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Dobson 10 clash: Bressler vs Skywatcher vs Omegon

dob collimation equipment beginner
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#1 iMskywalker

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Posted 12 October 2019 - 11:38 AM

Hello to all the Cloudynights community!

 

First, thank you for accepting me. It’s an honor. My name is Miguel, I’m 43  and I’m from Portugal.

 

I’m starting this post after reading a bit of this and other forums and now I’ve decided to buy a 10” dob.

 

My problem is that I’m REALLY just starting, I admit I’m very excited and full of curiosity but with absolutely 0 experience in space observation. I can’t even point to the sky and say eitch constellation is it or planet etc. But I’m very eager to learn it all! ;-)

 

To do that, I’m currently considering these 3 telescopes to use with my 3 daughters in our weekend home in the country:

 

- Bresser Messier 254/1270: https://www.bresser....-10-Dobson.html

 

- Skywatcher 254/1200 Skyliner Pyrex: https://www.astrosho...ssic-dob/p,5025

 

- Omegon 254/1250 Advanced X N: https://www.astrosho...54-1250/p,53803

 

My doubts/questions:

- are teu the same and I should choose the less expensive one or do you recommend one in particular?

- I have absolutely no idea if the accessories that come with them are enough to start or if I should buy something else right away?

- Are there better options in the 500-850 dollar range?

 

Thank you so much,

Miguel


Edited by iMskywalker, 12 October 2019 - 09:01 PM.

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#2 jayrome

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Posted 12 October 2019 - 12:13 PM

Hello Miguel welcome to CloudyNights!

My father is Portuguese; we have lots of family there around Peniche, Caldas da Rainha..

I also have a 10" dob (Meade Lightbridge) - I don't have any experience with any of the 3 scopes you mention in your post however, the Bresser Messier looks pretty good though. I'm sure other members here will give you good advice to choose the best one.

Where in Portugal are you going to be doing your observing? How dark is the sky there?

 

clear skies! :)


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#3 Jond105

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Posted 12 October 2019 - 01:02 PM

Welcome to cloudy nights. 

 

Out if the 3 listed, I think the Bresser is the best looking to go with. I like how you have rings and can rotate the tube to put the eyepiece wherever you want, the bigger trunnions give you a bigger friction surface. I really like the Bresser/Explore Scientific type dobs, though I have never used them. Have used the 10” from Sky-Watcher. It is also a nice scope. The mirrors are good, the hand knobs help give you the right amount of tension to keep the scope moving smoothly for you to track. 


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#4 iMskywalker

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Posted 12 October 2019 - 07:32 PM

Hello Miguel welcome to CloudyNights!

My father is Portuguese; we have lots of family there around Peniche, Caldas da Rainha..

I also have a 10" dob (Meade Lightbridge) - I don't have any experience with any of the 3 scopes you mention in your post however, the Bresser Messier looks pretty good though. I'm sure other members here will give you good advice to choose the best one.

Where in Portugal are you going to be doing your observing? How dark is the sky there?

 

clear skies! smile.gif

Hi, thank you Jayrome! Wow Peniche is great... have you ever been there? I’m from Lisboa, but I love to go to Peniche sit at a restaurant near the sea and eat their EXCELENT sea food. It’s just wonderful.

I’ll be observing in a very small village called Sobral do Campo. It’s about 20Km from the nearest town, Castelo Branco. And yes, the sky is as dark as it gets! Not at my house itself, because  its near the road that has public lighting but, if I drive 2kms I’ll be virtually with no artificial light in sight.

I just can’t wait to buy this scope and go there and try it! :-D

 

And hows Canada for observing the sky?


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#5 iMskywalker

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Posted 12 October 2019 - 07:43 PM

Welcome to cloudy nights. 

 

Out if the 3 listed, I think the Bresser is the best looking to go with. I like how you have rings and can rotate the tube to put the eyepiece wherever you want, the bigger trunnions give you a bigger friction surface. I really like the Bresser/Explore Scientific type dobs, though I have never used them. Have used the 10” from Sky-Watcher. It is also a nice scope. The mirrors are good, the hand knobs help give you the right amount of tension to keep the scope moving smoothly for you to track. 

