46 replies to this topic

[Kasmos]

I've had a 12.5mm Goto eyepiece for 40 years, but I never thought I'd have the chance to score (can't help the pun) a Goto Telescope.

So when one showed up on the Goodwill auction site and was fairly local (approx. 85 miles away), I took a chance with a bid.

I say chance since what was shown in the auction was a bit sketchy.

It was hard to tell what you'd get or how complete it was from these photos, but as shown looked worth it to me.

There was no photo of the box other than this of the famous NTOE!! instructions.

 

BTW, local purchases are the way to go.

Shipping including the $2.99 s/h charge was only $9.79!

[Kasmos]

Other than some stains and finish wear, the box is in good shape.

 

So far so good.

 

No wonder they didn't show the contents of the box.

 

As noted in the Finds thread, this was their idea of protective packaging.

 

After a little straightening up.

 

The photo doesn't show it, but other than being very dirty, it's in good shape. 

 

I'll be posting more of the contents and asking for help from other 451 owners.

[Bomber Bob]

Congratulations Chris!   Glad a Classic Nut nabbed the GHS 451.  Look forward to your restore & observing reports!

[deepwoods1]

Congratulations! Love the old packing materials. Check my gallery for some images of it packed up. 

[Kasmos]

Congratulations Chris!   Glad a Classic Nut nabbed the GHS 451.  Look forward to your restore & observing reports!

Thanks JW.

I'm real busy with some personal things so it's going to be awhile before I can do much to it but I couldn't pass it up. Hopefully I can at least get a peek thru it soon. It's one of those scopes that's just right for tinkering. It will be fun since much of it will just require disassembling, cleaning, polishing, and putting back correctly.

Edited by Kasmos, 22 June 2019 - 08:41 PM.

[Kasmos]

Congratulations! Love the old packing materials. Check my gallery for some images of it packed up. 

Thanks. I like the old packing too (but prefer it when it's still in it's paper wrapping!)

 

When researching it last night I came across your album 

[Esso2112]

Congrats. I love my 451. Mine was complete, with the same misspelled label. Good luck on the restore. 

[Kasmos]

Whenever I buy an old scope I always take photos documenting it as recieved and the accessories that came with it.

 

Unlike some other 451s mine has a typical old school visual back.

It's hard to know why some do and some have a different style.

Unless others are incorrectly dating their scopes, my research so far hasn't showed the style of VB to correspond to an age.

Some were older and some were newer. This scope is dated Sept. 16, 1958

 

The pinion holder is missing one of the adjusting grub screws .

Hopefully I can find a replacement without resorting to doing a re-threading.

 

Again it's is different from some 451s. Instead of being chrome, it has a black lens cap as on 201s.

 

Other than a cleaning, I believe all is well with the lens. 

 

The OTA had a strip of clear tape on each side. Perhaps some protection left from the original packing?

It actually has very few scratches as most of the other marks have already been wiped off. 

 

The mount is in good shape but there's no tripod hub or legs included. I'll be needing some help with that!

Thankfully the alt-az slow motion collar was included. Once again it's different than found on some 451s.

It was shown in the second post but I'll show it again in the next post.

 

 

It's nice to have a serial number and date.

I've noticed that same signature included with some other Gotos.

 

It's always a bonus when a scope comes with it's original docs.

 

More photos are coming soon.

Edited by Kasmos, 24 June 2019 - 12:29 AM.

[Stew44]

Congrats,

 

As is so often seen, the Goto scopes with one piece legs are more than likely to have tripod and yoke be separated from the scope in the case.  The grey ring slips over the yoke and is the tang that azimuth adjusts against.  Looks like parts are there to put the finder together and the diagonal.  Hopefully there is a lens in the finder cell.  The 6mm and 10-20 convertible might also be complete when parts are put together.  Same with the porro prism perhaps.  Why everything was disassembled is a mystery to me.

 

Most of these Fraunhoffer 60mm Gotos have excellent optics.

[Cobalt*Blue]

Nice. You have good taste! I was a bider on this scope as well and it's good that it went to a fellow CN member. If I had won I was going to make a very heavy duty wooden tripod and hub. Interested in how she turns out. Chris.

[Cobalt*Blue]

Nice. You have good taste! I was a bider on this scope as well and it's good that it went to a fellow CN member. If I had won I was going to make a very heavy duty wooden tripod and hub. Interested in how she turns out. Chris.

[Esso2112]

Yours is slightly newer than mine. I’m missing the objective cover, though. 

