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New AT102EDL

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#51 MalVeauX

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Posted 21 May 2020 - 03:40 PM

Im thinking this is for the visual group myself. It’s still a doublet. I’m thinking it’s spend that extra little bit, and get every bit light to come to focus better. It’s giving visual observers some added scopes to decide through, AT102ED, may get a little CA, spend extra, may get as good as the 100ED’s with a wider field and more compact scope for portability. Imaging is still a triplets game, not saying people don’t do it with the doublet as I’ve seen great photos, but this to me is still geared for the visual observer wanting that little extra in the better glass. 

I agree with this; I wanted an AT102ED at first, but the correction isn't good enough in my opinion for my purposes so I never went that direction. This new 102EDL however does have good enough correction, it should have no false color on bright planets,  unlike the AT102ED which does show CA on them (Venus, Jove....). And being able to get that on an F7 scope changes the mounting significantly from an F9 scope, so to me, that's a huge deal, since someone looking at a 4" frac is likely trying to have it portable and not need a monstrous mount just to handle it. F7 keeps it reasonable still as a grab & go. And it's in the same price category as the SW EvoStar 100 ED at F9, yet shorter and easier mount. Nice to have something else at this price point so there's not just a default single option (especially since the Stellarvue 102mm F7 was discontinued, was same price too). This basically is the Stellarvue 102mm F7 Super with a different brand name. And that's not a bad thing at all.

 

Very best,


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#52 Astronomics

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Posted 21 May 2020 - 03:52 PM

Mike - which focuser is coming with this telescope?  Is the same one as on the AT92?

It is the 2.5" model which is the same as the 92.


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#53 RAKing

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Posted 21 May 2020 - 04:21 PM

Mike,

 

I hate to put you on the spot, but do you have a realistic delivery estimate on this one?

 

Thanks,

 

Ron



#54 Astronomics

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Posted 21 May 2020 - 05:01 PM

Mike,

I hate to put you on the spot, but do you have a realistic delivery estimate on this one?

Thanks,

Ron


So production takes 70 days. I okayed the drawings and specs yesterday and today. Then you are looking at 20-30 days worth of shipping and customs. That would put delivery around Labor Day.
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#55 Doug Culbertson

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Posted 21 May 2020 - 05:29 PM

Good grief, I have a perfectly great FS-102 and I still find myself wanting this scope. It's only money, and can one have too many 4" refractors? 


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#56 RAKing

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 07:35 AM

Good grief, I have a perfectly great FS-102 and I still find myself wanting this scope. It's only money, and can one have too many 4" refractors? 

I find myself asking the same question and I have a beautiful FC-100.

 

The answer depends... is your FS-102 the jealous type? lol.gif 

 

Ron


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#57 peleuba

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 08:35 AM

It is the 2.5" model which is the same as the 92.

 

 

Thanks for the information.  As I have shared with you before, I think this focuser is terrific.


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#58 peleuba

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 08:47 AM

Imaging is still a triplets game, not saying people don’t do it with the doublet as I’ve seen great photos, but this to me is still geared for the visual observer wanting that little extra in the better glass. 

 

This is exactly my take on the market position of this telescope.


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#59 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 08:54 AM

Mike:

 

This looks like a great addition to the lineup. I had the very first AT-102 ED and I loved that scope. I had so much fun with it I ended up buying a TV NP-101.

 

Had this scope been available, I would have probably saved myself $1000 and bought it instead. As it was, I had my eye on the AT-106LE until the used TV came along.

 

I lobbied for years for an 102mm F/7 with FPL-53 class glass. I mostly bugged Kevin LeGore of Skywatcher thinking they could produced an F/7 version of the ED-100 but this new scope is really what I was dreaming of, the very good glass and the excellent build.. a beautiful scope to look at, a beautiful scope to look through, a scope that works beautifully.. 

 

Good call on the 0.95 Strehl. You can buy a case after you buy the scope.. 

 

Jon


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#60 Astronomics

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 09:29 AM

Thanks for the information.  As I have shared with you before, I think this focuser is terrific.

We have been super pleased with focuser mechanism so far as well.


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#61 Phillip Creed

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 10:14 AM

I'm thrilled with my new AT102ED.  I don't do deep-sky imaging, but I assume this EDL version is for that group?  For lunar/planetary, very few adjustments are needed for a CA-free capture...

I wouldn't try imaging with a 4" f/7 FPL-51 / FK-61 doublet, that's for sure.  You'd definitely get a little CA / "blue bloat" in your images.  These scopes are geared towards visual observers who want quality high-power views, but not willing to spend huge amounts of money.  To that end, the current AT102ED is a bargain.

That being said, a 4" f/7 FPL-53/FCD-100 and Lanthanum ED doublet is a different ballgame.  I think this would qualify as "not ideal, but good enough" for deep-sky imaging.  Many people image with either dedicated one-shot-color astro cameras or, like myself, modded DSLRs to bump up the H-alpha sensitivity.  So having the blue and red ends play nice with one another while the yellow and green are in focus is vital to sharp images.  A triplet is often the desired thing in this arena simply to remove all doubt, but I've seen plenty of photos on Astrobin with various models of 4" f/7 FPL-53/FCD-100 + Lanthanum ED doublets and they look fine to my eyes.  Not sure what (if anything) is done in processing to handle any residual CA.

