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Guilt?

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#1 Startex

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 04:41 PM

Ever have the night off to yourself, no work the next day and you have clear skies but you're too tired etc.. to get off the couch and set up so you feel guilty about blowing a night of clear skies? I had to deal with a plumbing project yesterday that left me beat and felt guilty when I went outside at about midnight to see nice conditions.


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#2 bobito

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 04:51 PM

I went through that after my first year or two of owning a telescope.  When I went from trying to get out any chance I could to allowing myself to make excuses to not go out I felt guilty that I spent all this money on gear and I'm not getting the most out of it.

 

But I'm now to the point where I'm fine going out less.  I find I enjoy going out about a dozen nights a year (plus another couple dozen or so days for Ha viewing the Sun), keeps it fresh. 

 

Everyone enjoys their hobbies differently, if astronomy is a leisurely hobby for you then there is nothing to be guilty about.  Your gear will be there waiting for you when it's convenient for YOU to use it.


Edited by bobito, 26 June 2019 - 05:02 PM.

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#3 Startex

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 04:54 PM

I should also add that I got a new 80mm triplet last week and last night would have been first light, made the guilt a bit worse.


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#4 Cali

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 04:55 PM

Ever have the night off to yourself, no work the next day and you have clear skies but you're too tired etc.. to get off the couch and set up so you feel guilty about blowing a night of clear skies?

Move the couch to the back yard.


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#5 Michael Covington

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 04:59 PM

Ken Fulton's The Light-Hearted Astronomer deals with this.  He has a new edition coming out soon, we hope.


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#6 jupiter122

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 05:01 PM

I have. 

 

But remember, this is supposed to be all about something you get enjoyment out of. So go out when you feel like going out and staying in when you don’t. 

 

Clear skies!

 

Tim


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#7 williew

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 05:16 PM

Bad-bad- bad! The purpose of new equipment is to reignite that spark. Get out the door with it while it's still fresh. Even if it's only for a few minutes. Then, leave it set up. (Assuming your tripod-scope combo is light enough to move around)smile.gif 


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#8 Tyson M

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 05:22 PM

It's not a competition with others. It is not something we should feel guilty about, not going outside when it's clear.

 

I have felt guilty myself, but sometimes we just don't feel like it and want to relax.  That is natural, after the hussle and bussle of daily life, with its accompanied stressors.


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#9 John Fitzgerald

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 05:35 PM

If you feel guilty, then a hobby becomes work.  If you force yourself to go out when too tired, mistakes can be more easily made, which can lead to damaged equipment.  If tired and feeling a little guilty, go out with hand held binoculars, or even look around naked eye.  You might see a bolide.  It happens.


Edited by John Fitzgerald, 26 June 2019 - 05:37 PM.

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#10 ButterFly

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 05:39 PM

Stretching is a great way to fuel a second wind.  And coffee ... lots of coffee.


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#11 Joe1950

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 06:29 PM

Listen, I'm of Italian descent so I know guilt very well.

 

Happened to me all the time, especially when I had big scopes that required set-up and take-down. I never had an observatory so I always had to take the scope out and bring it back in.

 

The worse was with a 10" Cave Newt, back in the 1970s. That was a big, heavy scope and not a pleasure to get it out and back. But I felt if I missed a clear night I was doing an injustice to myself since the scope was expensive at the time.

 

There were even times when I went outside to look at conditions and felt relieved that there were too many clouds. That's how bad it got! Let's keep that on the QT. Not everyone understands.

 

Anyway I ended up selling the scope to a guy with a dome. He was happy, I was happy and the scope was thrilled. I got something much more portable.

 

Seriously, what others have said is true. Don't make it a job. It's a hobby and a time to enjoy. When you feel like it, go out. When you're tired, hit the sac.

 

The key is written on Chinese Food containers...ENJOY!


Edited by Joe1950, 26 June 2019 - 06:30 PM.

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#12 csa/montana

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 06:37 PM

As said already; astronomy is a hobby that we are supposed to enjoy.  If we feel we have to get out & view, or feel guilty when we do not; then it's no longer a hobby.  It's now become a job.

 

Don't feel guilty, you wouldn't have fully enjoyed the viewing anyway.  Wait until you feel like it, then it will become a much greater night for you.


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#13 markb

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 06:52 PM

Absolutely been there!

Hobbies or pursuits are supposed to be FUN. And guilt-free.

Things did improve immensely when I started using a frictionless alt-az and an easy to mount, and light enough to carry, C8 or 5" f5 refractor.

No more finder, just a momentary switch pistol laser adapted to the Vixen/Synta shoe all my scopes now carry.

My long ignored moveable aluminum pier that has lived outside (for 15 years) was finally put to use with the alt-az.

And I made up a belly bag with a 2.5 and 4.8mm ep, a Baader Zoom, and a Vixen 1.25 diagonal.

It all started to gel...

Now the part that gets my lazy rear outside-

I put the mount and pier adapter plate in a simple shoulder bag, with the belly bag, and get it all out in one shot, scope under the other arm.

Unpowered alt az, so any mostly level spot will do for the pier, Three rosette screws and the plate and mount are on. Clamp on the scope, drop in any ep, light the laser and I am enjoying myself. Finally.

5-10 minutes, tops. Leave the mount outside, plastic bagged, if I am really really lazy (and the night is guarnteed dry). 5 minutes to get back to the TV or recliner.

Took a long time to get this routine set up.

But sometimes I'm still too lazy, but much, much less often.

If seeing is found to be awesome, I gwt up the energy to hump out the tablet driven GPS11, still easier than any gem for me, but at least I know what the reward will be.

And, now, I have FUN.
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#14 Startex

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 06:55 PM

 

There were even times when I went outside to look at conditions and felt relieved that there were too many clouds. That's how bad it got! Let's keep that on the QT. Not everyone understands.

