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Binocular advice - 82 mm vs 100 mm

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#1 DPT

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Posted 21 July 2021 - 04:25 PM

Toying with the idea of moving up from my 10.5X70 binoculars.  These have been great for quick looks when the weather, and energy levels, do not necessitate pulling out the big guns for a longer viewing session.  I have serious astigmatism so I do view with my eye glasses on.  The 82 mm, most likely from Oberwerk, seem to be a good compromise as an increase in size and quality, and they would work on my existing Series 5000 head/tripod.  But with that said, is it worth the extra money to move up to the 100 mm? and the increased size and weight that goes along with the increase?

 

I would appreciate any real-world experience, also any actual comparisons between these sizes.  I would use them primarily for general night time scanning, looking for nice wide field exploration of the night skies.  I would plan on getting the ED versions

 

Thanks!

 

David



#2 Fiske

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Posted 21 July 2021 - 04:28 PM

It's not that much more size and weight. Go with the 100XL-SD. I also have an 82XL, which is a great binocular. 

 

Fiske


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#3 sevenofnine

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Posted 21 July 2021 - 08:51 PM

+1 on Fiske's advice. A 100mm ED binocular telescope is the way to go. I have the Oberwerk 20x80 Deluxe and it's a great mounted binocular for daytime viewing. For astronomy, not so much. Good luck with your choice! waytogo.gif



#4 Fiske

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Posted 21 July 2021 - 09:19 PM

David, are you considering Oberwerk Deluxe series binoculars or XL series binocular telescopes? I thought you were considering XLs because you mentioned an 82mm instrument, which would be an XL from Oberwerk.

 

Fiske



#5 Stopforths

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Posted 21 July 2021 - 09:51 PM

Are you able to let us know why its not so good for astronomy the 20 x 80mm delux?? 

+1 on Fiske's advice. A 100mm ED binocular telescope is the way to go. I have the Oberwerk 20x80 Deluxe and it's a great mounted binocular for daytime viewing. For astronomy, not so much. Good luck with your choice! waytogo.gif



#6 MT4

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Posted 21 July 2021 - 09:54 PM

Both 82mm and 100mm would definitely require a good tripod + mount solution.  If you've been debating between the two, and if the additional cost of moving up to 100mm is not an issue, I'd say go with the 100mm to avoid having "what-if" thoughts later on.

 

Disclaimer:  I don't have any Oberwerk binoculars, as yet.   My 82mm Kowa Highlander Prominar have given me outstanding views of the heavens above, but to be honest there have been times when I wonder if I should have gone for something a bit larger in aperture.  I am not buying anymore binoculars for the time being so that I can focus on finding out what I can and cannot do with my existing binoculars.


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#7 TheUser

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 01:48 AM

what about to buy both?

P.S.: the FOV of them is not smth perfect suitable for

 

general night time scanning, looking for nice wide field exploration of the night skies

 



#8 edwincjones

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 04:35 AM

what about to buy both?

P.S.: the FOV of them is not smth perfect suitable for

70, 82,100mms- seems like a little duplication  question.gif

 

I would use the 70mm for quick scans, the 100 for more detail

I think the 82 would get left out a lot

 

edj


Edited by edwincjones, 22 July 2021 - 04:36 AM.

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#9 Fiske

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 06:41 AM

Well, a 10.5x70, which typically would have a 5 degree FOV, a 20x80 (3ish degrees), and a 25x100 (2.4ish degrees), could all potentially be reasonable additions to a binocular collection. In my case, I added the 20x80 Deluxe with center focus to have an instrument that can easily be used at star parties and for daytime observing (water fowl at lakes, etc.). For dedicated astronomy use, I prefer independent focus (IF) binoculars. The Deluxe binoculars are available in either CF or IF versions. The 25x100 Deluxe is quite a bit larger than the 20x80. At 10 pounds, still not that difficult to mount, but MT4 is exactly right, you want a substantial mount for any larger size binocular. 

 

The 20x80 binocular is a classic for astronomy, but of the two the 25x100 goes quite a bit deeper for not much more money. At the same time it has a narrower FOV. A lot of individual preference comes into this, frankly. wink.gif

 

Fiske


Edited by Fiske, 22 July 2021 - 06:43 AM.

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#10 TheUser

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 07:15 AM

2 Fiske

 

do the whole Pleiades fit to FOV of yours both 20x80 and 25x100?



#11 DPT

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 08:38 AM

I am considering the XL line from Oberwerk, definitely for astronomical use, hence the angled eyepieces. I already have their Series 5000 head and tripod, so that may save or at least postpone some spending to upgrade mounts at a later date should the 5000 prove to be borderline.

#12 Fiske

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 08:49 AM

Then I stand by my original advice -- 100XL- SD.



#13 Fiske

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 08:57 AM

2 Fiske

 

do the whole Pleiades fit to FOV of yours both 20x80 and 25x100?

I haven't had either binocular long enough to observe the Pleiades with them. However, with 3.25 and 2.4 degree FOVs respectively, both will show the entire Pleiades. 

 

Fiske


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#14 tmichaelbanks

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 12:13 PM

I am not a binocular telescope guy, so I am not speaking from personal experience.

 

However, I have read many posts in quite a few threads on CN talking about the benefits of ED vs. non-ED for dedicated astronomy viewing.

 

The difference in price between an XL 100 SD and a non-ED 100 BT is more than $1K.  If ED/SD is not needed for nighttime viewing, is the extra $1K worth it.

 

All that being said, I recently picked up a used pair of APM 20x80EDs (my doctor says it's a confirmed case of "Fiske Syndrome") and I was astonished at the lack of color fringing on daytime views of high-contrast objects.

 

With the lousy weather here in southern New England I haven't been able to try them out at night yet, so I can't comment on the benefit of ED glass at night.



#15 Fiske

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 12:56 PM

The difference in price between the Oberwerk 100XL-ED and -SD is about $450. It was certainly worth the extra to me, particularly considering lunar views. The better color correction will make a difference for planets also, I expect. A BT is not the primary choice necessarily for planetary observation, but I am guessing the 100XL will still provide enjoyable views of Saturn and Jupiter.

 

Regarding your doctor's diagnosis, in my experience an effective treatment option is to buy more binoculars. grin.gif

 

Fiske


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#16 tmichaelbanks

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 01:34 PM

It may be time for a 12-step program...       lol.gif


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#17 Fiske

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 05:27 PM

It may be time for a 12-step program...       lol.gif

My name is Fiske, and I'm a binoholic...

 

watching.gif


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#18 MT4

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 05:40 PM

 

Regarding your doctor's diagnosis, in my experience an effective treatment option is to buy more binoculars. grin.gif

 

Fiske

 

This makes a lot of sense.  One could only stop wondering about new binoculars after having a diverse collection of them to see for oneself smile.gif.

 

For instance, lower mags for broad overviews vs. higher mags for detailed studies of DSOs,  Porro prism vs. roof.  Straight-through vs. angled viewing.  Fixed mags vs. changeable eyepieces.  Traditional vs. image stabilized.  Made-in-Japan vs. Made-in-Germany vs. Made-in-China.

 

The last two comparisons are still missing from my lineup and so I'm not yet done with my Fiske syndrome.  I could only work on trying to slow it down smile.gif

 

My name is MT4, and I'm a binoholic...


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#19 Fiske

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 06:12 PM

This makes a lot of sense.  One could only stop wondering about new binoculars after having a diverse collection of them to see for oneself smile.gif.

 

For instance, lower mags for broad overviews vs. higher mags for detailed studies of DSOs,  Porro prism vs. roof.  Straight-through vs. angled viewing.  Fixed mags vs. changeable eyepieces.  Traditional vs. image stabilized.  Made-in-Japan vs. Made-in-Germany vs. Made-in-China.

 

The last two comparisons are still missing from my lineup and so I'm not yet done with my Fiske syndrome.  I could only work on trying to slow it down smile.gif

 

My name is MT4, and I'm a binoholic...

See, that's just the thing. I don't have an alpha roof 10x50 in my collection. Or an IS binocular...

 

whee.gif


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#20 MT4

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Posted 22 July 2021 - 06:18 PM

See, that's just the thing. I don't have an alpha roof 10x50 in my collection. Or an IS binocular...

 

whee.gif

 

There you go.  You're not done with your own Fiske syndrome smile.gif


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#21 edwincjones

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Posted 23 July 2021 - 04:09 AM

It may be time for a 12-step program...       lol.gif

 

12 steps      question.gif 

 

you mean everyone should have 12 pair of binoculars,

darn I am one step/pair short to join

 

edj


Edited by edwincjones, 23 July 2021 - 04:10 AM.

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#22 jprideaux

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Posted 23 July 2021 - 06:37 AM

12 steps question.gif

you mean everyone should have 12 pair of binoculars,
darn I am one step/pair short to join

edj

I’m getting up there in count myself. I just ordered the other day the new Orion 2x54 because - well I just needed to order something new! Must be the Fiske syndrome!

I’m also into using binoviewers (I have two) with telescopes (love two eye viewing) so the Fiske syndrome may play a role there as well.

As for whether it is worth getting the more expensive BT with 45 degree angled viewing instead of less expensive straight-through binoculars, I have similar setups for both and find myself using the 45 degree angle configuration much more (when mounted) than my straight-through set-ups even for terrestrial viewing. If something is really high in the sky, I go to a 90 degree set-up. For hand-held, I like straight-through with image stabilization.

Edited by jprideaux, 23 July 2021 - 06:39 AM.

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#23 Fiske

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Posted 23 July 2021 - 07:36 AM

My original thinking on the 82XL is that's the largest binocular that can reasonably be used on the Oberwerk PM1 pgram mount. But I don't use it on that mount anyway -- always on the XR3 with the NT608 head. Also, I imagined that the 100XL would be substantially larger -- but it isn't. A few pounds more and maybe 10 inches longer? Anyway, not enough to make a difference in handling on the XR3 mount. I'm using it with the OB 240 fork. Will eventually be on the 117B Manfrotto tripod when that is delivered. (Still backordered.)

 

Will the 82XL stay in my collection long term? I'm not sure. I can see using both the the 82XL at lower magnification / wider field and the 100XL at higher magnification. Will try using the red dot finder on either instrument to point them at a given location. Not sure how significant parallax will be doing that. I might set the 82XL up with filters to easily switch back and forth between filtered/nonfiltered views. Maybe other combinations will emerge over time. If I feel the 82XL is under utilized, I may sell it but will give it a couple of years to make that decision.

 

I'm content with 45 degree eyepieces for observing near the zenith. The OB 25x100 Deluxe is a nice alternative to the BTs. It works well on the PM1 and can point surprisingly high and still be comfortable to observe with for me. It's a lot less to mess with and makes a nice companion for telescopic observing. Somehow it seems more relaxed and casual. Less labor intensive and nicely adapted for roaming.

 

Fiske


Edited by Fiske, 23 July 2021 - 07:36 AM.


#24 DPT

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Posted 23 July 2021 - 08:08 AM

Interesting to hear your experience on the Oberwerk 25x100 Deluxe, may be a viable alternative for immediate gratification, plus allow saving funds for a future acquisition. I do enjoy the simplicity of setting up my 10.5x70 binoculars and they are very stable on my Series 5000 head/tripod. Straight viewing not bad, if something of interest is at the zenith I just wait for it to shift position. And again, I enjoy scanning the night sky to see what I can “discover”.

If/when I move up to a binocular telescope, I will definitely want angled eyepieces. Not certain yet if 45 degree or shoot for the 90 degree. Again, trying to educate myself now and learn from others experiences. Thanks again!

David

#25 Fiske

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Posted 23 July 2021 - 08:44 AM

I don't know what the 5000 series is rated for. The 25x100 weighs about 10 pounds. Kevin Busarow at Oberwerk can advise on that, surely. I really love the 25x100 Deluxe. A great value. Here is a topic on the 25x100, which includes details of how the filter eyepiece covers can easily be replaced with non-filter covers more friendly to eyeglass wearers. I chose the IF version instrument, which I find better suited for astronomy than the center focus option. I also own an Oberwerk 20x80 Deluxe III CF binocular, which enabled me to evaluate both options. Another terrific value, BTW. wink.gif

 

Fiske




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