 

 

 

[Kasmos]

Congrats,

 

As is so often seen, the Goto scopes with one piece legs are more than likely to have tripod and yoke be separated from the scope in the case.  The grey ring slips over the yoke and is the tang that azimuth adjusts against.  Looks like parts are there to put the finder together and the diagonal.  Hopefully there is a lens in the finder cell.  The 6mm and 10-20 convertible might also be complete when parts are put together.  Same with the porro prism perhaps.  Why everything was disassembled is a mystery to me.

 

Most of these Fraunhoffer 60mm Gotos have excellent optics.

Thanks Stew,

To lessen the gamble I tried to acess the accessories the best I could before bidding and hoped for the best. I also had noticed the collar (ring), with the tang for the alt-az slow motion before doing so. I'll address some of the issues of these parts in a up coming post.

 

Hopefully you and some other owners can answer any questions as they come up.

Edited by Kasmos, 23 June 2019 - 11:57 PM.

[Kasmos]

Nice. You have good taste! I was a bider on this scope as well and it's good that it went to a fellow CN member. If I had won I was going to make a very heavy duty wooden tripod and hub. Interested in how she turns out. Chris.

I don't bid very often but wonder if and who might be bidding from Cloudy Nights? I suppose all's fair in auctions and war.

 

I plan on modifing a similar hub and making some legs as close as practical to the originals. I'll probably use another tripod in the mean time. 

Edited by Kasmos, 24 June 2019 - 12:32 AM.

[Kasmos]

Yours is slightly newer than mine. I’m missing the objective cover, though. 

 

74147C4A-C38A-4DA2-AB4A-B6854F0C5609.jpeg

Is there a date on your paperwork? Does your visual back match mine?

[Kasmos]

Eyepieces and Accessories

 

Just about every lens and barrel was either taken off or put with the wrong assembly.

Therefore, as much as I like to take photos as found, I just had to match up every item to acess what I had.

 

I was relieved that the finder's objective remained intact, plus it's eyepiece and all of the adjusters were accounted for.

 

The finder's tube is resting on the mount's Alt-Az slow motion collar to show a flattened spot.

It's already been fixed and tested. It has no cross hairs but it works.

Why the threads inside don't start at the edge is puzzling, since they barely catch the ones of the eyepiece.

 

Everything was backwards with these. The 6mm lens was under the 10-20mm cap and on the wrong barrel.

The 10-20mm convertible is missing a lens so I'm not sure I have the right combination to make either one of the versions work?

 

The Goto's diagonal had the Porro's shorter black barrel fitted over it's chrome barrel which was cross threaded on.

Both barrels on the spare diagonal were removed. The black plastic one was threaded into the Porro.  

The Goto's reveal where the black barrel threads on is chipped a bit, but thankfully it doesn't interfere with it threading on correctly. I suppose it was due to sloppy handling while someone was forcing it on. 

 

It's likely that the spare diagonal is a Diamond Z (Tanzutsu Optical), since two Diamond Z eyepieces and a Barlow were included.

 

The Porro Prism now with the correct black barrel fitted.

 

Included spare eyepieces.

Again, the 20mm cap was on the 6mm EP and the 20mm's inner works was extremely cross threaded.

They must be older Diamond Z's, since the caps are metal.

The Unitron 7mm is a nice bonus, since I didn't have that size.

As is the SR 5mm which will help make my Manon complete.

The tall one in the back is a SR 4mm is likely a recent one of Chinese origins.

 

Mostly Junk Barlows. The middle one might have come from a Mayflower or Manon.

I believe it's the type they used, so once again another part for my Manon's kit. 

The bottom one is empty.

 

Original silca packs are a nice final touch.

 

Now all of this stuff can be be disassembled and cleaned.

Edited by Kasmos, 24 June 2019 - 02:44 AM.

[Piggyback]

Great find. Congratulations, Kasmos!

 

Love your extensive photo documentation. Makes me feel like I was unpacking. Goto rarer than hens teeth in my neck of the woods.

 

Looking forward to see the cleaned up scope and read your observation report.

 

[Stew44]

 

 

 

451-Goto-EPs.jpg

Everything was backwards with these. The 6mm lens was under the 10-20mm cap and on the wrong barrel.

The 10-20mm convertible is missing a lens so I'm not sure I have the right combination to make either one of the versions work?

 

 

You have 1, 2 and 3 so you can get the 10mm.  You would need 1, 3 and 4 for 20mm and I don't see 4.  Not sure what the disk is you included.  Didn't see a lens.

Edited by Stew44, 24 June 2019 - 07:19 AM.

[Esso2112]

Is there a date on your paperwork? Does your visual back match mine?

