Jump to content

  •  

CNers have asked about a donation box for Cloudy Nights over the years, so here you go. Donation is not required by any means, so please enjoy your stay.

Photo

And the astro journey is reaching critical point....

  • Please log in to reply
15 replies to this topic

#1 TareqPhoto

TareqPhoto

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 5,440
  • Joined: 20 Feb 2017
  • Loc: Ajman - UAE

Posted 25 May 2020 - 01:56 AM

Now i have to finish my last puzzle pieces this year, so after i'e got my 6" F/4 to be used for DSO, now only left to be ready is another mono cooled camera which i will buy sooner or later just waiting the budget, and then i will buy one scope for planetary.

 

The decisions are always difficult to make when there are different options and the budget is a factor above that, it makes life more harder than it should be, but i am trying to make the best decision overall so i don't regret whatever i get or do.

 

Now i have to think carefully of what i will choose, i did ask many times about the scope for planetary and i gave few choices or options, and i still can't decide as it is like pros and cons with each option, and i can't tell what i may face later, also what i may buy in future also may affect the current or very soon choices, but i really don't know how people just decide on anything, i see many choose and later after a while even years they change or replace, for me the change or replacement means i bought something temporarily and not lifetime, i only upgrade from excellent to more excellent or same quality but different job, like going from 10" scope high quality to 20" high quality, not from 10" cheap to 10" high end or even to 12" high end.

 

Hopefully i will finish this equipment dilemma as soon as possible so i can enjoy it, i am not in rush of anything at all, all asking for pics, pics is the least thing i am worry about, but i care about quality and possibility and comfortable, i hate to use items/setup that giving me headache every night or it doesn't stop me from thinking about something else rather than having something what is the right one and i don't think about anything else, or as you said, buy it and never look back.

 

Just to make few clear point:

 

1. I won't spend higher than $2000 for less aperture, and that is why SCT is always out of my plan and it will be

 

2. I don't buy used, i know it is not bad thing to say, but at this point of my journey i am still not gonna buy used yet, later when i have all setup i need then i don't mind.

 

3. Not in rush, but doesn't mean i have to wait 6 months or 2 years to decide and buy, i already had last 2-3 years to tell me everything i need to add, so i am not going to change plans because someone has different path or experience.



#2 rockstarbill

rockstarbill

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 6,994
  • Joined: 16 Jul 2013
  • Loc: Snohomish, WA

Posted 25 May 2020 - 02:52 AM

Planetary scope? SCT or a Classical Cassegrain scope. 

 

https://agenaastro.c...-ota-black.html

 

There is a truss version that is 10" and longer FL, but its pretty heavy at 38lbs. I think the SCT would be a better option, as they double as very good scopes for imaging DSO's. The Edge 9.25" is the one I have always looked at, given its nice spot diagram and specs. If Celestron would update the focuser to the one on the RASA 8, 11 V2, and 14 -- I would probably consider it a bit more strongly. 

 

https://www.highpoin...2414737532058b8



#3 TareqPhoto

TareqPhoto

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 5,440
  • Joined: 20 Feb 2017
  • Loc: Ajman - UAE

Posted 25 May 2020 - 02:58 AM

Planetary scope? SCT or a Classical Cassegrain scope. 

 

https://agenaastro.c...-ota-black.html

 

There is a truss version that is 10" and longer FL, but its pretty heavy at 38lbs. I think the SCT would be a better option, as they double as very good scopes for imaging DSO's. The Edge 9.25" is the one I have always looked at, given its nice spot diagram and specs. If Celestron would update the focuser to the one on the RASA 8, 11 V2, and 14 -- I would probably consider it a bit more strongly. 

 

https://www.highpoin...2414737532058b8

Nice choices, but after very long search and research i decided i will never buy anything less than 12" for planetary, so it must be 12" and larger, and you know the price of 12" SCT or larger, so it is OUT.



#4 rockstarbill

rockstarbill

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 6,994
  • Joined: 16 Jul 2013
  • Loc: Snohomish, WA

Posted 25 May 2020 - 03:00 AM

Nice choices, but after very long search and research i decided i will never buy anything less than 12" for planetary, so it must be 12" and larger, and you know the price of 12" SCT or larger, so it is OUT.

Then you should be shopping for a new mount. That AZ-EQ6 isnt going to work with a 12" scope.



#5 rockstarbill

rockstarbill

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 6,994
  • Joined: 16 Jul 2013
  • Loc: Snohomish, WA

Posted 25 May 2020 - 03:06 AM

You may be able to squeeze this on for planetary use:

 

https://www.highpoin...0771ff1664b5862

 

Its 11" not 12", but has good 2800mm focal length. You dont need the Edge optics for planetary use, so the scope price is basically cut down in half from the 11" Edge. Pretty much the same thing with the C14 (non Edge).