Hi Jond105,

Thank you for your answer. May I ask you if you saw any difference in the Pyrex vs normal scope? The Omegon has a flimsy fan powered by batteries at the bottom, but the Pyrex on the Sky-watcher is supposed to be even better... at least they say it’s awesome! lol.gif


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#6 Jond105

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Posted 12 October 2019 - 07:53 PM

The Omegon is using GSO mirrors as far as I can remember. The skywatcher views were phenomenal though. Compared to the 120ED and 100ED, once I added a coma corrector, the view blow away anything in the refractors. Especially clusters. 


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#7 jayrome

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 09:38 AM

Hi, thank you Jayrome! Wow Peniche is great... have you ever been there? I’m from Lisboa, but I love to go to Peniche sit at a restaurant near the sea and eat their EXCELENT sea food. It’s just wonderful.

I’ll be observing in a very small village called Sobral do Campo. It’s about 20Km from the nearest town, Castelo Branco. And yes, the sky is as dark as it gets! Not at my house itself, because  its near the road that has public lighting but, if I drive 2kms I’ll be virtually with no artificial light in sight.

I just can’t wait to buy this scope and go there and try it! :-D

 

And hows Canada for observing the sky?

Yes I've been there many times, and have enjoyed grilled peixe espada and espadarte among many others, I do miss it. I was just on Google Earth having a look at where Sobral do Campo is. 

Where I live in Canada is quite humid, sadly, clear skies don't happen as often as I'd like. Dew is a major problem here. But I make the best of it! It doesn't stop me from observing many deep sky objects as well as planets regularly. 

Have you done much astronomy before? It will be interesting to hear about your nights of observing once you get started.

enjoy!


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#8 iMskywalker

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 10:45 AM

The Omegon is using GSO mirrors as far as I can remember. The skywatcher views were phenomenal though. Compared to the 120ED and 100ED, once I added a coma corrector, the view blow away anything in the refractors. Especially clusters. 

Yes I believe you’re right. As far as I’ve read, Omegon is a GSO relabeling. But do you think thats a good or bad thing? smile.gif

 

After digging a bit more since yesterday, I read a Bresser Messier review mentioning some initial quality defects but on the other hand, everyone seems to mention the tube rings, the big alt bearings, then massive 2.5in hexagonal rack, the pinion focuser and the secondary adjustment screws: https://stargazerslo...10in-dobsonian/

Also, germans are known for their excelent quality and craftsmanship so I hope that, after 2 years from this review, they may have corrected the source for those initial complaints.

On top of that, Bresser online shop works beautifully (I’ve used it for microscope equipment) and that’s a plus. 

 

About the Skywatcher, I’ve only read good things so far! Everyone seems to love it’s image quality and, at the end of the day, isn’t it the most important thing? Specially if you’ll upgrade to a goto mount later on and want to keep the same tube?

 

thanks

Miguel


Edited by iMskywalker, 13 October 2019 - 11:41 AM.


#9 Jond105

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 10:51 AM

Having GSO certainly isn’t a bad thing. 

 

GSO has just as great of a reputation throughout as the Synta mirrors. I have never heard anything bad from GSO image quality just like I’ve never heard anything terribly bad about the Synta mirrors and image quality. 


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#10 iMskywalker

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 11:14 AM

Yes I've been there many times, and have enjoyed grilled peixe espada and espadarte among many others, I do miss it. I was just on Google Earth having a look at where Sobral do Campo is. 

Where I live in Canada is quite humid, sadly, clear skies don't happen as often as I'd like. Dew is a major problem here. But I make the best of it! It doesn't stop me from observing many deep sky objects as well as planets regularly. 

Have you done much astronomy before? It will be interesting to hear about your nights of observing once you get started.

enjoy!

