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EP's for NP127 and 12 inch f/5 Dob

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#1 BDS316

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Posted 14 January 2020 - 05:35 PM

Hi 

 

On the equipment forum they are doing a thread on your ultimate viewing dream package and the rules state 2 scopes and 6 eyepieces with a limit of $50,000.

 

After I retire in a few years I hope to own  a Televue NP127is and name it "Uncle Al" and a 12 inch f5 Dob with all the bells and whistles.

 

Which eyepieces would be best for use with these two scopes?  I'm thinking about a 31mm Nagler with a Leica Zoom / Barlow but I'd like to hear some suggestions from you all.

 

Thanks.


Edited by BDS316, 14 January 2020 - 05:59 PM.

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#2 25585

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Posted 14 January 2020 - 07:11 PM

For my 12" F5 Dob I have a Paracorr 2, 35 Panoptic, 22mm Celestron Ultima LX, ES92s 17mm & 12mm, Baader Morpheus 9mm, 6.5mm & Delite 5mm. Also an Astro-Physics 2x BARADV Barlow. 


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#3 Defenderslideguitar

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Posted 14 January 2020 - 07:39 PM

I have the TV NP101     great wide flat field refractor.  I am just starting to look into good eyepieces for it. I dont have a Dob  (yet)  But I will look for a 10 to 12.5  down the road.         But I am most interested in your thread as I am interested in the answers to best eyepieces for the NP127


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#4 sanbai

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Posted 14 January 2020 - 08:17 PM

Having such a budget and for such demanding scopes, the list of candidates should be short (and not cheap). I would focus on the characteristics that better suit your eyes (eye relieve, AFOV) and the weight/size you can manage (mount, traveling...). Then, think about the set of FL you want.

Of course Televue eyepieces area known for its performance with fast scopes. You can add the typical names: Nikon 100°, Pentax XW, best of explore scientific, Docter.

Other EPs can shine, but either are specialized lines (usually with compromises), or are single examples in their line (need a good scrutiny to save your pennies), or there is no line, just one (e. g. the Docter). This is the advantage of TV: several full lines, all top quality. Not always the absolute best, but very close.

Santiago

Edited by sanbai, 14 January 2020 - 09:05 PM.

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#5 John Huntley

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Posted 14 January 2020 - 08:24 PM

I use these with my 12 inch dob and larger refractors (120mm ED and 130mm triplet):

 

Nagler 31mm

Ethos 21mm

ES 92 17mm

Ethos 13mm

Ethos 8mm

Ethos 6mm

Pentax XW 5mm

Pentax XW 3.5mm


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#6 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 15 January 2020 - 12:46 AM

I have several faster Dobs plus an NP-101. TeleVue NP series scopes are about wide, flat fields.

 

The NP-101 challenges eyepieces, it's fast and with the right eyepiece provides essentially perfect views. Eyepieces that are not essentially perfect in a fast scope will reveal their flaws.

 

The TeleVue MPT was designed to test TeleVue eyepieces  and later the various Petzvals followed along that path, fast, wide and flat.

 

I use TeleVue Panoptics, Naglers and Ethos eyepieces and think TeleVue eyepieces are really the ones that best match the Petzvals. You really dont want to cut corners with the eyepieces because the scope will show the flaws. And the fact the TeleVue eyepieces are designed to be tested in these scopes means there's a certain synergy.

 

The bigger question is whether the NP-127 or the NP-101 is the ultimate scope for you. These scopes thrive on the deep sky and you need to be an low power wide field junky to appreciate them. If you're mostly a high power, planetary type, there are are other scopes to consider. You gotta love a big wide field that's as perfect as perfect can be because that's what separates these from the rest of the pack.

 

The same eyepieces that are well suited for an NP-127 or 101 are also good choices for a 12 inch F/5 Dob fitted with a Paracorr.

 

My eyepieces:

 

41 mm, 35, mm, 22mm  Panoptics

 

31mm, 16mm, 13 mm, 11mm, 9mm, 7mm, 5mm and 3.5 mm Naglers type 5 and type 6s.

 

21mm, 13mm, 8 mm Ethos's

 

2 x TeleVue Barlow.

 

Not many have the 41mm and 35 mm Panoptics plus the 31 mm Nagler. But for one of these scopes, it makes sense because these are the views these scopes are about. If you think, just one's enough, probably an F/7 doublet or triplet will do the trick for you.

 

I'm sure the Delos are great, the Delites with their 60° AfoV tend to defeat the purpose of a scope like this though I am sure they perform admirably.

 

For these scopes, it's not just rounding up the usual suspects. For example, the Meade/ES 24 mm 68° eyepieces generally get high marks but in the NP-101, there are edge aberrations that are just not there in the 22mm Panoptic. If you're OK with that, then the NP-127 is not the scope for you because correcting that last bit is what these scopes are about.. From what I know about the Pentax XWs, I'd think they wouldn't be a good fit.

 

I've had my NP-101 for 10 years and it's seen a lot of eyepiece time.  When I bought it, I really didnt understand what I was buying, I thought I was buying a faster app with very good optics and color correction and the legendary TeleVue build.

 

I did get that. But the whole refractor field curvature thing, I didn't understand. The flat-flat field, that's what I was buying.

 

3925365-TV NP-101 at Jewel Valley.jpg
 
I will add this. For me,  I believe the NP-101 is a better choice than the NP-127. The NP-127 would be better at the higher power stuff but there are plenty of scopes for that.  This is about the 4.9° field at 13x with the 41 mm Pan  and the 4.5° field with the 31mm Nagler.
 
Jon

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#7 areyoukiddingme

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Posted 15 January 2020 - 12:55 AM

I have a 12.5 F5 Portaball, and a Televue 101.

 

The Televue really shines with a Nikon 17 HW and the 31 Nagler. After that, you want to be able to get mid and high powers (say 200x), and that requires short focal lengths. A Nagler 3-6 zoom is a nice match, for high powers and would be too with the NP127.

 

As for the Portaball, I use a Paracorr, and my set is 6 and 8 Ethos, a 10/12.5 Nikon HW, a 14/17 Nikon HW, 21 Ethos, and 31 Nagler.

 

I use a 1.6x Nikon barlow on the 6 and 8 Ethos, and if I need crazy high power, I also have a 2.5x Powermate.

 

But the most used eyepiece in the Portaball is the Leica zoom.

 

I'm pretty well done with eyepieces. I've tried orthos, and don't care for them in manual scopes. I also have a set of Pentax XWs, and while I really enjoy the ease of use and comfort, it's the others that get the nod most of the time. And I have also picked up a 12.5 Docter and 22 Nagler to try out. They are very nice, but as of yet they aren't making me rethink any previous choices.


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#8 Roragi

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Posted 15 January 2020 - 12:43 PM

The golden rule is not to talk about eyepieces of millimeters in focal length. The step to follow is that pupil is the right one for you in the objects that are in your preferences, then comes the power range and the visual field that you can pay the most. Good luck with your research.



#9 BDS316

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Posted 15 January 2020 - 01:41 PM

 

I have several faster Dobs plus an NP-101. TeleVue NP series scopes are about wide, flat fields.

 

The NP-101 challenges eyepieces, it's fast and with the right eyepiece provides essentially perfect views. Eyepieces that are not essentially perfect in a fast scope will reveal their flaws.

 

The TeleVue MPT was designed to test TeleVue eyepieces  and later the various Petzvals followed along that path, fast, wide and flat.

 

I use TeleVue Panoptics, Naglers and Ethos eyepieces and think TeleVue eyepieces are really the ones that best match the Petzvals. You really dont want to cut corners with the eyepieces because the scope will show the flaws. And the fact the TeleVue eyepieces are designed to be tested in these scopes means there's a certain synergy.

 

The bigger question is whether the NP-127 or the NP-101 is the ultimate scope for you. These scopes thrive on the deep sky and you need to be an low power wide field junky to appreciate them. If you're mostly a high power, planetary type, there are are other scopes to consider. You gotta love a big wide field that's as perfect as perfect can be because that's what separates these from the rest of the pack.

 

The same eyepieces that are well suited for an NP-127 or 101 are also good choices for a 12 inch F/5 Dob fitted with a Paracorr.

 

My eyepieces:

 

41 mm, 35, mm, 22mm  Panoptics

 

31mm, 16mm, 13 mm, 11mm, 9mm, 7mm, 5mm and 3.5 mm Naglers type 5 and type 6s.

 

21mm, 13mm, 8 mm Ethos's

 

2 x TeleVue Barlow.

 

Not many have the 41mm and 35 mm Panoptics plus the 31 mm Nagler. But for one of these scopes, it makes sense because these are the views these scopes are about. If you think, just one's enough, probably an F/7 doublet or triplet will do the trick for you.

 

I'm sure the Delos are great, the Delites with their 60° AfoV tend to defeat the purpose of a scope like this though I am sure they perform admirably.

 

For these scopes, it's not just rounding up the usual suspects. For example, the Meade/ES 24 mm 68° eyepieces generally get high marks but in the NP-101, there are edge aberrations that are just not there in the 22mm Panoptic. If you're OK with that, then the NP-127 is not the scope for you because correcting that last bit is what these scopes are about.. From what I know about the Pentax XWs, I'd think they wouldn't be a good fit.

