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Recent Jupiter and Saturn.

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#1 David Gray

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Posted 12 May 2021 - 09:22 AM

At last can get to posting the May 7 views after some urgent observatory roof restoration.....as related in my Mars/M35 thread (Post #6).........

 

“....on Friday morning after a good session with Jupiter & Saturn a cat leaping off the observatory/garden shed north roof caused a major cave in.  Showing how rotted/weakened the structure was (and likely surprised/shocked the cat). That  fixed/non-opening roof already earmarked for a major renewal by end summer.  The (temporary) repair has taken some time and effort and that was constantly stalled with the showery weather.”

 

Yesterday morning after a decent view of Jupiter I might start to feel under attack from the animal world.  Completing the sketch I ambled over to the garden seat to take in the dawn chorus only to see a Blackbird swoop into the observatory.  Briefly perching on the sketching board it launched back out and sent the drawing plummeting to the floor. The concrete floor is still damp and muddied from the recent roof failure and repair activity.  Phew....it had landed face-up, and thankfully the bird did not leave a ‘calling card’ – as the avian ‘graffiti’ around the yard lately might have signalled!

 

My first view of the GRS this apparition and seems fairly dark tho’ its hue quite muted.  Saturn was hopeless on the 11th, and so too was Jupiter till nearly sunrise. Getting Jupiter when the GRS was still clearing the CM; the seeing IV/III-IV then, Already an indication of the spot’s dullness when in recent apparitions the vividness still beaconed through even poor spells of definition – giving an almost fluorescent effect at times.

 

As with other apparitions of Saturn the closing ring reveals the formerly hidden hemisphere (Southern) is showing that cold bluish cast (sometimes greenish)...........Dave.

J up Sat 2021 May 7  11.jpg


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#2 niteskystargazer

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Posted 12 May 2021 - 10:04 AM

David,

 

Very nice sketches of Recent Jupiter and Saturn smile.gif .

 

CS,KLU,

 

thanx.gif ,

 

Tom



#3 frank5817

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Posted 12 May 2021 - 10:50 AM

David,

 

Impressive Jupiter and Saturn sketches.

 

Frank :)



#4 Quinnipiac Monster

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Posted 12 May 2021 - 07:08 PM

I noticed too the relative dullness of GRS a few mornings ago. I was even more impressed by the weakness of SEB(S) after GRS, though it looks healthier in your drawing. What could be seen appeared grayish rather than brown. Seeing was so bed I did not even try a sketch, though it improved before sunrise. Crepuscular light helped a lot too, before it got too bright. 

 

Great stuff as usual.


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#5 astronz59

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Posted 12 May 2021 - 07:14 PM

Excellent work as ever David. I've waited up 'til 4am imawake.gif to catch both Saturn and Jupiter, but they're still not high for good seeing in my light polluted area...fingertap.gif


Edited by astronz59, 12 May 2021 - 07:15 PM.

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#6 mdowns

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Posted 12 May 2021 - 08:12 PM

I overlooked this earlier David,what a pleasant surprise. Superb as always.Can I ask,there is always much subtlety with the details you capture,how significant of an aid,if any, do you find the bino-viewer to be?                   Michael



#7 flt158

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Posted 13 May 2021 - 08:52 AM

That south polar region looks very weird, David!

Have you seen it as such a colour before?

(Just wondering). 

 

The Great Red Spot looks unusual too. 

 

Thank you for these super sketches. 

 

Clear skies from Aubrey. 



#8 Special Ed

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Posted 13 May 2021 - 09:44 PM

Dave,

Great sketches for such a low altitude.  Bless the ADC (and your experienced eye).  I recall the bluish appearance of the Saturn hemisphere that has been hidden from us (and I guess the Sun).  I'm looking forward to some early morning observations of the gas giants--that's usually the time for the best seeing here.

