Jump to content

  •  

CNers have asked about a donation box for Cloudy Nights over the years, so here you go. Donation is not required by any means, so please enjoy your stay.

Photo

Apertura 6inch F4 Imaging Newt

NV reflector
  • Please log in to reply
30 replies to this topic

#1 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 19 September 2019 - 08:42 PM

Got my Apertura 6inch F4 Imaging Newtonian today. It's really good!

 

Resized 20190919 173331 5273

 

It comes with quite a lot of stuff for $299 shipped. Although one thing I found interesting was no manual. Sure, I don't really need one, but someone new to telescopes would.

 

The fit and finish is pretty good. Not quite premium telescope quality, but I'd say it's the same as an Orion scope quality.

 

Resized 20190919 211521 6039

 

The mirror looks very good. Center spotted and collimation turned out to be very easy (because luckily the secondary mirror was centered under the focuser). I had to adjust the secondary tilt and the primary mirror. I want to say thank you to the late Howie Glatter for his tools. I used my Glatter lazer (for secondary tilt) and Tublug barlowed lazer for primary adjustment. Three lock screws and three adjusters. Very easy to collimate with those tools. I was almost regretting getting another newt because I hate secondary collimation (especially if the secondary is way off). But no issues here luckily.

 

The focuser works quite well. I did have to use the included extension tube to reach focus in eyepeices and the mod 3. While I could then get focus with the GSO .5, it didn't appear to really work with this setup. Things were just a bit weird...such as, on axis, the nebula didn't look bright, but off axis it was better. And something up top was darker. No idea what was going on there. But the .7 Antares worked great. It was a great image with and without the reducer.

 

Star tests showed very good on both sides of focus. So it's certainly a nice scope. Jupiter and Saturn looked pretty decent.

 

So, coma wasn't such an issue on axis...but if you wanted to get both the Lagoon and the Trifid in the same view (which is possible), then coma was for sure an issue. I'll have to consider what to do for the coma. Let me know if any of you have done any solutions. I don't really want to pay too much at this point. And I don't think I need it right now.

 

Riding on my old original Vixen Porta mount was quite good actually. One of the reasons I got the 6 inch vice a larger one. I couldn't get all the way to zenith, but pretty close. I may try my FTX at some point also. And of course I can use my GPD2 which I've modified for GOTO. Especially if I want to do tracking and GOTO. However, I'm more of an alt/az kind of guy. Which is pretty easy to do with NV.

 

So personally I'm very impressed by the scope. I have flocking paper on the way. This will be much easier to flock compared to my 10 inch dob. While planetary and lunar observing isn't going to be the primary focus (see what I did there), I still like to take care of stray light as much as possible. And heck...where I am using this neighbors have a ton of lights on all the time.

 

Looks like this is the same scope as the Astrotech and probably a few others. I would have got the Astrotech but it was out of stock.

 


  • eros312, Ed D, OleCuss and 3 others like this

#2 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 19 September 2019 - 08:47 PM

Forgot the say, while the image wasn't quite as good as my 10 inch dob...it was not too far off. The good thing here is I can keep this scope upstairs and it will be more grab and go. Whereas the 10 inch takes a lot of effort to lug upstairs. Now in all fairness the sky wasn't as good tonight. But just my initial impression is the 10 inch was a bit better. 

 

All that being said, it's probably a Duh! The 10 inch is pretty fast also and larger aperture. But I felt like this setup was closer in capability as far as NV goes. Using eyepeices  it would be much bigger a gap I believe.



#3 AlienRatDog

AlienRatDog

    Mercury-Atlas

  • *****
  • Posts: 2969
  • Joined: 15 Jul 2005
  • Loc: Ann Arbor

Posted 20 September 2019 - 10:16 AM

I was thinking of this scope in conjunction with a skywatcher Quattro coma corrector, I wonder if these work together?

#4 Rickster

Rickster

    Viking 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 831
  • Joined: 09 Jun 2008
  • Loc: NC Kansas Bortle 3 SQM 21.8+

Posted 20 September 2019 - 12:36 PM

I use the GSO made coma corrector with mine (Astro Tech AT6IN).  It is made by the same manufacturer that makes the scope.  Like the scopes, the CCs are sold under various brand names (Astrotech, High Point, etc).  I also use the same CC in my 16" f4.4 Sky Watcher.  Like all CCs, getting the spacing correct is necessary for the best results.  There is a big thread in the AP forums on these CCs.  I have an old thread where I combined one with an Antares 0.7X reducer to get 0.55x when used with a PVS-7/NAIT adapter.  Worked OK.  I also use it with DSLRs.  All things considered, I have been happy with mine.



#5 The Ardent

The Ardent

    Aurora

  • *****
  • Moderators
  • Posts: 4510
  • Joined: 24 Oct 2008
  • Loc: Virginia

Posted 20 September 2019 - 12:42 PM

How did you find out about it???

#6 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 21 September 2019 - 06:52 PM

I ordered the paracorr 2...really should have had one for the 10 inch anyways.

#7 Eddgie

Eddgie

    ISS

  • *****
  • Posts: 24598
  • Joined: 01 Feb 2006

Posted 22 September 2019 - 11:42 AM

Ouch..  I only just saw this and was going to recommend the Baader MPCC.   

 

The Baader MPCC has the advantage of not raising magnification and it can also be made to work exceptionally well with a filter wheel. 

 

While it might not be as good as a Paracorr when working with ultra-wide field eyepieces, it works great at f/4 with NV.

 

Cheap enough that you should still consider getting one for use with your f/4.  Just mount it on the filter wheel and leave it.  At f/4, you can use the standard 1.25" eyepiece holder so you only need to add a small spacer between the front of the filter wheel and the MPCC...

 

Boren Simon on Minitower.jpg

 

There is nothing like having a filter wheel, but (and this is a big one), if the only scope you are going to use it in is the f/4, it makes sense.

 

Otherwise, I recommend a filter drawer or slide.  The filter wheel or filter drawer are both cheap, but what is not cheap is the filters, so the drawer lets you keep your filters in a box and swap them without having to screw them in and out of the filter wheel.  

 

Much faster than f/4, and the device really needs to be mounted directly to the top of the filter wheel, or the filter will be far enough ahead of the device that it will vignette the field.  Again, at f/4, you can use the eyepiece holder and kind of be OK but faster than f/4 and the filter has to be kept pretty close to the front of the ND device if you want to avoid vignetting.   While the above pic shows using the eyepiece holder at f/4, mostly I actually use the scope above at f/2.8, so I direct connect the NV device to the filter wheel as shown here:

 

130PDS R.jpg


Edited by Eddgie, 22 September 2019 - 11:47 AM.

  • wargrafix likes this

#8 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 22 September 2019 - 12:04 PM

I was hoping to use it visually as well. So hopefully it works well with both situations. I did look at that a bit but it seemed like the paracorr was worth trying.

 

I used to have one of the earlier paracorrs and it was nice. 

 

I also used to have the GSO one, but I didn't like it...too much of a hassle I found.



#9 Rickster

Rickster

    Viking 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 831
  • Joined: 09 Jun 2008
  • Loc: NC Kansas Bortle 3 SQM 21.8+

Posted 22 September 2019 - 12:58 PM

I use the GSO made coma corrector with mine (Astro Tech AT6IN).  It is made by the same manufacturer that makes the scope.  Like the scopes, the CCs are sold under various brand names (Astrotech, High Point, etc).  I also use the same CC in my 16" f4.4 Sky Watcher.  Like all CCs, getting the spacing correct is necessary for the best results.  There is a big thread in the AP forums on these CCs.  I have an old thread where I combined one with an Antares 0.7X reducer to get 0.55x when used with a PVS-7/NAIT adapter.  Worked OK.  I also use it with DSLRs.  All things considered, I have been happy with mine.

Correction.  It was the 0.5X Antares focal reducer (not the 0.7x).  This was the thread.  https://www.cloudyni...es#entry9443925


  • cmooney91 likes this

#10 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 24 September 2019 - 09:13 PM

Well, unfortunately I am going to return the Paracorr. I couldn't get it to work correctly with the 6 inch F4 newt and my mod 3. I had to take the extension out, and pull the Paracorr out a few inches. But when doing that, I got vignetting. It did seem to work OK for eyepieces, but my main purpose was for the Mod 3.

 

I guess the good news is the other options are a bit cheaper.

 

Oh well.



#11 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 25 September 2019 - 09:44 PM

Just a quick correction to my above post. I'm keeping the Paracorr, but it does not work with the Mod3 with the turn table top. I am going to try and figure out a way to get that working, but for visual the Paracorr is working nicely in this scope and my 10 inch dob. Though I think the paracorr and the 6 inch F4 is not a perfect match because of the way the extention is needed. So I personally would not suggest the Paracorr with this scope.

 

However, the paracorr seems quite good for my 10 inch.



#12 mikenoname

mikenoname

    Viking 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 509
  • Joined: 29 Jan 2015
  • Loc: Death Valley Region (Bortle 2 - SQM 21.9+)

Posted 26 September 2019 - 05:59 PM

 

Riding on my old original Vixen Porta mount was quite good actually. One of the reasons I got the 6 inch vice a larger one.

 

 

How much does one of these beauties weigh? I'm wondering if it would ride on my SLT mount.



#13 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 26 September 2019 - 06:12 PM

Think they are 10 poundsish. Only issue i have is zenith. Going to try my FTX tonight and see how that goes.

#14 mikenoname

mikenoname

    Viking 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 509
  • Joined: 29 Jan 2015
  • Loc: Death Valley Region (Bortle 2 - SQM 21.9+)

Posted 26 September 2019 - 07:03 PM

That is what I was afraid of, just a wee bit too heavy. Thanks! It looks like a great scope.



#15 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 26 September 2019 - 08:59 PM

Currently I'm thinking I don't need to use a coma corrector with the scope. Especially in F4 mode it's pretty nice. I think I actually prefer F4 to F2.8 at this point. Maybe just the size of the nebulas being a bit bigger.

 

It's really nice for NV in my opinion.

 

I tried out the FTX mount today. Took me a bit of time to get it balanced for the first time. Now I have marks and it will be easier. 

 

Once balanced the FTX is such a good mount. It's a bit of a pain to get everything 100%, but it does pay off with extremely smooth motions. You don't need slow motion controls with this mount. It's that smooth.

 

I couldn't quite get 100% vertical, but it was very close. The tube itself will hit the mount if I go strait up. A safety stop that's adjustable stops it from doing so.

 

I may try to do some photography with it (basic). Though I am fairly anti astro photography (hence why i'm loving NV).

 

A few pics on the FTX:

ftx2
ftx1


#16 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 26 September 2019 - 09:03 PM

I should mention I prefer the Vixen Porta Mount for ease of use and it's a bit lighter. But I have wooden legs and not sure if the normal Porta Mount would handle the scope as well. I suspect it would and if a bit shaky, celestron vibration pads would work. But I was able to get slightly more vertical with the FTX. 

 

One thing I can say as a slight negative is the tube rings do not allow for easy sliding of the OTA. You almost have to the rings half off to adjust the tube. So I'd imagine on an EQ mount it would be annoying for visual observing. 

 

I can try to find an extension sometime for the Vixen mount, but it's really quite good as is. It just happens that there are a ton of good nebulas at Zenith right now, so that's a consideration.


Edited by GOLGO13, 26 September 2019 - 09:05 PM.


#17 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 26 September 2019 - 09:49 PM

Also want to mention it appears to hold collimation quite well. I transported it a few times in and out of the house. Expecting to have to adjust with the barlowed lazer...and no, it was still spot on.



#18 StarCurious

StarCurious

    Messenger

  • *****
  • Posts: 407
  • Joined: 24 Dec 2012
  • Loc: York Region, Ontario

Posted 29 September 2019 - 01:10 AM

How much does one of these beauties weigh? I'm wondering if it would ride on my SLT mount.

I have the same OTA. F/4 6".

 

I saw this thread:

 

https://www.cloudyni...-a-6-reflector/

 

and I took a chance, and mount it on my SLT.  I had to remove the plastic cover of the mount head in order for the dovetail to connect properly.  The most important thing to do was to replace the weak tripod.  I bought a used 2" aluminum tripod that was from iOptron, and I got some hardware to connect the SLT head with the iOptron tripod. I have quite a few things loaded.  In addition to the OTA, I have a Starsense camera, a electronic filter wheel. I have added a electronic focuser, the focuser controller, a MiniPC, a USB hub, a serial interface between the mount and the PC, ASI 224MC camera and a big 20000 MAh 12v lithium ion battery. The idea was no cord wrap, completely remote controlled from indoors. I used this with Sharpcap Pro, remote control via Teamview, and it has been working.  I have been busy with other things in my life so I haven't used it for a year, but will get back to EAA soon.  See picture below:

 

https://www.cloudyni...aven/?p=8096417

 

Now don't hold me to this.  I cannot guarantee your results.  I took a risk and pushed the limit.  My SLT mount may die a premature death due to overload (or not).

 

Cheers,

Joseph


  • mikenoname likes this

#19 mikenoname

mikenoname

    Viking 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 509
  • Joined: 29 Jan 2015
  • Loc: Death Valley Region (Bortle 2 - SQM 21.9+)

Posted 29 September 2019 - 02:05 AM

Joseph,

 

Wow. That is certainly one loaded SLT!

 

But I hear you on the tripod. I built a heavy duty one based on the Eyes on The Sky design and my SLT now throws my Heritage 130 around with no issues. I even fashioned a hangar for the power tank which adds to the weight and stability.

 

IMG_20190926_232804560s.jpg

 

Others have reported using 12 pounds on their SLTs, so maybe this newt would be ok...



#20 StarCurious

StarCurious

    Messenger

  • *****
  • Posts: 407
  • Joined: 24 Dec 2012
  • Loc: York Region, Ontario

Posted 29 September 2019 - 01:32 PM

Mike,

 

Your tripod looks nice. I wish I have your woodworking skills.

 

I too at one time looked at the Skywatcher Heritage 130, to put onto the SLT mount.  The CN comments on the mount encouraged me to go to the 6".  I figured that if the SLT mount could handle 150mm/6in F/8, then it should be able to handle 150mm/6" F/4 - as long as I changed the tripod.  I added a stack of 4 squares (I don't have a router nor the skills to make them circular) cut out of 2x6 to make a "pier", in order to allow the OTA to go near zenith.



#21 mikenoname

mikenoname

    Viking 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 509
  • Joined: 29 Jan 2015
  • Loc: Death Valley Region (Bortle 2 - SQM 21.9+)

Posted 30 September 2019 - 12:09 AM

The CN comments on the mount encouraged me to go to the 6".  I figured that if the SLT mount could handle 150mm/6in F/8, then it should be able to handle 150mm/6" F/4 - as long as I changed the tripod.

 

I would be curious about what exactly these comments were. How heavy do people load these SLTs?

 

I really would be interested in this 6" f/4 if I thought the SLT could handle it.



#22 StarCurious

StarCurious

    Messenger

  • *****
  • Posts: 407
  • Joined: 24 Dec 2012
  • Loc: York Region, Ontario

Posted 30 September 2019 - 01:42 AM

https://www.cloudyni...ctor/?p=2105613

 

This was the post I read.

 

6" even at F/8 works if tripod is replaced by rigid pier.

 

The longer OTA is much more demanding on the mount than my F/4, almost half the length.  Not only is the metal tube longer and heavier, it also has greater moment of inertia on the motors. That's why F/4 6" works. 



#23 mikenoname

mikenoname

    Viking 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 509
  • Joined: 29 Jan 2015
  • Loc: Death Valley Region (Bortle 2 - SQM 21.9+)

Posted 30 September 2019 - 11:57 AM

Hmm. Interesting!



#24 GOLGO13

GOLGO13

    Skylab

  • *****
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 4280
  • Joined: 05 Nov 2005
  • Loc: West Virginia

Posted 30 September 2019 - 01:15 PM

My porta mount handles the 6 inch F4 quite well. It does hit the tripod a little in spots...in-between the legs I can get almost vertical. It's good enough for me at this point. I don't want to spend the money on a pier extension at this point.

 

But it handles it just fine...maybe because it's not a long tube.

 

I do have wooden legs on my porta mount though.

 

On an automated scope I'd be worried about hitting legs and messing up the gears or motors.



#25 mikenoname

mikenoname

    Viking 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 509
  • Joined: 29 Jan 2015
  • Loc: Death Valley Region (Bortle 2 - SQM 21.9+)

Posted 30 September 2019 - 03:39 PM

On an automated scope I'd be worried about hitting legs and messing up the gears or motors.

That's why there are slew limit settings on the SLT (and probably most if not all AltAz mounts). You give it an altitude slew limit of 75 degrees or whatever and if you try to slew to an object higher than that the HC spits out a warning. You can override it, but at least you have been warned. :)




CNers have asked about a donation box for Cloudy Nights over the years, so here you go. Donation is not required by any means, so please enjoy your stay.


Recent Topics







Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics