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Fierce winds...fractured frames - but fine seeing: Jupiter 10th August: GRS close-ups..

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#1 Kokatha man

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 05:08 AM

EDIT: I have just included a set of GRS close-ups down the thread in Post #17 from this night's captures... wink.gif

 

Hi, the thread's title says it all...after staying at Moonta Bay & catching a few squid (calamari - well, Pat bettering me in that! lol.gif ) we rode out a day & a half of incredible winds before deciding "enough was enough" & heading off.

 

I have Ethan's impact video to thank for heading to Leigh Creek about 500km North to get above the cloud cover...by the 9th most educated guesses deemed that any impact "scar" (if any was there initially!) was most unlikely to be seen, but the relevant Jovian vista was on view late on the 10th so we thought we'd have a try...

 

Leigh Creek, which was moved 20km South many years ago now due to the brown coal seam being found to be under the "Old Town"...this fed the Port Augusta power station which has now been shut down: a rather "eerie" place where a large, relatively modern "New Town" with fine streets & sports grounds etc has barely 1 or 2 people in all the winding, tree-lined streets therein...sad but a modern phenomena world-wide I suppose.

 

It is also adjacent to the magnificent Flinders Ranges, home of the Adnyamathanha people & on the road North to Marree, Oodnadatta or also Birdsville in South-Eastern Queensland.

 

There is a small caravan park run by volunteers & we drove from Moonta Bay on Friday 9th...set up & iced the scope early on Saturday evening ready to try our luck.

 

Unfortunately the ground winds were quite savage & although we wedged the car up to the end of the van to provide some protection for the scope in the "crook" it was not really sufficient: Jupiter ricocheted around & in & out of the ROI constantly, especially as I had opted for a small ROI to get the highest fps to try & compensate. (300fps)

 

I hardly need to say that this was an ASI224MC night - the mono camera would've been sheer lunacy!  Clouds were also drifting across making the whole session quite farcical in some ways..! lol.gif

 

After I post the images which I'll have to split up due to file-size limits I'll also post some screenshots of what AS!3 had to deal with - PIPP would've been nice but for some reason the version on my laptop (where I did 95% of the processing) records an error if I try to utilise the cropping & centring etc options so I just had to work with the situation...more when I post those screenshots. wink.gif

 

I've kept all the images dimensions to 900 pixels so they might not need clicking on - but that's something you'll need to work out for yourselves...from the preview it still looks less than full capture scaling! wink.gif

 

First up 4 rgb images across the session - we never did wait until the relevant vista for Ethan's impact was fully visible but by then not only was Jupiter getting low...my eyeballs were exhausted from trying to focus on an uber-oscillating disk onscreen...not to forget struggling to keep Jove onscreen in a 500x420 ROI - that in itself was so demanding..! crazyeyes.gif

 

...jpeg for this one due to file-size limits.

 

j2019-08-10_10-29&10-46&11-07&11-36@CapScale.jpg


Edited by Kokatha man, 15 August 2019 - 02:34 AM.

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#2 Kokatha man

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 05:09 AM

Next just a random choice of one image with the colour pane split included... smile.gif

 

j2019-08-10_11-07_rgb_dpm+Channels.png


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#3 Kokatha man

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 05:12 AM

4 of the images (those shown at capture scale in my first posting here) are presented in chronological order here in pairs to cater for the file-size limits. smile.gif

 

j2019-08-10_10-29_rgb_dpm@123%.png

 

j2019-08-10_10-46_rgb_dpm@123%.png


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#4 Kokatha man

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 05:16 AM

Then the 2nd pairing of 123% of capture scale images. smile.gif

 

All these images display some nice detail...once more affirming that the list of seeing variations & outcomes are almost infinite: in normal circumstances we would not have bothered going to Leigh Creek to image due to the weather patterns...the only encouragement was that the skies might've been clear...even though that was not the case! lol.gif

 

j2019-08-10_11-07_rgb_dpm@123%.png

 

j2019-08-10_11-36_rgb_dpm@123%.png

 

 


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#5 Kokatha man

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 05:24 AM

For now (there is literally a ton of data from this night! rofl2.gif ) I'll include some AS!3 screenshots: as I said a functioning PIPP on my laptop would've made things easier (better I cannot say) but with split frames like the example shown...as well as many frames sliced off to varying stages; one has to exercise a bit of nous when deciding upon the % cut-off - "2.9%" or whatever hardly seems a good choice to include in the stack but in these circumstances AS!3 throws a few wobblies & after "Analyse"  you have to look at the best frame - or rather the best frame where the whole planet is at least visible - & then scroll through to include all the frames that you think come up to what you consider a still decent-looking one for inclusion in your stack... wink.gif

 

AS!3AnalysisExample#1&2.jpg

 

 


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#6 Kokatha man

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 05:27 AM

Clouds also affect the functioning of AS!3 & unfortunately as the evening wore on not only did the wind get fiercer & harder to keep the planet on the sensor...more constant drifts of clouds kept flowing through such that turning to Saturn would've been a complete waste of time & effort! lol.gif

 

CloudAffected-BestFrame&18222rd.jpg


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#7 AstroEthan

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 06:27 AM

Looks very nice Darryl. Hard to believe I'm affecting the travels of people on the other side of the planet! waytogo.gif

 

You have no idea how frustrating wind has been for me this year, although you will soon wink.gif. It has killed so many nights that were otherwise perfect for the CGEM DX/C14. If there is even a little breeze, it throws off the aim. I've been using the AVX/C8 a lot more since it can take the hits. The bright side is that I wouldn't have captured the impact if we took out the C14 that night (which we almost did).

 

I really need to figure out how to get proper color with my ASI224MC. I used to be happy with the colors I got from it, but I gave up and use mono exclusively because no amount of adjustment makes me happy.

 

BTW, is there a reason you explicitly type in the number of frames you want instead of the percentage? I see the first post uses 16211/54200 (30%), and the second post uses 8222/54233 (15%).


Edited by AstroEthan, 14 August 2019 - 06:42 AM.

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#8 aeroman4907

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 06:28 AM

Thanks for the post Darryl.  Very nice images.  I am at a complete loss how your surface winds can be so bad but seeing so good.  I guess that just never happens in my part of the world and I have only imaged from one place.  The problems of living on the leeward side of a massive mountain range I guess...



#9 Foc

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 07:36 AM

Great detailed images and your travels (travails?) really broaden our minds!


Edited by Foc, 14 August 2019 - 07:44 AM.

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#10 HentySky

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 08:01 AM

Darryl, great detail in the GRS, fantastic result under your trying conditions.

 

I am in AstroEthan's court, I find getting the colour balance with the ASI224MC difficult so I general don't bother with it, I get a much better result with the 290MM, but looking at your images you certainly have that down to a fine art.

 

I was looking at your comments on seeing in my last post, and it is not an exact science.  I class great seeing when the Jovian moons are relatively steady disks  in the eyepiece, but each is to their own judgement on this.  I suspect Mars is a little different as it is predominantly in the red spectrum.  Incidentally, when the winds are from the east here the seeing is rubbish, when the winds are from the west the seeing is great (generally) irrespective of how strong the winds are.



#11 DMach

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 10:27 AM

Another tasty selection of images Darryl, congrats!

 

 

You have no idea how frustrating wind has been for me this year, although you will soon wink.gif. It has killed so many nights that were otherwise perfect for the CGEM DX/C14. If there is even a little breeze, it throws off the aim. I've been using the AVX/C8 a lot more since it can take the hits. The bright side is that I wouldn't have captured the impact if we took out the C14 that night (which we almost did).

Seems wind is a common bane at the moment - breezy nights have been common of late here as well, which is a little unusual when the sky is clear here. (More often means heavy rain is on the way!)



#12 KiwiRay

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 11:35 AM

Beautifully smooth processing, and very natural colours - great work, Darryl!

 

So can you somehow discard the frames with a cut planet before stacking?  I seem to recall some feature for detecting such frames, but I couldn't get it to help, and I usually just give up stacking such captures.  Your post #5 suggests you're perhaps manually selecting frames for inclusion, which sounds much harder than manually excluding frames.  I don't know how to do either.



#13 kevinbreen

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 02:53 PM

Looks very nice Darryl. Hard to believe I'm affecting the travels of people on the other side of the planet! waytogo.gif

 

You have no idea how frustrating wind has been for me this year, although you will soon wink.gif. It has killed so many nights that were otherwise perfect for the CGEM DX/C14. If there is even a little breeze, it throws off the aim. I've been using the AVX/C8 a lot more since it can take the hits. The bright side is that I wouldn't have captured the impact if we took out the C14 that night (which we almost did).

 

I really need to figure out how to get proper color with my ASI224MC. I used to be happy with the colors I got from it, but I gave up and use mono exclusively because no amount of adjustment makes me happy.

 

BTW, is there a reason you explicitly type in the number of frames you want instead of the percentage? I see the first post uses 16211/54200 (30%), and the second post uses 8222/54233 (15%).

 

Oh you experts!

 

Wind has been affecting me here too, it must be all the beans. 



#14 kevinbreen

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 02:57 PM

Stunning images, as usual. I love the detail within the GRS! As the GRS is about the size of the Earth now, give or take, it follows that should you ever travel to Jupiter Darryl with your C14 and land on a moon and train your scope on the distant earth you would be able to make out continents and oceans. Which is pretty amazing imho.


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#15 Kokatha man

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 07:31 PM

BTW, is there a reason you explicitly type in the number of frames you want instead of the percentage? I see the first post uses 16211/54200 (30%), and the second post uses 8222/54233 (15%).

 

 

So can you somehow discard the frames with a cut planet before stacking?  I seem to recall some feature for detecting such frames, but I couldn't get it to help, and I usually just give up stacking such captures.  Your post #5 suggests you're perhaps manually selecting frames for inclusion, which sounds much harder than manually excluding frames.  I don't know how to do either.

Thanks to everyone for responding with comments &/or "Likes." smile.gif

 

Ethan, that was 18,222 frames for the second example although you cannot see it clearly: part of my point was that when the image AS!3 selects as the "best" is compromised by being "split" or a half-frame (fantastic contrast variations then! lol.gif ) then the graph values become rather meaningless...clouds render poor ratings for dimmer frames also.

 

So in those circumstances where it's rather meaningless to decide upon 4.5% or 2.5% cut-offs lol.gif I find it much better to simply eyeball the frames as I scroll through them after the "Analyse" stage of AS!3.

 

Of course I don't look at them all rofl2.gif but if I get to (say) 2.5% & stop & look at one & decide I can include that group I'll just go to where 2.5% turns into 2.4% & choose that as the cut-off...it's not hard to develop an eye for it unless the frames are all really bad.

 

I have to add that originally I used % but because I'm left-handed or maybe just crazy I "invert" many situations & originally thought that if I typed "65%" (for example) AS!3 would keep all those frames at 65% or better in the stack - instead of actually keeping 65% of the entire stack..! lol.gif

 

The "revelation" that I was end-up had me then paying a bit more attention to the actual individual frames (from a broad perspective) & in these circumstances led me to what I consider a more informed decision - but there's probably a bit of both the % quality & the appearance of the individual frame in most situations... wink.gif

 

Ray, in that horribly split frame AS!3 chose as the "best" I simply use the keyboard space bar to deselect it from the mix: running the avi through PIPP is the surest way to get rid of all broken or split frames where you can also crop or enlarge each frame in the new avi PIPP creates - this is helpful if you have started out with a small ROI to capture sometimes because if the background is "tight" around the planet due to said it can be difficult placing MAPs near the edge (but not too near!) Unfortunately this is what causes the laptop version to jack up! frown.gif

 

I should add here that it is ridiculous to go through 5,000 or 15,000 frames using the space bar to delete "bad 'uns" but in practise I find that the broken/partial frames (those where the red area impinges or cuts off the actual planet) is irrelevant & you don't need to worry about them being in the end-stack.....it's just those that are split like the example that I will weed out.

 

But time to reload PIPP I think because tbh I'd feel much more confident about AS!3 working at its most efficient without all the dross that was in these captures! lol.gif

 

Kevin, I'll post some enlarged GRS images later as well as something else that gives an idea of just how bad those winds were...

 

Quite a bit of work to do in the next few days...got home & found the caravan door had locked itself from the inside & the only thing was to remove the front window (these are screwed & siliconed in!!!) & crawl inside to unlock the door, which we did in the dark the night we got home from a 650km drive...& the night before last the EQ8 played up on the 1x slew/drift correction rate...so I need to give that my pretty immediate attention even though we do have the EQ6 that carried the C14 for quite a few years before we got the EQ8 - hopefully I can sort out the problem! fingerscrossed.gif


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#16 Tulloch

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 08:07 PM

Hi there, great images (as always), but I was wondering how auto-guiding copes with split frames? I noticed a comment where you said you had to struggle to keep the planet on the sensor - do you autoguide or jog the mount manually?

 

Thanks,

 

Andrew



#17 Kokatha man

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Posted 15 August 2019 - 02:44 AM

I don't think auto-guiding would've coped with the movement that night Andrew - the only time I can recall anything worse was whilst Mars imaging at Stonefield, North of Sedan back in 2012 or 2014...those images turned out quite well also!

 

I have used autoguide a few times in the past but prefer just correcting by hand...nor do we usually bother with the FC cut-out feature either: I just think this night the winds were too savage anyway.

 

Hardest was checking focus after each capture because the image was bouncing &/or ricocheting all over the place much of the time except for in the lulls - but the bonus (besides good captures) was that it is the first time in ages that we didn't have to worry about defogging the corrector plate - it was reasonably warm (♎ 8°C) as well as windy. smile.gif

 

Here's the GRS close-ups I mentioned in the edited first post just now - this is 1200 pixels wide so it will need clicking on. wink.gif

 

j2019-08-10_GRSx4#1a.png

 

 


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#18 Rouzbeh

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Posted 15 August 2019 - 08:17 AM

Another set of beautiful images. 

Thanks for sharing the images and AS3 screenshots.

Looks like you had an adventurous night smile.gif.



#19 AstroDan2015

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Posted 15 August 2019 - 09:00 PM

WOW... The pictures say it all, loud and clear. Congrats... Mo!



#20 Az Frank

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Posted 15 August 2019 - 10:45 PM

Another fine example of your work Darryl thanks again for sharing!

#21 AstroEthan

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Posted 16 August 2019 - 01:29 AM

BTW Darryl, I should've asked earlier, but did you run the raw data through DeTeCt? wink.gif



#22 Kokatha man

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Posted 16 August 2019 - 07:46 PM

Thanks for the posts & "likes" from everyone - appreciated! smile.gif

 

I pm'd you last night Ethan, but for the public record I don't get into DeTeCt - as I said to Ethan I have more than enough on my plate! lol.gif

 

Despite the satisfaction from getting nice Jovian outcomes I am really waiting for Neptune to present at a more sociable hour tbh...& atm I've nearly finished the basic layering of a 26-frame animation from this night's data (52 for the reversing) as well as looking at a linear map version & a couple of other thoughts: looking at the bottom bar of my pc lately it's nothing unusual for up to half a dozen software applications to be open with at least 2 running at the same time...it slows things down as it is so I have no desire to start anything else as well if it isn't high on my priorities! wink.gif



#23 Vega700

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Posted 16 August 2019 - 10:27 PM

Excelent as usual Darryl waytogo.gif I could well imagine the cold nights there, here has been around 8 degrees which is cold enough. 




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