Jump to content

  •  

CNers have asked about a donation box for Cloudy Nights over the years, so here you go. Donation is not required by any means, so please enjoy your stay.

Photo

Takahashi TSA120N

  • Please log in to reply
156 replies to this topic

#26 Steve Allison

Steve Allison

    Apollo

  • *****
  • Posts: 1,302
  • Joined: 25 Nov 2016
  • Loc: Olympia, Wash. 98502

Posted 04 July 2019 - 03:24 PM

Punctuation is a plus.


  • Paul G, Scott99, eros312 and 5 others like this

#27 areyoukiddingme

areyoukiddingme

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 6,291
  • Joined: 18 Nov 2012

Posted 04 July 2019 - 03:33 PM

It appears that you are arguing that a Skywatcher Esprit 120 beat out a Tak FS-128, and that this led you to buy a TSA-120???

 

Their is no comparising between the FS-128 and the TSA-120 one guy had a Takahashi FS-128 and a the other Takahashi FS-102

and we were looking at the moon at our Astronomy festival many Apos there the Takahashi FS-102 was the best doublet

iv ever looked with and beat all the doublets at the festival including two SkyWatcher 120mm Equinox doublets and one

Sky-Watcher EVOSTAR-120 and APM FK-61 ED 152

 

Everybody agreed that the APM FPL-53 140mm was a match for the Takahashi FS-128 the FS-102 at the same power the lenses

were the same but when put against the Sky-Watcher 120mm Esprit this is where you could see the FS-128 lost it Magical cult like

status power you could see tiny bit of false colour where the 120mm Esprit had none at all then it was the turn of the Takahashi FS-102

against a TS-107 mm f/6.5 FPL53 Triplet the look on the FS-102 owners face victim of the fluorite hype both FS owners bought their

FS Refractors from the US as they are very rare Apos

 

This was just over a year ago ill admit i use to buy into the fluorite hype it was this star party that convinced me to finally get a TSA-120

watching it beat every other triplet Apo and crush the FS-128 only the LZOS 123mm could match the TSA-120 with the star tests



#28 25585

25585

    Voyager 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 11,944
  • Joined: 29 Aug 2017
  • Loc: In a valley, in the UK. Dark end of the street.

Posted 05 July 2019 - 01:13 AM

A guy owning a  FS128 here, grudgingly admits its beaten by the TSA120. The 120 was designed to replace the FS, so Takahashi would make it better.


  • Michaeljhogan, Lookitup and agmoonsolns like this

#29 Tyson M

Tyson M

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 5,378
  • Joined: 22 Jan 2015
  • Loc: Canada

Posted 05 July 2019 - 11:05 PM

As much as I would enjoy a TSA120, I would pass on this for the sliding dew shield for a more portable package. 

 

Any purported cool down savings (which I am not sure is entirely accurate), would be offset by the fact you're waiting a bit for the triplet lens in both designs anyways.

 

So considerations of cool down are always adhered to before an observing session. 


  • jay.i and agmoonsolns like this

#30 agmoonsolns

agmoonsolns

    Surveyor 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 1,651
  • Joined: 17 Sep 2018

Posted 05 July 2019 - 11:25 PM

I am not seeing any cool down advantages either, has anyone provided reasons as to why either one would have better thermal equilibrium times? 



#31 watchplanets

watchplanets

    Vostok 1

  • -----
  • Posts: 188
  • Joined: 20 Jun 2019

Posted 06 July 2019 - 10:55 AM

But the fs128 us a doublet and u compared to a triplet and it also has another lens for field flatter inside. So comparing a 4 lens scope to a 2 is not apple's to apple's in my book.even to compare a triplet to doublet makes no sense.

I look at it like this compare a 6 inch f/5 acro to a 6 inch f/8 ed or triplet and would that compare?

I would only compare doublet to doubles and triplets to tripmetes and of same size

#32 donadani

donadani

    Apollo

  • *****
  • Posts: 1,125
  • Joined: 20 Jul 2015
  • Loc: Germany

Posted 06 July 2019 - 11:40 AM

I would prefere the 8mm more aperture of the FS any time over the small bit of better color correction the TSA has to offer for visual use.

