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2019 Eyepiece Buyer's Guide

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#26 Starman1

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 10:26 PM

I disagree with what you said about governing the trading. But no political topic here.

Some TV eyepieces are indeed made in Mainland China. And has some relationship with Explorer Scientific before. And the ES eyepieces are made by Jinghua, and changed the name to JOC Group already.

At the very begining, they put “Made in ROC” on eyepieces. But not everyone can distinguish republic of China (ROC) and People’s Republic of China (PRC). And a lot of people think products made in China means low quality. Telling the truth, I also think that way before. Then they change it to “made in Taiwan”. But still, not every one buy it. Then they erased the word now. So, not matter they are from Taiwan, Japan or USA, they all looks same.

Does Televue cheat you? No. They indeed let the Taiwan manufacturers OEM. But they doesn’t put the term in contract saying all the work along production line must be done in Taiwan. And all the Taiwan OEM manufacturers have factories in mainland China. You know what will happen. However, the factory in mainland China is following the OEM manufacturers’ standard procedure and TV’s quality requirement. And their supplier are all the same. So no need to worry about the quality. TV is still THE TV

Businessman are greedy, no matter where are they from. They will always find some place to make cost less products and make more profit. Some super famous fashion brand even buy leathers directly from China, then stamp “Made in Italy”, and make the price hundred times more. Apple is kinda honest, but he also play the trick change the word “Made in China” to “Assemble in China” on iPhone.

Anyway, it’s age of globalization now. Why should we care about where are all these products from. And how can you tell there is no other countries are involved for one product? I have Televue NP101, Ethos, Nagler which are made in US, I also have QHY 16200, Skywatcher HEQ5 which are made in China. As long as they can made good stuff, why should I care where are they from?


Sorry to contradict you but I know for a fact that no TeleVue products are made in mainland China.
I don't know who you heard this from, but they are,simply, wrong.

Where you are right is that we shouldn't care where the products are from as long as they are of high quality and meet our personal requirements.
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#27 agmoonsolns

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 11:10 PM

P.S. I would love to visit your country, it's very beautiful. 


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#28 agmoonsolns

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 11:12 PM

Are any eyepieces still made in Germany?



#29 hongxu chen

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 11:24 PM

Sorry to contradict you but I know for a fact that no TeleVue products are made in mainland China.
I don't know who you heard this from, but they are,simply, wrong.

Where you are right is that we shouldn't care where the products are from as long as they are of high quality and meet our personal requirements.


All the plastic shell and some part of the coated lens are made in China, and part from Japan. If you come to visit China, and go to some optic market, they will tell you the details. Years ago, they even have fake TV made by real TV plastic shell and low quality lens there. This alone is enough for me to totally understand a lot of people don’t like Chinese product. It is funny that when cops go there, they are all in rush to take the fake stuff run away, and drop eyepieces here and there. Then the cleaner take all of them to trash bin. If you don’t know what is going on, you will be shocked to see some TV and other valuable eyepieces been thrown away.
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#30 hongxu chen

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 11:46 PM

P.S. I would love to visit your country, it's very beautiful.


I haven’t finished it yet, but pressed reply carelessly. you still took it eve though I deleted it just in 1 minute after I replied.
I will take you to the huge optic market here. You can buy some high quality Chinese made APO with low price. And the TAKAHASHI here is also really cheap. FSQ106 is around $4200. Even cheaper than some of the retailers in Japan. The eyepieces listed here are only the tip of iceberg. Meanwhile you can also buy some junk by high price without my guid, lol.
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#31 agmoonsolns

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Posted 16 July 2019 - 11:49 PM

I deleted it. :-) You are so fortunate to be surrounded by such a wealth of wonderful optics and great beauty. 


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#32 Starman1

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 01:10 AM

All the plastic shell and some part of the coated lens are made in China, and part from Japan. If you come to visit China, and go to some optic market, they will tell you the details. Years ago, they even have fake TV made by real TV plastic shell and low quality lens there. This alone is enough for me to totally understand a lot of people don’t like Chinese product. It is funny that when cops go there, they are all in rush to take the fake stuff run away, and drop eyepieces here and there. Then the cleaner take all of them to trash bin. If you don’t know what is going on, you will be shocked to see some TV and other valuable eyepieces been thrown away.

Ah.  Fakes.  Like fake Rolexes and fake Fendi purses.

Well, not the real products.



#33 hongxu chen

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 10:07 AM

Ah. Fakes. Like fake Rolexes and fake Fendi purses.
Well, not the real products.


Most of the people buying fake Rolex and Fendi know what they are buying, just for vanity. But the fake TV eyepieces are different. They will sell the fake ones for original price. It is scam! It looks, touches exactly same as real one. Actually, the plastic shells are leaked out from the factory who is really making for TV. The shell are exactly same as real ones. So it is really hard to tell it’s fake until you put them on your telescope. But the seller has already been disappeared by then.

As the lens, it is from high pollution industry. The manufacturers should spend a lot to process the polluted water and paying huge environmental tariff in Taiwan. So they moved all the lens factory to Mainland already. But the high level lens like FPL 53, are still bought from Japan. As I said, it is globalization age now, no need to argue where is it from. Probably they ship all the parts to Taiwan and assemble. Just like iPhone are assembled in China. But I don’t think China is capable of making iPhone alone.

Anyway, it is just one side story from the guys in market. I don’t make eyepiece. So I can not make sure my words are 100% right. I don’t have evidence to prove TV is made in China either. Just share something interesting concerning the Chinese made eyepieces.

#34 Starman1

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 10:10 AM

Not to mention, TeleVue doesn't make plastic bodied eyepieces.


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#35 hongxu chen

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 10:41 AM

Not to mention, TeleVue doesn't make plastic bodied eyepieces.

What? I thought this part I point to is made by coated plastic. Silly...
Anyway it is just one side story from the market sellers. No argument.

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Edited by hongxu chen, 17 July 2019 - 02:59 PM.


#36 Starman1

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 11:39 AM

Nope, that's anodized aluminum.



#37 skyskan

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Posted 18 July 2019 - 03:59 PM

Thanks a lot Don for the super nice guide.  It is really nice.

 

However, the discussion has taken a very strange turn. 

 

The information Don offered was very thorough and detail.  However, I am not so sure if we needed "extra truth" in addition to this very nice buyer's guide.  Also, a lot of people here already are aware of that truth.  It is just that we do not need to discuss here what we do not have to discuss here.  


Edited by skyskan, 18 July 2019 - 03:59 PM.

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#38 hongxu chen

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Posted 18 July 2019 - 04:31 PM

Thanks a lot Don for the super nice guide. It is really nice.

However, the discussion has taken a very strange turn.

The information Don offered was very thorough and detail. However, I am not so sure if we needed "extra truth" in addition to this very nice buyer's guide. Also, a lot of people here already are aware of that truth. It is just that we do not need to discuss here what we do not have to discuss here.

If you don't like it. Just ignore it.
My suggestion is do not buy any over cheap eyepieces directly from Chinese seller on eBay. Just for your own good.

Edited by hongxu chen, 19 July 2019 - 07:16 AM.

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#39 skyskan

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Posted 18 July 2019 - 04:54 PM

If you don't like it. Just ignore it.

Yes, please


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#40 dwindstr

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Posted 22 July 2019 - 09:27 PM

Actually, "SUNNY" bought Meade, not Celestron.

Celestron was bought by another Chinese company, SYNTA.  And Synta has been known to US astronomy for many years.  They distributed refractors and reflectors through Celestron even before they bought Celestron, during the years that Celestron was still making their SCT's.  There had been a relationship with Celestron for quite a while.

 

One of the most famous scopes made by Synta was the beloved "Short Tube 80mm", an F5.0 refractor made by Synta and sold under the Orion label, hence the name "Orion Short Tube Refractor".  For a short time, Celestron branded a version of this refractor, in a black tube instead of Orion's white tube.  Celestron claimed it was superior to the Orion version of the Synta OTA, because they put superior coatings on the lens after receiving them from Synta.  I don't know if this was actually true or not.  But I picked one of these scopes up for $90 as demo floor model, and mounted on top of my 8" SCT for wide field views.  People have always said it had remarkably crisp views for a (very) inexpensive achromatic refractor.  So we know about Synta.


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#41 PolyWogg

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Posted 30 July 2019 - 05:53 PM

Wow, I didn't know this list existed. Absolutely fabulous! Amazing work.

 

I was surprised though that no filters are applied (not astro filters, Excel filters). I entered my data, highlighted row 5 (the headings) all the way to the bottom of the list with all the rows highlighted, and chose DATA / SORT & FILTER / FILTER. It turned all the top of the columns into filterable categories. So if I pull down type, and choose ZOOMs only, it shows me all 34 ZOOMs in the list. I'm sure Don has a thousand different sorts and tweaks he does, just mentioning it if those not entirely familiar with Excel want to do a quick sort, or "extract", they can turn it into a drop down filterable list with a couple of clicks.

 

Now on to the astro filters list. :)

 

Paul



#42 Astro8885

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Posted 07 August 2019 - 07:57 AM

I would like to know from someone's actual experience which eyepeices are great and affordable.

#43 Starman1

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Posted 07 August 2019 - 02:29 PM

I would like to know from someone's actual experience which eyepieces are great and affordable.

lol.gif

Ask 100 astronomers and get 100 answers.

It depends on the focal length, focal ratio, type of scope, sensitivity to a whole host of aberrations, etc.

Take coma: some don't use a coma corrector in an f/4 newtonian, while others use one at f/6.

Observers differ in expectations and even what use the eyepiece gets.

 

Affordable?  What is that?  About half of all eyepieces are under $100.  Some people find $600 eyepieces easily affordable.

It depends on your disposable income and your priorities.  I've seen astronomers with $60,000 scopes and they drive a $6000 vehicle.

I've seen others with $300,000 vehicles and $1000 telescope.  Priorities.  So the definition of affordable is yours and yours alone.

And, the definition of great has an even bigger variation.

 

To be truthful, I think that unless you just go for the high end and start and end there, there is only one real way to learn what you want in eyepieces, and that is to use and/or buy a lot of them. I sure went that route (over 340 at last count, and I might have missed a few).  I wonder how much I'd have in the bank if I just started with what I ended up with.  Eek!

 

That isn't to make light of your comment, merely to point out that if what you ask were easy, we'd all have the same eyepieces.  And, as you see, the list of eyepieces is quite long, and much longer if you include all the eBay and Amazon ones straight from China.


Edited by Starman1, 07 August 2019 - 02:31 PM.

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#44 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 07 August 2019 - 02:43 PM

Actually, "SUNNY" bought Meade, not Celestron.

Celestron was bought by another Chinese company, SYNTA.  And Synta has been known to US astronomy for many years.  They distributed refractors and reflectors through Celestron even before they bought Celestron, during the years that Celestron was still making their SCT's.  There had been a relationship with Celestron for quite a while.

 

One of the most famous scopes made by Synta was the beloved "Short Tube 80mm", an F5.0 refractor made by Synta and sold under the Orion label, hence the name "Orion Short Tube Refractor".  For a short time, Celestron branded a version of this refractor, in a black tube instead of Orion's white tube.  Celestron claimed it was superior to the Orion version of the Synta OTA, because they put superior coatings on the lens after receiving them from Synta.  I don't know if this was actually true or not.  But I picked one of these scopes up for $90 as demo floor model, and mounted on top of my 8" SCT for wide field views.  People have always said it had remarkably crisp views for a (very) inexpensive achromatic refractor.  So we know about Synta.

 

 

I have an early Celestron 80 mm F/5.  Like the other Celestron 80 mm F/5 it was sold as the EQ 80 mm or something like that. It looks the same but has a metal dew shield that threads on to metal objective cell. The later versions have plastic cells like the Orion.

 

Jon



#45 Napp

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Posted 07 August 2019 - 02:45 PM

Astro8885, Don answered your question above much better than I can.  I would recommend hanging out with your local astronomy club.  At observing sessions and star parties you can check out the eyepieces that others are using.  See what you like and check if they fit your budget.  It’s a way to avoid buying a lot of eyepieces.



#46 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 07 August 2019 - 02:53 PM

To be truthful, I think that unless you just go for the high end and start and end there, there is only one real way to learn what you want in eyepieces, and that is to use and/or buy a lot of them. I sure went that route (over 340 at last count, and I might have missed a few).  I wonder how much I'd have in the bank if I just started with what I ended up with.  Eek!

 

 

Don:

 

When you started, what you have now didn't exist. But more importantly,  if you had started at the top, the vast knowledge you have now would not exist.  There are choices at the top just as there are at every price point and until one has the experience to make the right choice for themselves, starting at the top is just a way to make bigger mistakes.

 

You can't buy your way to knowledge and experience but once you have it, you can share it.

 

Thank you for sharing it, for making this list.

 

bow.gif

 

Jon


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#47 Gravity Wave

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Posted 07 August 2019 - 05:55 PM

Don.  Thank you for the guide.  Your passion shines through 


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#48 PolyWogg

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Posted 12 August 2019 - 09:34 AM

To be truthful, I think that unless you just go for the high end and start and end there, there is only one real way to learn what you want in eyepieces, and that is to use and/or buy a lot of them. I sure went that route (over 340 at last count, and I might have missed a few).  I wonder how much I'd have in the bank if I just started with what I ended up with.  Eek!

We joke in our club when we're doing some sidewalk astronomy that we prefer to have "minimum 3 people" since "Three people set up with scopes are a hobby club, while one person is just some weirdo". We also then started to calculate the level of weirdness with other variables -- size of aperture, number of scopes. I think we need a whole new DSM for people who have used / tried over 300 EPs! How many filters?

 

P.



#49 Starman1

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Posted 12 August 2019 - 10:57 AM

Filters?  Counting colored filters, well over 100.

Maybe 60-70 of them nebula filters, and I'm not counting exotic minus violet or notch filters.

 

And, BTW, that eyepiece count doesn't include tons of them I've borrowed over the years but never owned.



#50 azure1961p

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Posted 24 August 2019 - 10:25 AM

It'd be great , but honestly this is already beyond fantastic, to list the countries of origin for fabrication.

 

Comprehensive though Don.

 

Pete




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