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#26 Astrojensen

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 05:16 AM

Shopping on the web is too easy these days. Bought a padded carrying case for "the beast". Or should it be "the beauty"? I'm certainly not the beauty here...

 

Also bought an M82/M68 adapter, a 60mm long M68 extension tube and a Baader 2"/M68 Clicklock. I'm not really a fan of APM's 2" Clicklock wannabee adapter. The real thing is much superior. 

 

 

Clear skies!

Thomas, Denmark


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#27 daquad

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 11:21 AM

Shopping on the web is too easy these days. Bought a padded carrying case for "the beast". Or should it be "the beauty"? I'm certainly not the beauty here...

 

Also bought an M82/M68 adapter, a 60mm long M68 extension tube and a Baader 2"/M68 Clicklock. I'm not really a fan of APM's 2" Clicklock wannabee adapter. The real thing is much superior. 

 

 

Clear skies!

Thomas, Denmark

I think they call it a twistlock.  The 2" holds my accessories very securely.  The 1-1/4" is awkward to use as it takes too much torque to close it tightly enough.  I simply use one of my four Astro-Physics adapters that I have somehow managed to accrue over the years.

 

Dom Q.


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#28 Fomalhaut

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 12:53 PM

No test report.


It might have been the one which you'd gotten with the first scope already… grin.gif

However, congratulations for the new one. waytogo.gif
However as for me, I wouldn't dare to follow your footsteps… shrug.gif

Edited by Fomalhaut, 07 December 2019 - 12:57 PM.

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#29 Astrojensen

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 05:21 PM

Had second light this evening. +3°C, 90% cloudy or more all the time (or 100% at some times) and mediocre or worse seeing along with quite a bit of wind made it less than a perfect evening, to put it mildly, but I was starved for starlight and also extremely curious about how the 152/1200 ED would perform on the Moon, once it had cooled down. 

 

In short, it performed very, very well indeed. Very sharp, clean views (as far as the seeing allowed), with very little false color that was basically only faintly visible at 255x and not at all at 179x or lower. 

 

This time I didn't forget to do a ronchi test and it was indeed better than the first lens. There's still a hint of turned down edge, but it's minimal, unlike on the first one. There's a bit of spherical aberration, but it doesn't seem to be too serious. Airy disks are sharp and clear, even on bright stars. Only very bright stars, like Vega, Capella, etc., are slightly hazy from a tad of false color (red, mostly) and the narrow TDE. It's really minor. As soon as we're down to first magnitude, everything's sharp and clear, as far as the seeing allows. I can't wait to see how this scope performs on the planets or the Moon in fine seeing and clear air. 

 

The Vixen Saturn mount on the Baader tripod handles the scope just fine. The height with the tripod in its lowest position is perfect for most of the sky. The giant, rotatable, 3.7" focuser is fantastic. It's the best focuser I've ever had, bar none. It just laughs at anything I can throw on it and is incredibly smooth. It's extremely convenient to just clamp the diagonal down and leave the focuser with just the right tension to be able to rotate it smoothly with almost no effort and be able to position the diagonal in the most comfortable position and always have the finderscope and the focuser knob in the right place. The only negative comment I have on it is that there are no predrilled holes for attaching the finderscope on the opposite side.

 

It doesn't take longer to set this scope up, than it does for the 4" f/11 ED on the same mount. The only thing that keeps the 152/1200 ED from being a "rapid deployment" telescope is its comparatively long cooldown time. Has anyone tried using a Lymax Cat Cooler for speeding up the cooldown process on a refractor?   

 

 

Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark


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#30 RogerLaureys

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 05:32 PM

The holes in the SCT Lymax cooler are directed towards the baffle tube or main mirror. So no use for a refractor.You can mount a little computer fan with airfilter in the focusser and let it blow filtered air into the tube. 



#31 Astrojensen

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 06:07 PM

The holes in the SCT Lymax cooler are directed towards the baffle tube or main mirror. So no use for a refractor.You can mount a little computer fan with airfilter in the focusser and let it blow filtered air into the tube. 

The air needs a way out, so the design has to be like the Cat Cooler, just with the air going in being directed towards the objective. Just putting a fan in the focuser won't do much, because the air doesn't have a way out.

 

 

Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark



#32 John Fitzgerald

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 06:49 PM

This may not apply to Thomas, but the best solution for a largish refractor is a dome or ROR, with the scope on a pier.   Less cool down issues, no chance of slips when mounting.   Just saying.....


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#33 ris242

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 06:50 PM

Shopping on the web is too easy these days. Bought a padded carrying case for "the beast". Or should it be "the beauty"? I'm certainly not the beauty here...

 

Also bought an M82/M68 adapter, a 60mm long M68 extension tube and a Baader 2"/M68 Clicklock. I'm not really a fan of APM's 2" Clicklock wannabee adapter. The real thing is much superior. 

 

 

Clear skies!

Thomas, Denmark

What bag did you get?

a clicklock is on my Wishlist as well.

whats the extension for? Do you run without a diagonal a lot?


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#34 AllanDystrup

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 02:01 AM

.... The only thing that keeps the 152/1200 ED from being a "rapid deployment" telescope is its comparatively long cooldown time. …

    

     In my experience it is possible to relatively "rapidly deploy" a 4" oiled triplet and even a 7" closed Mak by isolating the tube (esp. the lens/corrector part), so the scope can gently slide down to ambient temp. and thereby hold the reins on the tube currents during cooldown.

 

    Of course it also helps keeping the OTA in a non-heated shed, or putting it out there a couple of hours before use -- but with our changing weather here in Denmark, the "before use" part is indeed a challenge tongue2.gif 

 

     -- Allan


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#35 Astrojensen

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 02:30 AM

This may not apply to Thomas, but the best solution for a largish refractor is a dome or ROR, with the scope on a pier.   Less cool down issues, no chance of slips when mounting.   Just saying.....

An observatory is definitely on my wish list. 

 

 

Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark


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#36 Astrojensen

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 02:35 AM

What bag did you get?

a clicklock is on my Wishlist as well.

whats the extension for? Do you run without a diagonal a lot?

I got this one: https://www.teleskop...g-L-121-cm.html

 

The scope has so much back focus, that if I use a Baader T2 diagonal, I need an extension tube to reach focus. I'm currently using an 80mm long 2" extension tube, but I'd like something a little more solid, hence the M68 tube. If I want to observe without a diagonal, I need an even longer extension tube. The scope has around 180mm back focus, but the focuser only has about 100mm travel. 

 

 

Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark


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#37 Astrojensen

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 02:44 AM

    

     In my experience it is possible to relatively "rapidly deploy" a 4" oiled triplet and even a 7" closed Mak by isolating the tube (esp. the lens/corrector part), so the scope can gently slide down to ambient temp. and thereby hold the reins on the tube currents during cooldown.

 

    Of course it also helps keeping the OTA in a non-heated shed, or putting it out there a couple of hours before use -- but with our changing weather here in Denmark, the "before use" part is indeed a challenge tongue2.gif 

 

     -- Allan

This scope is very different to an oiled triplet or a mak-cass, in that it's not the tube currents that are the main issue, it's the different temperature between the front and rear lens, which causes spherical aberration. This problem can't be solved with insulation, as the front lens is directly exposed to the cold nighttime air and will invariably cool faster than the inner lens. In fact, insulation will only make the problem worse. 

 

An oiled triplet acts more or less as a single lens, so it will quite rapidly cool through the front, regardless of whether the scope is insulated or not, and its inner curves are very closely matched (and of course in contact), which also minimizes spherical aberration issues during cooldown. Especially in a small 4". A mak is very different, because the corrector has very little optical power, so a temperature difference between it and the primary mirror is not a major problem. 

 

 

Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark


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#38 HCR32

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 03:39 AM

It’s good to hear that you are happy with the scope mate. Judging from the views I got this year on Jupiter and Saturn you will be using the scope a lot more then you are planning to. They are very good for the money and this scope has stopped me from buying back my TEC160FL.

#39 Astrojensen

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 03:51 AM

It’s good to hear that you are happy with the scope mate. Judging from the views I got this year on Jupiter and Saturn you will be using the scope a lot more then you are planning to. They are very good for the money and this scope has stopped me from buying back my TEC160FL.

I initially more or less only planned to use it as a "when-I-have-plenty-of-time-and-the-weather-is-good" scope, but the views are really very good and if I can find a way to bring the cooldown period down to something manageable, say, half an hour or so, then I suspect it could see a LOT of use. It doesn't take me long to set it up on the Vixen Saturn mount. 

 

If you say yours is so good, it has stopped you from buying a TEC 160, that's high praise indeed. And I'm not disputing it. The lunar views I had yesterday were extremely promising. 

 

 

Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark


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#40 HCR32

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 06:31 AM

For me the TEC160FL was an exceptional telescope that can’t be faulted but at 12k compared to say 3k I can’t say I see anymore in a TEC then I see in a APM. The APMs have a slight bit of color for example if looking at the moon right around the edges but you have to look for it. In my case if you move your viewing angle it goes away. I don’t have the scientific answers to why but it just comes in and out of view. Other than that it’s as sharp as any scope I’ve ever used. I think what’s the most important fundamental for any scope is it’s sharp. Everything else is secondary and the APM throws at you sharp views. One day I will do a side by side with the TEC because it only lives about two hundred meters down the road. I made sure the sale was very local and accessible anytime 😁
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#41 Astrojensen

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 06:42 AM

 

I made sure the sale was very local and accessible anytime

You sneaky devil you. wink.gif

 

 

Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark



#42 Bomber Bob

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 08:51 AM

I initially more or less only planned to use it as a "when-I-have-plenty-of-time-and-the-weather-is-good" scope, but the views are really very good and if I can find a way to bring the cooldown period down to something manageable, say, half an hour or so, then I suspect it could see a LOT of use. It doesn't take me long to set it up on the Vixen Saturn mount. 

 

If you say yours is so good, it has stopped you from buying a TEC 160, that's high praise indeed. And I'm not disputing it. The lunar views I had yesterday were extremely promising. 

 

 

Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark

My APM 152 is a weekend-only scope, not so much for hauling out the mount & loading the scope, but for the Temperature Prep.  The Swamp has the opposite condition of blazing hot Summer, and taking the scope from a cold air-conditioned indoors to the outdoors.  I lay a thick beach towel across my workbench in the shed, and rest the OTA on it, with the caps off, at least an hour before use.  Still, I have to keep in mind that the first hour or so of observing, the 152 may not be at its best.  I have used it often enough to see when it's not quite ready.  On the plus side, temperatures fall gradually during the night down here, and the 152 keeps up.

 

Like Thomas, I'd prefer to use my 152 more often -- the views of every object are so dang good!  It makes all the prep worth it.


Edited by Bomber Bob, 08 December 2019 - 08:54 AM.

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#43 BillP

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 09:27 AM

The APMs have a slight bit of color for example if looking at the moon right around the edges but you have to look for it. In my case if you move your viewing angle it goes away. I don’t have the scientific answers to why but it just comes in and out of view. Other than that it’s as sharp as any scope I’ve ever used.

That behavior sounds more like behavior of the exit pupil formed by the eyepiece than the objective.  I've come across a number of eyepieces that are sensitive this way and a slight repositioning of the eye so it is in the sweet spot of the eyepiece's exit pupil and any perceived CA vanishes.  I would also conjecture that if the color crossings from the objective are less than full Apo that the eyepiece may be more sensitive to this issue.  FWIW, my Abbe Orthos never have this issue so I use them as the standard when examining CA in an objective.


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#44 Bomber Bob

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 09:30 AM

Yep, I use either my Orthos or my spectros Kellners for CA sky-testing.


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#45 Astrojensen

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 04:09 PM

It suddenly, and quite unexpectedly, cleared again this evening, around 8 P.M. The weather forecast had predicted partially clear skies, but on the satellite images, it looked like it wouldn't reach this area. 

 

I immediately put the ED152/1200 out for cooling, while I took a shower. Temp outside was around +7° and the delta was about 15°C. There was quite a bit of wind, which helped. I left the dewcap all the way back and the focuser open, to assist the cooldown as much as possible. Half an hour later, I had the scope set up. Setup takes less than ten minutes.   

 

The scope was very nicely sharp at 96x and very, very slightly soft at 120x in my old 45° binoviewer with 25mm and 20mm Zeiss microscope eyepieces. The seeing was very mediocre, although with an occasional moment of better clarity. This was definitely in the atmosphere and not the telescope, because I could see the turbulence move with the wind.

 

That the scope is usable at a magnification of 120x after just half an hour cooldown is great news. This means it has potential to be used a lot more often than I thought at first. 

 

The performance obviously improved markedly during the hour or so I got, until the clouds returned. Sadly, the seeing deteriorated badly, once the clouds began to come rolling in again, so I couldn't take much advantage of the better correction. I did get a few, brief moments of stunning clarity, but that was about it. 

 

Even after just half an hour cooldown, there was absolutely no hazy glare in the images whatsoever, unlike the first objective, which would never give a clear view of the Moon at full aperture, despite hours of cooldown. Images are startlingly clear, sharp, bright and with stunning contrast. The color correction is astoundingly good. And thanks to the sliding dew cap and the short tube, thanks to the long back focus, it's nowhere nearly as unmanageable as its stats would lead one to believe. During mounting, it feels more like an f/6, than an f/8. 

 

I am starting to like this scope A LOT.  

 

 

Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark


Edited by Astrojensen, 08 December 2019 - 04:12 PM.

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#46 aneeg

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 04:19 PM

Still you have to plan an observatory, Thomas!
 

Arne


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#47 Astrojensen

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 04:23 PM

Still you have to plan an observatory, Thomas!
 

Arne

Yes, that would be nice. 

 

 

Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark



#48 BillP

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 04:43 PM

Hi Thomas.  FWIW, when I use the 1.25" Zeiss prism and direct connect my WO binos to that, there is plenty of focuser travel to use the binoviewer without OCA!  My preference is a pair of 17.5mm Morpheus in this configuration (68x @ 2.2mm Exit Pupil).  When I do this, I usually never change the eyepieces as that magnification seems about perfect for everything non-lunar/planetary.


Edited by BillP, 08 December 2019 - 04:43 PM.

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#49 Jan Owen

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 05:23 PM

It's good to see you're now enjoying a series of POSITIVE experiences, so you can begin to enjoy the new telescope, and begin working the nuances that'll make your future observing sessions more enjoyable yet!!!  Working on things like how to structure setup activities and processes to facilitate faster startup and getting to thermal equilibration faster instead of worrying about the quality of the objective, or the collimation, or centration, or turned edge can make ALL the difference with a new scope.  Sounds like you're off and running, and I wish you well.  Looks like you now have a good one!!!  Enjoy!!!


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#50 pao

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Posted 08 December 2019 - 07:10 PM

I’m very happy to hear now that you are very happy with your instrument Thomas. Hope that you will find all the necessary time and good weather in beautiful Bornholm to test extensively the instrument. Enjoy the universe!

pao


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