 

Had the small brother of the 120 the TSA-102 "N" - visually it was stunning but on a bench comparing it in doublepass at high power to other 4" apos it was not as good as I thought it would be. 



#33 bobhen

bobhen

    Aurora

  • *****
  • Posts: 4,927
  • Joined: 25 Jun 2005

Posted 06 July 2019 - 01:07 PM

Both of my old 6” AP triplets had screw-on dew shields. Off of the top of my head, I think half of the refractors that I’ve owned had screw on dew shields. They are just not that big of a deal.

 

The TSA 120–N saves you $500 over a regular TSA. For that savings (which ain’t hay) I would take the TSA 120–N in a minute.

 

Bob


  • Jeff Morgan, doctordub, payner and 2 others like this

#34 25585

25585

    Voyager 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 11,944
  • Joined: 29 Aug 2017
  • Loc: In a valley, in the UK. Dark end of the street.

Posted 06 July 2019 - 01:37 PM

Both of my old 6” AP triplets had screw-on dew shields. Off of the top of my head, I think half of the refractors that I’ve owned had screw on dew shields. They are just not that big of a deal.

 

The TSA 120–N saves you $500 over a regular TSA. For that savings (which ain’t hay) I would take the TSA 120–N in a minute.

 

Bob

Saving $500 - either that's to make sure the N sells, or more likely $500 extra for a sliding dew shield is a rip-off!  4.gif

 

Now a big saving on a TOA 130 N is what I want!


  • balu01 likes this

#35 Michaeljhogan

Michaeljhogan

    Messenger

  • -----
  • Posts: 485
  • Joined: 25 Aug 2014

Posted 06 July 2019 - 02:29 PM

Punctuation is a plus.

Butthurt are you a FS owner grin.gif


Edited by Michaeljhogan, 06 July 2019 - 02:50 PM.


#36 Michaeljhogan

Michaeljhogan

    Messenger

  • -----
  • Posts: 485
  • Joined: 25 Aug 2014

Posted 06 July 2019 - 02:35 PM

A guy owning a  FS128 here, grudgingly admits its beaten by the TSA120. The 120 was designed to replace the FS, so Takahashi would make it better.

Yes becuase their is a wierd cult that has grow up mostly on US forums that has infected some victims in europe into thinking

that a doublet will beat out a triplet Apo even after Takahashi themselves has tried to put an end to it to no avail.

 

Takahashi of course doesnt like this crazyness because they are stopping people from buying a far superior Apo i watched

myself here on this very forum as this cult convinced and pressured a victim into not buying a new TSA-120 FT for a obsolete

doublet Apo.


Edited by Michaeljhogan, 06 July 2019 - 02:47 PM.


#37 MGD

MGD

    Ranger 4

  • *****
  • Posts: 329
  • Joined: 16 Aug 2015
  • Loc: Interlaken NY

Posted 06 July 2019 - 03:21 PM

If you don't like US forums so much why don't you leave?

Mike


  • Scott99 likes this

#38 25585

25585

    Voyager 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 11,944
  • Joined: 29 Aug 2017
  • Loc: In a valley, in the UK. Dark end of the street.

Posted 07 July 2019 - 11:54 AM

Yes because there is a weird cult that has grow up mostly on US forums that has infected some victims in Europe into thinking

that a doublet will beat out a triplet Apo even after Takahashi themselves has tried to put an end to it to no avail.

 

Takahashi of course doesnt like this crazyness because they are stopping people from buying a far superior Apo. I watched

myself here on this very forum as this cult convinced and pressured a victim into not buying a new TSA-120 FT for an obsolete

doublet Apo.

I am too obstinate to let peer/cult pressure influence me. What was the doublet & buyer's main use to be?



#39 Paul G

Paul G

    Cosmos

  • *****
  • Posts: 9,234
  • Joined: 08 May 2003
  • Loc: Freedonia

Posted 08 July 2019 - 10:14 AM

As much as I would enjoy a TSA120, I would pass on this for the sliding dew shield for a more portable package. 

