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Televue DeLites for a NexStar 6SE - would this be a mismatch?

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#1 Axiom20

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Posted 05 June 2020 - 11:12 PM

Hello All,

 

First post as I start my rookie season on CN.  I've had the 6SE for several years now and have been impressed with what I've been able to see with it.  I'd say my home field is Bortle 5-6 and other than a few pesky sensor lights that randomly go on at both next door neighbors' houses, it can get decently dark in the backyard; especially with all the leaves on the trees now and softball leagues on ice.

 

I know my scope isn't setting the world on fire from a light gathering perspective, but it's provided some great looks and my goal is to push this thing as far as I can.  Early on, I added a 15mm Celestron Luminos eyepiece to the mix and have been very pleased with its performance.  It's great on star clusters, galaxy pairs (M81 & M82, M65 & M66) and general probing/sweeping of the Milky Way.  But this also represents my highest useful magnification eyepiece for lunar and planetary work and this is the area I'm looking to make strides in this Summer.  Frankly, the higher mag eyepieces that came with the 6SE aren't that great and are a bear to look through.  After much research, the Televue DeLites sounded ideal for getting to the next level, but it was disheartening to read that for scopes like the 6SE, premium eyepieces don't make a worthwhile difference and that something like basic Plossl's would be the better play.  Is this true?  Can anyone clear the air on this?  I was really excited to get out there with some DeLites this summer, but if they're not a good match for what I have, I'll have to head back to the drawing board.

 

Thanks!

 

Chris


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#2 stevenrjanssens

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 12:23 AM

It's not that they're not a good match, DeLites will work great in your scope. It's just that at f/10 you have a lot more options that will give you satisfactory performance than if you were looking for eyepieces to use at f/4. This isn't to say you shouldn't consider the DeLites, just the pool of possible eyepieces available to you is larger when working at f/10, and will include some more economical candidates. What is it about the DeLites that makes them ideal for you?


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#3 Dave Mitsky

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 12:26 AM

One of my telescopes is a 6" Celestron NexStar Evolution.  I sometimes use some of my Tele Vue Delos eyepieces with it with excellent results.  The DeLites should perform similarly, albeit with smaller apparent fields of view.



#4 Dave Mitsky

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 12:28 AM

It's not that they're not a good match, DeLites will work great in your scope. It's just that at f/10 you have a lot more options that will give you satisfactory performance than if you were looking for eyepieces to use at f/4. This isn't to say you shouldn't consider the DeLites, just the pool of possible eyepieces available to you is larger when working at f/10, and will include some more economical candidates. What is it about the DeLites that makes them ideal for you?

I agree that there are less expensive alternatives for an f/10 SCT.


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#5 collaredkeeper

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 12:51 AM

If it helps, try giving this guide a read. It helped me pinpoint the eyepiece ranges and attributes best suited towards my SCT and focal lengths, it might give you an idea of what would work best for your telescope and the eyepiece options out there. https://agenaastro.c...-telescope.html.

 

I don't have any experience with DeLites, but they are described as more economical and lightweight Delos. As with anything Televue, going from consumer grade eyepieces to theirs has always been a real shock for me! I think you can even try to post a wanted ad and find a used one on the classifieds if money is a concern. If you like it you can keep it or sell it for about the same money to buy a new one.  



#6 bdcmd

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 01:02 AM

 After much research, the Televue DeLites sounded ideal for getting to the next level, but it was disheartening to read that for scopes like the 6SE, premium eyepieces don't make a worthwhile difference and that something like basic Plossl's would be the better play.  Is this true?  

 

I see this opinion fairly frequently on the eyepiece forum and I think it's bovine manure.  Premium eyepieces perform well at ANY focal ratio.  The difference at longer focal ratios may be less pronounced than more basic eyepieces, but it is there, nevertheless.  I don't have any experience with the Delites, but do have complete sets of Radians and T6 Naglers.  They are outstanding in my long focal ratio SCT, Mak and refractors, as well as in the very fast Dob and Mak-Newt.  Admittedly, simpler eyepieces work well in the SCT and Mak and long refractors, but the premium eyepieces outperform them even there.  No contest in the faster scopes, though.  The 6SE is a great scope; if budget is limited, by all means look at eyepieces such as the Paradigms, TV Plössls, Vixen SLV, etc.  If not, don't be dissuaded from trying a really good, premium eyepiece such as the Delite.  After all, you may acquire a shorter focal length scope in the future and an eyepiece such as a Delite will work very well in it, where less well corrected types might not.  If I was starting out today, I would seriously look at the Delite series for my shorter focal length eyepieces as they have excellent eye relief, near perfect field correction and adequately wide field for most purposes, according to most reviews here on the forum.  YMMV, but I haven't regretted the purchase of any of my premium eyepieces.