 

I've had my NP-101 for 10 years and it's seen a lot of eyepiece time.  When I bought it, I really didnt understand what I was buying, I thought I was buying a faster app with very good optics and color correction and the legendary TeleVue build.

 

I did get that. But the whole refractor field curvature thing, I didn't understand. The flat-flat field, that's what I was buying.

 

 
 
I will add this. For me,  I believe the NP-101 is a better choice than the NP-127. The NP-127 would be better at the higher power stuff but there are plenty of scopes for that.  This is about the 4.9° field at 13x with the 41 mm Pan  and the 4.5° field with the 31mm Nagler.
 
Jon

 

 

Thanks Jon, lots to consider here.

 

I agree that medium to high power lunar & planetary viewing has been my favorite for quite a while and this is because of where I live, which is pretty light polluted unless I find my way to Stellafane where things noticibly improve. My 8in Dob provides nice views with the ep's in my sig, along with ZAO Ortho's borrowed from my friend who owns the TEC200.  My 80mm SV refractor gave me great low power views from Stellafane but not from home.

 

I'm hoping to retire where there's less light pollution, and I keep recalling one amazing night at Stellafane where I set up right next to Al Nagler and family and he showed me some remarkable low power views with his NP127 including the Sagitarrius star cloud and a view of the Trifid and Lagoon in the same field of view with a 13mm Ethos, 50x with a 2 degree field, which sold me on the greatness of low power viewing from a dark sky location.  


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#10 turtle86

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Posted 15 January 2020 - 10:40 PM

I have several faster Dobs plus an NP-101. TeleVue NP series scopes are about wide, flat fields.
 
The NP-101 challenges eyepieces, it's fast and with the right eyepiece provides essentially perfect views. Eyepieces that are not essentially perfect in a fast scope will reveal their flaws.
 
The TeleVue MPT was designed to test TeleVue eyepieces  and later the various Petzvals followed along that path, fast, wide and flat.
 
I use TeleVue Panoptics, Naglers and Ethos eyepieces and think TeleVue eyepieces are really the ones that best match the Petzvals. You really dont want to cut corners with the eyepieces because the scope will show the flaws. And the fact the TeleVue eyepieces are designed to be tested in these scopes means there's a certain synergy.
 
The bigger question is whether the NP-127 or the NP-101 is the ultimate scope for you. These scopes thrive on the deep sky and you need to be an low power wide field junky to appreciate them. If you're mostly a high power, planetary type, there are are other scopes to consider. You gotta love a big wide field that's as perfect as perfect can be because that's what separates these from the rest of the pack.
 
The same eyepieces that are well suited for an NP-127 or 101 are also good choices for a 12 inch F/5 Dob fitted with a Paracorr.
 
My eyepieces:
 
41 mm, 35, mm, 22mm  Panoptics
 
31mm, 16mm, 13 mm, 11mm, 9mm, 7mm, 5mm and 3.5 mm Naglers type 5 and type 6s.
 
21mm, 13mm, 8 mm Ethos's
 
2 x TeleVue Barlow.
 
Not many have the 41mm and 35 mm Panoptics plus the 31 mm Nagler. But for one of these scopes, it makes sense because these are the views these scopes are about. If you think, just one's enough, probably an F/7 doublet or triplet will do the trick for you.
 
I'm sure the Delos are great, the Delites with their 60° AfoV tend to defeat the purpose of a scope like this though I am sure they perform admirably.
 
For these scopes, it's not just rounding up the usual suspects. For example, the Meade/ES 24 mm 68° eyepieces generally get high marks but in the NP-101, there are edge aberrations that are just not there in the 22mm Panoptic. If you're OK with that, then the NP-127 is not the scope for you because correcting that last bit is what these scopes are about.. From what I know about the Pentax XWs, I'd think they wouldn't be a good fit.
 
I've had my NP-101 for 10 years and it's seen a lot of eyepiece time.  When I bought it, I really didnt understand what I was buying, I thought I was buying a faster app with very good optics and color correction and the legendary TeleVue build.
 
I did get that. But the whole refractor field curvature thing, I didn't understand. The flat-flat field, that's what I was buying.
 
 
 
I will add this. For me,  I believe the NP-101 is a better choice than the NP-127. The NP-127 would be better at the higher power stuff but there are plenty of scopes for that.  This is about the 4.9° field at 13x with the 41 mm Pan  and the 4.5° field with the 31mm Nagler.
 
Jon

 
waytogo.gif   The NP 101 is an optical marvel.  Can’t really think of another scope that gives a field of view as wide and as flat.  It is exhilarating to pan around the Milky Way with it, with a 31mm Nagler in the diagonal.  Your post has got me thinking that the 31mm Nagler might not be enough, that I might also need to get the 41mm Pan to go even wider.  grin.gif

Edited by turtle86, 16 January 2020 - 10:44 AM.

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#11 BDS316

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Posted 16 January 2020 - 10:02 AM

 

I have several faster Dobs plus an NP-101. TeleVue NP series scopes are about wide, flat fields.

 

The NP-101 challenges eyepieces, it's fast and with the right eyepiece provides essentially perfect views. Eyepieces that are not essentially perfect in a fast scope will reveal their flaws.

 

The TeleVue MPT was designed to test TeleVue eyepieces  and later the various Petzvals followed along that path, fast, wide and flat.

 

I use TeleVue Panoptics, Naglers and Ethos eyepieces and think TeleVue eyepieces are really the ones that best match the Petzvals. You really dont want to cut corners with the eyepieces because the scope will show the flaws. And the fact the TeleVue eyepieces are designed to be tested in these scopes means there's a certain synergy.

 

The bigger question is whether the NP-127 or the NP-101 is the ultimate scope for you. These scopes thrive on the deep sky and you need to be an low power wide field junky to appreciate them. If you're mostly a high power, planetary type, there are are other scopes to consider. You gotta love a big wide field that's as perfect as perfect can be because that's what separates these from the rest of the pack.

 

The same eyepieces that are well suited for an NP-127 or 101 are also good choices for a 12 inch F/5 Dob fitted with a Paracorr.

 

My eyepieces:

 

41 mm, 35, mm, 22mm  Panoptics

 

31mm, 16mm, 13 mm, 11mm, 9mm, 7mm, 5mm and 3.5 mm Naglers type 5 and type 6s.

 

21mm, 13mm, 8 mm Ethos's

 

2 x TeleVue Barlow.

 

Not many have the 41mm and 35 mm Panoptics plus the 31 mm Nagler. But for one of these scopes, it makes sense because these are the views these scopes are about. If you think, just one's enough, probably an F/7 doublet or triplet will do the trick for you.

 

I'm sure the Delos are great, the Delites with their 60° AfoV tend to defeat the purpose of a scope like this though I am sure they perform admirably.

 

For these scopes, it's not just rounding up the usual suspects. For example, the Meade/ES 24 mm 68° eyepieces generally get high marks but in the NP-101, there are edge aberrations that are just not there in the 22mm Panoptic. If you're OK with that, then the NP-127 is not the scope for you because correcting that last bit is what these scopes are about.. From what I know about the Pentax XWs, I'd think they wouldn't be a good fit.

 

I've had my NP-101 for 10 years and it's seen a lot of eyepiece time.  When I bought it, I really didnt understand what I was buying, I thought I was buying a faster app with very good optics and color correction and the legendary TeleVue build.

 

I did get that. But the whole refractor field curvature thing, I didn't understand. The flat-flat field, that's what I was buying.

 

 
 
I will add this. For me,  I believe the NP-101 is a better choice than the NP-127. The NP-127 would be better at the higher power stuff but there are plenty of scopes for that.  This is about the 4.9° field at 13x with the 41 mm Pan  and the 4.5° field with the 31mm Nagler.
 
Jon

 

Jon what mount and tripod is that with your NP101....kind of looks like a Vixen but not a TV Gibraltar...

 

Thanks.  You're kind of making me lean more toward an NP101 rather than a 127.


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#12 turtle86

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Posted 16 January 2020 - 10:54 AM

I have the TV NP101     great wide flat field refractor.  I am just starting to look into good eyepieces for it. I dont have a Dob  (yet)  But I will look for a 10 to 12.5  down the road.         But I am most interested in your thread as I am interested in the answers to best eyepieces for the NP127


A 10 or 12.5" Dob would complement an NP 101 very well--use the NP 101 to go wide and the Dob to go deep. In fact, I like having my 12.5" Dob and NP 101 both set up at the same time. The Dob lets me observe an object in greater detail whereas the wide field of the NP 101 lets me observe the object in context.

As for eyepieces the NP 101, I would stick with TeleVues, especially at lower power, since they're optimized to work well with TV Petzvels. I mostly use the 27 and 35mm Pans, and occasionally the 31mm Nagler for low power. Stars are pinpoint out to the edge.

#13 laedco58

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Posted 16 January 2020 - 11:38 AM

I have a 12” dob and a NP 127. They compliment each other very well.  My Z 12 was my first scope and has been giving me pleasing views for several years. The 127 is a recent acquisition so I’m still warming up to it and getting used to the eyepiece being located on the wrong end of the scope.  lol.gif I have an assortment of eyepieces ranging from premium to eh. 31N, 30 GSO, 21E, 20 UWA, 13E, 10D, 9 GSO, 8-24 MK IV, 5.5 UWA. The UWA’s are series 5000 Meads. They are all useable in the Z12, though seeing limits the usability of the 5.5. I’ve only observed with the 31N and the 21E in the 127 the few times I’ve had it out, as low power wide views are why I got it. As I spend more time with it I’ll “see” what it’s other capabilities are with other eyepieces in my arsenal.


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#14 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 16 January 2020 - 11:53 AM

Jon what mount and tripod is that with your NP101....kind of looks like a Vixen but not a TV Gibraltar...

 

 

It's a Vixen Portamount with a set of Hands on Optics wooden legs.  For low powers, it's adequate, for high powers, it's marginal at best.  I love the ergonomics on the Portamount.  They have that figured out,. If they would make a Portamount XL, I think it would be a big seller.

 

I also have a StellarVue MG-2 which is a modified version of the Sky-Tee mount.  They didn't get the ergonomics right so the slow motion controls often end up on the backside forcing the observer to reach around the back of the mount.  But it is solid with my 120mm Eon and it only weighs 19 pounds. 

 

6213871-NP-101 with SV MG-2.jpg
 
I used it last night, did some doubles at 309x. 
 
Jon

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#15 Deep13

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Posted 16 January 2020 - 02:40 PM

Well, my 12.5" f/5 Dob uses:
36mm Seibert University 65 deg.
27 Pan.
14 Delos
10, 7, & 5 Pentax XW

#16 astro744

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Posted 17 January 2020 - 02:43 AM

Thanks Jon, lots to consider here.

 

I agree that medium to high power lunar & planetary viewing has been my favorite for quite a while and this is because of where I live, which is pretty light polluted unless I find my way to Stellafane where things noticibly improve. My 8in Dob provides nice views with the ep's in my sig, along with ZAO Ortho's borrowed from my friend who owns the TEC200.  My 80mm SV refractor gave me great low power views from Stellafane but not from home.

 

I'm hoping to retire where there's less light pollution, and I keep recalling one amazing night at Stellafane where I set up right next to Al Nagler and family and he showed me some remarkable low power views with his NP127 including the Sagitarrius star cloud and a view of the Trifid and Lagoon in the same field of view with a 13mm Ethos, 50x with a 2 degree field, which sold me on the greatness of low power viewing from a dark sky location.  

I think the last para says it all.  If you are contemplating the NP-127 and can afford it then it will bring you the fondest memories of that night with Al Nagler and family.  Sentimental reasons aside I think the extra exit pupil offered by the NP-127 over the 101 would be advantageous at the planetary end and low power end.

 

I have the TV-101 and love it for both low power scanning of the sky with 41mm Panoptic and 31mm Nagler but also for high power work with planets particularly Mars at 270x with the 4-2mm Nagler zoom.  At 270x though I only get 0.37mm exit pupil with the 101 and yearn for the 0.47mm that the NP-127 would give me at the same power.  At the other extreme under dark skies the NP-101 at 7mm exit pupil would give 14x whereas the NP-127 with 7mm exit pupil would give 18x magnification.  That little bit of extra magnification would make deep sky objects just that little bit easier to see at 18x with the same brightness.  (I understand focal length and ratios are different so getting exactly 7mm is not going to be possible and my point is that the NP-127 will give the same exit pupil at a higher power).

 

I have only ever looked through a TV-101 and not the NP-101 but I understand there is enough difference to make the NP-101 the finest flat field 4" telescope that Tele Vue has ever made and the same could be said for the 5" NP-127.  If I had the choice and the money I'd go for the NP-127 and the only thing I'd lose out on would be a bit of true field but if true field was most important to me I'd then get the TV-76 and get 5.5 degrees, more than the NP-101.

 

I don't think you can go wrong with either but if you think you want the NP-127 and you'll always wonder if you didn't get it then you know the answer.  As for eyepieces for both the NP-127 and 12" Newtonian reflector; first go with Tele Vue since they work well in both their refractors and Newtonians.  As for sizes I suggest you contact Al Nagler and have a chat as I'm sure he will steer you in the right direction.  It will come down to preferences on eye relief, apparent field, ergonomics and cost and maybe you should go to a few more star parties to look through as many eyepieces in the 'scopes you have in mind before deciding.

 

Whatever you choose, enjoy!


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