 

 

Same here, wouldn't want to cross thread the thing in the dark.


  • Tyson M and 25585 like this

#40 CounterWeight

CounterWeight

    Star walker

  • *****
  • Posts: 11,184
  • Joined: 05 Oct 2008
  • Loc: PDX, OR.

Posted 08 July 2019 - 12:38 PM

As far as I can remember, in my comparisons I've never said there was a 'better' between the TSA-120 and the FS-128, I've tried to stress that other than the color balance I could not see anything in one I could not see in the other in same night, same eyepieces, same air column testing.  This went on for a while weeks if not months until it stopped being fun trying to eek out differences and more a PITA.  I sold the TSA as the FS-128 has been a reference scope for me for so long (I think 10 years or so now in 2019), it's become my baseline tester. 

 

In it's favor the TSA is far easier to mount, I was using on an Orion Sirius mount with it and it was good enough, the FS-128 takes a much beefier mount to really keep solid for critical fine focus.  I've tried to recommend the TSA whenever asked as it is a scope you can buy off the shelf of exceptional quality and it's ease of mounting.  I don't recall any acclimation issues, or saying there are any with the TSA, but then I always set up well before I intend to use.  No question I'd recommend the TSA first for anyone wishing for dual visual/imaging, though I've seen great images made with the FS.

 

I also owned and compared the TOA-130 to the FS-128, and though an exceptional scope for visual or imaging, I did notice acclimation issues with it in my climate, nothing show stopping, again setting up well before intended use goes a long way.  It is a far heavier scope than the TSA-120, surprisingly not much lighter than the TEC apo160ED I bought to go up in aperture, so it imo requires a beefy mount to really keep rock solid.

 

All this said, I live in the USA, pacific northwest, an area not known for world class seeing or skies, so the usual caveat I always try to add, the above is based on the seeing where I live.

 

Without question, at least to me, there are no dogs in this race, the FC, TSA, and TOA really exceptional optics you can buy off the shelf without worry.  To get an FS you'll have to look used. No reason to manufacture a crisis of truth or create a false dilemma and get worked up over.  All can be bought and fielded with confidence and that is what you are paying the premium for.

 

As a final comment, when i was imaging I realized how important having properly mated reducer/flattener can be for imaging.  That Takahashi manufactures specific items for their scope (again, at a premium) and actually publishes spot diagrams for them is another feather in their cap.  To me Takahashi is a class A+ outfit that understands their business and customer base.


Edited by CounterWeight, 08 July 2019 - 12:40 PM.

  • eros312, SkyRanger, areyoukiddingme and 4 others like this

#41 bobhen

bobhen

    Aurora

  • *****
  • Posts: 4,927
  • Joined: 25 Jun 2005

Posted 08 July 2019 - 02:50 PM

As far as I can remember, in my comparisons I've never said there was a 'better' between the TSA-120 and the FS-128, I've tried to stress that other than the color balance I could not see anything in one I could not see in the other in same night, same eyepieces, same air column testing.  This went on for a while weeks if not months until it stopped being fun trying to eek out differences and more a PITA.  I sold the TSA as the FS-128 has been a reference scope for me for so long (I think 10 years or so now in 2019), it's become my baseline tester. 

 

 

The planetary observer Mr. Yoshida from Japan rates the Tak TSA 120 and the Tak FS 128 as exact equals when it comes to planetary observing, so your observations match his.

 

The TSA 120 does have the portability/size and color correction advantage.

 

Bob


  • RAKing, CounterWeight and 25585 like this

#42 RAKing

RAKing

    Cosmos

  • *****
  • Posts: 9,023
  • Joined: 28 Dec 2007
  • Loc: West of the D.C. Nebula

Posted 09 July 2019 - 09:51 AM

The planetary observer Mr. Yoshida from Japan rates the Tak TSA 120 and the Tak FS 128 as exact equals when it comes to planetary observing, so your observations match his.

 

The TSA 120 does have the portability/size and color correction advantage.

 

Bob

 

That is the same way I felt about my FS-128 and my TSA-120.  Both are great scopes, but I would now have to go with the 120 because of size.

 

Ron


  • CounterWeight, StarDust1, Michaeljhogan and 1 other like this

#43 4esop

4esop

    Sputnik

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 33
  • Joined: 15 Feb 2017

Posted 30 August 2019 - 03:50 PM

Update!  Good news:  My TSA-120N arrived.    Bad news:  I live in Florida and guys from my local astronomy group have named my Tak: "Dorian".

 

 

tak_on_cgx2.jpg

 


  • Paul G, Scott Beith, bobhen and 13 others like this

#44 4esop

4esop

    Sputnik

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 33
  • Joined: 15 Feb 2017

Posted 30 August 2019 - 03:55 PM

tak_idplate.jpg

Here is the id plate on the scope.  There's a dual speed focuser knob on it.


Edited by 4esop, 30 August 2019 - 04:01 PM.

  • Paul G, Scott Beith, bobhen and 5 others like this

#45 RAKing

RAKing

    Cosmos

  • *****
  • Posts: 9,023
  • Joined: 28 Dec 2007
  • Loc: West of the D.C. Nebula

Posted 30 August 2019 - 04:23 PM

Congrats on the new scope.  Stay safe! waytogo.gif

 

Ron



#46 Haydon

Haydon

    Mariner 2

  • *****
  • Posts: 258
  • Joined: 05 Oct 2009

Posted 31 August 2019 - 07:49 AM

What is the length (for storage)?  



#47 Marcus Roman

Marcus Roman

    Ranger 4

  • *****
  • Posts: 337
  • Joined: 25 Jul 2018

Posted 31 August 2019 - 12:17 PM

attachicon.gif tak_idplate.jpg

Here is the id plate on the scope.  There's a dual speed focuser knob on it.

A beauty! Take care!



#48 RAKing

RAKing

    Cosmos

  • *****
  • Posts: 9,023
  • Joined: 28 Dec 2007
  • Loc: West of the D.C. Nebula

Posted 31 August 2019 - 01:24 PM

What is the length (for storage)?  

My TSA-120N is 39.75 inches (934mm) long.  It has a Tak CAA and a Baader Clicklock visual back installed and it still fits easily into my Lightware Cargo 8 storage case.

 

Cheers,

 

Ron

 

TSA-120N - LW Case.JPG


  • Scott Beith, doctordub, plyscope and 8 others like this

#49 Tyson M

Tyson M

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 5,378
  • Joined: 22 Jan 2015
  • Loc: Canada

Posted 31 August 2019 - 03:52 PM

My TSA-120N is 39.75 inches (934mm) long.  It has a Tak CAA and a Baader Clicklock visual back installed and it still fits easily into my Lightware Cargo 8 storage case.

 

Cheers,

 

Ron

 

attachicon.gif TSA-120N - LW Case.JPG

Is this your only scope Ron?  Beauty! Nice case for it too.



#50 RAKing

RAKing

    Cosmos

  • *****
  • Posts: 9,023
  • Joined: 28 Dec 2007
  • Loc: West of the D.C. Nebula

Posted 31 August 2019 - 04:22 PM

Is this your only scope Ron?  Beauty! Nice case for it too.

No, but thanks for asking.  This is my newest scope.  I had a regular TSA-120 a few years ago and regret letting it go.  I like this "N" version because I actually like a fixed dew shield.  It is one less thing for me to deal with when I go outside - it will not slip.

 

I still have my TEC 140, FS-128, and an FC-100D, but will be selling the TEC soon.  I bought the TSA-120 because it is light enough for me to use when I cannot handle the bigger scopes, yet it has enough aperture that I don't feel "cheated" when I am observing.  That simply means I can see the stuff I planned to see. lol.gif

 

The tiny Tak 100 is for winter grab and go sessions.

 

Cheers,

 

Ron

 

Tak TSA-120 083019.JPG


  • Scott Beith, Scott in NC, doctordub and 7 others like this


CNers have asked about a donation box for Cloudy Nights over the years, so here you go. Donation is not required by any means, so please enjoy your stay.


Recent Topics






Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics