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Fluorite forever!

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#51 John Huntley

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Posted 19 October 2020 - 05:20 PM

Buy a new one & you get baby blue. 

 

Classic Vixen metallic green is OK, Tak green too pale maybe. 

 

Celestron Black  raspberry.gif

And Tak Black ?:

 

 

 

 

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Edited by John Huntley, 19 October 2020 - 05:20 PM.

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#52 laedco58

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Posted 19 October 2020 - 06:53 PM

And Tak Black ?:

John,

what finder scope is on your Tak?



#53 SpaceX

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Posted 19 October 2020 - 07:20 PM

Scott,

 

Having had both the black Celestron version of the FL 102S f/8.8 with Moonlight focuser and a standard FS-102 NSV, I can put the myth to rest that the slower FL 102S would perform better than the faster FS102. It does not. I'm sure there are some very fine samples of the FL102 S, but mine was not having particularly great optics, despite the seller promising it did and that optics were comparable to the FS102. In my experience, quality variance in the FL series is bigger than in the FS series. So some samples are similar between FL and FS, others are not. 

 

Over my lifetime I've owned 3 Celestron/Vixen fluorite doublets. 1 so-so, one spherically well corrected but with astigmatism. And one with out of this world outstandingly perfect optics: the small Celestron branded FL 55S. Should never have sold that one. Cosmetically challenged, but boy had it PERFECT optics. Alas, my FS102 NSV had similarly perfect optics. But my other Celestron/Vixen fluorites definitely had not. Great scopes nonetheless. But I recommend to handpick a sample to get a superb one living up to it's legendary status. Especially when coming from lesser scopes, even a just OK fluorite doublet will show wonderful images of the night sky.

 

With Takahashi, handpicking is less relevant, all are superb. And some are, well, extra superb.

Just make sure that it has been well cared for. No high-end instrument will do better if treated badly.

Treating the CaF2 lens well is an integral part of the ownership experience of a fluorite refractor. For my FS-60CB, it is the front element lens. Putting a smudge on such a lens can be a dauting fix. I would send it in to takahashi to have the lens cleaned for a few hundred dollars. Humidity control is essential as well. Does anybody have a handy link to a maintenance guide for fluorite telescopes?

 

I think getting a CaF2 lens assembly is very much worth it. The CaF2 lens assembly is more than just an apochromat: it is an art piece to be handed down to the next generation. The low light scatter provides superb images, if used with the right equipment later in the light path. I am using a "cheap" Tak C2x module which likely ruins any gains from the fluorite lens. The planetary and lunar views are still impeccable (if used with the right eyepieces). My gosh, put some bino Zeiss eyepieces on this tiny scope at low to medium magnification and the lunar views will blow you away. The Jovian system is sharp and brilliant. Go to a dark site, throw in a single low mag Zeiss eyepiece and the deep sky is yours. I once stumbled across a great view of majestic bald eagle nest in the moonlight. It is my strong opinion that it doesn't matter how many objects you can see with an optical instrument or how many you can see/photograph per night. What matters is the time you spend on enjoying each object. graduate.sml.gif blahblah.gif

 

Takahashi FS owners, how do you guys handle the situation with preventing dew on the front lens?


Edited by SpaceX, 19 October 2020 - 08:11 PM.

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#54 Scott in NC

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Posted 19 October 2020 - 07:40 PM

 

Takahashi FS owners, how do you guys handle the situation with preventing dew on the front lens?

I use a dew heater if I’m going to be outdoors for several hours under dewy conditions.  If I’m just observing for a couple of hours at home, dew isn’t usually much of an issue.  If I’m attending a star party in the southeastern U.S., then a dew heater is a necessity.


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#55 John Huntley

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Posted 19 October 2020 - 07:46 PM

John,

what finder scope is on your Tak?

It is a lowly Skywatcher 6x30 RACI. Fits the Tak finder mount perfectly. I have added the ADM quick release finder adapter as well. The Tak 30mm finder is superb but I needed an RACI to help with back / neck ache. 

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#56 laedco58

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Posted 19 October 2020 - 09:12 PM

It is a lowly Skywatcher 6x30 RACI. Fits the Tak finder mount perfectly. I have added the ADM quick release finder adapter as well. The Tak 30mm finder is superb but I needed an RACI to help with back / neck ache. 

Thanks!
Back/ neck aches and pains are precisely why I asked. My DL is from the second run so the finder mount and focuser are the new Tak blue, but my ADM quick release is black.


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#57 Bowlerhat

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Posted 19 October 2020 - 09:16 PM

It is a lowly Skywatcher 6x30 RACI. Fits the Tak finder mount perfectly. I have added the ADM quick release finder adapter as well. The Tak 30mm finder is superb but I needed an RACI to help with back / neck ache. 

Huh. I didn't know it fits, I thought the ring is too small. I need to try this.



#58 Marcus Roman

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Posted 20 October 2020 - 04:07 AM

Anyway, all this does is demonstrate sample-to-sample variability.  And it proves that Takahashi is not better then Vixen in all cases and from my experience maybe not even in most cases.  Takahashi does have superior build quality and there are other compelling reasons to choose a TAK over a Vixen.  

 

For a very long time I have always read (usually from owners of the FS102) of the superior optics in the FS102 but practical experience tells me different.

 

Both are very good. 

 

A tale of two FS102's.  Both decent.  The top one is exceptional, but not quite to the level of the best Vixen Fluorite above.

 

The second suffers from some spherical is between a ¼ and ⅙ wave and a wide central zone.  

Interesting! However, I think a more suitable comparison should be done with a Takahashi Steinheil model with longer focal ratio, i.e. with an FC100N (f/10)...in fact, the FL102 is a Steinheil f/9 while the FS 102 is a Frainhofer f/8..I think this can be material....


Edited by Marcus Roman, 20 October 2020 - 04:09 AM.


#59 25585

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Posted 20 October 2020 - 08:58 AM

And Tak Black ?:

raspberry.gif raspberry.gif

 

I may get a Feather Touch for my DL or TSA one day. John your 1st edition looks very cool. 


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#60 25585

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Posted 20 October 2020 - 09:02 AM

It is a lowly Skywatcher 6x30 RACI. Fits the Tak finder mount perfectly. I have added the ADM quick release finder adapter as well. The Tak 30mm finder is superb but I needed an RACI to help with back / neck ache. 

Had Tak made a RACI, I would have had one. I use an Altair 60mm RACI finder at present.


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#61 laedco58

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Posted 20 October 2020 - 12:00 PM

raspberry.gif raspberry.gif

 

I may get a Feather Touch for my DL or TSA one day. John your 1st edition looks very cool. 

My DL came with the Tak MEF two speed. Works great, came included with the scope, not as pretty as the Feather Touch pinion  on my NP127, but didn’t cost $385.00 either.


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#62 John Huntley

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Posted 20 October 2020 - 04:01 PM

raspberry.gif raspberry.gif

 

I may get a Feather Touch for my DL or TSA one day. John your 1st edition looks very cool. 

Thanks waytogo.gif

FT are wonderful - I have one on my TMB/LZOS 130. I thought Moonlight were pretty good but the FT is in a different league again. Pricey but quality costs of course and when you look at the design and construction you can see what you are paying for smile.gif

 

I wish I could afford to put them on all my scopes tongue2.gif


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#63 Winks

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Posted 20 October 2020 - 07:41 PM


 

Takahashi FS owners, how do you guys handle the situation with preventing dew on the front lens?

I moved to Arizona.


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#64 zsb04

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Posted 20 October 2020 - 08:42 PM

Yeah no dew in AZ . 


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#65 StarAlert

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Posted 20 October 2020 - 11:19 PM

None in SoCal either. 


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#66 roadi

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Posted 21 October 2020 - 05:28 AM

Even if the Vixen had the better lens?

Depends on how much better the Vixen lens will be. As customer, I'm not realy in a position to make a qualified judgement on quality of the lenses before ordering.

What steers me to the Tak is "as you also noticed" the mechanical build quality.

I've never owened an Vixen fluorite refractor, but I asume the lenses are generally more equal than different as both companies get the optics from same maker, Canon.

I have also owened and used 4 samples of Takahashi fluorite refractors and all of them where excellent IMO. (FS 60 CB; Sky90; FS102; FS128). Aside from these I've owened a 210 Mewlon. All top notch build wise.

The Vixen/Celestron hardware seems to match same level as Skywatcher. Thats not what I would expect from an instrument at almost same price level as Takahashi.

I would realy like to look through a Vixen, a sample like yours. Must be joy to use waytogo.gif wink.gif  


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#67 25585

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Posted 21 October 2020 - 07:49 AM

Thanks waytogo.gif

FT are wonderful - I have one on my TMB/LZOS 130. I thought Moonlight were pretty good but the FT is in a different league again. Pricey but quality costs of course and when you look at the design and construction you can see what you are paying for smile.gif

 

I wish I could afford to put them on all my scopes tongue2.gif

I have a Moonlite on my 120 Equinox & it is fine. But FT is a "which scope" scope choice & I have not made the decision yet. Part of the problem is knowing how compatible with Tak accessories, in particular my extenders, FT focusers are. 


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