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PHD2 adds multi-star guiding...

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332 replies to this topic

#326 bvalente

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Posted 29 March 2021 - 01:18 PM

I'm not sure if it's dev4 or the multi star option, but every night (4) I've tried using the feature I get a telescope disconnect notice about 4 hours into my 4 run.  With the feature disabled (only 2 due to weather) I've had a full night's run.  Will continue testing.

 

Yeah i don't know. MSG/algorithms are invisible to telescope communications and don't work any differently than single star (from telescope interface/communications) , so i'm not sure why that's happening. 


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#327 mlrtime99

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Posted 29 March 2021 - 10:41 PM

And confirmed..... not related to MSG.  Could have just been bad timing.  I'll try reinstalling drivers tomorrow



#328 Noobulosity

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Posted 02 April 2021 - 12:07 PM

I've had a few runs since MSG was added. I'll have to go back to old logs, if I still have them. But from my foggy memory, I believe old guiding Total RMS was around 1.5" to 1.6". Last night seemed to hover just over 1".

While it could be down to better seeing conditions, I have to imagine MSG played a good part in my better guiding numbers.

No major issues with losing stars. No instability. Everything has been working well over the past few runs since I updated PHD2 to the latest dev build and N.I.N.A. to a nightly build with the latest sequencer.

I'm pretty dead from last night's imaging. But I can share guiding logs or screenshots, if anyone wants to see anything.

Edited by Noobulosity, 02 April 2021 - 12:09 PM.


#329 dcweaver

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Posted 06 April 2021 - 08:12 PM

Hi Brian - My GM811G has wild DEC backlash at times to the point where I have to crop my images during processing - only in DEC.  I have lost star lock several times during dithering on a star near the edge.  I have also had stars fuzz-out and lost star lock.  I should try increasing (?) SNR to see if the last issue stills occurs.  My GM811G has a DEC only SLW.  I have followed Scott's YouTube video on adjusting the worm but I still get wild DEC backlash at times.  I have locked the DEC down now effectively eliminating the SLW to see if this corrects the problem.  I had a Classic G8 several lifetimes ago and never had this bad of a DEC backlash on that mount.

 

IMHO it would be helpful if the user could select the size of the AutoFind star area.  Where 1.0 is the entire FOV and something like 0.75 only covers 75% of the inner area FOV.

 

 

Hi Jim

 

that sounds frustrating for sure. 

 

Talking about things in general terms like fuzzing out, 'wild' backlash probably isn't the path to getting things addressed.

 

my suggestion is that you do a baseline guiding run, and take those results and post them to the phd forums and explain your concerns regarding any guiding results. I have no idea how you are using PHD and if/how you are using things like the auto backlash compensation. 

 

(baseline guiding steps are here: https://www.dropbox....enPHD2.pdf?dl=0 )

 

if/when you get results like it looses the guidestar on the edge, grab the relevant log, make note of the time, and post it up for the PHD devs to see. 

 

They are always open to improving things provided there is good data and use case to back it up.

 

hth

 

Brian

   

This is an interesting exchange from the perspective of someone looking for a new mount.  A Losmandy user describes an issue with "wild DEC backlash" in their GM811G, and provides some description regarding how they have tried to address it.  The Losmandy rep then counsels the user about vague posts not being helpful, and suggests they work with the PhD2 team more closely.

 

I can appreciate the recommendation to work with the PhD2 team, makes sense.  But wouldn't it also make sense to offer some assistance diagnosing the "wild backlash".  After all, it is a Losmandy mount that is being discussed.  Perhaps this was done via private message and I didn't see it.  Perhaps I missed some context elsewhere in the exchange.

 

As it reads, it sounds like a missed opportunity to demonstrate the kind of product commitment someone would expect from Losmandy.

 

Help me if I am seeing this wrong.



#330 Jim Waters

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Posted 06 April 2021 - 08:32 PM

I don't recall any private messages related to this one post.  I have the problem 'somewhat' under control.  One screw hole on the DEC gear box was stripped and the motor would rock back and forth when the DEC changed directions. I purchased another gear box, disassembled the DEC worm assembly, adjusted stuff and put it back together.  Its better now but I have to keep on top of things.  I still have more DEC backlash than I would like.  The PHD2 dither 'settle time' is better.



