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Is the Ethos really the best there is?

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#1 rkelley8493

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 01:07 PM

The Ethos has long been praised for its excellence in the eyepiece division, but is it really the best there is out there? I've had the opportunity to view through a few of them, and they are in fact excellent. However, *in my humble opinion*, I don't think they are the best eyepieces available in today's market, with an exception of the 21. I compared the 17 & 13 Ethos with the 17 & 12 Explore Sci 92, and the winner for me was the 92's. The 17 Ethos may have had the edge in edge performance [no pun intended], but overall winner for me was the 17mm 92. Hard to compete with an eyepiece that has an eye lens the size of a can of snuff. In a head to head with the 14mm Explore Sci 100 & 13mm Ethos, the performance was almost identical, but personal preference with the ergonomics made me favor the ES 14mm. Field of view aside, in focal lengths under 10mm, the TeleVue Delos series is one of the best 1.25" barrel eyepieces, as so are the Pentax XW's. Eye relief, sharpness, contrast, and viewing comfort put these eyepieces on the top tier. I haven't had a chance to put the 4.7 Ethos SX in a head to head with the 4.5 Delos & 5 XW, but that will happen soon, so stay tuned for that comparison. 

All that being said, what eyepieces do you think are the best out there? Do you think it's the Ethos, or do you think others are better? What makes them the best in your opinion?

 

Side note - I am not bashing TeleVue or the Ethos at all. I think they are amazing eyepieces! Definitely one of the best series out there. But in my personal preference, I like some of the other options out there a little more.  


Edited by rkelley8493, 30 May 2019 - 03:57 PM.

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#2 zohsix

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 01:25 PM

Yep, it is.  See, everyone has an opinion.

 

Dan


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#3 REC

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 01:26 PM

The Ethos has long been praised for its excellence in the eyepiece division, but is it really the best there is out there? I've had the opportunity to view through a few of them, and they are in fact excellent. However, *in my humble opinion*, I don't think they are the best eyepieces available in today's market, with an exception of the 21. I compared the 17 & 13 Ethos with the 17 & 12 Explore Sci 92, and the winner was the 92's. The 17 Ethos may have had the edge in edge performance [no pun intended], but overall winner for me was the 17mm 92. Hard to compete with an eyepiece that has an eye lens the size of a can of snuff. In a head to head with the 14mm Explore Sci 100 & 13mm Ethos, the performance was almost identical, but personal preference with the ergonomics made me favor the ES 14mm. Field of view aside, in focal lengths under 10mm, the TeleVue Delos series is one of the best 1.25" barrel eyepieces, as so are the Pentax XW's. Eye relief, sharpness, contrast, and viewing comfort put these eyepieces on the top tier. I haven't had a chance to put the 4.7 Ethos SX in a head to head with the 4.5 Delos & 5 XW, but that will happen soon, so stay tuned for that comparison. 

All that being said, what eyepieces do you think are the best out there? Do you think it's the Ethos, or do you think others are better? What makes them the best in your opinion?

 

Side note - I am not bashing TeleVue or the Ethos at all. I think they are amazing eyepieces! Definitely one of the best series ever made. But in my personal preference, I like some of the other options out there a little more.  

So out of all your great eyepieces you have in your tool box, are you saying that the bottom line best of the best is your ES 17mm 92*



#4 rkelley8493

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 01:27 PM

Holy Jeepers Creepers, this one's gonna hit some fans lol. step.gif

That's why I emphasized "personal preference" and "my humble opinion" because nobody's opinion is a wrong opinion. What do you think? Do you like others better? How does the Nikon HW compare?


Edited by rkelley8493, 30 May 2019 - 01:39 PM.

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#5 rkelley8493

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 01:34 PM

So out of all your great eyepieces you have in your tool box, are you saying that the bottom line best of the best is your ES 17mm 92*

I wouldn't use the word "best" but I would say it's the one I like to use the most, next to the 21 Ethos. I just liked the 12mm & 17mm 92's more than the 13 & 17 Ethos. Personal preference..


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#6 rkelley8493

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 01:38 PM

Yep, it is.  See, everyone has an opinion.

 

Dan

How about your shorter focal length eyepieces? Did you prefer the Delos over the Ethos under 13mm?



