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Tariff and binocular sales

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#51 dd61999

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Posted 16 May 2019 - 09:55 AM

It happens that I know a bit of economics.

 

Sometime taxes / state intervention are good - market becomes more efficient: this situation is called market failure. Pollution (externality) is a typical example. Another example is moral hazard / adverse selection in many insurance markets (you americans are crazy to have such an health system: Germany pays half of what you pay in term of % GDP and has a better output - I'm talking purely in terms of efficiency, what you get for what you pay).

 

But a trade-war is not a market failure. There's no efficiency gain for the average Joe in having tariffs and taxes with China. The only people who gains are the stakeholders of firms protected by the tariffs. But the damage to the economy will be larger than the gains of the people who get protected.

 

True, there's the level the playing-field argument (which is not an argument for efficiency, the average Joe is still worst-off, but a short-term justification to force your opponent to "play fair game"). But if this is the reason of the tariffs, then tariffs should be targeted against the specific sectors where the playing field is not levelled. That's not the case with the broadband tariff-war you President has started. Easy example, Mr. Trump wants to put tariffs against EU car makers. It's very difficult to say that EU car-makers pay their employees lower wages or have less stringent anti-pollution requirements (indeed labor costs is much higher in Europe).

I have to disagree, tariffs are never a good thing. It’s basic economics that can be read in “economics in one lesson”  

 

which you can get your free copy here

 

https://fee.org/medi...inonelesson.pdf


 

#52 dd61999

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Posted 16 May 2019 - 09:56 AM

So ... is America winning yet?

No, because China holds all the cards. The United States has little to leverage


 

#53 MartinPond

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Posted 16 May 2019 - 10:25 AM

No, because China holds all the cards. The United States has little to leverage

 

Technically, China could sustain more short-term damage,

but they are already setting up other sources and buyers,

and their president is a real businessman with lifetime job.

 

Meanwhile, the US Trump supporters are already suffering trade and weather

before this.   I have witnessed incredible price drops on pasta, and even 

premium cuts of pork are at stunning low prices.  And then the floods

hit the farmers silos that were waiting for a turnaround. Outside of pricing,

China has been redirecting   demand already for a year. 

If they sit out the next US debt auction.....it will be a swooning Wall St.

 

Back to optics:  for a year, be on the watch cheapened products. 

In the res=cessions and inflation of the 70s-80s, Japan

shipped a lot of molded plastic product outsourced to HongKong

and Korea. 


Edited by MartinPond, 16 May 2019 - 10:29 AM.

 

#54 dd61999

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Posted 16 May 2019 - 11:43 AM

Technically, China could sustain more short-term damage,

but they are already setting up other sources and buyers,

and their president is a real businessman with lifetime job.

 

Meanwhile, the US Trump supporters are already suffering trade and weather

before this.   I have witnessed incredible price drops on pasta, and even 

premium cuts of pork are at stunning low prices.  And then the floods

hit the farmers silos that were waiting for a turnaround. Outside of pricing,

China has been redirecting   demand already for a year. 

If they sit out the next US debt auction.....it will be a swooning Wall St.

 

Back to optics:  for a year, be on the watch cheapened products. 

In the res=cessions and inflation of the 70s-80s, Japan

shipped a lot of molded plastic product outsourced to HongKong

and Korea. 

Not only sit out the auction, but call in the debt. Trump just might land up appeasing the Chinese. Imagine that!


 

#55 Cali

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Posted 16 May 2019 - 01:06 PM

The Harmonized Tariff Schedule (2019 Revision 5) was just released by the U.S. International Trade Commission.

 

I see no tariffs on binoculars or lenses.

 

Optical telescopes have a tariff of  8%.

 

The upcoming Schedule (2019 Revision 6) is the one we will all be interested in.

 

- Cal


Edited by Cali, 16 May 2019 - 04:13 PM.

 

#56 kellyvictoria

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Posted 16 May 2019 - 03:47 PM

I have to disagree, tariffs are never a good thing. It’s basic economics that can be read in “economics in one lesson”  

 

which you can get your free copy here

 

https://fee.org/medi...inonelesson.pdf

It worked quite well for China. That is partially how they have come so far, while we let them do it.

I don't think the U.S. should have implemented tariffs. I am just disagreeing with your statement.   


 

#57 dd61999

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Posted 16 May 2019 - 05:01 PM

It worked quite well for China. That is partially how they have come so far, while we let them do it.

I don't think the U.S. should have implemented tariffs. I am just disagreeing with your statement.   

China became an economic super power because of economic freedoms in their trade zones, not because of tariffs. They get away with tariffs because of the other benefits they provide

 

the reason a large portion of my clients businesses offshore their production is because of those freedoms. That you don’t have in the U.S. 


 

#58 Astrojedi

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Posted 16 May 2019 - 05:33 PM

China's success is not due to tariffs but rather free trade and its continued and significant investment in manufacturing and industry. Tariffs almost always are a drag on economic growth. 

 

US should be looking forward not backward. US has been an economic leader because we "lead" through risk taking and innovation. Imposing tariffs to try and prop up industries that are not economically viable is going backwards. It only benefits those special interests. No amount of tariffs can impact jobs or US wages. Actually they do the opposite - they hurt free trade which will eventually hurt US exports which will hurt US jobs and wages more.

 

Value is created from free trade via specialization and by being able to sell what you are good at to a global market and by being able to buy (at a lower cost) what others are good at and most efficient at producing. This way you increase your wages and at the same time increase your buying power hence raising your standard of living.

 

Ultimately what these tariffs will do is increase the cost of goods and impact those that are most vulnerable. It is a dangerous and futile game - purely to rally a voter base for 2020.


Edited by Astrojedi, 16 May 2019 - 05:43 PM.

 

#59 SandyHouTex

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Posted 16 May 2019 - 08:46 PM

I agree. But the point is: should Americans have access to cheap Chinese goods or not?

 

Or should tariffs drive the Chinese out and force Americans to buy SnapOn quality products? It would create more American jobs but price ratchets out of the range some Americans can afford.

 

Should amateurs have access to cheap Chinese scopes or not? Or should we force Americans to buy AstroPhysics quality scopes? 

 

 Americans need to have that discussion.

 

Clouding the issue with the lie,  ‘China is paying billions of dollars in tariffs to the US Treasury’ is a propaganda lie. Not helpful.

 

Tariff taxes force Americans to pay billions of tariff dollars into the US Treasury.

The tariffs will not prevent Americans from buying Chinese goods, and no one will be forced to buy only American made items.  Where did you come up with this drivel?


 

#60 Cali

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Posted 16 May 2019 - 09:18 PM

The tariffs will not prevent Americans from buying Chinese goods, and no one will be forced to buy only American made items.  Where did you come up with this drivel?

Americans will have no choice but to buy certain goods from China because there are no close substitutes with regard to manufacturers. Think Telescopes.

 

Sneakers Too.

 

- Cal


Edited by Cali, 16 May 2019 - 10:22 PM.

 

#61 Erik Bakker

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Posted 17 May 2019 - 01:23 AM

Much has been discussed here. Since this is the binoculars forum, this thread has more than served its purpose and come to an end.

 

Thank you.


 


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