The only date I have on mine is the instructions, 1957. My visual back has black ring and bare metal holder.

[Kasmos]

You have 1, 2 and 3 so you can get the 10mm.  You would need 1, 3 and 4 for 20mm and I don't see 4.  Not sure what the disk is you included.  Didn't see a lens.

Thanks Stew.

Good to know. Nice to have at least one version of that system that works.

Never seeing a good break down of the components, I wasn't 100% sure. 

 

The photo below is a crop and mark up from Deepwoods' album.

In the disscussions I read so far, I never saw anyone take a good photo of the components.

I assume this is what the missing #4 lens should look like.

 

I couldn't figure out where the blank (retaining), disk came from, so I suppose it's from another missing eyepiece.

I'll have to double check but I think there's a similar one inside one of the other EPs.

[Kasmos]

Great find. Congratulations, Kasmos!

 

Love your extensive photo documentation. Makes me feel like I was unpacking. Goto rarer than hens teeth in my neck of the woods.

 

Looking forward to see the cleaned up scope and read your observation report.

 

Glad you like the posts. I do hope they are enjoyed and not just a bore. 

 

Outside of Japan, Gotos seem fairly rare everywhere. It's the first one available I've seen nearby and it was affordable, so I jumped on it.

[Stew44]

Thanks Stew.

Good to know. Nice to have at least one version of that system that works.

Never seeing a good break down of the components, I wasn't 100% sure. 

 

The photo below is a crop and mark up from Deepwoods' album.

In the disscussions I read so far, I never saw anyone take a good photo of the components.

10-20 Convertible Lens.jpg

I assume this is what the missing #4 lens should look like.

 

I couldn't figure out where the blank (retaining), disk came from, so I suppose it's from another missing eyepiece.

I'll have to double check but I think there's a similar one inside one of the other EPs.

Yep, that's #4.

[Kasmos]

Like I've said before, I tend to jump around from scope to scope slowly getting them all fixed up.

 

Next month it will be two years since I bought this one so I've really been wanting to get it cleaned up enough to try out.

Since it was the item with the most questionable issues, I started with the focuser.

 

These focusers rotate and you can see there was lots of dirt and grime at the rotation joint where lube leached out.

Because it was locked up with hardened grease I really wasn't completely sure how these focusers were attached or rotated.

It turned out the whole unit is threaded onto the tube and the stationary collar is held by the little screw on top and the larger thumb screw on the bottom.

 

This shows how both screws go through the tube to secure it.

 

While it's Plastic (smells like Bakelite), the focuser body is well made and machined.

As a matter of fact all of the scope's plastic parts have threaded brass inserts. 

 

The first issue. The pinion cover was missing one of the grub screws that secures one of the eccentric bearings.

When I first received it I found one in my spare parts that fit, but when tightened, the pinion still wouldn't always engage with the rack's teeth.

This made it necessary to take the whole thing apart and determine why.

 

The brass grub screw on the right is the replacement.

 

There wasn't much grease inside but what's left was very hardened.

This had prevented good adjustment between the bearings and the rack.

 

The top arrow points to the locking ring that holds the center housing to the outer collar. It has three holes for a special tool.

The thumbscrew on the bottom of the focuser is tightened to hold it in place or loosened just enough to permit rotation.

Using WD-40 I freed up the housing so it now rotates but I gave up trying to get the locking ring off for fear of damaging it.

The lower arrow points to where it has H18 scratched into it. This is to keep it matched with it's fitted rack tube (below) during manufacturing.

You can also see a little bit of how the gear rack is raised from the tube just below where it is attached.

I believe this is to give it a bit of spring tension with the pinion gear.

 

Goto attention to quality. This rack tube is the first one I've seen with 3 baffles in it.

Edited by Kasmos, 14 May 2021 - 12:04 AM.

[Kasmos]

Everything was cleaned, degreased, polished, regreased and adjusted.

 

With the grub screws slightly loose I used the old marks in the bearings for their position. 

Then slowly tightened down the the pinion cover followed by tightening and adjusting the grub screws.

Very small adjustments in them makes a big difference in how the focuser feels.

 

 

When it went back on the tube, was aligned with the two outer screws installed, it now had a little side to side play.

I believe this was because they had used sticky grease on the threads (which hardened), and it was removed during the clean up. 

A small strip of tape on each side (they don't show when fully threaded on), was enough to make it feel snug again

Edited by Kasmos, 14 May 2021 - 12:00 AM.

[semlin]

very nice.  i recently purchased but have not yet received a goto 451.  this is a pretty helpful introduction.  i am looking forward to having it in my hands.