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So this doesn’t look good...

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#1 Olhado

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 05:04 PM

So I just broke out my old Nighthawk Next Generation for the first time in 10-years-old. Looking at the objective I noticed weird stains(?) around the edges.

I am worried if the lens cell is compromised, and if so, what I can do about it.
Below are some pictures I took:

2d027e9fb1afaa2e0d8680f9503eae75.jpg

bc81ea18419269e8bec56d75025f5188.jpg

52f7a1c76d02f467508596f0124ad569.jpg


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#2 Jim Waters

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 05:22 PM

I would call Stellarvue first thing Monday and talk to them.  Send them these images.


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#3 petert913

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 05:31 PM

Fungus Amongus ?


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#4 Jim Waters

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 05:35 PM

Could be.  You may need to recoat the optics.  SV can help you.


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#5 CounterWeight

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 05:42 PM

Agree with Jim W post above, want to ask if you are comfortable working on optics?  oops i see another, the first post about calling SV.

 

If you are comfortable I'd recommend getting the dew shield off and seeing how easy the lens cell access is and go from there.   Should add i have not owned one of these.


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#6 KerryR

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 05:49 PM

Were these cemented doublets? That looks very similar to cement failure that I've seen, both personally and in other CN posts.

In any case, I agree with the others: Get it touch with SV directly.


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#7 nicoledoula

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 05:54 PM

Can you notice it while looking through it?


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#8 spencerj

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 06:47 PM

Fungus or cement failure, images (especially visual) will not be affected at all. If it is fungus, it needs to be cleaned to prevent it from getting worse. If it is between elements, SV has to do it. They have a cleaning service that is reasonably priced and they do a great job.
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#9 gnowellsct

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 08:34 PM

Were these cemented doublets? That looks very similar to cement failure that I've seen, both personally and in other CN posts.

In any case, I agree with the others: Get it touch with SV directly.

Why call experts when you can guess?


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#10 Olhado

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Posted 19 October 2019 - 08:35 PM

I was afraid it might be fungus. I took it for a spin on Jupiter and Saturn, and at x75 I got reasonably decent views, especially since it was my first time using the mount/scope in over a decade.
I definitely am not comfortable cleaning the fungus myself, so is there a link to ask about that that service, or is it just use their normal methods? (I reached out to them last week on the specs of their old M1 Deluxe Mount, and got a response fairly quickly).

Thanks everyone!


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#11 peleuba

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Posted 20 October 2019 - 09:03 AM

Could be.  You may need to recoat the optics.  SV can help you.

 

Right - but you can't recoat a lens with the type of multicoatings that are appropriate for telescopes without refiguring the underlying glass.  The only way to remove the original coatings would be to polish them off and then refigure the lens as as the underlying optical figure will be altered.  The bond between glass and modern anti-reflective coatings is such that, for all intents and purposes, the coatings  become one with the glass. 

 

Aluminum coatings are quite different in that the aluminum sits on top of the glass with comparatively little holding it to the glass.

 

I doubt SV figured these to begin with so, really, your looking at a replacement objective.  It may/may not be worth the cost. 


Edited by peleuba, 21 October 2019 - 03:15 AM.

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#12 KerryR

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Posted 20 October 2019 - 10:09 AM

Right - but you can't recoat a lens with the type of multicoatings that are appropriate for telescopes without refiguring the underlying glass.  To be removed the original coatings would have to be polished off and then the lens refigured.  The bond between glass and modern anti-reflective coatings is such that, for all intents and purposes, the coatings  becomes one with the glass. 

 

Aluminum coatings are quite different in that the aluminum sits on top of the glass with comparatively little holding it to the glass.

 

I doubt SV figured these to begin with so, really, your looking at a replacement objective.  It may/may not be worth the cost. 

That's my understanding, too-- these, I think, predated SV's more recent capability to make their own lenses.

The Googles told me that these objectives are air-spaced, so that's good-- no cement failure.
 


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#13 gnowellsct

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Posted 20 October 2019 - 01:36 PM

For my 2c sending it out for cleaning and collimation (if needed) would be worthwhile.   Regardless of whether the coatings have been etched, which I think is *much* less frequent than posts here lead us to think, the scope will be much better for having been cleaned and tuned.  

 

Greg N


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#14 Bomber Bob

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Posted 20 October 2019 - 02:49 PM

That looks very similar to cement failure that I've seen, both personally and in other CN posts.

 

Yep.  I've seen it before with the old lenses I work with.  If that's all that's wrong with this lens, I wouldn't worry about it -- especially for a scope that's not used for 10 years at a pop.


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#15 Spikey131

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Posted 20 October 2019 - 07:26 PM

I don't know what is on you lenses, but it does not look like fungus.

 

Fungus looks like this:

 

 

Attached Thumbnails

  • IMG_0256.jpeg

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#16 Spikey131

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Posted 20 October 2019 - 07:27 PM

By the way, that cleaned off completely, leaving no residue or damage to the coatings or lenses of any kind.

 

I agree with sending this scope to Stellarvue for cleaning and see what they say.  Don't assume the worst.


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#17 kksmith

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Posted 21 October 2019 - 12:21 AM

Cement failure. I have seen this numerous times before in vintage camera lenses. 

 

Ken


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#18 skycamper

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Posted 21 October 2019 - 02:30 AM

I've sent several scopes to SV and not always got lucky, best case scenario, $100 SV cleaning and collimation , you also pay shipping back and forth, from where I am in oregon to where they are in California , shipping with insurance $50 each way.  So that's $200 bucks.  Plus damage risk.....how much do you like this scope?    Hope you live close by at least.


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#19 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 21 October 2019 - 02:49 AM

This is an ED doublet so I think it's probably not cemented. But like Greg said:

 

"Why call experts when you can guess?"

 

Whether or not, the scope is sent to SV for repair, at least the OP find out more about the lens and what the possibilities are.

 

Jon


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#20 Olhado

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Posted 21 October 2019 - 08:03 AM

I've sent several scopes to SV and not always got lucky, best case scenario, $100 SV cleaning and collimation , you also pay shipping back and forth, from where I am in oregon to where they are in California , shipping with insurance $50 each way. So that's $200 bucks. Plus damage risk.....how much do you like this scope? Hope you live close by at least.


So I am across the country from CA (New England). I am going to call them up today at lunch (they should be open by then).

As an additional note, that snowflake-like thing is something I DID find, but on the outside ring. :( so that is at least part of the problem.

That said, does SV hold no liability with the scope repairs? It’s my only one, and I likely don’t have the cash for a new one anytime soon. While it’s been ten years since last light, now that the kids are older, I expect the pull it out more.

Will SV confirm if they think it can be fixed/improved before doing the work, after they have received it?

Also, what is the best way to ship the scope to them?

#21 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 21 October 2019 - 08:49 AM

Hi:

 

My recommendation:

 

Call them and make sure you ask them if is a cemented doublet or an air spaced doublet. If it's air spaced, then it's easier to deal with and a CN member in the New England area could very likely help you clean it. 

 

Knowing what the scope is, that's the place to start.

 

Jon


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#22 Paul G

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Posted 21 October 2019 - 08:53 AM

So I am across the country from CA (New England). I am going to call them up today at lunch (they should be open by then).

As an additional note, that snowflake-like thing is something I DID find, but on the outside ring. frown.gif so that is at least part of the problem.

That said, does SV hold no liability with the scope repairs? It’s my only one, and I likely don’t have the cash for a new one anytime soon. While it’s been ten years since last light, now that the kids are older, I expect the pull it out more.

Will SV confirm if they think it can be fixed/improved before doing the work, after they have received it?

Also, what is the best way to ship the scope to them?

All good questions...for SV.


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#23 Spikey131

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Posted 21 October 2019 - 09:16 AM

You can probably even email them your photos.


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#24 KerryR

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Posted 21 October 2019 - 09:34 AM

THIS article, here on CN, says the objective is air-spaced... so, if that's correct, this isn't cement failure, so that's good. I bet whatever's going on will respond well to cleaning.


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#25 Bomber Bob

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Posted 21 October 2019 - 10:56 AM

THIS article, here on CN, says the objective is air-spaced... so, if that's correct, this isn't cement failure, so that's good. I bet whatever's going on will respond well to cleaning.

If it's an air-spaced ED, I'd clean it myself; and, while I had it apart, I'd figure out what is seeping in at the gap!


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