Hi Jayrome,

Nope, I’ve never ever observed the space in a telescope. That’s why I’m so confused about tubes, eyepieces, bases etc... I’ve decided to take the plunge risking not to buy the perfect scope because this summer, in Sobral do Campo, in an incredible clear night, I was observing the sky with my family and  my 2 younger daughters told me that they would love to have a telescope, so I’ve decided to buy a very good one since that was a dream of mine for a long time. I’m the kind of guy that doesn’t miss a TV show about space for years but that can’t point at anything in the sky and say what is what.

But it’s never too late, and at 43 I think I can make up for the lost time if I get to it with serious dedication and some invaluable help from guys like yourself and everyone replies helping making this forums so important to keep the comunitário growing.

And yes, I’m very eager to start and start sharing my experience from observing from Portugal.

 

all the best,

Miguel


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#11 SloMoe

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 11:14 AM

Another plus for the Bresser and the tube rings is being able to slide the ota to help balance as you acquire heavier 2" eyepieces, and most likely in your location a cooling fan won't be needed.

 

To help find DSO's and identify them a good phone app is really nice to have, that is if there's service for them there.

Also what kind of lighting are you deasling with, if not LED's then the LP filters can help a lot.


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#12 iMskywalker

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 11:25 AM

Another plus for the Bresser and the tube rings is being able to slide the ota to help balance as you acquire heavier 2" eyepieces, and most likely in your location a cooling fan won't be needed.

 

To help find DSO's and identify them a good phone app is really nice to have, that is if there's service for them there.

Also what kind of lighting are you deasling with, if not LED's then the LP filters can help a lot.

 

Hi Mike W.,

 

Thank you for your answer and advice. Yes, that seems important and I’m really getting inclined for the Bresser now.

About lighting I really can’t say for sure if it is LED or not but, I think it is not, because as that is such a remote place the lamps ar at least 25year old.

Do you think I should order the LP filter from Bresser with the scope or buy it separately from another brand?

And about the best app to use, any suggestions?

Thanks,

Miguel


Edited by iMskywalker, 13 October 2019 - 11:43 AM.


#13 AaronF

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 02:22 PM

Hello from the other side of the Iberian Peninsular :-)

 

I bought my 10" Dobsonian from Astroshop after doing a lot of research (thanks CN!) into what I should get.

I went for the "GSO N 250/1250 deluxe Dobsonian" and chose the "deluxe" over the standard model because of the dual-speed focuser, the improved bearings on the mount, the primary cooling fan, and the two bundled eyepieces (one 2" 30mm 70° EP). At the time it was discounted down to €600 which helped.

(Oh, it also has the feature of being able to move the tube up and down to achieve balance, like the Bresser)

 

I'm very happy with it. It was a very good complete package, arrived collimated, and I was able to use it the same night.

 

I also looked at those other telescopes but wasn't as impressed with the bundled accessories. None of the focusers were dual-speed, for instance. I didn't like the look of the mount of the Skywatcher, but the Pyrex mirror sounded good.

I liked the look of the Bresser, its mount especially, but at the time the scope wasn't in stock anywhere in Europe that I could see, and even now Astroshop are still showing it as out of stock until the end of the year, and the Bresser site shows it as available for pre-order only, so not sure if that's even an option unless you want to wait.

 

Speaking of waiting... if there are going to be four of you and only one telescope, then people are going to be waiting for a turn most of the time.

Have you considered getting two telescopes? Two 8" Dobsonians would still fit into your budget, and that way people are only going to be waiting half of the time.

Alternatively, you could get an 8" Dobsonian and add a smaller wide-field refractor and a pair of binoculars - that should keep everyone busy!

 

 

If I were to buy my 10" Dob again, knowing what I know now, then I would get that 12" basic GSO that's only €700 right now lol.gif

It's got a fan. The mount looks fine, and if it's not then it can be replaced later. I could live with a single-speed focuser for a few months, and buy a nice one later.

It needs another eyepiece (or two) to complement the bundled 25mm.

I'd also buy a Cheshire collimator, because I didn't get a collimation tool in my GSO deluxe, so I doubt there'll be one in the standard model.


