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For those who "upgraded" from a Takahashi FC-100DC or DF to a DZ...

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#1 ddegroot

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Posted 30 July 2020 - 02:48 PM

Can you tell us whether you notice any change in the visual appearance of the objects you normally observe through the DZ, relative to the DC or DF? 

Are there any differences, good or bad, that you discern between the DC/DF and DZ? 

Apologies if this thread exists elsewhere; I couldn't find it. And thanks in advance for the insights. 



#2 drmark67

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Posted 31 July 2020 - 11:29 PM

I'm curious as well?popcorn.gif  


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#3 Allan Wade

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Posted 01 August 2020 - 08:41 AM

There's a few guys here who have done the switch. Hopefully they chime in. Reports are that Takahashi got the recipe spot on and the DZ is about as well corrected as a doublet can be. Though I suspect you will probably still need a combination of good seeing and experience to pick up the difference from the earlier DC and DF.



#4 sunnyday

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Posted 01 August 2020 - 08:47 AM

popcorn.gif

i have the dz but i never had the chance to see in another tak before.


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#5 MJB

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Posted 02 August 2020 - 02:25 AM

paging mikeDnight ... 


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#6 mikeDnight

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Posted 02 August 2020 - 09:59 AM

I did change from a fabulous DC that I'd used for five years, to a DZ which arrived at the end of April. I'd read some reports that the DZ is cooler in tone, which is a quality I like, and from what I've seen so far it appears to be so. Optically the DZ has given me a surprisingly sharp star image at 1000X while I was studying a close double. Tak do in fact state in the user manual that the DZ is a high power instrument, but I doubt they'ed expect any nut to use it at 1000X. The DC was no slouch when it came to high power observing, and I could effectively observe the Moon between 180X and 474X as well as on tiny Mars and the large narrow crescent of Venus. Jupiter was best between 150X and 250X depending on seeing. Saturn 250X. 

So far I've had some superb lunar views using the DZ and Jupiter & Saturn are very nice, but are quite low in the sky so the best is yet to come I imagine. Mars back in 2016 was amazingly detailed through the DC despite it bouncing off the roof tops, so I'm expecting it to be spectacular in the DZ this year as it rides high in the sky and is much larger. Time will tell!

 

From what I've seen visually so far, there is little to choose between any of the FC100D series. I found the DC/DF to be a vibrant planetary scope that revealed festoons, garlands and white ovals in Jupiter's cloud belts with ease. It's star images were textbook perfect, and deep sky targets such as Messier objects were unusually bright. Using a binoviewer in my DC, I honestly believe I saw a greater level of planetary detail using both eyes than I ever saw with one eyepiece while using my FS128. 

My DZ hasn't yet had the opportunity to be fully put through its paces, but what I've seen so far has impressed me. It's power and its perfect star images lead me to believe it has an exquisite lens, and there is absolutely zero CA. But apart from the warmer tone of the DC I can't ever remember seeing any CA in it either. I've used a number of DL's and they are perfection, and are slightly cooler than the DC/DF. I'd say the DZ is more the visual equivalent to the DL but in a shorter body. The real colour correction advantage of the DZ would probably only really come into its own when the scope is used for imaging.

Mechanically the DZ has a much better focuser than the DC, and with its retractable dew shield and removable extension tubes, it is physically small and easy to transport. 

If you're a visual observer using a DC/DF and you're wondering if its worth selling your scope and buying a DZ like I have, I would honestly say its probably not worth the move. The DC/DF are terrific visual refractors with great optics and will take very high power. If you're buying for the first time and want the best optics out of the series ( technically only), and you don't mind paying the extra, you're unlikely to be disappointed with the DZ. 

Bottom line - If you lined each of the various FC's alongside eachother and aimed them at Jupiter on a first class night and when the planet is high in the sky, you wouldn't care which one you carried away under your arm. They're all great!


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#7 25585

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Posted 02 August 2020 - 11:26 AM

Great comparison Mike  waytogo.gif

 

I am looking forward to reading how you find binoviewing with your DZ, and how you fit up the scope for it, with its heftier focuser. 


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#8 mikeDnight

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Posted 02 August 2020 - 06:04 PM

Below is the DZ focuser and Baader Zeiss prism with helical microfocuser. The binoviewer with 2X barlow is held solidly at any angle and without any image shift as far as i can tell so far. The extension tube is needed when the bv & barlow are used.

 

IMG_7069.JPG

 

The DZ & binoviewer is seen below without the barlow. Here the extension tube is removed to gain more inward focus, enabling low power views. 

 

IMG_7070.JPG

 

The pencil mark on the draw tube was purposefully drawn onto the tube by myself. It represents the point of infinity focus when I'm searching for Venus in daylight using my 35mm Eudiascopic.


Edited by mikeDnight, 02 August 2020 - 06:10 PM.

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#9 ddegroot

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Posted 03 August 2020 - 01:19 PM

I did change from a fabulous DC that I'd used for five years, to a DZ which arrived at the end of April. I'd read some reports that the DZ is cooler in tone, which is a quality I like, and from what I've seen so far it appears to be so. Optically the DZ has given me a surprisingly sharp star image at 1000X while I was studying a close double. Tak do in fact state in the user manual that the DZ is a high power instrument, but I doubt they'ed expect any nut to use it at 1000X. The DC was no slouch when it came to high power observing, and I could effectively observe the Moon between 180X and 474X as well as on tiny Mars and the large narrow crescent of Venus. Jupiter was best between 150X and 250X depending on seeing. Saturn 250X. 

So far I've had some superb lunar views using the DZ and Jupiter & Saturn are very nice, but are quite low in the sky so the best is yet to come I imagine. Mars back in 2016 was amazingly detailed through the DC despite it bouncing off the roof tops, so I'm expecting it to be spectacular in the DZ this year as it rides high in the sky and is much larger. Time will tell!

 

From what I've seen visually so far, there is little to choose between any of the FC100D series. I found the DC/DF to be a vibrant planetary scope that revealed festoons, garlands and white ovals in Jupiter's cloud belts with ease. It's star images were textbook perfect, and deep sky targets such as Messier objects were unusually bright. Using a binoviewer in my DC, I honestly believe I saw a greater level of planetary detail using both eyes than I ever saw with one eyepiece while using my FS128. 

My DZ hasn't yet had the opportunity to be fully put through its paces, but what I've seen so far has impressed me. It's power and its perfect star images lead me to believe it has an exquisite lens, and there is absolutely zero CA. But apart from the warmer tone of the DC I can't ever remember seeing any CA in it either. I've used a number of DL's and they are perfection, and are slightly cooler than the DC/DF. I'd say the DZ is more the visual equivalent to the DL but in a shorter body. The real colour correction advantage of the DZ would probably only really come into its own when the scope is used for imaging.

Mechanically the DZ has a much better focuser than the DC, and with its retractable dew shield and removable extension tubes, it is physically small and easy to transport. 

If you're a visual observer using a DC/DF and you're wondering if its worth selling your scope and buying a DZ like I have, I would honestly say its probably not worth the move. The DC/DF are terrific visual refractors with great optics and will take very high power. If you're buying for the first time and want the best optics out of the series ( technically only), and you don't mind paying the extra, you're unlikely to be disappointed with the DZ. 

Bottom line - If you lined each of the various FC's alongside eachother and aimed them at Jupiter on a first class night and when the planet is high in the sky, you wouldn't care which one you carried away under your arm. They're all great!

Just what I was looking for, thank you! 


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