#331 bvalente

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Posted 06 April 2021 - 08:53 PM

This is an interesting exchange from the perspective of someone looking for a new mount.  A Losmandy user describes an issue with "wild DEC backlash" in their GM811G, and provides some description regarding how they have tried to address it.  The Losmandy rep then counsels the user about vague posts not being helpful, and suggests they work with the PhD2 team more closely.

 

I can appreciate the recommendation to work with the PhD2 team, makes sense.  But wouldn't it also make sense to offer some assistance diagnosing the "wild backlash".  After all, it is a Losmandy mount that is being discussed.  Perhaps this was done via private message and I didn't see it.  Perhaps I missed some context elsewhere in the exchange.

 

As it reads, it sounds like a missed opportunity to demonstrate the kind of product commitment someone would expect from Losmandy.

 

Help me if I am seeing this wrong.

sure - i can offer my perspective. 

 

I am a regular contributor on the PHD forums, and i analyze anywhere from 5-15 guidelogs per day. So i like to think i am familiar and comfortable diagnosing guiding related issue. 

Something like this involves getting the proper guidelogs, making sure it includes a calibration and guiding assistant run, and they are good results (this may take some back and forth, since sometimes the issue are simple errors like bad setup data, bad sky position, etc.).  

 

A baseline guiding is what I would always start with to start with a clean slate, which was part of my recommendation

 

Then, figuring out what is the cause may involve a lot of detailed specifics about PHD, the mount, guiding settings, etc. that are unique to that individual. there is a lot of back and forth

 

My suggestion about moving to PHD forums was because:

1. This specific thread is about multi-star guiding feature, not about general guiding help and not Losmandy, so i think it's off topic enough and detailed enough that it should be given a proper forum. 

 

2. as mentioned, I am at the PHD forums every day helping out with a lot of guiding questions (across all mounts), so I fully expect to engage Jim or anyone in those forums. (if you aren't familiar with PHD support forums, you'll see i post a lot). in addition to helping in general, I also have Losmandy experience wink.gif so i'm basically saying let's get your question answered with full attention, not as an off topic thread distraction. 

 

3. in addition, Jim specifically mentioned a feature request "IMHO it would be helpful if the user could select the size of the AutoFind star area.  Where 1.0 is the entire FOV and something like 0.75 only covers 75% of the inner area FOV." which has nothing to do with multi-star, guiding results, or the mount.  It's a feature request and I think referring this to the PHD devs makes the most sense. not sure where else I would send that? :) .

 

Jim and I have exchanged messages over the months (years?) and i'm always happy to help him or anyone out. you can PM me, send email to techsupport at losmandy.com whatever i'm good with it

 

Jim if you have any followup questions just let me know.

 

@dcweaver if you still think it is a missed opportunity, let me know what you think i could have done better. 

 

Brian


Edited by bvalente, 06 April 2021 - 08:56 PM.

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#332 Cfreerksen

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Posted 13 April 2021 - 11:20 AM

Between MSG and PPEC I have to say that my guiding has gotten to a point of satisfaction. I had a couple of steady nights a few nights ago while doing the needle. I had tried PPEC a couple of times and I guess I never gave it enough time to settle out and fully determine the period of the worm. I let it do it's thing for a while and then changed some of the reactive and predictive defaults and was quite impressed. Pairing MSG and PPEC has made me a happy camper. I just hope it remembers the profile so I don't have to let it learn all over again. It took about 8-9 turns of the worm to figure the period the first time and smooth out.

 

I started PPEC (below) at about image 20 after a filter change. RA almost as good as DEC, this has never happened.

 

Chris

Attached Thumbnails

  • MSG_PPEC_PHD2.jpg

Edited by Cfreerksen, 13 April 2021 - 11:26 AM.


#333 TXLS99

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Posted 13 April 2021 - 06:38 PM

Between MSG and PPEC I have to say that my guiding has gotten to a point of satisfaction.

Same here! My last time out I tried MSG with PPEC and got great results, and the seeing wasnt even that good.




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