A big, BIG selling point with the AT102EDL will be the focuser and the weight.  It's 4 lbs. lighter than the AT115EDT with a slightly shorter focal length.

Clear Skies,

Phil


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#62 NYJohn S

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 10:35 AM

Well this is  good news. This scope checks all the boxes for me. I love my AT102ED but after getting the AT72EDII the near perfect optics spoiled me. I was just thinking there should be a version of the AT102ED with better glass as an upgrade path. I'm saving my $ for this one.


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#63 erin

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 11:01 AM

I will not flip my SVAccess 102 for this....

 

I will not flip my SVAccess 102 for this....

 

I will not flip my SVAccess 102 for this....

HELP!!

 

lol.gif


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#64 bobhen

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 11:15 AM

 And being able to get that on an F7 scope changes the mounting significantly from an F9 scope, so to me, that's a huge deal, since someone looking at a 4" frac is likely trying to have it portable and not need a monstrous mount just to handle it. F7 keeps it reasonable still as a grab & go. And it's in the same price category as the SW EvoStar 100 ED at F9, yet shorter and easier mount. 

 

Very best,

The SW 100ED F9 will be longer but it weighs less.

 

Bob


Edited by bobhen, 22 May 2020 - 11:16 AM.


#65 Auburn80

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 11:43 AM

I will not flip my SVAccess 102 for this....

I will not flip my SVAccess 102 for this....

I will not flip my SVAccess 102 for this....
HELP!!

lol.gif

No need for the help unless you just enjoy new things. It'd be like selling a 6 month old Accord to buy a new Accord.
🤣

Edited by Auburn80, 22 May 2020 - 11:43 AM.

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#66 GOLGO13

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 11:47 AM



That being said, a 4" f/7 FPL-53/FCD-100 and Lanthanum ED doublet is a different ballgame. I think this would qualify as "not ideal, but good enough" for deep-sky imaging.

Clear Skies,
Phil


The guy who had my Vixen 103s before me took unbelievably good astro photos with it. Certainly this scope would also do a very good job.

#67 erin

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 11:57 AM

No need for the help unless you just enjoy new things. It'd be like selling a 6 month old Accord to buy a new Accord.

lol.gif

 

The new AT’s rings and handle are sporty-looking and I like that, but that isn’t justification enough in my case. 


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#68 aa6ww

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 11:15 PM

Thankfully, you aren't part of their marketing team since your additions would price the scope out of any favorable market its trying to occupy. 

The scope looks excellent, just as it is.

 

...Ralph 

 

 

Looks like it needs 3 improvements.

1. The handle is one point and will have to be tossed for a guider bar


Fix: make it a two point handle with a counter groove to accept clamp type accessory holders/3 point rings or solid rings. Removable clamps to separate the guider/ finder and still have a fixed handle to carry the scope.

2. The dove plate is vixen style, it should be a Losmandy style for this size scope.

Fix: use instead of the vixen dove bar a same length Losmandy style dovetail bar.

3. A nice scope like this needs a much beter than just an OK visual focuser.

Fix: should be offered with a 3" plus superior focuser with options in flattener threaded connection for the various popular flattener/ reducers. At least as large as 82mm threads.

And a nice case would be a plus


Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


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#69 StarHugger

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Posted 23 May 2020 - 12:28 AM

Well said Ralph, very very well said...

#70 drd715

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Posted 23 May 2020 - 01:08 AM

Thankfully, you aren't part of their marketing team since your additions would price the scope out of any favorable market its trying to occupy. 

The scope looks excellent, just as it is.

 

...Ralph 

A ligitament point considering the market constraints and the next step up to a 115edt scope/price. It does have to fit in the value segment. 

 

The expensive upgrade would be a high end focuser,  but it appears this scope has a better than standard focuser that would come on some competitive scopes. If you want a feather touch it would probably be overkill for a 102mm doublet. 

 

The other iteams are accessories that are inexpensive to add for those that desire a different plate or case.

 

But I  still believe that the handle should be a  two point attached piece (between both rings) and have a built in rail.  The  projected handle while having a rail is only one point attached. it will work as a handle. The  cost of this upgrade from the manufacturer would be $10 or so and effect the retail price maybe $20. I  don't think this would push the selling price of this scope up enough to notice.   It would make an excellent finder or guide scope attachment point. Single point guider mounts don't work nearly as well to keep the solid connection between the guide scope and main scope. Some may say this scope is not a good candidate for astrophotography, but I think it will be excellent - if used at native F-7. If you need a faster scope then a triplet is needed, but at nearly twice the price. So this scope should be an excellent mid focal length reasonably priced entry level imager. Yes you can get a better imaging scope, but you have to pay the price. 



#71 GOLGO13

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Posted 23 May 2020 - 08:16 AM

The guy who had my Vixen 103s before me took unbelievably good astro photos with it. Certainly this scope would also do a very good job.

This wonderful photo was done with my 103s...So I think this scope would likely be quite capable of some great astro photos:

 

https://www.cloudyni...410-and-ic1396/


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#72 russell23

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Posted 23 May 2020 - 08:55 AM

A ligitament point considering the market constraints and the next step up to a 115edt scope/price. It does have to fit in the value segment. 

 

The expensive upgrade would be a high end focuser,  but it appears this scope has a better than standard focuser that would come on some competitive scopes. If you want a feather touch it would probably be overkill for a 102mm doublet. 

 

The other iteams are accessories that are inexpensive to add for those that desire a different plate or case.

 

But I  still believe that the handle should be a  two point attached piece (between both rings) and have a built in rail.  The  projected handle while having a rail is only one point attached. it will work as a handle. The  cost of this upgrade from the manufacturer would be $10 or so and effect the retail price maybe $20. I  don't think this would push the selling price of this scope up enough to notice.   It would make an excellent finder or guide scope attachment point. Single point guider mounts don't work nearly as well to keep the solid connection between the guide scope and main scope. Some may say this scope is not a good candidate for astrophotography, but I think it will be excellent - if used at native F-7. If you need a faster scope then a triplet is needed, but at nearly twice the price. So this scope should be an excellent mid focal length reasonably priced entry level imager. Yes you can get a better imaging scope, but you have to pay the price. 

The buyer does have the option of making necessary upgrades.  I'm not into AP, but my ED doublets are excellent visual scopes and the focusers on these ED doublets from Astrotech and Williams Optics are excellent.  If you have to jack the price with a bunch of upgrades just for astrophotography you may lose some sales for people that are looking for a visual only scope.  Isn't the AT 80mm f/6 triplet a more desirable scope for AP anyway?


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#73 rustynpp

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Posted 23 May 2020 - 09:22 AM

FWIW I do think a handle attached to both rings is a worthy upgrade for what I imagine would be a very modest increase to the retail price. I find with my Zenithstar 103 that I typically grab the handle much closer to the front ring, but it's nice to be able to adjust my grip if there are additional accessories on the back end.

 

If I bought this scope I would likely attach the current handle to the front ring, if a full handle was not available.

 

Nick


Edited by rustynpp, 23 May 2020 - 11:35 AM.


#74 drd715

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Posted 23 May 2020 - 10:25 AM



The buyer does have the option of making necessary upgrades. I'm not into AP, but my ED doublets are excellent visual scopes and the focusers on these ED doublets from Astrotech and Williams Optics are excellent. If you have to jack the price with a bunch of upgrades just for astrophotography you may lose some sales for people that are looking for a visual only scope. Isn't the AT 80mm f/6 triplet a more desirable scope for AP anyway?


Yes the AT-80 triplet is an excellent choice for wider field astrophotography. The 80mm triplet is the perfect beginner astrophotography scope.

For visual and and imaging though the 102mm F-7 works out best (if visual use is of primary importance) . The 80mm being a triplet with the use of a reducer/flattener instead of a unity flattener would certainly frame some of the larger objects well. The usefulness of the 102mm F-7 would be its longer focal length to frame mid size subjects to better advantage. Like camera lenses different focal lengths for different subjects. Scenic views or portraits. Astro subjects vary from several degrees across to only a few arc seconds. One scope is not going to do it all. If someone were to purchase an 80mm F-6 triplet with both a unity flattener and a reducer flattener this would be a great place to start imaging (two different framing sizes). But for a little tightening on the framing size the 102mm F-7 using the same unity flattener would add options in the imaging frame coverage. A person could shoot wide and crop, but this dosen't get you the benefits of keeping all of the data with better resolution. Also framing scale size is dependent upon the imaging chip size too, but that is another subject.

So the 102mm has its place in the scheme of things. As does the 80mm and the 115mm and the 130mm and a longer fl scope for planets. This is how we end up with ten telescopes (I'm only on wife number 5 - I mean telescope #5 - actually wife #1, but I'm not sure if she is jealous of the scopes or happy I'm out from under her feet 24 hours a day).

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#75 RAKing

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Posted 23 May 2020 - 10:45 AM

FWIW I do think a handle attached to both rings is a worthy upgrade for what I imagine would be a very modest increase to the retail price. I find with my Zenithstar 103 that I typically grab the handle much closer to the front ring, but it's nice to be able to adjust my grip if there are additional accessories on the back end.

 

If I bought this scope I would likely attach the current handle to the front ring, if a full handle was not available.

I would also mount the handle on the front ring.

 

When I balance my scopes, the center of gravity (CG) is between the rings with a diagonal and eyepiece.  That CG shifts forward if there is nothing back there and that is how I normally carry my scope around.

 

The specs on this new AT102 show it's less than 10 pounds.  Maybe we add a couple of pounds for the rings, but I think a single handle (like the Vixen units) is plenty. 

 

The single point also lets you adjust the length of your dovetail and the spacing of your rings, if you wish.

 

Cheers,

 

Ron




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