#7 havasman

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 01:42 PM

The answer to this and all these many similar questions is about the same: It depends.

on what you like

on what you want to do

on your budget

on what you're mating it with

on many things!


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#8 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 01:44 PM

My two cents

 

There is no one best eyepiece line.  It's a question of priorities .

 

I had both the 14 mm and 20 mm ES 100s . I found them less sharp at the edge in my F/5 scopes than my Naglers , the field was not visible in a single glance, I had to peek to see edge.  As a result I kept 12 mm , 16 mm and 20 mm Naglers,  it was a toss up,  the wider field versus the better field. 

 

Through good fortune I was able to purchase the 21 mm,  13 mm and 8 mm Ethos's.  They were sharp-sharp across the field and I could take in the entire view.  For me,  while subtle , those were important differences and the two Ethos's replaced the other 5.

 

Priorities:

 

I value edge correction , I use a Paracorr at F/5.5, my primary refractor is the NP-101, no field curvature.  I have owned my 12.5 inch F/4.06 for nearly 20 years..  Those two scopes are demanding of eyepieces.  My eyes have no astigmatism , no distance correction. 

 

If I had slower scopes , if I wasn't using coma correctors on my fast scopes, if I had different eyes,  I might have different priorities.  If I weren't a 100% star Hopper spending over 100 nights a year under dark skies with some pretty big scopes,  I might have different priorities. 

 

Jon


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#9 russell23

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 01:49 PM

Personal preferences.  I don’t think any eyepiece is the best.  It depends on scope and observing target.


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#10 Magnetic Field

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:01 PM

The Ethos has long been praised for its excellence in the eyepiece division, but is it really the best there is out there? I've had the opportunity to view through a few of them, and they are in fact excellent. However, *in my humble opinion*, I don't think they are the best eyepieces available in today's market, with an exception of the 21. I compared the 17 & 13 Ethos with the 17 & 12 Explore Sci 92, and the winner for me was the 92's. The 17 Ethos may have had the edge in edge performance [no pun intended], but overall winner for me was the 17mm 92. Hard to compete with an eyepiece that has an eye lens the size of a can of snuff. In a head to head with the 14mm Explore Sci 100 & 13mm Ethos, the performance was almost identical, but personal preference with the ergonomics made me favor the ES 14mm. Field of view aside, in focal lengths under 10mm, the TeleVue Delos series is one of the best 1.25" barrel eyepieces, as so are the Pentax XW's. Eye relief, sharpness, contrast, and viewing comfort put these eyepieces on the top tier. I haven't had a chance to put the 4.7 Ethos SX in a head to head with the 4.5 Delos & 5 XW, but that will happen soon, so stay tuned for that comparison. 

All that being said, what eyepieces do you think are the best out there? Do you think it's the Ethos, or do you think others are better? What makes them the best in your opinion?

 

Side note - I am not bashing TeleVue or the Ethos at all. I think they are amazing eyepieces! Definitely one of the best series ever made. But in my personal preference, I like some of the other options out there a little more.  

Out of interest:

 

What telescope did you test it with?



#11 Procyon

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:06 PM

That's why I emphasized "personal preference" and "my humble opinion" because nobody's opinion is a wrong opinion. What do you think? Do you like others better? How does the Nikon HW compare?


Tried the 6, 8, 10 & 13mm Ethos, they seemed great but had difficulty with eye placement so I sold them all. Maybe I'm an Alien.


Edited by Procyon, 30 May 2019 - 02:09 PM.

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#12 russell23

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:14 PM

Tried the 6, 8, 10 & 13mm Ethos, they seemed great but had difficulty with eye placement so I sold them all. Maybe I'm an Alien.

I found the Ethos and clones to be more field than I liked.  You are not an Alien.  My favorite eyepieces are the Morpheus and DeLite's.  But I would not say that any eyepiece is the "best" because there are too many factors.


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#13 zohsix

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:23 PM

RKelly,

 

I do prefer the Delos in the shorter focal lengths, used mainly for moon and planets.  I am very happy with both the Delos and Ethos line, but for different targets.  I also like my Brandon pairs in my binoviwer for moon and planets.  I couldn't see using just one line for everything.

 

Dan


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#14 RadioAstronomer

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:29 PM

The best wide field eyepiece? Probably yes.

