2041 replies to this topic

[nexStar2008]

Thanks Mark, It's a cloudless night tonight and nice not to have to worry about my cables getting tangled while I am inside the house connected remotely doing some EAA. Here's some pics of the scope that you brought to life again and the 3d printed case I designed for the HBG3 (Everything is friction fit, so no screws):
 

 

Cheers

[mlord]

Nice case!  I'll probably release a v8.47 this week with those changes and others.

 

Cheers

Edited by mlord, 27 May 2024 - 07:42 PM.

[mlord]

So, now that the HBG3 has a full fix for CPWI's buggy use of the CORDWRAP stuff...

 

Is anyone out there (still) using the cordwrap.override functionality of the HBG3?

 

I hope to be able to nuke it from the code in the near future.

[nexStar2008]

So, now that the HBG3 has a full fix for CPWI's buggy use of the CORDWRAP stuff...

 

Is anyone out there (still) using the cordwrap.override functionality of the HBG3?

 

I hope to be able to nuke it from the code in the near future.

Don't nuke it just yet, I have no way to set cordwrap on/off from within CPWI. I could never get it to work properly using my NXGPS scope so I would like to test what the handset sends to the MC and all my testing was done with cordwrap.override = 1.
 

Edited by nexStar2008, 28 May 2024 - 08:48 AM.

[mlord]

Ah well, get rid of the cordwrap.override setting -- it defeats everything else.  So do this:

 

   set cordwrap.override

   save

   reset

 

Cordwrap is a mount setting, so you should be able to turn it ON once with the hand-controller after that, and CPWI should pick it up and run with it.  See if that's true or not.

 

Cheers

[nexStar2008]

Ah well, get rid of the cordwrap.override setting -- it defeats everything else.  So do this:

 

   set cordwrap.override

   save

   reset

 

Cordwrap is a mount setting, so you should be able to turn it ON once with the hand-controller after that, and CPWI should pick it up and run with it.  See if that's true or not.

 

Cheers

Yes, I have confirmed that it still works by setting the cordwrap on the hand controller now with cordwrap.override disabled.

However, I believe we (or perhaps just me) are losing some convenience by removing the ability to automatically always set cordwrap via HBG3 for a number of reasons.

1. This setting is not remembered by the scope and needs to be set every time it is turned on. It's just something I will forget to setup one night only to discover my cables torn or camera broken. The potential for a costly mistake is large, and this feature greatly reduces that potential for me. 
    
2. My hand controller screen is on the way out on this scope, so who knows how long until the display is completely blank and I can't see it to set it at all.
    
3. The feature is not available to be enabled/disabled in CPWI for NexstarGPS users.

I will stick with 8.46g if I have to of course as it seems to have everything I need for my EAA setup, and it all worked flawlessly for 7 hours last night (Level scope, face north, go inside, connect remotely) everything just works as it should, aligning via CPWI, sharpcap and plate solving, gps works, cordwrap prevention works, remote focus/auto focus works) I didn't even have to look at the hand controller. I can just basically turn on the scope and go back inside to do my imaging, no need for a security camera to watch the scope for cordwrap.

Cheers

[mlord]

This setting is not remembered by the scope and needs to be set every time it is turned on.

Is that actually true?

[Rac19]

I have watched the saga of CPWI Cord Wrap for many years and can only conclude that it has been considered to be a trivial issue, not worthy of the attention of the "A team". I have become disinterested these days because I now use a wedge. CPWI seems to always take the sky route (not the subterranean route) when slewing to a target, which coincidentally avoids cord wrap.

[nexStar2008]

Is that actually true?

Yes, this is actually true.

 

Right from the manual:

 

I did indeed test for this when I tested disabling cordwrap.override with CPWI. I traced the HC -> MC commands earlier today, during that testing I did test to see if the MC_ENABLE_CORDWRAP setting was saved over a power cycle. MC_ENABLE_CORDWRAP is not saved.

Ultimately, I don't think there needs to be a cordwrap.override in the way it is currently implemented. I would imagine just sending a MC_ENABLE_CORDWRAP to the mount from the HBG3 sometime during or shortly after the boot would be sufficient and have a value in NVRAM of the Esp32 that we can set on or off for cordwrap on power on. Anyone who doesn't need it can leave it off.

Edited by nexStar2008, 28 May 2024 - 10:33 PM.

[Rac19]

Yes, this is actually true.

 

Right from the manual:

cordwrap.JPG

This seems to confirm my experience. When using a wedge, in the Southern Hemisphere, GoTo slew never transit through due South. I assume that the opposite is true in the Northern Hemisphere. You would think that they could keep that simple in Alt/Az mode. Most of us probably don't care where the no-cross line is, although there may be some that have a reason to specify it.

[mlord]

Firmware version v8.47 is now available for this project, as well as for the All-In-One (AIO) project:   hbg3.ino.v8.47.txt   320.72KB   21 downloads

• Work around CPWI CORDWRAP bug: CPWI uses DEV_ALT instead of DEV_AZM for some (but not all) CORDWRAP commands.  Meaning.. it doesn't actually get turned on for many mounts, because the commands get sent to the wrong motor controller by CPWI.
• Revert to 4-sec p2000_timeout for most stuff; use a longer timeout during SSAA capture activity.

The HBG3_Arduino.zip and HBG3_Arduino_Linux64.tgz build environments have been updated to include this version, and are available as always from the project site at https://rtr.ca/hbg3/

 

Flashable binaries are also available in all of the usual places, including via the recommended Over-The-Air (OTA) Firmware Update feature of the HBG3 or AIO device.

 

Anyone using CPWI with the CORDWRAP feature should immediately upgrade, to get a WORKING implementation of that, courtesy of the CPWI-bug workarounds now provided by the HBG3.

Edited by mlord, 29 May 2024 - 12:12 PM.

[mlord]

Ultimately, I don't think there needs to be a cordwrap.override in the way it is currently implemented. I would imagine just sending a MC_ENABLE_CORDWRAP to the mount from the HBG3 sometime during or shortly after the boot would be sufficient and have a value in NVRAM of the Esp32 that we can set on or off for cordwrap on power on. Anyone who doesn't need it can leave it off.

Mmm.. Yes.  I'm leaving the full override functionality in place for now.  But this (above) has given me a simpler idea:  Perhaps have the HBG3 watch for "something" (HC, CPWI, other apps) either enabling or disabling CordWrap, and then remembering that action and automatically re-applying it at each power-on/reset.

 

We'd have to look at a few more traces first, to ensure that those "somethings" are not ALWAYs issuing a "turn OFF" command at start-up though.

 

Cheers
 

[mlord]

The recent CORDWRAP changes in the HBG3 firmware have run into a snag:  they work fine with my Evolution mount, but mess up with the CPC mount.  Dunno about others.

 

The problem seems to be that the CPC (and others?) includes an extra, unnecessary byte in their responses to some CORDWRAP commands.  My Evolution does NOT include the extra byte.  That extra byte causes the HBG3 firmware to not "do the Right Thing™".

 

So.. I could use some help here, people.  If you have an HBG3, please install the latest firmware, and then try connecting from CPWI to the mount, and let me know which mount and if it still works for you.  If not, then I may ask for a bit more information.  No need to be outside or perform an alignment or anything else.  Simply try to connect, that's all.

 

That's how this "Open Source" stuff works -- I help you, you help me.  Repeat as necessary! 

 

Thanks!

Edited by mlord, 31 May 2024 - 09:03 PM.

[mlord]

Firmware version v8.48 is now available for this project, as well as for the All-In-One (AIO) project:   hbg3.ino.v8.48.txt   320.87KB   24 downloads

 

This version fixes CPC mount compatibility, which was broken in the past couple of versions due to an extra/unexpected response byte from the mount firmware to some of the CORDWRAP commands.

 

Sources, binaries etc.. all available now in the usual places.

[josh@]

Hi all,

 

I'm a new HBG3 owner and very much impressed, but I still have some serious teething pains to get over in the form of severe connectivity issues. I upgraded the HBG3 firmware to the most recent version (8.48) but this did not help. I have an AVX mount with a Star Sense Auto Align (SSAA). I run SkySafari Pro 6 on a Pixel 6a. I'm running with a nunchuck controller attached to the HBG3 and nothing plugged into the mount's handbox port. I'm trying to use Bluetooth because I used it successfully in past (with SkyBT), and because Mark says it's the most stable and reliable connection. I'm following Mark's instructions.

 

I have two issues that I have to resolve. The first is that I can't maintain the Bluetooth connection for more than a minute or two, and I can't reestablish it merely by hitting the connect button on SkySafari, but I can get it back by bouncing back and forth between the SkySafari app and the "BT/USB/TCP Bridge Pro" app (now known as Communication Bridge Pro ). I have to switch to CCBP each time SkySafari drops the session, and then when CCBC reestablishes the session, I return to SkySafari, which reestablishes the connection.

 

Mark's instructions for setting up Bluetooth say I should 'Tap on Battery, and then Battery Optimisation, and ensure that the app is tagged as "Not optimised".' The language in the settings dialogue box has changed a bit, but I think I'm doing what Mark recommends:

 

The second issue is that I have a hard time establishing connnectivity in the first place. It always takes multiple attempts to establish a conneciton, and it's nearly impossible with the SSAA connected. My current workaround is to establish the connection with the SSAA disconnected, then drop the connection by clicking Sky Safari's disconnect butten, then plug in the SSAA into the mount's AUX2 port, and then tap "Connect and Align." It doesn't always work right away, but if I try it repeatedly, it works eventually.

 

These two issue combined make the overall experience less-than-fun, but I did successfully use the system for several hours and observed a whole bunch of DSOs. If I could fix the connectivity problems the HBG3 would be a delight to use. Anybody got any ideas?

 

Thanks,

 

Josh

[CraigB1960]

Have you tried using WiFi Direct connect? I use WiFi Access point at home since I have a very strong signal, but Direct connect has worked well too. I never drop my mount and that is with the SSAG and Focuser connected.


This is using SkyPortal, SkySafari Pro 7 (does not support SSAG), and CPWI. It is solid for me. (CPC mount).

[josh@]

Have you tried using WiFi Direct connect? I use WiFi Access point at home since I have a very strong signal, but Direct connect has worked well too. I never drop my mount and that is with the SSAG and Focuser connected.


This is using SkyPortal, SkySafari Pro 7 (does not support SSAG), and CPWI. It is solid for me. (CPC mount).

Thanks Craig. I did try WiFi Direct about a week ago using firmware version 8.46b, and I had the same difficulty establishing a connection. I think it may work much better maintaining a connection, but I haven't tried (I was out of town this week). The problem with Bluetooth feels like a software issue (given that I can work around it by jumping back and forth between SkySafari and Communication Bridge Pro), and I'm hoping I can solve it. I'm willing to use a WiFi connection if need be, but I'm not ready to give up on Bluetooth yet.

[mlord]

I'm a new HBG3 owner and very much impressed, but I still have some serious teething pains to get over in the form of severe connectivity issues.

...

drop the connection by clicking Sky Safari's disconnect butten, then plug in the SSAA into the mount's AUX2 port

...

First off, hot-plugging stuff as described above is a great way to kill your SSAA accessory and anything else connected, including the mount itself.  DO NOT EVER DO THAT!!!

 

Now, because of the extra app, bluetooth may be trickier to figure out than straight WiFi Direct Connect.  So start with Direct Connect WiFi, and don't bother with Bluetooth until you learn to use the WiFi.

 

The issue with establishing a connection is almost always the "wrong WiFi mode" selected in SkyPortal.  Yes, the SkyPortal app, NOT SkySafari.  Again, you are a beginner, so start with the app that is easiest to get working, which is SkyPortal not any other version of SkySafari!!  I'm not a beginner, but I still also use/prefer SkyPortal.

 

So in the app, one has to specify either "Direct Connect" or "Access Point" mode.  For the easy way to get going, use Direct Connect WiFi.  Later, once that has been mastered, only THEN think about using BlueTooth.  One of the differences with Bluetooth, is one must ALWAYS specify "Access Point" mode in the app.  So do that in SkyPortal.  Only once you have mastered THAT (2nd level of mastery!), think about a version of SkySafari if you must.

Edited by mlord, 02 June 2024 - 07:18 PM.

[Rac19]

A general comment on wireless connectivity (WiFi and Bluetooth). Some people use them without problems. Others (like me) seem to have endless trouble, whether it be direct connect or via a local network. I simply don't bother anymore because there is just too much drama.

 

In my case the signal strength is strong, so I have to assume that there is something unfavourable in the local wireless environment. I have noticed, on my network diagnostics, that the 2.4 GHz band has a higher error rate than 5 GHz, although it is by no means extreme. I can see signals from 5 or 6 nearby WiFi networks in by backyard and that may be a factor.

 

I suspect also that wireless errors are much more disruptive when communicating with a telescope mount than when web browsing.

 

EDIT: I do wonder if the fault tolerance & error recovery in the Celestron Apps and CPWI are robust enough to cope with the WiFi environment that some of us have to live with.

Edited by Rac19, 02 June 2024 - 07:26 PM.

[josh@]

Hi Mark,

 

Thanks so much for warning me about hot-plugging. I won't do it again. Hopefully I haven't already destroyed anything.

 

What is the "extra app" you mentioned? Surely it isn't Communication Bridge Pro, which is a necessary component in the Bluetooth link.

 

I will download SkyPortal, but I've been using SkySafari Pro for many years (with the FireflyBT/SkyBT dongle plugged into the StarSense AutoAlign handbox) so it was natural for me to continue using it.

 

I'll be quite surprised if the issue is "Wrong WiFi mode" in SkySafari. Your documentation says to use Direct Connect for HBG3-as-access-point (1.2.3.4) and to use Access Point for an external DHCP router (red switch up) or for Bluetooth (red switch down). That's what I've been doing.

 

I'll download SkyPortal and get back to you.

 

Thanks,

 

Josh

 

First off, hot-plugging stuff as described above is a great way to kill your SSAA accessory and anything else connected, including the mount itself.  DO NOT EVER DO THAT!!!

 

Now, because of the extra app, bluetooth may be trickier to figure out than straight WiFi Direct Connect.  So start with Direct Connect WiFi, and don't bother with Bluetooth until you learn to use the WiFi.

 

The issue with establishing a connection is almost always the "wrong WiFi mode" selected in SkyPortal.  Yes, the SkyPortal app, NOT SkySafari.  Again, you are a beginner, so start with the app that is easiest to get working, which is SkyPortal not any other version of SkySafari!!  I'm not a beginner, but I still also use/prefer SkyPortal.

 

So in the app, one has to specify either "Direct Connect" or "Access Point" mode.  For the easy way to get going, use Direct Connect WiFi.  Later, once that has been mastered, only THEN think about using BlueTooth.  One of the differences with Bluetooth, is one must ALWAYS specify "Access Point" mode in the app.  So do that in SkyPortal.  Only once you have mastered THAT (2nd level of mastery!), think about a version of SkySafari if you must.

[josh@]

Hello again. I downloaded SkyPortal, but regrettably its behavior is essentially identical to SkySafari Plus 6. Whether via Wi-Fi / Direct Connect or Bluetooth / Access Point, I can reliably connect only if the SSAA is not plugged in (to Aux2), and I cannot connect at all if it is. In all 4 cases, nothing was plugged into the hand controller port. The connection fails after several seconds with this error (same error whether WiFi/Direct or Bluetooth/AP):

 

 

I double-checked that the I can still use the scope with the SSAA with the handbox: it works fine (whether or not the HBG3 is plugged in).

 

So I'm back to square one. Perhaps there is some incompatibility between my phone (Pixel 6a) and some aspect of the system? I'd be more than willing to do some more advanced debugging (e.g., gathering trace data or running with some special setup) if you tell me what to do. Alternatively, I could try using some other Android device (such as my wife's One Plus 8) to see if it behaves differently. FWIW, both the AVX motor board and the SSAA have the latest firmware. And on the bright side, this issue is absolutely repeatable: I simply can't connect SkyPortal / SkySafari to HBG3 with the SSAA attached to the AVX.

 

First off, hot-plugging stuff as described above is a great way to kill your SSAA accessory and anything else connected, including the mount itself.  DO NOT EVER DO THAT!!!

 

Now, because of the extra app, bluetooth may be trickier to figure out than straight WiFi Direct Connect.  So start with Direct Connect WiFi, and don't bother with Bluetooth until you learn to use the WiFi.

 

The issue with establishing a connection is almost always the "wrong WiFi mode" selected in SkyPortal.  Yes, the SkyPortal app, NOT SkySafari.  Again, you are a beginner, so start with the app that is easiest to get working, which is SkyPortal not any other version of SkySafari!!  I'm not a beginner, but I still also use/prefer SkyPortal.

 

So in the app, one has to specify either "Direct Connect" or "Access Point" mode.  For the easy way to get going, use Direct Connect WiFi.  Later, once that has been mastered, only THEN think about using BlueTooth.  One of the differences with Bluetooth, is one must ALWAYS specify "Access Point" mode in the app.  So do that in SkyPortal.  Only once you have mastered THAT (2nd level of mastery!), think about a version of SkySafari if you must.

 

 

[mlord]

I can reliably connect only if the SSAA is not plugged in (to Aux2), and I cannot connect at all if it is.