 

https://www.highpoin...5b41d5e2820949e

 

Both will still do Hyperstar though, and you can technically get a corrector for them for imaging from the rear cell, but those correctors arent perfect. The 14" will tip that mount over though. grin.gif



#6 TareqPhoto

TareqPhoto

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 5,440
  • Joined: 20 Feb 2017
  • Loc: Ajman - UAE

Posted 25 May 2020 - 03:07 AM

Then you should be shopping for a new mount. That AZ-EQ6 isnt going to work with a 12" scope.

That is one of the plans, i can't buy a new mount now, but i may do that let's say at the end of this year or next year, if i do that then anything smaller scope will be out of use as i will definitely go for larger, and also if i buy that mount that time it means i can't afford a larger scope then, but now i can afford a larger scope and wait 1 year for its mount, i did buy 8" f/5 and i kept it stored for years and nowadays i am trying to use it.

 

There is also a dobsonian, they have own mount and later i can add EQ platform, and with a dob the thing is it will give me visual experience, i am also thinking about this idea, but i am not sure if i will end up doing less visual and more imaging, or visual will make me busy, for that i can get either 12" dob or 14" dob which are both not so much expensive but can be affordable.

 

There is also 12" F/4 Newtonian, the weight can be handled by AZ-EQ6, i saw enough people used 12" Newtonian on their EQ6 even it reached the limits, but they did it, they even use it for DSO too, so 12" can be at risk but it is possible, i just not rush myself for 12" Newt, i still think 14" Dob will be the best option over any 12" scope i will buy, i am still saving separately for 20" Dob for visual mainly and planetary f necessary, but that is very long term planning, but now for these 2-3 months i can afford a camera and 12"-14" Newt/Dob scope for planetary and visual, but thinking too much about it is killing me, the prices between them are marginal, like between $800 up to $1500.



#7 TareqPhoto

TareqPhoto

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 5,440
  • Joined: 20 Feb 2017
  • Loc: Ajman - UAE

Posted 25 May 2020 - 03:08 AM

You may be able to squeeze this on for planetary use:

 

https://www.highpoin...0771ff1664b5862

 

Its 11" not 12", but has good 2800mm focal length. You dont need the Edge optics for planetary use, so the scope price is basically cut down in half from the 11" Edge. Pretty much the same thing with the C14 (non Edge).

 

https://www.highpoin...5b41d5e2820949e

 

Both will still do Hyperstar though, and you can technically get a corrector for them for imaging from the rear cell, but those correctors arent perfect. The 14" will tip that mount over though. grin.gif

Nah, both are not in my mind, they are amazing no doubt, but not my cup of tea.



#8 rockstarbill

rockstarbill

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 6,994
  • Joined: 16 Jul 2013
  • Loc: Snohomish, WA

Posted 25 May 2020 - 03:10 AM

Nah, both are not in my mind, they are amazing no doubt, but not my cup of tea.

For what you are looking for, I do not think there are any other options. 

 

Newts are great instruments, but lack the FL you are looking for in order to do planetary imaging. They can do it, it just wont be as good as what you can accomplish with the right tools. 



#9 TareqPhoto

TareqPhoto

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 5,440
  • Joined: 20 Feb 2017
  • Loc: Ajman - UAE

Posted 25 May 2020 - 03:15 AM

For what you are looking for, I do not think there are any other options. 

 

Newts are great instruments, but lack the FL you are looking for in order to do planetary imaging. They can do it, it just wont be as good as what you can accomplish with the right tools. 

I knew that you will say it, in fact even with SCT people want to go even longer, so i did solve that already, i only have to get the scope, i have 2x Powermate and 5x Powermate, i even can buy 4x Powermate as Damian Peach recommended this one in particular, i saw people using those even with SCT but only 2x and 2.5x mainly, but i will use 5x or 4x, with planetary dedicated cameras small sensor, so i am fine, so are you re-thinking your comment now?



#10 TareqPhoto

TareqPhoto

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 5,440
  • Joined: 20 Feb 2017
  • Loc: Ajman - UAE

Posted 25 May 2020 - 03:17 AM

And to add more about cameras, i have planetary cameras from 2.4µm up to 5.86µm as pixel size for sampling, so i am set with cameras already.



#11 rockstarbill

rockstarbill

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 6,994
  • Joined: 16 Jul 2013
  • Loc: Snohomish, WA

Posted 25 May 2020 - 03:21 AM

I knew that you will say it, in fact even with SCT people want to go even longer, so i did solve that already, i only have to get the scope, i have 2x Powermate and 5x Powermate, i even can buy 4x Powermate as Damian Peach recommended this one in particular, i saw people using those even with SCT but only 2x and 2.5x mainly, but i will use 5x or 4x, with planetary dedicated cameras small sensor, so i am fine, so are you re-thinking your comment now?

I am not an SCT person, I don't even own one. :) 

 

You can certainly use barlows to assist and use a Newt, but the same stuff on longer FL instruments will provide better end results -- at least from what I have seen. The best planetary images I have seen, came from Classical Cassegrain scopes but they were very expensive. 

 

I am not a planetary imager, I do purely DSO, but if I were to get into that, I would be looking at the Classical Cassegrains. They offer very long FL in very compact packages all things considered. 6-10" there are some less expensive options, then in the larger ones the price skyrockets.

 

Perhaps a nice big dob (like 17"+) would be a good way to go... 



#12 TareqPhoto

TareqPhoto

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 5,440
  • Joined: 20 Feb 2017
  • Loc: Ajman - UAE

Posted 25 May 2020 - 03:28 AM

I am not an SCT person, I don't even own one. smile.gif

 

You can certainly use barlows to assist and use a Newt, but the same stuff on longer FL instruments will provide better end results -- at least from what I have seen. The best planetary images I have seen, came from Classical Cassegrain scopes but they were very expensive. 

 

I am not a planetary imager, I do purely DSO, but if I were to get into that, I would be looking at the Classical Cassegrains. They offer very long FL in very compact packages all things considered. 6-10" there are some less expensive options, then in the larger ones the price skyrockets.

 

Perhaps a nice big dob (like 17"+) would be a good way to go... 

I know you are a DSO guy, and MAN, you make us into shame, i can't match your equipment and skills, but i won't give up, i liked your DSO and thanks for the data you shared before with us all.

 

For planetary, i saw all results, i liked results by all not just cass, but most are using it because as you said for native FL and compact size, but those people are rich maybe or can afford so many things as the scope expensive or the mounts for it, but i go with possibilities not with capabilities, i saw so many results enough from Newt/dobs that telling me that they are very capable really, it is only a matter of how to mount them and collimate them only, but it doesn't do for which type, i know guys moved from SCT to Newt and they never looked back and vice versa, and because the Newt/dob prices are more affordable so i decided i can give them a try, but i have to decide which size from 12", and those with SCT are more skilled so that you saw the best results from them, but it doesn't mean it is the only type, 1 meter scopes did amazing planetary, one is RC actually and the other is Cassegrain, and both produced mind blowing, so the type isn't all the story here, same with DSO, i saw images from refractors and Newt and RC, and to me i loved images from RC the most but people are using refr the most.



#13 rockstarbill

rockstarbill

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 6,994
  • Joined: 16 Jul 2013
  • Loc: Snohomish, WA

Posted 25 May 2020 - 03:42 AM

I know you are a DSO guy, and MAN, you make us into shame, i can't match your equipment and skills, but i won't give up, i liked your DSO and thanks for the data you shared before with us all.

 

For planetary, i saw all results, i liked results by all not just cass, but most are using it because as you said for native FL and compact size, but those people are rich maybe or can afford so many things as the scope expensive or the mounts for it, but i go with possibilities not with capabilities, i saw so many results enough from Newt/dobs that telling me that they are very capable really, it is only a matter of how to mount them and collimate them only, but it doesn't do for which type, i know guys moved from SCT to Newt and they never looked back and vice versa, and because the Newt/dob prices are more affordable so i decided i can give them a try, but i have to decide which size from 12", and those with SCT are more skilled so that you saw the best results from them, but it doesn't mean it is the only type, 1 meter scopes did amazing planetary, one is RC actually and the other is Cassegrain, and both produced mind blowing, so the type isn't all the story here, same with DSO, i saw images from refractors and Newt and RC, and to me i loved images from RC the most but people are using refr the most.

The data share may return, although with new data. We will see how Narrowband season goes here in WA for weather. I have the array system in the works now, which was derailed by some vendors sending me the wrong products I ordered. mad.gif Hoping OPT can come through in the clutch, if all goes well it will be online for new moon ~June 20.

 

After chatting with you here, I went and looked in the Solar System Imaging forum, and there were a lot of SCT's in use there. I did come across this though:

 

https://www.cloudyni...-and-asi-290mm/

 

Promising results for the Newt. I would be pleased with those results if it were me, but for Solar System Imaging it would not take much for me to be pleased with whatever result I got. lol.gif Maybe someday I will pop my 183MC camera on the big 10" and see what comes of it. 

 

As far as imaging on the big scopes - I prefer the corrected DK's over the RC's. Easier to work with, but a well-collimated and set up RC can produce some incredible images. My iDK has a long list of work queued up for it this NB season as well. I am stuck behind clouds though, and have been all year so far. :( 



#14 TareqPhoto

TareqPhoto

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 5,440
  • Joined: 20 Feb 2017
  • Loc: Ajman - UAE

Posted 25 May 2020 - 04:33 AM

The data share may return, although with new data. We will see how Narrowband season goes here in WA for weather. I have the array system in the works now, which was derailed by some vendors sending me the wrong products I ordered. mad.gif Hoping OPT can come through in the clutch, if all goes well it will be online for new moon ~June 20.

 

After chatting with you here, I went and looked in the Solar System Imaging forum, and there were a lot of SCT's in use there. I did come across this though:

 

https://www.cloudyni...-and-asi-290mm/

 

Promising results for the Newt. I would be pleased with those results if it were me, but for Solar System Imaging it would not take much for me to be pleased with whatever result I got. lol.gif Maybe someday I will pop my 183MC camera on the big 10" and see what comes of it. 

 

As far as imaging on the big scopes - I prefer the corrected DK's over the RC's. Easier to work with, but a well-collimated and set up RC can produce some incredible images. My iDK has a long list of work queued up for it this NB season as well. I am stuck behind clouds though, and have been all year so far. frown.gif

I hope you can figure what what plans or projects are you working for, i am supporting you with my heart, can't see more from you, and my plan is also to use my new 3nm filters alongside with my old 5nm filter, i got tired of using 7nm/6.5nm filters for last 2 years, and that is why i am buying another mono cooled camera so i can merge both filters sets and slowly i will replace my 7nm/6.5nm filters as well to something affordable such as Antlia, but for now i have to test my new 6" Newtonian and 3nm filters [OIII and SII].

 

That is a nice link and results there, see, i know it is always possible, i will be happy for those results too, and i may do better who knows because i have nice seeing maybe like him or maybe better, poor is always there too but we can avoid it, and for that i won't give up on thinking about getting a Newtonian or a dobsonian, i just have to decide between 12" or 14", if i go with 14" Dob i will be using it more as visual but i can practice manually for planetary until i can provide EQ platform, i don't think this 14" Dob will be very bad for planetary anyway as long i can be smart and manage how to use it nicely regardless of the weight and size.

 

You HAVE TO put your ASI183MC on that 10" scope, you really don't know what you gonna have, but it will be amazing really, with ROI you can do a lot, and if you can also add something as a Barlow then you are not far at all from planetary imaging, you have to trust yourself and your equipment as you do for DSO, and i can see you are good enough and smart to do nice for planetary too.

 

Thank you very much for mentioning DK, sounds i should move my future plan from RC to DK, i just hope i can find very cheap DK that i can afford in the future, something in 10-12" range, maybe maybe 14" if i get better mount and can afford that DK, but i made this RC/DK scope as the last addition to my collection, and i know they are bloody lungs expensive, i just don't want to think about those for now, i will have time hopefully in future to ask and afford, but good you mentioned about DK vs. RC, i better choose one the best for long time.



#15 rockstarbill

rockstarbill

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 6,994
  • Joined: 16 Jul 2013
  • Loc: Snohomish, WA

Posted 25 May 2020 - 09:31 AM

DK's are very expensive, the only cost effective ones are made by Orion UK and those folks do not have the best reputation. RC's are much cheaper, if you look at the GSO ones. They take some work to get up to snuff, and I would only look at the truss models, but they are going to be far more affordable than iDK/CDK scopes.



#16 TareqPhoto

TareqPhoto

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • -----
  • topic starter
  • Posts: 5,440
  • Joined: 20 Feb 2017
  • Loc: Ajman - UAE

Posted 25 May 2020 - 09:53 AM

DK's are very expensive, the only cost effective ones are made by Orion UK and those folks do not have the best reputation. RC's are much cheaper, if you look at the GSO ones. They take some work to get up to snuff, and I would only look at the truss models, but they are going to be far more affordable than iDK/CDK scopes.

I saw the prices of CDK, indeed incredible expensive, but i saw someone an Asian using a DK made in Asia and i think the price was more affordable, almost in same price league of RC or little more, and his results are very nice, i can't tell that this DK quality is the best, but sounds it is available to be used if interested, so i am not sure if i should go with that or better stay with RC, and yes, i will only go with a truss design RC [or DK], i really like a truss design.

 

I saw GSO RC options, i even looked at the tube design not truss RC options, but i won't be so rush to get one and replace it later, and i really wish if i can get a job so that will help me to afford a DK also, i did buy a camera in the past which cost nearly $50K body alone, and i got 3 lenses with it, say one is a kit lens so included in that price, but the other two lenses are so expensive as well, means if i really can have budget then i can go for it.


  • rockstarbill likes this


CNers have asked about a donation box for Cloudy Nights over the years, so here you go. Donation is not required by any means, so please enjoy your stay.


Recent Topics






Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics