Jump to content

  •  

CNers have asked about a donation box for Cloudy Nights over the years, so here you go. Donation is not required by any means, so please enjoy your stay.

Photo

Best option for LIVE solar viewing

  • Please log in to reply
11 replies to this topic

#1 crazyqban

crazyqban

    Mercury-Atlas

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 2662
  • Joined: 16 Dec 2008
  • Loc: Miami, Florida

Posted 24 May 2019 - 10:20 PM

Hello, I have been doing some solar outreach for a little while with my 90mm DS Coronado SolarMax II but it seems that the general public has trouble seeing the Sun. "I only see red" is a usual comment and trying to explain what they are looking for is just too much time. What would a good way to provide a live view of the sun on a screen be? What would be a good camera to provide live view like a Mallincam does? I tried searching the forum but nothing really came up so any help would be appreciated. BTW, the scope rides on a Celestron CGEM mount.


Edited by crazyqban, 24 May 2019 - 10:21 PM.


#2 Bob4BVM

Bob4BVM

    Surveyor 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 1887
  • Joined: 23 Mar 2015
  • Loc: W. Oregon

Posted 25 May 2019 - 01:55 AM

Hello, I have been doing some solar outreach for a little while with my 90mm DS Coronado SolarMax II but it seems that the general public has trouble seeing the Sun. "I only see red" is a usual comment and trying to explain what they are looking for is just too much time. What would a good way to provide a live view of the sun on a screen be? What would be a good camera to provide live view like a Mallincam does? I tried searching the forum but nothing really came up so any help would be appreciated. BTW, the scope rides on a Celestron CGEM mount.

Loose the camera stuff. Simple solar projection to a white paper board or onto ground glass is the way to go for this. Almost any scope or even binocs will form a nice solar image, size depends on distance to screen.

CS

Bob



#3 sg6

sg6

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 5479
  • Joined: 14 Feb 2010
  • Loc: Norfolk, UK.

Posted 25 May 2019 - 02:26 AM

I think that the sun is going to be a "problem".

You can show the sun as a whole but then the scale is such that detail like the granularity is lost. That seems to need either imaging and processing or you pick a small bit and try to drag it out. Seeing a patch of the sun's surface is not impressive.

 

The one time I saw such as you want was at a show and the person was showing how to image the sun. They picked a "huge" flare on the edge. Catch was it was a huge flare in reality but at the distance of the sun it looked close to insignificant. They had to zoom in on that portion of the sun.

 

In angular terms the solar events are small, and so what people see is small. Experience has been that a sunspot in a Herschel wedge with continium filter through an 80ED, even an achro, has greater impact.

 

From events that have solar scopes and white light scopes I do find that people are (unfortunately) slightly unimpressed with a Ha solar scope. As you say "It is red". To get the benefit of a Ha solar scope needs more then just pointing one at the sun.

 

Another factor is that 1 scope may be difficult, too much to do. Image the sun and there is a flare, to bring out that flare someone needs to center and zoom in. You will find it difficult to talk about the initial solar image then stop, center the flare, and then carry on. Also the flare (narrow field) needs to remain centered. One outreach I visit uses 3 scopes, so while 1 is the subject the others are acquiring the next target and having it ready. Nice continuous flow.

 

I do wonder if this is a case of an Ha solar scope impresses us, but to the general public it is just a red image?



#4 MalVeauX

MalVeauX

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 5314
  • Joined: 25 Feb 2016
  • Loc: Florida

Posted 25 May 2019 - 06:45 AM



Hello, I have been doing some solar outreach for a little while with my 90mm DS Coronado SolarMax II but it seems that the general public has trouble seeing the Sun. "I only see red" is a usual comment and trying to explain what they are looking for is just too much time. What would a good way to provide a live view of the sun on a screen be? What would be a good camera to provide live view like a Mallincam does? I tried searching the forum but nothing really came up so any help would be appreciated. BTW, the scope rides on a Celestron CGEM mount.

Heya,

 

Any monochrome camera will do the job, but to keep it simple, I would use the largest sensor you can afford to allow for a wider FOV. Take a look at cameras like the ASI178MM or ASI183MM, ASI290MM and ASI174MM, or the sensors equivalent in other camera maker's. They'll all do the job for live streaming view. Just depends on the FOV you want to have.

 

You'll be able to maniuplate real time histogram, gamma, etc, and use flat calibration overlay in FireCapture to make it a great image just to see on the screen. Your 90mm DS will do a great job. As long as seeing is decent, they will easily see surface spicule bundles, any active regions, spicules on the limb, prominences, filaments, etc.

 

This is similar to what you'd see (this is from an 80mm), granted this is a little processed, but it's not far from how the video looked. It's just a lot easier to look at the sun on camera, because B&W contrast is superior to our poor red sensitivity in our eyes.

 

46935054825_5532cb4cba_o.jpg

 

Very best,


Edited by MalVeauX, 25 May 2019 - 06:47 AM.

  • George Bailey and Alien Observatory like this

#5 barbarosa

barbarosa

    Vanguard

  • -----
  • Posts: 2140
  • Joined: 11 Apr 2010
  • Loc: 139 miles W of the Awahnee Hotel

Posted 25 May 2019 - 11:45 AM

I've watched a few solar broadcasts on the Night Skies Network both Ha and white light. The fellows with Ha scopes put on good shows using many different cameras, CCD and CMOS, 1/3" to >4/3". used, standard definition to better than UHD (4k). 

 

If you have or want to get a color camera you can avoid the red problem with software such as SharpCap (free version or Pro) that gives you options to see the image in monochrome (red, green or blue channel as mono) or full output as mono. 

 

Use the field of view calculator to see how the sun will look with different sensors at ASTRONOMY TOOLS .  Any of the cameras mentioned earlier in the thread will give you a good image whether on a small display at the scope or a 70" display on the wall.



#6 crazyqban

crazyqban

    Mercury-Atlas

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 2662
  • Joined: 16 Dec 2008
  • Loc: Miami, Florida

Posted 27 May 2019 - 08:23 PM

Thanks everyone. I think a couple of friends have some monochrome cameras. I guess I will be experimenting.



#7 crazyqban

crazyqban

    Mercury-Atlas

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 2662
  • Joined: 16 Dec 2008
  • Loc: Miami, Florida

Posted 30 May 2019 - 07:05 PM

Heya,

 

Any monochrome camera will do the job, but to keep it simple, I would use the largest sensor you can afford to allow for a wider FOV. Take a look at cameras like the ASI178MM or ASI183MM, ASI290MM and ASI174MM, or the sensors equivalent in other camera maker's. They'll all do the job for live streaming view. Just depends on the FOV you want to have.

 

You'll be able to maniuplate real time histogram, gamma, etc, and use flat calibration overlay in FireCapture to make it a great image just to see on the screen. Your 90mm DS will do a great job. As long as seeing is decent, they will easily see surface spicule bundles, any active regions, spicules on the limb, prominences, filaments, etc.

 

This is similar to what you'd see (this is from an 80mm), granted this is a little processed, but it's not far from how the video looked. It's just a lot easier to look at the sun on camera, because B&W contrast is superior to our poor red sensitivity in our eyes.

 

 

 

Very best,

Marty, with which camera will I be able to get a full disc image with my scope? Thanks.



#8 HxPI

HxPI

    Apollo

  • -----
  • Posts: 1439
  • Joined: 05 Sep 2013
  • Loc: Virginia Beach, VA

Posted 30 May 2019 - 08:45 PM

I do solar outreach with a dual scope on alt/Az mount setup. Lunt 80 for Ha and ES80 with Baader Herschel Wedge for WL. I use ASI183MM with Antares 1.5x Barlow for Ha and ASI183MC with Televue 2x Barlow for WL. Set square ROI for both in SharpCap. A 15” MBP in hooded laptop case mounted on tripod provides for viewing and recording. This setup is about as good as I can make it for outreach and gets mostly full disc. The high resolution cameras allow for some magnification for details, seeing permitting.

 

I used AstronomyTools.com to figure out the best combination of camera/Barlow for each scope. It mostly matches what will show in real world experience.


Edited by HxPI, 30 May 2019 - 09:00 PM.


#9 crazyqban

crazyqban

    Mercury-Atlas

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 2662
  • Joined: 16 Dec 2008
  • Loc: Miami, Florida

Posted 30 May 2019 - 09:01 PM

Thanks HxPI, I will check out AstronomyTools.com. Your setup sounds similar to what I am putting together.



#10 crazyqban

crazyqban

    Mercury-Atlas

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 2662
  • Joined: 16 Dec 2008
  • Loc: Miami, Florida

Posted 30 May 2019 - 09:03 PM

Oh, just went to AstronomyTools.com and it seems to no longer be up. frown.gif



#11 crazyqban

crazyqban

    Mercury-Atlas

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 2662
  • Joined: 16 Dec 2008
  • Loc: Miami, Florida

Posted 30 May 2019 - 09:03 PM

Nevermind, found it. It is... https://astronomy.tools/



#12 crazyqban

crazyqban

    Mercury-Atlas

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 2662
  • Joined: 16 Dec 2008
  • Loc: Miami, Florida

Posted 31 May 2019 - 10:03 AM

Based on the info that I entered it looks like I will be able to get a full disk using the ASI183MM.

Attached Thumbnails

  • astronomy_tools_fov.png



CNers have asked about a donation box for Cloudy Nights over the years, so here you go. Donation is not required by any means, so please enjoy your stay.


Recent Topics






Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics