be in an observatory I'm working on and will be on equatorial mount anyway.  I am giving it second thoughts.  The optics and mechanics aren't as good as my LX200.  But I'm still giving it a go.

 

Perhaps some tweaks to the alignment process might help GoTo accuracy?

I'm going to try a few hints others have offered, and perhaps do a three star alignment.  I know the tripod was level when I started because I used a bubble level.  I'm hoping it's not some problem with the encoders or bearings.  The previous performance was pretty bad.  Stuff was half the finder field of view away from center!

 

You will probably find my "Hand Control Version 4 User's Guide" useful to learn the differences with this new version. 

Thanks.  I've downloaded it and will give it a read.  It's all new to me as I never learned the old version.  :)  



#374 emflocater

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Posted 23 September 2019 - 11:09 AM

Hi Jeff,

 

You will probably find my "Hand Control Version 4 User's Guide" useful to learn the differences with this new version.  Available free here:

https://www.nexstars...com/Manuals.htm

 

Best regards,
Mike Swanson
Author of "The NexStar User's Guide II"
Author of "The NexStar User's Guide"
Author of "NexStar Observer List"
https://www.NexStarSite.com

Hi Mike. Question...is this Manual the most updated (other then the new GPS Fix) for my version 4 Hand Controller used on my CG5-ASGT Mount purchased in 2006?

 

Thanks.

Cheers

Don



#375 Michael_Swanson

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Posted 23 September 2019 - 08:40 PM

Hi Mike. Question...is this Manual the most updated (other then the new GPS Fix) for my version 4 Hand Controller used on my CG5-ASGT Mount purchased in 2006?

 

Thanks.

Cheers

Don

Hi Don,

 

It might help as there is commonality between GEM and alt-ax) but that guide, like my books, is specifically for the alt-az mounts.

 

Best regards,
Mike Swanson
Author of "The NexStar User's Guide II"
Author of "The NexStar User's Guide"
Author of "NexStar Observer List"
https://www.NexStarSite.com




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