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#14 SloMoe

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 02:40 PM

Miguel, LP filters are things that there are a lot of opinions on, mine is simple after a long learning curve, for you and what you have as far as skies go there's only one, broadband filters are/were a very used filter until LED's came along, they still perform but in your case with old lighting then the Farpoint?Lumicon UHC for most of the nebulae.

the most recent generation of them, none for sale used yet so new is the way to go.

 

There are wider bandwidth LP filters available but I think for your skies they won't be much help as that all of them reduce total light pass through and so why cut that down, you're going to see a lot of stuff in your skies and that UHC I suggested should be the only filter you would ever need for DSO's.

 

Solar system filters are a complete different thing, there you're trying for contrast in the colors, faint as they are the Televue Planetary Bandmate does very well.

Neutral color shift and and great light pass through.

 

Aaron mentioned a dual speed focuser, that's something I would go for on a 10", might contact the vendor and find out if your scope could be equipped with one.

 

As far as app's go, I use a basic free app from Google, Sky Map, here's a link for options

https://www.tomsguid...ching-apps.html

 

So now comes the learning curve of collimation, something you want to read up on before you purchase your scope.


Edited by Mike W., 13 October 2019 - 02:45 PM.

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#15 SloMoe

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Posted 13 October 2019 - 02:52 PM

Also Miguel, I want you to wait before buying any filter until you have some time using  scope, there are more important things to consider.

Remember this, the entire universe  will still be up there when you're ready.


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#16 zleonis

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 11:09 AM

Hi Mike W.,

 

Thank you for your answer and advice. Yes, that seems important and I’m really getting inclined for the Bresser now.

About lighting I really can’t say for sure if it is LED or not but, I think it is not, because as that is such a remote place the lamps ar at least 25year old.

Do you think I should order the LP filter from Bresser with the scope or buy it separately from another brand?

And about the best app to use, any suggestions?

Thanks,

Miguel

I'd second Mike W's suggestion to hold off on filters until you've used the scope a few times. If the main source of light pollution is nearby streetlights, setting up in a place where they weren't shining directly on you would mitigate most of their effects. 

 

I tried a number of astronomy apps and my favorite by a fair margin has been Sky Safari. There's a free version that would give you a sense of how it works, and if you like the looks of it, I'd definitely suggest purchasing the Plus, or even Pro version. The plus version would have essentially every object that you could observe in your telescope, plus useful tools for searching for targets, planning observing sessions, learning about what you're seeing, and logging your observations. 

 

Another accessory that would be immediately useful would be an eyepiece that provides higher magnification, maybe in the ~8mm range. Higher magnification is especially useful for viewing planets, the moon, and planetary nebulae, and is useful with other classes of objects as well. I have had good experiences with the Explore Scientific 82° eyepieces and with an eyepiece line that looks essentially identical to TS optics, but many people with much more experience than me would be glad to offer their thoughts as well on Cloudy Nights.

 

You might also consider a tool for aligning (collimating) the telescope's mirrors. There's a lot on Cloudy Nights about collimation, much of which can be kind of intimidating, but I've found that getting reasonably close alignment is pretty straightforward. I use a combination sight tube/cheshire, which looks similar to this one, which is straightforward to use.

 

There are lots of other accessories that you might find useful at some point, like additional eyepieces, a better finderscope, filters for viewing certain types of nebulae, but I agree with some of the other posters who suggested that it'd be helpful to observe for a while before getting additional accessories so you can figure out what, if anything, will help  you get the most out of observing. Good luck with your new telescope!


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#17 iMskywalker

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 01:54 PM

Hello from the other side of the Iberian Peninsular :-)

 

I bought my 10" Dobsonian from Astroshop after doing a lot of research (thanks CN!) into what I should get.

I went for the "GSO N 250/1250 deluxe Dobsonian" and chose the "deluxe" over the standard model because of the dual-speed focuser, the improved bearings on the mount, the primary cooling fan, and the two bundled eyepieces (one 2" 30mm 70° EP). At the time it was discounted down to €600 which helped.

(Oh, it also has the feature of being able to move the tube up and down to achieve balance, like the Bresser)

 

I'm very happy with it. It was a very good complete package, arrived collimated, and I was able to use it the same night.

 

I also looked at those other telescopes but wasn't as impressed with the bundled accessories. None of the focusers were dual-speed, for instance. I didn't like the look of the mount of the Skywatcher, but the Pyrex mirror sounded good.

I liked the look of the Bresser, its mount especially, but at the time the scope wasn't in stock anywhere in Europe that I could see, and even now Astroshop are still showing it as out of stock until the end of the year, and the Bresser site shows it as available for pre-order only, so not sure if that's even an option unless you want to wait.

 

Speaking of waiting... if there are going to be four of you and only one telescope, then people are going to be waiting for a turn most of the time.

Have you considered getting two telescopes? Two 8" Dobsonians would still fit into your budget, and that way people are only going to be waiting half of the time.

Alternatively, you could get an 8" Dobsonian and add a smaller wide-field refractor and a pair of binoculars - that should keep everyone busy!

 

 

If I were to buy my 10" Dob again, knowing what I know now, then I would get that 12" basic GSO that's only €700 right now lol.gif

It's got a fan. The mount looks fine, and if it's not then it can be replaced later. I could live with a single-speed focuser for a few months, and buy a nice one later.

It needs another eyepiece (or two) to complement the bundled 25mm.

I'd also buy a Cheshire collimator, because I didn't get a collimation tool in my GSO deluxe, so I doubt there'll be one in the standard model.

Bona nit AaronF,

 

First just let me tell you that I've heard from people from Barcelona themselves, that Lisbon is very similar to Barcelona in many ways. Of course not similar in size, and we didn't have Gaudi! bow.gif

 

As they say, it's a miniaturised Barcelona wink.gif

 

Second, thank you for your answer! It revived me to a pool of doubts but that is a good thing at this fase. I prefer to have a lot of doubts right now than after I purchase it. About the GSO 12" Deluxe, yes I've been there but got really afraid after reading a lot of posts raising doubts about the GSO mirror quality: https://stargazerslo...orth-the-extra/

 

Now, you and Jond105 tell me they're great and trustable. I confess... I'm a bit lost right now, but I like it! lol.gif 

 

Do you think I:

- Should I go with a GSO 12" Deluxe, pay 855 euros and just enjoy the increase in light? Or will the quality of the optics start haunting me after purchase? To make it worse, a 12" DOB isn't something you can easily pass on eBay because shipping is such a nightmare hassle and in price. So I would just have to stick with it.

https://www.astrosho...-deluxe/p,45110

 

- Go with the Bresser, on the other hand, is only 10" but, for 503+75 euros (578 euros Total), I also get the 1:10 focuser adaptation. My question mark here is still... is there a difference in the contrast, detail and overall quality of the optics between them?

https://www.bresser....-10-Dobson.html

 

- Or should I just go with the Skywalker that seems to be consensual on this matter. It's only a 10" also but everyone praises its optics and image quality all the time. And the Pyrex thing. But what about the focuser and the base? Never heard  anything good about them. I guess I would have to invest on a nice focuser later, and that can be expensive, at least on my brief online search fo 1:10'ers. So, in this one, i'm a bit afraid that the accessible 599 for the base version could easily step up fast and surpass the cost of the 12" GSO Deluxe.

 

Oh and thank you for the collimator tip too!

 

See you in the Peninsula!

Miguel 



#18 iMskywalker

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 02:17 PM

Miguel, LP filters are things that there are a lot of opinions on, mine is simple after a long learning curve, for you and what you have as far as skies go there's only one, broadband filters are/were a very used filter until LED's came along, they still perform but in your case with old lighting then the Farpoint?Lumicon UHC for most of the nebulae.

the most recent generation of them, none for sale used yet so new is the way to go.

 

There are wider bandwidth LP filters available but I think for your skies they won't be much help as that all of them reduce total light pass through and so why cut that down, you're going to see a lot of stuff in your skies and that UHC I suggested should be the only filter you would ever need for DSO's.

 

Solar system filters are a complete different thing, there you're trying for contrast in the colors, faint as they are the Televue Planetary Bandmate does very well.

Neutral color shift and and great light pass through.

 

Aaron mentioned a dual speed focuser, that's something I would go for on a 10", might contact the vendor and find out if your scope could be equipped with one.

 

As far as app's go, I use a basic free app from Google, Sky Map, here's a link for options

https://www.tomsguid...ching-apps.html

 

So now comes the learning curve of collimation, something you want to read up on before you purchase your scope.

Hi Mike,

 

As before, you're 100% right! I'm still very puzzled with the scope itself (and the eyepieces) as there are so many different options. I seem to go back and forward all the time. Please read my previous post and see how lost I am. Now I'm back considering a 12" grin.gif lol.gif

 

And by the way, can you please give me your opinion on that?

 

Back to the filters, of corse I'll follow your advice and wait. I have no idea what I'll see or not in my first observation so it just makes sense to test-drive whatever I buy first and see what the results are.

About the apps, I'll read the link article tonight after dinner. I saw many use Sky Safary in the paid version. You chose the Google, Sky Map. I guess there are pros and cons not both of them so I'll read calmly first and get on that later.

 

But, above all, thank you so much! As in everything else related to telescopes, I didn't had a clue on both of these themes and it's proving to be a bit more complex than I expected to be a complete newbie on this hobby. But, already,  for your answers, goodwill and knowledge I got, from you and from the other members that are replying to my question, It's already worth it. Amazing community CN!

 

All the best,

Miguel


Edited by iMskywalker, 14 October 2019 - 05:29 PM.


#19 iMskywalker

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 04:06 PM

I'd second Mike W's suggestion to hold off on filters until you've used the scope a few times. If the main source of light pollution is nearby streetlights, setting up in a place where they weren't shining directly on you would mitigate most of their effects. 

 

I tried a number of astronomy apps and my favorite by a fair margin has been Sky Safari. There's a free version that would give you a sense of how it works, and if you like the looks of it, I'd definitely suggest purchasing the Plus, or even Pro version. The plus version would have essentially every object that you could observe in your telescope, plus useful tools for searching for targets, planning observing sessions, learning about what you're seeing, and logging your observations. 

 

Another accessory that would be immediately useful would be an eyepiece that provides higher magnification, maybe in the ~8mm range. Higher magnification is especially useful for viewing planets, the moon, and planetary nebulae, and is useful with other classes of objects as well. I have had good experiences with the Explore Scientific 82° eyepieces and with an eyepiece line that looks essentially identical to TS optics, but many people with much more experience than me would be glad to offer their thoughts as well on Cloudy Nights.

 

You might also consider a tool for aligning (collimating) the telescope's mirrors. There's a lot on Cloudy Nights about collimation, much of which can be kind of intimidating, but I've found that getting reasonably close alignment is pretty straightforward. I use a combination sight tube/cheshire, which looks similar to this one, which is straightforward to use.

 

There are lots of other accessories that you might find useful at some point, like additional eyepieces, a better finderscope, filters for viewing certain types of nebulae, but I agree with some of the other posters who suggested that it'd be helpful to observe for a while before getting additional accessories so you can figure out what, if anything, will help  you get the most out of observing. Good luck with your new telescope!

Thanks zleonis,

I’ll sure check the Sky Safary! About the eye pieces, thanks also for your Explore Scientific 82° Recomendation. I’ll sure buy them after choosing the telescope. If you don’t mind ’ll ask you wich ones do you recommend to complement the ones that will come with it. Ok?

All the best,

Miguel



#20 AaronF

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 04:23 PM

Bona vespre Miguel!

I've heard that Lisbon is lovely, and I'd love to visit one day soon. Barcelona itself is relatively small for being a city, so I'd like to see what a mini-Barna is like :-)

I'm British, myself, but have lived here long enough to call it home. We have much better weather for stargazing down here in southern Europe, except for in the summer when it looks like someone's cooking the Earth's atmosphere all night! :-D

 

I saw that post on SGL about the GSO optics when I was researching purchasing mine. The post is five years old now, so I gave it less weight when making my decision. I'm afraid that I haven't used an equivalent telescope to be able to make a comparison, but hopefully someone else here can help answer that question.

