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Takahashi FC100 - DF, DL, or DC?

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#101 Maurizio.67

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Posted 14 February 2021 - 01:13 PM

I had the 100DF and a few months ago I have the 100DZ, both excellent on the eyepiece but perhaps with more detail on the DZ. But the real surprise was the little FOA60, an incredible detailed and nested image down to the Vixen HR 3.4mm. Clear skies.

Maurizio

 

Taka-100-DZ-FOA60-2.jpg


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#102 25585

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Posted 14 February 2021 - 05:02 PM

http://scopeviews.co...akFC100DCDL.htm


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#103 teashea

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Posted 14 February 2021 - 08:42 PM

I had the 100DF and a few months ago I have the 100DZ, both excellent on the eyepiece but perhaps with more detail on the DZ. But the real surprise was the little FOA60, an incredible detailed and nested image down to the Vixen HR 3.4mm. Clear skies.

Maurizio

 

Taka-100-DZ-FOA60-2.jpg

Nice finder scope


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#104 teashea

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Posted 14 February 2021 - 08:51 PM

I don't move the dovetail at all for a few reasons, mostly having to do with my equipment. First, my dovetail is only four inches long so there is not much room to move it. I would need to get a longer dovetail.

Also, the dovetail on my mount has two screws, a main screw and a locking screw, so its more work to move a dovetail.

Also, the dovetail screws are on the bottom, where its harder to reach them and make sure they are tight, whereas the clamp screw is on top, easier to reach and check to make sure its tight. And it is a higher quality screw that is easier to manipulate.

Its also easier to slide the tube in and out of the clam shell than it is to slide the dovetail in and out. This makes a difference in the dark or when I am tired and may have trouble seating the dovetail and making sure its tight. But its easy for me to seat the tube into the clam shell even in the dark when I am tired.

So for me, with my mount, I feel much more secure leaving the dovetail permanently clamped down with both the main screw and the locking screw and doing any needed balancing and scope removal for transport to and from the deck with the clam shell.

I am honestly much more worried about the dovetail coming loose and causing a problem than the clam shell.

For three of my Takahashi telescopes mounted on Vixen mounts, I have 3 or 4 inch dovetails mounted perpendicular to the tube - rather than parallel to the tube.  I feel this is a little bit more secure in the very rare case that the dovetail slips a bit.  That way the telescope will not slide out of the dovetail and down on the ground.  I think you can see it in this photo on the telescope on the right.

 

Taks.jpg


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#105 chuckles

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Posted 15 February 2021 - 12:38 AM

DF. Short and easy to use with 2” eyepieces. DZ might also be a good choice. I think Id rather have a short triplet than the DL, but I guess that’s a personal choice. All these are light and easy to mount scopes, so Im not sure you can go wrong with any of them.
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#106 teashea

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 10:34 AM

Don't like the clamshell clamps, not just because they look ugly to me, but because they only use 1 bolt. So an attractive expensive OTA is IMO inadequately secured in an unattractive fixing - put heavy accessories on the OTA, the single bolt and single tube holder has more load to bear. 

 

The photos above with 2 tube rings, I consider minimum safety. My own 2 Taks, I use 3 rings on a Losmandy D bar, which is also easier to slide in its clamp than loosening rings bolts and moving the OTA on its own.

 

The GEM in DD's vlog is cool. And I am a book & atlas fan, Burnhams still rocks!

I love the Tak clamshell tube holders.  I find them far superior to rings.  I think that the clamshells look better than rings and are more secure from an engineering standpoint.  In addition, the use of the clamshell tube holder eliminates the necessity for a long dovetail bar.  I think these bars look awkward and detract from the clean appearance of a setup.  In some instances the clamshells can mate directly to a mount, without the need for any dovetail bar.  This is the ultimate option for stability and simplicity.  

 

Taks.jpg


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#107 teashea

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 10:43 AM

There are also "lawyer lips" on the Tak clam shell, so even after the knob is unscrewed enough to rattle, the clam shell won't open until you loosen it a couple more turns and pull it up and over the lips, so there is really no danger of a scope falling out of the clam shell.  I only point this out for others who may read this and wonder about the security of the Tak clam shell.  Not trying to convince anyone to change their personal preference.  The clam shell does have a unique appearance.  Personally I find it quite fetching and the Tak blue looks nice with my white LX70 mount.  But beauty is in the eye of the beholder and everyone has different taste.  

I agree.   Security is not an issue when one really examines the clamshell system.  It is very secure.  Takahashi really through this through when they designed it.  Simple, strong, secure, and easily adjusted.  It is a marvelous engineering.  



#108 teashea

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 10:47 AM

Does anyone other than me move the dovetail in the saddle instead of moving the scope in the rings/clamshell in order to balance the scope? I literally never move the scope in the rings, I use the dovetail for that... and most times I don't even need to move it, as my setups are back heavy, so I use moderate tension and the scope doesn't move when I swap eyepieces, yet I can move the scope as necessary without much force. I see no reason why you should move the scope inside the rings/clamshell.

I do not move the dovetail.  I use the clamshell for any adjustments necessary.  In fact, most of my Takahashi claimshells are bolted directly to the mount, eliminating the need for a dovetail.  For the ones I have with a dovertail, the dovetails are 3 or 4 inches long.  These dovetails are mounted perpendicular to the telescope tube, instead of parallel with the tube.  


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#109 teashea

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 10:52 AM

I don't move the dovetail at all for a few reasons, mostly having to do with my equipment. First, my dovetail is only four inches long so there is not much room to move it. I would need to get a longer dovetail.

Also, the dovetail on my mount has two screws, a main screw and a locking screw, so its more work to move a dovetail.

Also, the dovetail screws are on the bottom, where its harder to reach them and make sure they are tight, whereas the clamp screw is on top, easier to reach and check to make sure its tight. And it is a higher quality screw that is easier to manipulate.

Its also easier to slide the tube in and out of the clam shell than it is to slide the dovetail in and out. This makes a difference in the dark or when I am tired and may have trouble seating the dovetail and making sure its tight. But its easy for me to seat the tube into the clam shell even in the dark when I am tired.

So for me, with my mount, I feel much more secure leaving the dovetail permanently clamped down with both the main screw and the locking screw and doing any needed balancing and scope removal for transport to and from the deck with the clam shell.

I am honestly much more worried about the dovetail coming loose and causing a problem than the clam shell.

I agree entirely.  For those few mounts that I cannot bolt directly to the clamshell, I have very short dovetail bars and I drill dimples in the dovetails to make them more secure.  

 

Dimples.jpg



#110 teashea

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 11:00 AM

I had the 100DF and a few months ago I have the 100DZ, both excellent on the eyepiece but perhaps with more detail on the DZ. But the real surprise was the little FOA60, an incredible detailed and nested image down to the Vixen HR 3.4mm. Clear skies.

Maurizio

 

Taka-100-DZ-FOA60-2.jpg

Just for reference, the clamshell can be bolted directly to the mount, eliminating the need for a dovetail.  


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#111 25585

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 12:09 PM

I love the Tak clamshell tube holders.  I find them far superior to rings.  I think that the clamshells look better than rings and are more secure from an engineering standpoint.  In addition, the use of the clamshell tube holder eliminates the necessity for a long dovetail bar.  I think these bars look awkward and detract from the clean appearance of a setup.  In some instances the clamshells can mate directly to a mount, without the need for any dovetail bar.  This is the ultimate option for stability and simplicity.  

 

attachicon.gifTaks.jpg

This is a nice Tak alternative for the TSA-120 clamshell. Also their accessory ring.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 0039150_takahashi_double_tube_holder_for_tsa_120.jpeg
  • tka36430accessoryringholder.jpg

Edited by 25585, 21 February 2021 - 12:12 PM.

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#112 JeremySh

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 12:14 PM

This is a nice Tak alternative for the TSA-120 clamshell. Also their accessory ring.

But it looks like you need tools (Allen key) to loosen and tighten. That’s inconvenient compared to the screw holder on the Tak tube holders, especially when you want to slide the OTA to adjust balance.


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#113 25585

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 12:33 PM

But it looks like you need tools (Allen key) to loosen and tighten. That’s inconvenient compared to the screw holder on the Tak tube holders, especially when you want to slide the OTA to adjust balance.

 I would attach the arrangement to a D dovetail, which could be slid for balancing by loosening its clamp knobs enough.

 

Tele Vue clamshells are the best. They screw down, but have a loosening key top bolt, so OTA securing is there, but grip can be loosened safely for sliding an OTA. I use them on my TV refractors happily.



#114 teashea

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 12:33 PM

But it looks like you need tools (Allen key) to loosen and tighten. That’s inconvenient compared to the screw holder on the Tak tube holders, especially when you want to slide the OTA to adjust balance.

That is one of the reasons I use the Takahashi clamshell tube holder on my TSA120.



#115 25585

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 12:37 PM

I like belt and braces securing. Nights make me jumpy enough already!



#116 MJB

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 12:53 PM

Aesthetics aside (and that is a matter of personal taste) - let's talk about security of the OTA while moving and attaching it to the mount. I think that's when I'd be most likely to drop or bang the tube into something. I really like to have a handle or another rail to get a good grip with. My rig is fairly lightweight, but heavy enough that I have to detach the OTA and move the mount/tripod and OTA separately. Handling a slick and maybe cold tube in the dark is lots easier with a handle of some sort. The is not really a clamshell/ring thing, as you can mount a handle on a clamshell. But if the clamshell is bolted to the mount, I'm not sure of the solution there.


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#117 Ihtegla Sar

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 02:53 PM

I love the Tak clamshell tube holders. I find them far superior to rings. I think that the clamshells look better than rings and are more secure from an engineering standpoint. In addition, the use of the clamshell tube holder eliminates the necessity for a long dovetail bar. I think these bars look awkward and detract from the clean appearance of a setup. In some instances the clamshells can mate directly to a mount, without the need for any dovetail bar. This is the ultimate option for stability and simplicity.

Taks.jpg


That's a gorgeous collection. I only have the DF and DL. Sometimes I use my mount for other scopes, so I need the dovetail clamp, but I like the clean look of the clamshell attached directly to the mount.
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#118 Ihtegla Sar

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 03:16 PM

Aesthetics aside (and that is a matter of personal taste) - let's talk about security of the OTA while moving and attaching it to the mount. I think that's when I'd be most likely to drop or bang the tube into something. I really like to have a handle or another rail to get a good grip with. My rig is fairly lightweight, but heavy enough that I have to detach the OTA and move the mount/tripod and OTA separately. Handling a slick and maybe cold tube in the dark is lots easier with a handle of some sort. The is not really a clamshell/ring thing, as you can mount a handle on a clamshell. But if the clamshell is bolted to the mount, I'm not sure of the solution there.


If I had a heavier OTA with a fatter tube, I'd want a handle, but the FC Taks have 95mm diameter tube that is small enough for me to get my hands around easily and they don't weigh very much. I use two hands when carrying the bare OTA and placing it into the clamshell. Never felt the need for a handle. If I am carrying one any distance I put it in a soft sided case.
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#119 25585

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Posted 21 February 2021 - 06:35 PM

A Vixen bar attached at each end to tube mounting ring tops makes a good handle.


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#120 Maurizio.67

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Posted 22 February 2021 - 07:04 AM

Solo per riferimento, la conchiglia può essere imbullonata direttamente al supporto, eliminando la necessità di una coda di rondine.  

Interesting the small plate was made by the official delear Takahashi in Italy, Skypoint.

How can I make the connection?

Thank you very much

Maurizio


Edited by Maurizio.67, 22 February 2021 - 07:08 AM.



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