 

Hope you get your roof fixed without any other hassle and before you scare any more cats.  lol.gif   Birds in the observatory is always a problem for me during the spring nesting season--especially wrens.  I've got wash cloths and hand towels stuffed in the biggest openings to keep them from getting in--a low tech fix but it works.  smile.gif


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#9 David Gray

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Posted 14 May 2021 - 08:56 AM

Thanks Tom, Frank, Ivano, Astronz, Michael/mdowns, Aubrey, Michael/Special Ed  and Folk for the Likes....smile.gif

 

.Can I ask,there is always much subtlety with the details you capture,how significant of an aid,if any, do you find the bino-viewer to be?             

Yes Michael the binovu is a significant factor: not so much it allowing sight of weaker features etc. but simply there the increased comfort with looking for such. And as Special Ed said “Bless the ADC”.   The Apodizer has always worked well for me also. Along with the D-K f/16-f/18 allows the comfort of using larger longer-focus eyepieces. 

 

Then there is the ¼ ton rock steady accurately tracking (manual-no drive) EQ/GEM mount which allows intermittent/minutes-long holding the object in the fov by simply applying and flexing a finger or two.  

 

The custom-built sketch board is logistically very friendly/ultra-convenient. 

 

https://www.cloudyni...8-sketch-board/

 

All that in the mix with decades-seasoned/practiced eyes.  Eyesight I have guarded/nurtured with diet & exercise to the point of hypochondria ever since (1961) reading the chapter on Vision in Sidgwick’s “Amateur Astronomer’s Handbook”............Dave.

DK Sktch Brd.jpg

 


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#10 David Gray

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Posted 14 May 2021 - 09:01 AM

That south polar region looks very weird, David!

Have you seen it as such a colour before?

THANKS Aubrey: that hue of the South Hemisphere is quite usual with either hemisphere as they emerge from those years of shadow.  Telling us that even at Saturn’s distance the Sun has an effect on the atmosphere/cloud tops. In fact when the N Hemisphere of Uranus started tipping sunward after 2008 I was getting the impression that it was less cyan – more blue – than the South.

 

Currently there is little of Saturn’s actual S. Polar Region showing and I have put tentative indications, against latitude of the Zones currently on display.  Also there is a possible sighting of the STB shown on the posted sketch.......... Cheers Dave.

SAT S Hem 2021.jpg


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#11 Special Ed

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Posted 14 May 2021 - 03:59 PM

That south polar region looks very weird, David!

Have you seen it as such a colour before?...

 

 

THANKS Aubrey: that hue of the South Hemisphere is quite usual with either hemisphere as they emerge from those years of shadow.  Telling us that even at Saturn’s distance the Sun has an effect on the atmosphere/cloud tops. In fact when the N Hemisphere of Uranus started tipping sunward after 2008 I was getting the impression that it was less cyan – more blue – than the South....

 

I went back in my records 15 years to another time one of the hemispheres of Saturn was coming out of shadow.  By November of 2006 the ring tilt was a little more shallow than it is currently but it had been slowly changing all year revealing the northern hemisphere to sunlight.  The bluish tint was quite noticeable to me (at the time a not very experienced Saturn observer).

 

Saturn_11.10.06.v1.JPG


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#12 David Gray

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Posted 19 May 2021 - 09:54 AM

Thanks Michael....

 

Good you posted that and it had me looking at some earlier views also........

 

First one quite close in time to yours; and I think that is maybe the most vivid blue-sighting I have had of a re-appearing hemisphere.

 

The view of 2010 maybe indicates with the cool-hue of the tipping-away N. Hemisphere it was already being affected by the lowering solar elevation.  

Note in this apparition, seen from Saturn the Sun is lower elevation than is the Earth....

 

Incidental points of interest......

 

2006:  An apparent white spot on Ring B might be the light interspace twixt spokes.

 

2010: The unusual tonalities of the Rings due to that low solar angle; inc.Ring C & Cassini unusually light. 

EZ(N): note the salmon hue.  Dione egressing on the dusky p. limb.......Cheers, Dave.

SAT 2006 Oct  2010 Jan.jpg


Edited by David Gray, 19 May 2021 - 11:07 AM.

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#13 David Gray

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Posted 20 May 2021 - 09:30 AM

Another nice spring morn – a bit rare of late with the prevailing/enduring showery spells.  Jupiter & Saturn now slowly but noticeably getting ahead of the increasingly lighter pre-dawn sky.

 

As with May 11 Saturn was not very productive and again Jupiter only became fairly good as sunrise approached (03:52 UTC/04:52 a.m. BST).

 

First off with Jupiter (~03:20 UTC) seeing poor enough that Io’s shadow was mostly fleeting and soon off the disk. The sketch being inspired when things became good enough to see Io itself, and the GRS sighted about halfway onto the f. limb........Dave.

JUP 2021 May 20 0340.jpg

 

 

 


Edited by David Gray, 21 May 2021 - 05:19 AM.

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#14 Special Ed

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Posted 22 May 2021 - 06:45 AM

Very fine sketchwork, Dave.  smile.gif   And very interesting for me to come back and study as it shows the same CM as my sketch done on the 21st.  It was my first look at Jupiter and I hadn't previewed or looked at any imagery.

 

I saw some of the same features that you show but I seem to have missed some things--like the faint SEBn which made me think the darker band in the EZ was further north than what you show.  I saw that same scalloping on the NEBn--but the NEB appeared darker from south to north.  The limb was obscured much like you show--that's my excuse for not catching the GRS.  tongue2.gif

 

Fun to compare observations.  cool.gif


Edited by Special Ed, 22 May 2021 - 06:47 AM.

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#15 David Gray

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Posted 24 May 2021 - 08:50 AM

Thanks Michael.....

 

I’m thinking we can call that darker South border to the EZ(N) the EB.

 

Good to know that you honour the practice of avoiding previewing with imagery especially at this early stage of the apparition.  Too easy to risk being influenced in such a way these days.  In fact alluding to that on the SSO Forum a while back when I innocently mentioned that years back we got through most of an apparition without seeing much of any photos etc.  Only to find myself branded as an elitist newbie-basher by three ‘valiant’ protectors of beginners......smirk.gif

 

Getting back to Jupiter: interesting how those NEBs projections seemed to fade – dissipate even – in step with that NTB Revival last apparition.  After fading somewhat last apparition that russet EZ(N) hue seems revived again.  During the view of the 20th I took a few sightings with the co-mounted 3-inch and apart the prominent SEB(S) it was putting in mind my first ever view (1961 July) of Jupiter (& Saturn) when Jupiter confounded my expectations by showing virtually one broad band and no SEB defining the anticipated bright EZ

 

By 1962 seems there was a dark SEB(S), a very dark EZ+NEB. The whole looking like a very broad dark red-brown belt – and especially in blue-light photos.  That reported intense ruddiness looked more of a chocolate hue in the 3-in.  If only I’d had the 10” Newt (1964-78) then....just catching Jupiter late 1964 when things were normalizing in the EQ regions.  Catching it again 1965 Aug there was remarkable transformation with the NEB s. edge being garlanded with numerous festooning loops.....

 

Here, a modified extract from a later-planned post, I have simulated those 1961/62 views (long etched in my memory) along with the most recent one...........Cheers Dave.

JUP SAT 1961 1stx.jpg


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#16 Quinnipiac Monster

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Posted 24 May 2021 - 10:13 AM

Thanks Michael.....

 

 

Good to know that you honour the practice of avoiding previewing with imagery especially at this early stage of the apparition.  Too easy to risk being influenced in such a way these days. 

 

That should be the rule for visual observers... 


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#17 Special Ed

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Posted 25 May 2021 - 08:51 PM

Dave,

 

Thanks for the historical perspective.  That's the observer's commitment, isn't it--to record what is seen, not what is expected. 

 

An experienced Mars observer knows what to expect when a CM is coming up (although there can be surprises)--with Jupiter, nobody knows what to expect (although there are long term trends), e.g., what happened to those deep blue festoons on the NEBs last apparition?

 

I will take a closer look at the Equatorial Zone next opportunity and see where that EB really is.  smile.gif


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