If you don't have anything similar to compare it to, then I imagine you'll be as happy with it as I am with mine, but if you sit it next to a reflector with premium optics then you might be less impressed.

 

The 12" GSO deluxe is €855, which on one hand is a lot more than you initially wanted to pay, but on the other hand it's the best price-to-aperture ratio you're going to find, I think.

At €1.89 per square inch, only the 10" and 12" basic GSOs are cheaper (€1.52/in² & €1.55/in² respectively), and they lack the aforementioned bundled goodies.

 

If your budget can stretch to it and your place in the country has the space to put it then I would go for it.

However, do double-check that it'll fit in your car (you mentioned driving it a couple of kilometers) as the 12" OTA is 25cm longer than the 10" and the 8".

 

And if you think it's a bit more than you really want to pay, then a 10" or even 8" will still show you fantastic sights - an 8" will show you a whole lot more from the country than I'll ever see from the city with my 10"!

 

Finally, just to confuse things a little bit more than they already are: something that the 8" has going for it over the 10" and the 12" is that it has a slightly longer focal length, which means that less expensive eyepieces will perform better at the edges of the FoV than they do in the F/5 scopes.

 

Also, it would be remiss of me to not mention the few small negative issues I found with my GSO deluxe 10":

 

As happy as I am with telescope as a package, I do have to say that the 30mm eyepiece gets quite annoying, and the game of "is it a galaxy? is it a double star? Oh no, it was just the horrible edges of this eyepiece" gets old quickly. I'm looking to replace that eyepiece. I've already replaced the bundled 9mm plössl with an ES82° 8.8mm, which I picked up on sale from my local astronomy shop. But I kept the plössl for when kids are using it - I've found it's a lot easier for them to get a good eye position with that than with the 82° extra wide eyepiece.

 

Another negative of the GSO is the handle for the mount. Mine came with some strange little holders for the bolts which pushed into the chipboard with small metal teeth, and the whole thing promptly came off in my hand two minutes later when I attempted to use the handle. That was slightly disappointing, but I haven't really missed the mount not having a handle.

 

The finder isn't a right-angled correct image (RACI) finder but a straight-through one, which means you shift position to use it (often off your chair and onto the ground on your knees, and then back up again once you've found what you're after).

 

The fan's power socket is small brittle plastic, which I broke on the second or third time I used the telescope. This is more my fault than GSO's, sure, but the flimsy design didn't help.


Edited by AaronF, 14 October 2019 - 05:59 PM.

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#21 SteveG

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 07:06 PM

A 10” f5 scope can provide a lifetime of astronomy use, and is an excellent choice. All 3 scopes you have listed will perform very well. The Chinese mirrors have improved substantially over the years, but they still produce occasional poor samples. I strongly suggest you seeing a 12” dob in person before making that commitment. The size is much larger, but the views are only a little brighter.

 

I believe the Skywatcher and Oregon have Synta mirrors, and the Bresser is GSO. I have an excellent sample of a GSO 10” f5 btw. Of the 3, I would go with the Bresser, based on the scope’s features. I strongly recommend you should not be concerned with the accessories provided with any of these scopes. They are always low-end, budget minded accessories that you will likely end up replacing. This includes eyepieces, finders, fans, handles, etc.

 

Be sure to include in your budget for an adjustable height chair. An 8” or 10” dob is perfect for seated viewing, allowing you to be able to relax while viewing for extended periods.


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#22 Jond105

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 07:09 PM

A 10” f5 scope can provide a lifetime of astronomy use, and is an excellent choice. All 3 scopes you have listed will perform very well. The Chinese mirrors have improved substantially over the years, but they still produce occasional poor samples. I strongly suggest you seeing a 12” dob in person before making that commitment. The size is much larger, but the views are only a little brighter.

 

I believe the Skywatcher and Oregon have Synta mirrors, and the Bresser is GSO. I have an excellent sample of a GSO 10” f5 btw. Of the 3, I would go with the Bresser, based on the scope’s features. I strongly recommend you should not be concerned with the accessories provided with any of these scopes. They are always low-end, budget minded accessories that you will likely end up replacing. This includes eyepieces, finders, fans, handles, etc.