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#7 russell23

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 06:58 AM

The Biggest problem with the DeLite’s is stopping with only one!  :)

 

Seriously though maybe the 7mm or 9mm would be the next logical step up from your 15mm Luminos.  
 



#8 ewave

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 09:40 AM

Welcome to Cloudy Nights.

 

If you have the funds to invest in a high end eyepiece, then by all means do it.

I happen to have several Televue EPs which include a few Delites.  I can certainly vouch for the 7mm Delite.

It performs well in my C8 Edge when the atmospheric seeing allows it. It really shines in my fast APO,

exhibiting very good correction and contrast across the entire field of view. 

 

Another big reason to get the Delite is eye relief, so if you wear glasses, a Delite in a shorter focal length makes sense.

I was going to recommend a 9mm Baader Morpheus (for the same price but wider field of view) but that would provide you 

with ~ 167x power. This or even an alternate 8mm EP would be my recommendation if your atmospheric seeing is less than ideal.

Whereas a 7mm EP will provide you with ~ 214x in the 6 SE, which is a little much but if your seeing in your area supports it, again

I wouldn't hesitate getting a 7mm Delite.  Happy star and planet hunting.


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#9 RAKing

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 09:57 AM

I would also like to welcome you to Cloudy Nights. flowerred.gif

 

As far as I am concerned, it never hurts to invest in quality eyepieces.  These eyepieces can go with you through the rest of your observing career and through many scopes down the road.

 

Suggesting that you stick with inexpensive eyepieces because you have an inexpensive SCT doesn't work for me.  If you can afford it, buy the best you can get.  Better eyepieces will bring out the best your scope can provide and give you the best view you can get from your scope - both now and in the future.

 

I owned a 6SE many years ago and it was a very nice scope.  I had a 2-inch visual back on mine and actually used Ethos and Naglers with it.  The weakest part of the 6SE is the tripod and I eventually found a Celestron CPC tripod to use under mine.

 

Cheers,

 

Ron

 

C6-SE041808.JPG


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#10 SeattleScott

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 10:09 AM

I might consider a 9mm and 6.5mm HD-60/Xcel LX. The Delite should slightly outperform them at much greater cost. So that is really what people are saying. It isn’t that Delites won’t work well. But your scope isn’t a F4.7 Dob, so you don’t NEED $250 eyepieces to get good views. The difference between Televue and good quality but more generic eyepieces is fairly subtle at F10. So if you want to go top tier you can certainly get Delite. It just won’t make a big difference compared to Xcel LX.

Scott
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#11 howardcano

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 10:22 AM

I'd try a 9mm or 11mm DeLite, new or used.  That way you'll absolutely know that the eyepiece is NOT the limiting factor in the images you see.

 

The 7mm DeLite is my most-used eyepiece in my f/6 and f/7 scopes.

 

I had a good selection of XCel LX eyepieces.  They are very good for the price.  But after I tried my first DeLite, I replaced the XCel LX's, one by one, as funds became available.  And I'm one of the stingiest guys I know!


Edited by howardcano, 06 June 2020 - 10:27 AM.

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#12 ewave

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 10:35 AM

I might consider a 9mm and 6.5mm HD-60/Xcel LX. The Delite should slightly outperform them at much greater cost. So that is really what people are saying. It isn’t that Delites won’t work well. But your scope isn’t a F4.7 Dob, so you don’t NEED $250 eyepieces to get good views. The difference between Televue and good quality but more generic eyepieces is fairly subtle at F10. So if you want to go top tier you can certainly get Delite. It just won’t make a big difference compared to Xcel LX.

Scott

Scott, in general I agree with your statement as far as on-axis views are concerned.  So why not simply get something like your suggestion or an Explore Scientific eyepiece , especially if you are getting a smaller focal length to see the planets at a higher magnification etc.  Where Televue EPs excels here is off-axis for a more pleasing entire field of view, not just at the center.  Too bad the COVID thing prevents the OP from getting to a nearby astro club where a try before you buy can put all of this into perspective.   Agree though that on-axis, there is very little to gain in getting a high end ep, but off-axis there will be at least some improvement in off-axis aberrations. 


Edited by ewave, 06 June 2020 - 10:36 AM.


#13 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 10:52 AM

Scott, in general I agree with your statement as far as on-axis views are concerned.  So why not simply get something like your suggestion or an Explore Scientific eyepiece , especially if you are getting a smaller focal length to see the planets at a higher magnification etc.  Where Televue EPs excels here is off-axis for a more pleasing entire field of view, not just at the center.  Too bad the COVID thing prevents the OP from getting to a nearby astro club where a try before you buy can put all of this into perspective.   Agree though that on-axis, there is very little to gain in getting a high end ep, but off-axis there will be at least some improvement in off-axis aberrations. 

 

My varsity set of eyepieces is all TeleVue. My scopes are nearly all quite fast. In a fast scope. TeleVue eyepieces care king, with a Paracorr or in a refractor corrected for field curvature, star truly are sharp across the field.

 

But at F/10, the light cone is not as steep and less sophisticated designs can work quite nicely.  

 

Chris is happy with his Luminos, I'd probably be happy with his Luminos in his F/10. I'd probably be unhappy with it in my 12.5 inch F/4.06.

 

At F/10, the differences between eyepieces in terms of off-axis sharpness is much less than it is at F5 or F/4.

 

In that sense, Chris is fortunate, his scope is forgiving and he can get very good views with more affordable eyepieces.

 

Jon


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#14 SeattleScott

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 11:31 AM

Yes ES would be an excellent option as well, sort of a happy medium between Xcel LX and TV. Maybe something with more than 60 AFOV.

I suggested the Xcel LX because they have similar AFOV and ER as the Delite, and going from 15 to 9 to 6.5 seems fairly ideal. But ES 8.8 and 6.7 UWAs would certainly work too.

Scott

Edited by SeattleScott, 06 June 2020 - 11:33 AM.


#15 russell23

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 11:35 AM

I’ll also point to the 8.5mm Pentax XF.  For $129 you get a premium performing eyepiece that goes well with the DeLite line.  For Moon and planets I only use the 13mm DeLite and the 8.5mm XF and the 1.6x Nikon Barlow.


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#16 ewave

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 11:35 AM

Jon, at shorter focal length EPs such as a 7mm working at F10, your statement is a good one.  I must have been thinking about longer focal length EPs as you maximize the fov.  My subjective findings applied to my slow and well corrected Edge scopes using cheaper 2" EPs and found much better off axis correction with Televue widefields EPs.  You have no disagreement from me here at the OP's concerns other than the small possibility of needed eye relief.


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#17 AJK 547

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 11:36 AM

Hello All,

 

First post as I start my rookie season on CN.  I've had the 6SE for several years now and have been impressed with what I've been able to see with it.  I'd say my home field is Bortle 5-6 and other than a few pesky sensor lights that randomly go on at both next door neighbors' houses, it can get decently dark in the backyard; especially with all the leaves on the trees now and softball leagues on ice.

 

I know my scope isn't setting the world on fire from a light gathering perspective, but it's provided some great looks and my goal is to push this thing as far as I can.  Early on, I added a 15mm Celestron Luminos eyepiece to the mix and have been very pleased with its performance.  It's great on star clusters, galaxy pairs (M81 & M82, M65 & M66) and general probing/sweeping of the Milky Way.  But this also represents my highest useful magnification eyepiece for lunar and planetary work and this is the area I'm looking to make strides in this Summer.  Frankly, the higher mag eyepieces that came with the 6SE aren't that great and are a bear to look through.  After much research, the Televue DeLites sounded ideal for getting to the next level, but it was disheartening to read that for scopes like the 6SE, premium eyepieces don't make a worthwhile difference and that something like basic Plossl's would be the better play.  Is this true?  Can anyone clear the air on this?  I was really excited to get out there with some DeLites this summer, but if they're not a good match for what I have, I'll have to head back to the drawing board.

 

Thanks!

 

Chris

Chris, Welcome to CN!  As you can see in my signature I have two C6’s and  C8-A.  I use my DeLites most of the time with the SCT’s due to very easy eye placement, and use the longer fl’s of my Deloi for more expansive observation.  The DeLites will work nicely in your C6.

 

One thing to remember is to collimate your C6 as best as you can.  This task will extract the best your C6 can give you.  As others have mentioned, since your scope is quite forgiving, you can drop down in cost and explore other ep options that are a bit less $$$.  
 

I was performing some high power tests last night on some doubles and was using my Denk II binoviewer (with Vixen NPL plossels).  I turned my attention early this morning to Jove and Saturn with the BV setup and the visual observations were distinctly more resolved and enjoyable than using  mono viewing with my TV9DL, 7DL, or  5DL..  Many ways to improve the visual experience!  😊

 

Clear, steady nights.


Edited by AJK 547, 06 June 2020 - 12:16 PM.


#18 Starman1

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 11:49 AM

Hello All,

 

First post as I start my rookie season on CN.  I've had the 6SE for several years now and have been impressed with what I've been able to see with it.  I'd say my home field is Bortle 5-6 and other than a few pesky sensor lights that randomly go on at both next door neighbors' houses, it can get decently dark in the backyard; especially with all the leaves on the trees now and softball leagues on ice.

 

I know my scope isn't setting the world on fire from a light gathering perspective, but it's provided some great looks and my goal is to push this thing as far as I can.  Early on, I added a 15mm Celestron Luminos eyepiece to the mix and have been very pleased with its performance.  It's great on star clusters, galaxy pairs (M81 & M82, M65 & M66) and general probing/sweeping of the Milky Way.  But this also represents my highest useful magnification eyepiece for lunar and planetary work and this is the area I'm looking to make strides in this Summer.  Frankly, the higher mag eyepieces that came with the 6SE aren't that great and are a bear to look through.  After much research, the Televue DeLites sounded ideal for getting to the next level, but it was disheartening to read that for scopes like the 6SE, premium eyepieces don't make a worthwhile difference and that something like basic Plossl's would be the better play.  Is this true?  Can anyone clear the air on this?  I was really excited to get out there with some DeLites this summer, but if they're not a good match for what I have, I'll have to head back to the drawing board.

 

Thanks!

 

Chris

Many good eyepieces out there.

I'll suggest some focal lengths to look for and why:

 

Low power, widest field--something with as large an exit pupil as possible and as large a true field as possible.

The obvious choice is a 32mm Plössl, which has the largest field possible in 1.25" and as large an exit pupil for a bright image.  About 50x.

 

Medium power, high acuity, good for general use on all DSOs: 

I'd select a 19-20mm eyepiece of around 68° for a nice engaging field size and a most-used eyepiece.  Magnification 75-79x.

 

Higher power for smaller objects and still a low enough power to yield a bright image.

13-14mm, maybe 82° to still have a decent sized true field and be a often-used eyepiece.  Magnification 107-115x.

 

High power for planets, moon, double stars, small DSOs.  Yet, still want to keep FOV from being too small.

9-10mm, maybe 82°, magnification 150-167x

 

That's if you want to have a set of 4 eyepieces to cover the bases.

 

But since there may be conditions that allow for an even higher power on occasion, I'd suggest a good 2X Barlow lens.

In that case, I'd eliminate the 9-10mm eyepiece and use the Barlow lens on the 19-20mm to yield a 9.5-10mm eyepiece and the 13-14mm eyepiece to yield a 6.5-7mm,

giving you a set of 32mm, 19-20mm, 13-14mm, 9.5-10mm, and 6.5-7mm.

That would cover just about every need you could have.

 

All eyepieces would be 1.25", as well as the Barlow.

And, with only 3 eyepieces, they could be higher quality eyepieces for high optical performance. 

As merely one possible example: 32mm Plössl, 20mm Explore Scientific 68°, 14mm Explore Scientific 82°

A higher end example: 32mm Plössl, 19mm TeleVue Panoptic, 13mm TeleVue Nagler Type 6

There is a huge number of possible collections that could fit here, including TeleVue Delites, and many others.

If you wear glasses and need eye relief, a 21mm Baader Hyperion and a 14mm Baader Morpheus could accompany the 32mm Plössl.

 

One last note: Why not a 40mm Plössl?  The image would be brighter. The true field is the exact same size as the 32mm, but the apparent field you see is quite a bit smaller, at 40°.

That apparent field might be acceptable at extreme high powers, but it tends to make the field appear distant, down a hole, at low power, so I recommend the 32mm instead.

Why not a 24mm 68° eyepiece as a low power.  The true field size is the same as a 32mm Plossl, and the apparent field wider.  Yes, but the field is darker because of the higher power, and 63x is a bit too high for a low power in a 6" scope.

 

Hope the ramblings help.


Edited by Starman1, 06 June 2020 - 11:51 AM.

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#19 Axiom20

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Posted 07 June 2020 - 09:43 PM

Hey CN,

 

Thanks a million for all the responses.  This information has helped me tremendously in reworking my eyepiece game plan.  The thought that goes into these replies is just unbelievable.  I surfed CN for about a year before joining and I can tell right now that posting is going to be addicting because the feedback is so doggone good.  Thank you again.

 

Hope everyone had a great weekend!

 

 


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#20 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 07 June 2020 - 09:53 PM

Hey CN,

 

Thanks a million for all the responses.  This information has helped me tremendously in reworking my eyepiece game plan.  The thought that goes into these replies is just unbelievable.  I surfed CN for about a year before joining and I can tell right now that posting is going to be addicting because the feedback is so doggone good.  Thank you again.

 

Hope everyone had a great weekend!

:waytogo:

 

Chris:

 

Hello and :welcome: to Cloudy Nights.  

 

You have a nice scope, you are in for some wonder times.

 

Jon


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