The best planetary eyepiece? Definitively not: These would be ZAOs, TMB Monocentrics, XOs, Tak TOE..


Edited by RadioAstronomer, 30 May 2019 - 02:29 PM.

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#15 turtle86

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:37 PM

The Ethos has long been praised for its excellence in the eyepiece division, but is it really the best there is out there? I've had the opportunity to view through a few of them, and they are in fact excellent. However, *in my humble opinion*, I don't think they are the best eyepieces available in today's market, with an exception of the 21. I compared the 17 & 13 Ethos with the 17 & 12 Explore Sci 92, and the winner for me was the 92's. The 17 Ethos may have had the edge in edge performance [no pun intended], but overall winner for me was the 17mm 92. Hard to compete with an eyepiece that has an eye lens the size of a can of snuff. In a head to head with the 14mm Explore Sci 100 & 13mm Ethos, the performance was almost identical, but personal preference with the ergonomics made me favor the ES 14mm. Field of view aside, in focal lengths under 10mm, the TeleVue Delos series is one of the best 1.25" barrel eyepieces, as so are the Pentax XW's. Eye relief, sharpness, contrast, and viewing comfort put these eyepieces on the top tier. I haven't had a chance to put the 4.7 Ethos SX in a head to head with the 4.5 Delos & 5 XW, but that will happen soon, so stay tuned for that comparison. 

All that being said, what eyepieces do you think are the best out there? Do you think it's the Ethos, or do you think others are better? What makes them the best in your opinion?

 

Side note - I am not bashing TeleVue or the Ethos at all. I think they are amazing eyepieces! Definitely one of the best series ever made. But in my personal preference, I like some of the other options out there a little more.  

 

Don't think it's really possible to say which eyepieces are "the best."  We all have different preferences, scopes and priorities.  For my purposes, the Ethos are excellent all-round performers for both planets and deep sky, and I find that all of them perform well and are a pleasure to use in all of my scopes. 


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#16 Esso2112

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:42 PM

Definitely a preference rather than best. I love my Ethos (3.7, 10, & 17), but they are not the best in light throughput or contrast. ZAO, TMB supermono, Tak .965 ortho’s all beat the Ethos in that regard.

Televue are the Cadillac of eyepieces, but they are not a Ferrari, Porsche, or other high end sports car. They are comfortable and work very well, but sometimes you need more.
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#17 ShaulaB

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:42 PM

Last year, I had the chance to compare an Ethos with a Takahashi eyepiece in a high end refractor. I preferred the view of a Summer open cluster with the Tak. This is just my humble opinion, your mileage may vary.

 

I am not a fan of having to move my head back-and-forth, side-to-side, and change tilt angle to get the view. The eyepiece should be my servant. I should not have to be the eyepiece's servant. Just my preferences and opinion. Please buy eyepieces that you enjoy using.


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#18 rkelley8493

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:45 PM

Out of interest:

 

What telescope did you test it with?

Stellarvue 130mm Apo-refractor, my primary scope. 



#19 Starman1

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:53 PM

The Ethos has long been praised for its excellence in the eyepiece division, but is it really the best there is out there? I've had the opportunity to view through a few of them, and they are in fact excellent. However, *in my humble opinion*, I don't think they are the best eyepieces available in today's market, with an exception of the 21. I compared the 17 & 13 Ethos with the 17 & 12 Explore Sci 92, and the winner for me was the 92's. The 17 Ethos may have had the edge in edge performance [no pun intended], but overall winner for me was the 17mm 92. Hard to compete with an eyepiece that has an eye lens the size of a can of snuff. In a head to head with the 14mm Explore Sci 100 & 13mm Ethos, the performance was almost identical, but personal preference with the ergonomics made me favor the ES 14mm. Field of view aside, in focal lengths under 10mm, the TeleVue Delos series is one of the best 1.25" barrel eyepieces, as so are the Pentax XW's. Eye relief, sharpness, contrast, and viewing comfort put these eyepieces on the top tier. I haven't had a chance to put the 4.7 Ethos SX in a head to head with the 4.5 Delos & 5 XW, but that will happen soon, so stay tuned for that comparison. 

All that being said, what eyepieces do you think are the best out there? Do you think it's the Ethos, or do you think others are better? What makes them the best in your opinion?

 

Side note - I am not bashing TeleVue or the Ethos at all. I think they are amazing eyepieces! Definitely one of the best series ever made. But in my personal preference, I like some of the other options out there a little more.  

We all have personal preferences.

My criteria are easy:

--not too much eye relief.  I prefer an eyepiece I don't casually drift too close to.  If it has a long eye relief, that's OK if the eyecup comes up nice and high (e.g. 22mm Nagler).

--as wide a field as possible.  100° is better than 90°.  90° is better than 80°, etc.

--zero noticeable barrel distortion of angular magnification distortion

--no noticeable astigmatism in the outer field at f/5 all the way to the field stop.

--no noticeable edge of field brightness

--good contrast

--no noticeable spherical aberration of the exit pupil, i.e. in tolerances for my seated viewing style.

--no noticeable internal reflections

--no noticeable external reflections.

--no noticeable field curvature

 

With those criteria, certain eyepieces are ruled out, which includes Pentax XWs, ES 92s, ES120, ES100s, APM 100s, etc.

 

I could suggest ways to improve the Ethos.  They are not perfect.  Perhaps the Nikon NAV-HWs qualify for a best label, but they are not optimizable in a Paracorr II, which I find essential in an f/5 scope.

 

Note: I rarely view planets or the Moon.  My main interest is galaxies and planetary nebulae.

If the eyepieces are OK on planets and moon, that's fine with me.

I do not have a driven scope, so I let objects drift almost from edge to edge.

My primary scope is a 12.5" f/5 newtonian.


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#20 Starman1

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:55 PM

Tried the 6, 8, 10 & 13mm Ethos, they seemed great but had difficulty with eye placement so I sold them all. Maybe I'm an Alien.

Odd you had issues with the 8mm Ethos, which is the eyepiece I find easiest to use of all eyepieces I've ever used

(though I haven't used the Apollo 11 eyepiece yet).


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#21 Tank

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 02:58 PM

IMHO

when were dealing with the TOP lines of WF EPs

there are small difference which make them better for certain individuals

personal preference is what i come up with

for instance even comparing say the 17 Ethos Vs ES 17 92

ER - 17 Ethos has less ER some people will like this because its easier to hold the view however people with glasses may say otherwise

WT - Ethos is lighter but some really dont care

ME i really like he 20mm ER since it give more immersive/easier to take in entire FOV im also a fan of the XW,Delos etc just these have smaller FOVs than the 92s


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#22 Procyon

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 03:01 PM

Odd you had issues with the 8mm Ethos, which is the eyepiece I find easiest to use of all eyepieces I've ever used
(though I haven't used the Apollo 11 eyepiece yet).


The 8 and 10 were not bad for eye placement actually. ER felt less than 15, can't remember.

#23 astrophile

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 03:31 PM

“Perhaps the Nikon NAV-HWs qualify for a best label, but they are not optimizable in a Paracorr II, which I find essential in an f/5 scope.”

My NAV-HW 12.5 seems optimizable in my Paracorr 2. Between positions E-F. Position H with the EIC-10 screwed in.
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#24 Jeff Morgan

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 03:47 PM

I would be reluctant to compare eyepieces of different AFOV.

 

People tend to gravitate towards a preferred AFOV, so "competitors" outside that class aren't really competitors are they? Niche or role players perhaps.

 

Clearing that hurdle, since you are interested in the 100 degree class - who has directly compared them all?

 

Given all of that, I have compared the 13 Ethos to the 14 Explore Scientific. I liked the Ethos better. A bit nicer view (correction and contrast) and physically smaller and lighter (by a small bit). But they were closer than I expected them to be.

 

I did note the thread on the Nikon entry in the 100 degree class. Quite a winner apparently. But since I prefer the 70 degree class, more of a curiosity to me than an active interest.


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#25 25585

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 04:36 PM

12 & 17mm, ES92s FTW. One day I hope for a 20s.

 

Until then Orion LHD 80° & Baader Morpheus 76° are my most WA, after the 92s.

 

100° AFoV is a number good for sales. Seeing all 92° edge to edge (or any AFOV I pay for), easily, aberration free, is what counts.  


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