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Help Creating HOO or HO from Triad OSC data--FITS attached

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#1 42itous1

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 10:51 AM

 https://www.dropbox....ad 1hr.fit?dl=0

 

This is one hour using the Triad filter on an asi1600MC Cool.  I am interested in getting the HOO or HO color palette.  I've looked at various tutorials--but haven't yet come up with a good plan of attack.

 

This is a straight forward processing in PI. 

 

get.jpg?insecure

 

 

 

 

 

Appreciate anyone giving it a try.



#2 sn2006gy

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 11:00 AM

The OO or O in HOO or HO will need a lot more time to probably show up much. 

 

What I've seen some people do is extract RGB channels,  rename R to H,   combine G & B into an O and then mess around with creating an HO using those or do the H + Combined O+ G(as another O channel) and such.

 

There is also a few DSLR users doing photoshop color/tone mapping to convert colors to hubble palette - i think more people do this than you're lead on to believe ;)  

 

https://www.cloudyni...for-stock-dslrs

 

There are a few people here doing cool things with this and similar filters, i'll see if i can find 'em and surface them. i keep getting search limited so it's kind of a pain (off to use google site search)



#3 bobzeq25

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 11:19 AM

https://pixinsight.c...Extraction.html

 

Etc.  <smile>  You extract the R, G, and B channels from the color data (3 operations, checking just one channel at a time).  They come as greyscale data, 3 different images.  You then process them as if you'd taken mono data with Ha and O(III) filters.  Which will not be trivial.  <smile>

 

I agree you'll need more data to get reasonably low noise data for O(III), maybe quite a lot.  The triad does nice images, but it's using two stacked filters, one of which is dyed glass.  A mono camera uses one interference filter, and, when you take O(III), all the pixels are working on all the O(III) data all the time.  It's significantly more effective.


Edited by bobzeq25, 27 September 2020 - 11:31 AM.


#4 42itous1

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 12:06 PM

Yes--I know I have too little data--and I have tried Jon Rista's method--

 

https://jonrista.com...-pixelmath-hoo/

 

after channel extraction and renaming (I used Ha--OII-and OII2 to distinguish the three channels)

 

something was wrong because when using the pixelmath expressions-my 3 images were not detected--

 

I also have IP4AP and have looked at Warren's method with CFA--he also referenced some threads I will take a look at--I'll probably figure it out.

 

The image is old and solely for experimenting so I don't plan on adding data--just trying to get ready for when I have some long integrations on emission nebula during moonlit nights :)



#5 42itous1

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 12:13 PM

(3 operations, checking just one channel at a time)

 

Ahh-maybe that had something to do with it--I extracted all 3 at once--you'd think that would be OK.

 

Anyway--I have to work on it.  Just trying to take the lazy way out.

 

Was also thinking someone may use the latest Startools 1.5 that does this fairly easily it would seem--(I have not tried yet)

 

APP also does this pretty well I think


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#6 Dereksc

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 01:09 PM

When you add more imaging time I think you will end up with a nice result.

 

I processed your image using PIP blending - a technique described by "thecoldestnights" CN subscriber:

https://thecoldestni...with-pixelmath/

 

From shared FIT file:

RGB split - single operation in PixInsight

ABE on each R,G,B

Histogram stretch R,G,B

assign Ha=R, Oiii=G, Sii=B (just name assignments for PixelMath expression below)

using PixelMath perform the following transformations to re-create a single RGB image:

    R = (Oiii^~Oiii)*Sii + ~(Oiii^~Oiii)*Ha
    G = ((Oiii*Ha)^~(Oiii*Ha))*Ha + ~((Oiii*Ha)^~(Oiii*Ha))*Oiii
    B = Oiii

use Starnet++ to separate stars and nebula.

use curves  to boost nebula color/intesity.

MLT noise reduction on nebula

re-combine stars and nebula using PixelMath

rotate, crop and re-sample for posting here

 

wiz_triad_1hr.jpg

 

Regards

 

Derek


Edited by Dereksc, 27 September 2020 - 01:16 PM.

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#7 sn2006gy

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 01:17 PM

Derek,

Going to apply some of that technique on my Squid and see if i can get the squid to pop - i hadn't tried color mask myself but i think that's the missing piece i needed smile.gif

 

In fact, i'd love to see what you can do with it!

 

https://rockchucksum...skies-with-osc/

 

 


Edited by sn2006gy, 27 September 2020 - 01:19 PM.

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#8 Dereksc

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 01:29 PM

Derek,

Going to apply some of that technique on my Squid and see if i can get the squid to pop - i hadn't tried color mask myself but i think that's the missing piece i needed smile.gif

 

In fact, i'd love to see what you can do with it!

 

https://rockchucksum...skies-with-osc/

Hi Byron,

I just edited my post above I ended up not needing ColorMask for the OP's image .... just curves, sorry for that. However I did use ColorMask on your Heart Nebula data, it helped me in that case - maybe your Squid data will benefit - worth a shot :). I'll see if I can have a go when I get chance.

 

Regards

Derek 



#9 42itous1

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 01:47 PM

When you add more imaging time I think you will end up with a nice result.

 

I processed your image using PIP blending - a technique described by "thecoldestnights" CN subscriber:

https://thecoldestni...with-pixelmath/

 

From shared FIT file:

RGB split - single operation in PixInsight

ABE on each R,G,B

Histogram stretch R,G,B

assign Ha=R, Oiii=G, Sii=B (just name assignments for PixelMath expression below)

using PixelMath perform the following transformations to re-create a single RGB image:

    R = (Oiii^~Oiii)*Sii + ~(Oiii^~Oiii)*Ha
    G = ((Oiii*Ha)^~(Oiii*Ha))*Ha + ~((Oiii*Ha)^~(Oiii*Ha))*Oiii
    B = Oiii

use Starnet++ to separate stars and nebula.

use curves  to boost nebula color/intesity.

MLT noise reduction on nebula

re-combine stars and nebula using PixelMath

rotate, crop and re-sample for posting here

 

attachicon.gifwiz_triad_1hr.jpg

 

Regards

 

Derek

Thanks, Derek!

 

Just what I was looking for.  It looks like I can do some interesting things with this filter with more integration in the future

 

 

Very nice stars!


Edited by 42itous1, 27 September 2020 - 01:48 PM.

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#10 the Elf

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Posted 28 September 2020 - 03:20 AM

Here is my attempt. Processing:

 

- split to R, G, B

- ABE, function degree 1, subtraction individually for each channel

- use image statistics, activate stdev and check how much noise there is in the three channels. Question is use green only or blue and green. It turns out your blue is not much worse than green.

- Linear Fit blue to green

- Pixel Math: O3 = 0.5xG + 0.5xB

- rename R to Ha

- I skipped deconvolution. The data is not deep enough.

- for both individually clone and make a mask that separates stars from background, invert mask, use wavelets for linear denoise.

- stretch Ha: 300 in arcsinh followed by a gentle HT

- stretch O3: 500 in arcsinh, follewed by a gentle HT, O3 is much dimmer, don't overstretch

- for O3: scripts-analysis-extract wavelet layer, 4. Keep the residual, close the layers. Stretch residual to a mask for individual boost of the nebula only, remove stars from the mask with clone stamp

- LHE on O3 to taste using that mask (I used the default settings) plus HT

- make the same residual mask for Ha but do not yet boost Ha, it is strong enough

- use PixelMath for combination so that the stars are neutral or ideally a few blueish and a few redish

  I used R=0.85Ha, G=0.75O3, B=0.07Ha+0.75O3

- use HT in RGB/K to stretch more, use R, G, B individually to adjust star color and background using the white point and black point sliders.

- use an inverted L-mask to apply TGV denoise 30 or so

- using the residual mask from Ha apply more LHE to taste

 

HOO_lowres.jpg

 

As you can see I failed getting the O3 out. NB is not my strong side but maybe you can pick up a few steps that help you.

 

clear skies!

the Elf

 

 

 

 

 


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#11 lakeorion

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Posted 28 September 2020 - 06:04 AM

And the OIII is an order of magnitude weaker than Ha on this target as pointed out here in Post 4.

 

The Wizard Nebula, NGC 7380 in SHO Started by Madratter

 

So a clean OIII component for targeted aggressive stretching is going to take significantly more time to obtain.

 

The good news is several people are looking at this target ('cause it's high in the sky now) and sharing their results (except for me - mine stink still) so everyone can get ideas.


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#12 the Elf

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Posted 28 September 2020 - 03:17 PM

My pacman image is basically a Ha image. What I mean by this is the Ha gives it the structure and the sharpness and the contrast. The O-III is so weak and drowned in the noise with my uncooled DSLR that it basically is a blue colored dot denoised until all structure is lost. I guess I hit the border of how far I can go with an uncooled camera.

http://www.elf-of-lo...Pacman2019.html

Times are getting ridiculous, 15h for this one. For me with some 300+ cloudy nights and a job to do this is not feasible unless I am very lucky with the weather. It boils down to picking an object that is in reach for the equipment and time. The wizard needs quite some time to pick up the O-III. I tried and gave up. Finally I made it an Ha-OSC:

http://www.elf-of-lo...Wizard2018.html

 

There are a few objects that have an O3 almost as strong or stronger than Ha and these are the Veil Nebula and the Dumbbell Nebula. These turn out perfect with the triad. Here is an example:

https://www.cloudyni...long-l-extreme/


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