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APM Super Zoom eyepiece

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#1101 thecelloronin

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Posted 09 January 2023 - 12:24 PM

In 2" mode, its focusing position is reasonable for those of us concerned with in-travel. However, the long nose makes barlow usage more difficult. I can only come to focus with my Burgess 1.9x OCA screwed directly onto the nose, and putting a parfocal ring on the zoom to avoid hitting the mirror. There is no configuration in which I can bring my GSO 2" or BARADV into focus, but my refractor is a unique case that uses both a 2" filter wheel and TSFlat2.



#1102 JeffreyC

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Posted 18 March 2023 - 02:11 PM

Most of my EP's are around 70° and using the APM SZ makes me feel right at home.

If it apeared smaller without testing it up and forth it would have bothered me.

 

I did upgrade it a little, to improve the eyecap it a bit, which don't come off everytime.

I did use the M43 extention ring which came extra with my Baader Morpious EP, which can be ordered at Baader:

https://www.baader-p...-extension.html

Also when I unscrewed the rubber eyecap off my Baader Morpious and screwed that on the extention ring on the APM SZ it became more comphy.

You can order it also at Baader, but it must be the rubber eyecap with metal screw threat inside.

https://www.baader-p...-threaded).html

Matthew, did you find that using the M43 extension ring cuts into the eye relief when the Morpheus eyecup is rolled down?  Ideally, I'd like to have just enough rubber extended over the SZ eyepiece to prevent eyeglasses from being scratched.  The original APM eyecup reduces maximum potential eye relief a little when rolled down.



#1103 Starman1

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Posted 18 March 2023 - 04:52 PM

Matthew, did you find that using the M43 extension ring cuts into the eye relief when the Morpheus eyecup is rolled down?  Ideally, I'd like to have just enough rubber extended over the SZ eyepiece to prevent eyeglasses from being scratched.  The original APM eyecup reduces maximum potential eye relief a little when rolled down.

This was answered on the other thread--the eyecup then sticks up 5mm above the aluminum.

Best to use one drop of green or blue loctite on the eycup without the extender and just wind it down to where you need it.


Edited by Starman1, 18 March 2023 - 04:52 PM.

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#1104 Rustler46

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Posted 19 March 2023 - 12:57 PM

I had an opportunity to use the APM SZ eyepiece the other night in my GSO 10-inch Dob with GSO coma corrector - f/5.5. The focuser has been upgraded from GSO R&P to a JMI EV1 Crayford. In 1-1/4 inch mode it would not come to focus. But removing the 2- to 1.25-inch adapter allowed inserting the zoom (2-inch mode) further in. For it to come to focus, I had to slightly withdraw the coma corrector from the focuser. The focuser has a very short focus travel - something around an 1 inch. So this necessitated making the adjustments described to get enough out focus.

 

Overall I'm quite pleased with the SuperZoom eyepiece. It gives 90-180X, which covers most of my needs. For more FOV a TV Panoptic 24mm works. For higher power a 5 mm 58 degree Olivon eyepiece is used. A Barlow or PowerMate gives even higher magnification.

 

Russ


Edited by Rustler46, 19 March 2023 - 01:33 PM.

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#1105 Levant

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Posted 21 March 2023 - 04:22 PM

I would not waste my money buying an APM zoom because Baader Hyperion zooms are excellent. I am using a pair of those Hyperion zooms  for both solar and night observations with or without binoviewers,

 

They also come with optional Barlow lens that increases the magnification more than twice...

 

As a cheaper alternative, for the star parties with kids, my Celestron zoom is very cost effective and I do not worry if someone would accidentally break it. People are satisfied with Celestron zoom very much in general.

 

Nevertheless, Hyperion zooms are the best.



#1106 sixela

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Posted 22 March 2023 - 02:04 PM

It wouldn’t necessarily be a waste of money (if Hyperion zooms are “the best”, I wonder what the APM zoom is, since it clearly bests the HZ on almost all aspects except price and perhaps convenience).

But nobody forced you to buy an APM zoom…so why the announcement?
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#1107 Rustler46

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Posted 22 March 2023 - 03:17 PM

It wouldn’t necessarily be a waste of money (if Hyperion zooms are “the best”, I wonder what the APM zoom is, since it clearly bests the HZ on almost all aspects except price and perhaps convenience).

But nobody forced you to buy an APM zoom…so why the announcement?

This has been discussed many times on this thread. I suspect we all will have our preference (Baader vs APM), particularly if we have already spent money on what we have. There are benefits to both fine zooms. As to which one is "best" we can all assess that for ourselves. As for me, the "best" zoom is the only one I have - the APM Super Zoom. In no way do I feel like my money has been wasted. Others are free to believe otherwise.

 

For a while I considered the wider, 3X zoom range of the BZ to be an advantage. But the APM SZ has nearly the same true FOV and more magnification (56% greater) at the longest focal length. This is due to its constant 66 degree AFOV across the zoom range. The very good  Baader zoom only has a claimed 48 degree AFOV at the wide end. Some measures put this at closer to 42 degrees - see post #1088 above.

 

But you are quite right, sixela. The APM SZ beats the Baader offering in many respects. Not that the latter isn't very good. Like many things, improvements can be made.

 

All the Best,

Russ


Edited by Rustler46, 23 March 2023 - 01:08 PM.

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#1108 ButterFly

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Posted 23 March 2023 - 11:55 AM

It wouldn’t necessarily be a waste of money (if Hyperion zooms are “the best”, I wonder what the APM zoom is, since it clearly bests the HZ on almost all aspects except price and perhaps convenience).

But nobody forced you to buy an APM zoom…so why the announcement?

While the APM is a very nice eyepiece, and better than the Baader in many respects, one should exercise caution for use with binoviewers.  I can say that the Baader no longer lives in my eyepiece case now that I have an APM zoom.


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#1109 adamgali89

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Posted 24 March 2023 - 01:59 AM

I use my APM SZ the most in my grab&go 5" on ALT AZ GoTo mount. In my larger telescopes (10" and 20") I prefer my APM 100° set.



#1110 Neanderthal

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Posted 24 March 2023 - 06:42 PM

Just a wild guess, but maybe the APM zoom is filling a space in one fell swoop in their UFF line-up?

30mm UFF
24mm UFF
18mm UFF
7-15 UFF?

It's my understanding that the APM 10 & 15 are not like the the above UFF series, I might be wrong. It would sort of make sense if the above scenario was the case.

#1111 Rustler46

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Posted 24 March 2023 - 08:57 PM

But, 

--it is wider than most zooms in apparent field.

   At low power it is significantly wider than pretty much all other zooms.

--it is a constant apparent field from one end of the range to the other, unlike other zooms

   The #1 complaint about zooms is the narrow field of view at low power.  This one is as wide as separate widefield eyepieces.

--it is optically superior in contrast to most other zooms.  That is particularly visible on bright objects like the Moon.

--it is sharp at the highest power, unlike a lot of zooms.

--many high end zooms on top of the line spotting scopes are 2:1  zooms (e.g. Swarovski, Leica), so 2:1 is not unusual.

--the selection of focal lengths covers a lot of the focal lengths people use in telescopes.  It would replace 5 eyepieces in my set and those 5, collectively, cost 7x the price of the APM Zoom,

   so this zoom would represent serious economizing

 

That you brand it inferior tells me you haven't used it.

Yes, there are a lot of zooms in the market (73 of them, in fact, though a number of them are relabeled versions of the same eyepiece).

But if you are not willing to accept fields of view smaller than a Plössl, there are only 6, and a couple of them are the same eyepiece with a different label.

I think it is the equal of many fixed focal length eyepieces.

Thanks Don, for setting the record straight. Nothing like hearing the word from "Mr. Eyepiece", if I may so label you.

 

I'll add an observation of my own. Mating my APM SZ with my 2-1/2X TV PowerMate turns it into a 3-6 mm zoom. I would guess the Televue 3-6 mm zoom would have somewhat better image quality. But as you noted, the APM has larger apparent field of view.

 

All the Best,

Russ


Edited by Rustler46, 25 March 2023 - 12:11 AM.


#1112 YeloSub

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Posted 25 March 2023 - 02:32 PM

Major zoom benefit is finding just the right magnification/FOV on the fly. At least for me. Especially when using the APM barlowed for higher power.

Also, 15.4mm at 65° FOV is almost the same TFOV as the 24mm setting on other zoom... and even slightly more than others.

I bought the APM and preferred it to the BHZ. Paired with x1 low power eyepiece and a barlow makes a really nice set.

X2 eyepieces and a barlow vs 6+ (I do have other sets too). It has its place, but may not be for everyone. If you don't want one, then don't buy one. I wanted one, so I bought one.

Love the options we have these days.

Clear skies!

Jake

#1113 noisejammer

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Posted 26 March 2023 - 03:07 AM

Gu's, it's the same old story.

 

One wally with a grudge against APM posts some incomprehensible drivel and several members try to debate him/her . So one trolling post turns into several well reasoned posts that need to removed in the clean up. It wastes your time and ours.

 

Please don't feed the trolls. Rather send us a MA and we can get started on it.

 

b


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#1114 Rustler46

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Posted 26 March 2023 - 01:19 PM

Thanks for all the work you Mods do for us. Cloudy nights is what it is thanks to that plus the efforts we all make to be civil and helpful to others.

 

All the Best,

Russ


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#1115 fishhuntmike

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Posted 26 March 2023 - 03:42 PM

This looooong thread cost me $400+ this morning (preorder).
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#1116 MSH411

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Posted 26 March 2023 - 04:21 PM

This looooong thread cost me $400+ this morning (preorder).

It will be worth the wait Mike.

 

Don helped me match my first three EP's with my scope and the APM was one of the three I picked up. While I am still learning this EP has been one of my go to's once I find my target. The image is bright and clear right to the edge. It was money well spent!


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#1117 Second Time Around

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Posted 01 January 2024 - 05:53 AM

I did a series of tests on a variety of Barlows (including with the lens cell only where this is detachable) on my APM zoom.  As you can see below, because of the position of the focal plane of the APM, Barlows give a greater magnification than normal.

 

1.25 inch mode

 

FLO Astro-Essentials 2x Barlow (probably the GSO) - cell only - 1.97x

FLO Astro Essentials 2x Barlow (probably the GSO) - complete - 2.63x

 

Baader 2.25x zoom Barlow - cell only - 2.48x

Baader 2.25x zoom Barlow - complete - 2.75x

 

APM 2.75x Barlow - cell only - 1.89x

APM 2.75x Barlow - complete - 3.28x

 

2 inch mode

 

FLO Astro Essentials 2x Barlow (probably the GSO) - cell only - 1.87x

FLO Astro Essentials 2x Barlow (probably the GSO) - see below*

 

Baader 2.25x zoom Barlow - cell only - 2.33x

Baader 2.25x zoom Barlow - complete - 2.54x

 

APM 2.75x Barlow - cell only - 1.83x

APM 2.75x Barlow - complete - 3.07x

 

* not tested as the APM zoom set screw is too big and needs replacing with a smaller one

 

I usually use my APM zoom with just the lens cell of my nominal 2x Astro Essentials Barlow (GSO) from First Light Optics, or just the lens cell of my nominal 2.75x APM Barlow.  In each case this gives just under 2x amplification, so gives me all the focal lengths from 15.4mm down to about 4mm.  If I want even more magnification I use the complete Barlow lens.  For still more magnification I add 1 or more inexpensive Baader extension tubes when in 1.25x mode.  Each of these adds about 0.25x amplification.  Go to https://www.firstlig...-18mm-long.html

 

I've just bought but not yet used an Omegon/TS glass path corrector.  This has a nominal amplification of 1.6x in a binoviewer, but 1.30x with the APM zoom in 1.25 inch mode.  It doesn't fit in 2 inch mode.


Edited by Second Time Around, 01 January 2024 - 11:42 AM.

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#1118 Levant

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Posted 20 January 2024 - 03:04 PM

Barlow is like red wine. It behaves different depending on additional factors. 



#1119 thecelloronin

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Posted 19 April 2024 - 12:23 AM

I did a series of tests on a variety of Barlows (including with the lens cell only where this is detachable) on my APM zoom.  As you can see below, because of the position of the focal plane of the APM, Barlows give a greater magnification than normal.

 

1.25 inch mode

 

FLO Astro-Essentials 2x Barlow (probably the GSO) - cell only - 1.97x

FLO Astro Essentials 2x Barlow (probably the GSO) - complete - 2.63x

 

Baader 2.25x zoom Barlow - cell only - 2.48x

Baader 2.25x zoom Barlow - complete - 2.75x

 

APM 2.75x Barlow - cell only - 1.89x

APM 2.75x Barlow - complete - 3.28x

 

2 inch mode

 

FLO Astro Essentials 2x Barlow (probably the GSO) - cell only - 1.87x

FLO Astro Essentials 2x Barlow (probably the GSO) - see below*

 

Baader 2.25x zoom Barlow - cell only - 2.33x

Baader 2.25x zoom Barlow - complete - 2.54x

 

APM 2.75x Barlow - cell only - 1.83x

APM 2.75x Barlow - complete - 3.07x

 

* not tested as the APM zoom set screw is too big and needs replacing with a smaller one

 

I usually use my APM zoom with just the lens cell of my nominal 2x Astro Essentials Barlow (GSO) from First Light Optics, or just the lens cell of my nominal 2.75x APM Barlow.  In each case this gives just under 2x amplification, so gives me all the focal lengths from 15.4mm down to about 4mm.  If I want even more magnification I use the complete Barlow lens.  For still more magnification I add 1 or more inexpensive Baader extension tubes when in 1.25x mode.  Each of these adds about 0.25x amplification.  Go to https://www.firstlig...-18mm-long.html

 

I've just bought but not yet used an Omegon/TS glass path corrector.  This has a nominal amplification of 1.6x in a binoviewer, but 1.30x with the APM zoom in 1.25 inch mode.  It doesn't fit in 2 inch mode.

I’m a bit confused on how you used the BHZ zoom.

  • How are you using the BHZ zoom in 2” mode? 
  • What does “cell only” entail with the BHZ zoom? Isn’t there only a single configuration that allows you to screw it into the filter threads of the 1.25” nose?

If you get the wildest of wild hairs, one day I’d love to see you repeat this experiment but measuring inward/outward travel changes.



#1120 Second Time Around

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Posted 19 April 2024 - 05:19 AM

My brother is dying of lung cancer at the moment and so I can't get hold of my notes at present but will respond later.

 

Unfortunately, I may not be able to do any further experiments for a while as my hands aren't working properly.



#1121 thecelloronin

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Posted 19 April 2024 - 09:42 AM

My brother is dying of lung cancer at the moment and so I can't get hold of my notes at present but will respond later.

 

Unfortunately, I may not be able to do any further experiments for a while as my hands aren't working properly.

Aw jeez. I'm sorry to hear... well all of it. Wishing you resilience.


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#1122 f18dad

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Posted 19 April 2024 - 12:06 PM

Very sorry to hear this Second. Thoughts and prayers for your brother and for you and the family.
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#1123 25585

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Posted 19 April 2024 - 12:15 PM

Steve, sorry to hear about your brother, my thoughts are with you both.


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#1124 davidgmd

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Posted 19 April 2024 - 03:43 PM

Steve, very sorry to hear this. Wishing you peace and strength.


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