 

Be sure to include in your budget for an adjustable height chair. An 8” or 10” dob is perfect for seated viewing, allowing you to be able to relax while viewing for extended periods.

If you look very closely at the Omegon, I’m almost positive that it’s GSO built. With the collimation knobs, the fan, the focuser, all scream GSO. 


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#23 iMskywalker

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 08:02 PM

A 10” f5 scope can provide a lifetime of astronomy use, and is an excellent choice. All 3 scopes you have listed will perform very well. The Chinese mirrors have improved substantially over the years, but they still produce occasional poor samples. I strongly suggest you seeing a 12” dob in person before making that commitment. The size is much larger, but the views are only a little brighter.

 

I believe the Skywatcher and Oregon have Synta mirrors, and the Bresser is GSO. I have an excellent sample of a GSO 10” f5 btw. Of the 3, I would go with the Bresser, based on the scope’s features. I strongly recommend you should not be concerned with the accessories provided with any of these scopes. They are always low-end, budget minded accessories that you will likely end up replacing. This includes eyepieces, finders, fans, handles, etc.

 

Be sure to include in your budget for an adjustable height chair. An 8” or 10” dob is perfect for seated viewing, allowing you to be able to relax while viewing for extended periods.

Hi Steve,

 

Thanks for your advice! You really touched a point that I’ve been realizing through my search these 7 days: the included finders and eyepieces are mostly garbage. So if I will be replacing them more sooner than later, I should focus on the quality of the base and mirror which are a nightmare to replace. That said, Bresser seems to gather your (and most) votes on base, bearings, tube rings etc. But I think we still haven’t the answer for the best image quality mirror. 

 

As John said, I also think I’ve read somewhere that the Omegon is a GSO relabeling. If so, Bresser, GSO and Omegon all have the same mirrors. Now, are they a few notches below the Skywatchers’ or are they similar in image quality?

Is there any other brand with better mirrors, and a clear stand out winner in this category that were not mentioning here?


Edited by iMskywalker, 14 October 2019 - 08:07 PM.


#24 SloMoe

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 09:02 PM

Evening Miguel, hmm, on the 12, you've mentioned a cranky back, the 12 will make it crank.

 

It's easy to start with a few more inches of aperture with out experiencing the weight o=r bulk in person, I chose the 10 over the 12 just because as I'm aging it's not going to get easier to set up or move around.

 

My co-worker went out to buy a scope, he's never owned a scope and had only attended a single public night.

Granted he and his wife were very enthusiastic, so they got a 16" thinking they would see things much bigger,,,

Well, pretty sure they found out that they just get brighter and noot much bigger and that was almost a year ago, it's been used like 4 times since they bought it, 

Don't get something you can't move around easily by yourself.

 

Filters don't make things brighter, they just reduce everything except your target.

You have to learn how to use them.


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#25 SloMoe

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Posted 15 October 2019 - 06:30 AM

I'm sorry Miguel, I get some post's and replies from different threads mixed, but a 12 of any manufacturer is going to be bulky, you want a scope that's easy enough to move around the decision to go out set up and view isn't hindered by the physical side of things.

My co-worker has of recent been asking about borrowing mine scope, I might turn loose a small short tube but not my dob.cool.gif

 

You asked about the app I use, I've built a small bracket that holds my phone on the top edge of my scope, I pick a few Messier targets before going out, numbers are easy to remember, pick a number, touch "search" and start to follow the arrow on the screen until it's almost centered, then using an optic finder I zero in on it, then once found I'll select a & swap eyepieces till there's a decent view, then start swapping filters until it's looking good, from there it's sit and observe for a spell.

 

To me, it's not how many things I can see in a night but how much detail I can squeeze out of the view.

 

Each filter will reveal a little bit different detail and depending greatly on seeing conditions one that worked before may not work tonight, kinda hit & miss 


Edited by Mike W., 15 October 2019 - 06:44 AM.

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