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Help installing Pegasus FocusCube 2 on Esprit 100

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#1 Marcelofig

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Posted 30 August 2019 - 05:38 PM

I am installing the Pegasus FocusCube 2 on my SW Esprit 100 and I have a question. Do I need to remove these screws first to install the bracket that holds the engine with its own screws?

 

Thank you,

 

Esprit 100 Focuser

 



#2 barbarosa

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Posted 30 August 2019 - 06:48 PM

I don't have one but I am in the market. In this image  the first pair of holes in your image (top arrow) are visible in the third slot. The open hole to the focus knob shaft is visible in the second slot. That makes it the second pair (lower arrow) if you are a betting man.

 

What does PegasusAstro  say, if anything? 



#3 Marcelofig

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Posted 30 August 2019 - 08:10 PM

Thanks for the answer.

 

What I'm basically asking is if I need to remove any screws first. I don't want to make a mistake and then damage the focuser.

 

(the installation manual doesn't mention the need to remove a screw, it just vaguely points out that you have to fix the bracket using some hole available).



#4 FlankerOneTwo

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Posted 31 August 2019 - 10:48 AM

I'll admit I'm a little reluctant to remove focuser mounting or tension screws, which I think are what you are pointing at - I don't have your exact scope however, so take with a grain of salt. I ended up removing the knurled focuser lock screw and using a single screw into that hole on my large FeatherTouch focuser.



#5 barbarosa

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Posted 31 August 2019 - 01:07 PM

It appears from posts elsewhere that the four corner screws hold the the knob and pinion gear assembly to the body. The other pairs of holes hold adjustment/locating screws.  Here is the image from the other thread.

 

post-86253-0-90749500-1474070497.jpg

 

Note however the arrangement of the holes in the focuser pictured above do not match those in the OP's image. Possibly this is the older version discussed in the thread. The Op's image matches  what I see on my 120 which I believe to be the current version. Inspecting the holes and the heads of the fasteners I think the outer pair (largest spacing) are the mounting screws and the  inner pair (smaller spacing) are locating screws.

 

If I had to bet I would use the larger/outer pair for the focus cube.  But the wiser course would be to ask the company which of the holes in your image you should use. Then please keep us advised about your progress and hopefully your satisfaction with the Cube 2.


Edited by barbarosa, 31 August 2019 - 06:50 PM.


#6 barbarosa

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Posted 06 September 2019 - 08:22 PM

The Cube 2 does not fit the current Esprit focuser. The holes do not align. 

 

I spoke with a dealer who gave the Cube 2 high marks and who offered to check the fit on a current Esprit 120. They don't match although he said that it might be possible to modify the bracket to fit.

 

Very disappointing I was reaching for my credit card. There is a much more expensive solution from Starlight. Hurry up ZWO!



#7 Marcelofig

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Posted 07 September 2019 - 12:09 AM

Yes, it does fit using the small holes in the picture above, a little tight, but it does. However:

 

1) You have to remove two small screws that prevent you from screwing something there.

 

2) A longer pair of screws is also needed, as the ones provided are very short and do not reach the internal thread.

 

 

Unfortunately I don't have any pictures at the moment, the telescope is outside and covered by a cover at the moment. But this image was taken by the Esprit 100 and Cube 2. And I really got some nice autofocus V curves with SGP.

 

Optec's solution seems to be also very good, but it's expensive (Tolga seems to be the only distributor that has it listed for the Esprit at the moment).


Edited by Marcelofig, 07 September 2019 - 12:09 AM.


#8 barbarosa

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Posted 07 September 2019 - 04:31 PM

Glad you were able to fit it. I wonder though about the original purpose of those screws. If as the images suggest they are locating, grub or tension screws what may happen if the replacement screws used for the bracket are not exactly the same length?

 

Pegasus still has not replied to my question via their contact form. The "send me a copy button doesn't seem to work" so I sent an email to support this morning. I will post any response or absence of a response. It is a simple question and I really hope for a positive response, one that explains why it is OK to replace those recessed screws and which size screws including length are required.

 

I'm not bashing Pegasus, the Cube looks like a great choice and I want to buy one. 



#9 Marcelofig

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Posted 07 September 2019 - 08:21 PM

Well, I also think they're tension screws. But I guess as long as another screw does that job the focus will work well and so far I haven't had any problems.

 

I also think the motor itself helps maintain tension.

 

Regarding Pegasus it is rare that they don't respond, I sent them an email last Friday week and Saturday morning they had already responded (long weekend). I did write directly to the support mail: support [at] pegasusastro.com .