 

 

Yep, been there. Glad I'm not the only one.


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#15 cuzimthedad

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 07:16 PM

As has already been said, it's a hobby and supposed to be fun. You had priorities to attend to which were more important. Sometimes a job well done can be just as rewarding as taking a few hours to spend under the stars. I owned an old farm that always presented plumbing issues and upgrades throughout the year. When I would replace or repair something old, it was always rewarding and one less thing to worry about. We now own a brand new home and guess what? The upgrades we've done have all been plumbing related...replaced all the push pull angle stops with quarter turn valve type, installed a reverse osmosis system, installed a pressure regulator into the mainline, added a hose bib to the side of the house that didn't have one. No worries...


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#16 ensign

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 07:44 PM

I just spent a day with a belt sander stripping a coating off a deck.

 

The skies are clear and transparent.  It’s warm out.  No moon during my usual observing window.

 

Think I’ll hit the hay a bit early tonight.

 

The gear will wait.  The stars aren’t going anywhere.


Edited by ensign, 26 June 2019 - 07:48 PM.

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#17 Michael Covington

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 09:49 PM

Economists talk about the fallacy of sunk costs, the false belief that if you have spent money acquiring the privilege of doing something, you must do that thing, even if it's not actually what you want or stand to benefit from.

 

Mankiw's textbook uses the example of paying $120 for a concert ticket and then deciding not to go to the concert.  Is this wasteful?  No.  You paid $120 for the option of going to the concert.  If you are sure you have something you'd rather do at the time, do it.  No goods or services are being thrown away.  The musician is getting paid.  Nobody is harmed by the "waste."  It's not like actually acquiring materials and throwing them away, or compelling someone to work uselessly.

(Investors often pay for options and then don't exercise them.  It is common to buy several options and use the one that fits what the market actually has done.)

 

Buying a telescope does not obligate you to spend all your time using it.

 

I find that a good tactic is to set yourself projects.  Observe certain specific things.  My three current ones are (1) the dissolution of the Great Red Spot; (2) trying to photograph Mare Orientale from earth (it's only partly possible, but I want to see how well it can be done); and (3) photographing faint nebulae that are not well mapped (galactic cirrus, IFN).  And of course (4) learning more about my equipment.  But the point is, I don't have to observe every night, only when it's a good opportunity to do one of these things.


Edited by Michael Covington, 26 June 2019 - 09:49 PM.

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#18 jaraxx

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 10:55 PM

I do feel guilty. Horribly guilty.

I find that drinking heavily helps.


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#19 John Fitzgerald

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 11:44 PM

If I bought a ticket to something that was more than a few dollars, and didn't use it, I would feel like I wasted the money.  It would be like renting a telescope for a clear night, for a substantial cost, and letting it sit in the house while I watched TV.  Might as well have burned the money.  But, if I BUY a telescope, I have the opportunity to use it ANY clear night.  If I miss a few, no big deal.  There will always be more clear nights.



#20 Joe1950

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 11:49 PM

 

Economists talk about the fallacy of sunk costs, the false belief that if you have spent money acquiring the privilege of doing something, you must do that thing, even if it's not actually what you want or stand to benefit from.

Exactly why I won’t buy life insurance. 

 

 

It is a real phenomena, however. I’ve felt that way myself with scopes and amateur radio equipment, especially for a time after a large purchase. But, I never would have guessed it had a name and that others experienced it! 



#21 sg6

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Posted 27 June 2019 - 03:06 AM

No, never feel guilty from not using anything, or missing a clear night.

Additionally means a drive for anything half reasonable and it all adds up against me.

 

Becomes:

It is clear, find scope, find mount, check everything I need in the bag, put in car, grab coat, drive 18 miles, take stuff out, set stuff up, align, decide what to look at. I have in effect close on an hour either side of the observing to add in.

 

Had a goto mount for 5 months before I applied power to it, small scope for the mount much the same.

I like to have them "in case" or "for when needed".

 

May be the apprehension of: Is this going to go smoothly or am I going to tear my hair out?

Had that once at an outreach and really bugged me.

 

Half the problem is also having something to look at and finding that this aspect becomes the greater. When is Betelguese going to go nova, I need a new something.



#22 iwannabswiss

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Posted 27 June 2019 - 03:49 AM

I did until I built an observatory.  Now all I have to do is press a button to open the roof and then start viewing or imaging.


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#23 edwincjones

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Posted 27 June 2019 - 05:23 AM

no-the sky repeats it rotation yearly

it is always there for me to see

but whenever I look there is something new 

 

edj


Edited by edwincjones, 27 June 2019 - 05:23 AM.


#24 Michael Covington

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Posted 27 June 2019 - 09:18 AM

Exactly why I won’t buy life insurance. 

 

 

This risks going off topic, but I don't understand how the fallacy of sunk costs prevents you from buying life insurance.  Life insurance, like all insurance, is risk management -- you'd rather incur a fixed cost than a risk of a large hardship.

I gather there's an analogy to telescope purchases in here somewhere, but you've lost me.


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#25 dgordontx

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Posted 27 June 2019 - 09:58 AM

Ever have the night off to yourself, no work the next day and you have clear skies but you're too tired etc.. to get off the couch and set up so you feel guilty about blowing a night of clear skies? I had to deal with a plumbing project yesterday that left me beat and felt guilty when I went outside at about midnight to see nice conditions.

You should feel guilty. Many of us are stuck on this forum because we don't have clear skies and here you are wasting them... On a more serious note, no. I sure as heck don't feel guilty about a clear sky on a winter night. Sure, I could be outside for several hours and still make it to bed at a reasonable hour. Or, I could sit inside where it's warm and I can feel my fingers. There will be more clear nights.




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