Edited by Marcelofig, 07 September 2019 - 08:24 PM.


#10 barbarosa

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Posted 08 September 2019 - 12:13 PM

I received an almost immediate  response to my email yesterday and it said in pertinent part,

 

"Thanks for reaching out. We got both of your emails. Angelos, my colleague is going to reply to you as soon as possible.

In short there is no issue with the Esprit and we have attached the FocusCube easily to this telescope. Please wait for a more detailed answer from Angelos."

 

I will share the detailed response when it arrives. I may as well go for the porcine entirety send a copy to SW for their opinion and if I get a response i will share it. 



#11 barbarosa

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:42 PM

UPDATE

 

I've exchanged emails with PegasusAstro  and with Skywatcher and recieved good replies from both companies. Alas they do not agree about the mounting points for the Cube 2. This image shows the holes which both Pegasus and SW agree should be used to mount the Cube2

 

skywatcher esprit 22661.jpg

 

However it would seem that these holes don't align with a slot in the bracket and the next set closer to the center and farther from the knob have been used instead. Pegasus is aware of this but says that they have no reports of it causing a problem.

 

SW says,

 

On the Esprit as you have seen there are two sets of screws. The outer screws (in the corners) are the mounting screws. These keep the focuser block mounted to the focusing housing. The smaller inner screws are leveling screws, these ensure the focuser axle is in the correct position. Too close and the rack [and] pinion gears can jam. Too far and you get backlash in the rack and pinion.

The only screws that should be removed are the large mounting screws but they need to be replaced in order to keep the block mounted correctly. (emphasis added)

 

SW recommends the Optec Inc focuser. But their reply carries the implication  that Pegasus Astro might so well to approach SW about the Cube2 ,

 

We have never worked with any of the Pegasus Astro products. We are seeing more enquirers about their products on our equipment however. We cannot comment on their compatibility as we have never worked with them in person. We try to recommend products we have actually tested so we can make certain they work from our experience.

 

I appreciate the time spent by Pegasus Astro in responding to my series of messages. I will email them to relay the message from SW and also to suggest that they try installing the bracket with a reduced shank screw. The images they provided suggest that might overcome the slight offset of the slots in the bracket.

 

At this point I will not buy the Cube2 for my Esprit 120.



#12 barbarosa

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:46 PM

Image from Pegasus with all of the holes labeled.

 

Pegasus 2  motor on a skywatcher esprit2658.jpg



#13 barbarosa

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:48 PM

Workaround  by using a longer dovetail bar.

 

Bracket on Bar.png



#14 JayS_CT

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Posted 10 September 2019 - 09:28 AM

It appears from posts elsewhere that the four corner screws hold the the knob and pinion gear assembly to the body. The other pairs of holes hold adjustment/locating screws.  Here is the image from the other thread.

 

post-86253-0-90749500-1474070497.jpg

 

Note however the arrangement of the holes in the focuser pictured above do not match those in the OP's image. Possibly this is the older version discussed in the thread. The Op's image matches  what I see on my 120 which I believe to be the current version. Inspecting the holes and the heads of the fasteners I think the outer pair (largest spacing) are the mounting screws and the  inner pair (smaller spacing) are locating screws.

 

If I had to bet I would use the larger/outer pair for the focus cube.  But the wiser course would be to ask the company which of the holes in your image you should use. Then please keep us advised about your progress and hopefully your satisfaction with the Cube 2.

Barbarosa..

Just curious if we're 100% sure that the picture posted with the holes all aligned is an Esprit 100 or a 120??  I took delivery of a 120 just last year (from SkyWatcher directly so not older vendor stock) and the bottom of my focuser looks like the OPs, not the one above..  Would make a huge difference in whether or not the Cube2 L bracket might work I'm thinking.

UPDATE:  I was able to confirm that the focuser in the above image is an Esprit 80, not a 100/120/150 therefore anything relative to mount points for the 120 should reference the screw placement on the original poster's image.  The outer two screws can and should be used for the L bracket..  Hope this helps!!!

Jay S.


Edited by JayS_CT, 10 September 2019 - 02:41 PM.


#15 barbarosa

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Posted 10 September 2019 - 01:42 PM

I did not find any images of the workings of the current focuser and I am not going to disassemble mine. However my 120 was purchased last year and the focuser is the same as the one in the top post.

 

The OP used the inner pair and says so far no problems. He referenced this video, https://www.youtube....h?v=KELpAyFq0UQ

 

Both Pegasus and SW agree that the recessed screws are functional. Pegasus says that they have been used by others. It could be that SW is taking a cautious position in saying not to use them because any problem would come back to them. Each of us must decide just what they intended to convey. I have decided not to try using the small holes.

 

I shared the SW email with Pegasus  and I suggested that they should try a pair of reduced shank M4 screws to see if the smaller shank will clear what appears from the images to be a slight offset from the recommended holes. The smaller shank diameter and maybe a careful and small enlargement of the slot might do the trick. But I am not going to buy a Cube2 in order to experiment. I can see the dealer looking unhappy if I returned a bracket  that showed signs of having been drilled, milled or filed.

 

A fellow who knows this sort of work and is unfortunately for me in NZ says that it would take only a few minutes to run up a bracket that would fit, but I don't have his skill set or access to a shop so that won't work for me. Actually if I had a non-returnable Cube2 I think I see a couple of ways to modify the stock bracket to salvage the bracket if as is likely I failed to measure 3 times and sleep on it.  The one thing I would not try is using the inner pair of screws.



#16 JayS_CT

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Posted 10 September 2019 - 07:20 PM

I did not find any images of the workings of the current focuser and I am not going to disassemble mine. However my 120 was purchased last year and the focuser is the same as the one in the top post.

 

The OP used the inner pair and says so far no problems. He referenced this video, https://www.youtube....h?v=KELpAyFq0UQ

 

Both Pegasus and SW agree that the recessed screws are functional. Pegasus says that they have been used by others. It could be that SW is taking a cautious position in saying not to use them because any problem would come back to them. Each of us must decide just what they intended to convey. I have decided not to try using the small holes.

 

I shared the SW email with Pegasus  and I suggested that they should try a pair of reduced shank M4 screws to see if the smaller shank will clear what appears from the images to be a slight offset from the recommended holes. The smaller shank diameter and maybe a careful and small enlargement of the slot might do the trick. But I am not going to buy a Cube2 in order to experiment. I can see the dealer looking unhappy if I returned a bracket  that showed signs of having been drilled, milled or filed.

 

A fellow who knows this sort of work and is unfortunately for me in NZ says that it would take only a few minutes to run up a bracket that would fit, but I don't have his skill set or access to a shop so that won't work for me. Actually if I had a non-returnable Cube2 I think I see a couple of ways to modify the stock bracket to salvage the bracket if as is likely I failed to measure 3 times and sleep on it.  The one thing I would not try is using the inner pair of screws.

I was just referring to your picture posted in post #5.  That's an Esprit 80.  My Esprit 120 matches the top one as well.  There shouldn't be an issue aligning the L Bracket to the outer screws. People may be using the inner two, but those are the adjustment for the tension on the worm gear.  It may work, but probably better just to use two longer screws on the outer two holes like the picture that was suppled by Pegasus which was correctly labeled as not touching the inner holes.  The only reason I'm bringing it up was in your description in that post you mentioned it might be an older version of the 120 focuser when it's not the 120 focuser at all.  So again I don't see why someone can't use the two outer holes with perhaps longer screws (30mm) which Pegasus recommended.  It just seems this thread got off track with some misinformation or images that were not relative to the OPs original request.

Again, bottom line, on a 120 Esprit, you can use the two outer holes, with longer screws, and the L Bracket from all appearances...

Clear skies to all!!

Jay S.



#17 barbarosa

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Posted 11 September 2019 - 04:15 AM

Again, bottom line, on a 120 Esprit, you can use the two outer holes, with longer screws, and the L Bracket from all appearances...

I am sorry if linking in that older thread confused the issue. Because of course the topic is the fit on the current focuser.  But no matter we are on the same page about which two screws should be used. The problem is that is not what the OP did and implication in the Pegasus email is that others have also used the inner adjustment screw holes. The dealer who actually looked at the bracket and a current 120 said that the slots in the bracket do not align with the outer holes, He did add that he thought a modification was possible..

 

If someone has been able to mount the bracket as it should be done I would be delighted to read about it and to see an image.

 

If it in fact the bracket is not a good fit  Pegasus is in a position try and modify a bracket, and either supply them or provide instructions for a sanctioned user mod. Heck if they send me an extra bracket I would be willing to buy a Cube and see if my drill press and Dremmel tool are up to the job. If I failed I guess I would be out the cost of returning the unused Cube.



#18 barbarosa

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Posted 12 September 2019 - 07:22 PM

 I have on good authority, the best, that Pegasus Astro is preparing a video to show how to properly mount the bracket to an Esprit 100.  One question remains which is are the 3" focusers in the Esprit line up all the same.  If they are then my finger hovers over the buy button.smile.gif

 

Here is a a single image. It looks like a go, but it also looks a bit different from other images, it could be perspective or some simple difference, say in how far the shaft is inserted in the 5 to 6mm coupling.

 

bracket alinged correctly.jpg


Edited by barbarosa, 12 September 2019 - 09:15 PM.


#19 barbarosa

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Posted 15 September 2019 - 12:07 PM

SW confirms that the current Esprit 100mm, 120mm, and 150 use exactly the same focuser. So if the Cube2 fits any one of them it should fit the others.

 

Comes now an experienced refractor owner, imager and seller of astronomy gear who seeing the image and SW's confirmation that the focuser is the same successfully installed a Cube 2 on a 120mm Esprit, with a bit of finagling (reversing the finder scope mount).  

 

I still want to see the video but really I am sold on the Cube2 for the Esprit 120.

 

 

 



#20 D Kusz

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Posted 16 September 2019 - 08:49 PM

Just installed the V2 on my Esprit 120 last week, took literally 5 minutes. removed two inner screws and fitted cube on and used the supplied screws that came with the cube. Works great!

  20190916_184238.jpg



#21 Marcelofig

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Posted 16 September 2019 - 09:00 PM

Just installed the V2 on my Esprit 120 last week, took literally 5 minutes. removed two inner screws and fitted cube on and used the supplied screws that came with the cube. Works great!

  attachicon.gif 20190916_184238.jpg

That's exactly what I did with my Esprit 100. I don't have any pictures at the moment, the telescope is outside doing its job right now, but it looks exactly like yours.



#22 JayS_CT

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 04:12 PM

Just installed the V2 on my Esprit 120 last week, took literally 5 minutes. removed two inner screws and fitted cube on and used the supplied screws that came with the cube. Works great!

  attachicon.gif 20190916_184238.jpg

I know it works, but it is recommended you use the outer two holes.  The inner holes are for tensioning and backlash adjustments on the focuser gearing.  It means some longer screws, but leaves the factory set tension as is..

Jay S.



#23 barbarosa

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 06:20 PM

Just installed the V2 on my Esprit 120 last week, took literally 5 minutes. removed two inner screws and fitted cube on and used the supplied screws that came with the cube. Works great!

  attachicon.gif 20190916_184238.jpg

So far we have a few guys using the "wrong" holes and not reporting a problem. I hope you won't chortle lol.gif when I say that to me this doe not seem the best method. 

 

Pegasus and Sky Watcher say it is wrong and a Sky Watcher dealer says that he was able to install the Cube2 on an Esprit 120  using the correct holes by reversing the finder scope mounting base so as to put the hold down screw on the opposite side. 

 

However, "This is Liberty Hall; you can spit on the mat and call the cat a ****!".shocked.gif



#24 gomezdb

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Posted 25 October 2019 - 10:41 PM

Hello there,

 

Any update regarding this topic? Can the inner holes be used or not?

 

 I know SW doesn’t recommend using them (They confirmed me this while ago) but again it seems that there’re fellows using them without problems.

 

Clear skies!

Diego



#25 Lead_Weight

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Posted 04 August 2020 - 11:13 AM

It's been some time since this post has seen an update. I've recently purchased an Esprit 100 and FocusCube 2 with universal bracket. 

 

I followed the guide provided on the Pegasus Astro website, and when using the outer holes as indicated in this post and in their instructions, the focus motor shaft is not close enough to the focuser shaft to use the provided coupler. The only way I could see to move the bracket closer, to get the two shafts together (and still have access to the grub screws to tighten the shaft), was to use the outer most hole on the focuser (right at the tip of the focuser) with one of the included screws and multiple washers to make sure that the length of the screw did not interfere with the coupler rotation.

 

See images here on how I mounted it. I'm currently talking with Pegasus Astro support about if this is good enough, or if it can be mounted some other way. I feel since the bracket is not perfectly flush against the focuser, and only held on by one screw that this is not ideal, and could over time cause metal fatigue in the screw hole used, and possibly break the focuser at this point.

 

I tried to use the inner holes as some others in this thread have done, but the included screws did not fit the holes.

 

IMG_2179.jpeg

 

IMG_2180.jpeg


Edited by Lead_Weight, 04 August 2020 - 11:14 AM.



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