That is new information.  Earlier you described it as very unreliable, here:

 

It doesn't always work right away, but if I try it repeatedly, it works eventually.

So.. which is it?  Details matter here.  Thanks.

 

Is connecting/using Direct Connect in SkyPortal close to 100% reliable without SSAA plugged in?

And is connecting WITH SSAA plugged in just about 0% reliable?

 

There are many reports here of the AVX having issues with a Celestron hand-controller connected, when that hand-controller has the latest firmware from Celestron installed.  And also several reports of SSAG (and also SSAA?) causing issues like you are describing for the AVX.

 

So let's get back to basics.  When you power on the mount, with the HBG3 and SSAA each plugged in, do you get the THREE BLUE BLINKS from the HBG3?  Those tell us that things are working (or not).

 

Thanks

Edited by mlord, 03 June 2024 - 09:48 AM.

[CraigB1960]

I know I had a lot of disconnects and tracking issues with my CPC-1100 mount using the Celestron's WiFi module and SSAG with the Hand Controller connected (Nextstar + at latest firmware).  It was not until I stopped connecting the HC did it get very stable.  This was the main reason I went with the HBG3; for the features of having the Nunchuck support that allows mount and focuser controller.  Totally eliminates the need for the HC when using either SkyPortal, SkySafari Pro, or CPWI.

 

In fact, it is a super clean setup now, with one cable running up to the scope connecting to the HBG3 and then the SSAG and Focus Motor connected to the Relay board on the HBG3.  I let the Nunchuck dangle down for focus and mount movement if needed.

[josh@]

Hi Mark,

 

When I said "It doesn't always work right away, but if I try it repeatedly, it works eventually," it was in the context of my hot-plugging workaround to connect both the HBG3 (in Aux1) and the SSAA (in Aux2). Sorry if this wasn't clear.

 

When I power up the scope, the HBG3 always displays the 3 blue blinks.

 

Connecting Direct Connect (or Bluetooth/AP) in SkyPortal (or SkySafari 6) is close to 100% reliable without the SSAA plugged in. As for reliability once connected, I suspect it's fine using Direct-Connect/WiFi, but not AP/Bluetooth. That said, I haven't tried the experiment yet. (The only long HBG3 session I had was over bluetooth with SSAA plugged in using the hot-plugging workaorund that I'll never use again.)

 

Connecting WITH SSAA plugged in is just about 0% reliable. (The error message is shown in my previous post.) This is true whether WiFi/Direct-Connect or Bluetooth/AP, SkyPortal or SkySafari Plus 6. (The behavior is the same in all four cases; I simply can't connect with the SSAA and HBG3 both plugged in.)

 

As previously mentioned, I'm not plugging anything into the HC (hand controller) port, and I'm running the client app on a Pixel 6a. FWIW, I have Rev E of the AVX "motor board." I don't know what version of the SSAA I have, or if multiple versions exist. I bought it in 2015 (so its handbox has an RJ jack rather than USB). Both the AVX mount and the SSAA have the latest firmware from Celestron).

 

Thanks,

 

Josh

 

 

That is new information.  Earlier you described it as very unreliable, here:

 

So.. which is it?  Details matter here.  Thanks.

 

Is connecting/using Direct Connect in SkyPortal close to 100% reliable without SSAA plugged in?

And is connecting WITH SSAA plugged in just about 0% reliable?

 

There are many reports here of the AVX having issues with a Celestron hand-controller connected, when that hand-controller has the latest firmware from Celestron installed.  And also several reports of SSAG (and also SSAA?) causing issues like you are describing for the AVX.

 

So let's get back to basics.  When you power on the mount, with the HBG3 and SSAA each plugged in, do you get the THREE BLUE BLINKS from the HBG3?  Those tell us that things are working (or not).

 

Thanks

[mlord]

Okay, good.  So, finish up with the tests thus far when you have a chance, and post the findings here.

THEN, AFTER doing all of that, proceed to this:

1. Connect both the HBG3 and SSAA camera to the mount.
2. Connect the HBG3 to a computer, with a Serial Monitor program running on the USB/Serial link (115200).
3. Hit ENTER.
4. Type the letter v and hit ENTER again.  It should respond with verbose=1
5. Power on the mount, wait 45-seconds for the SSAA to "boot".
6. Connect to the HBG3's SSID (Direct Connect) over WiFi.
7. Start the SkyPortal app, and hit CONNECT in the app.
8. Wait for it to finish failing.
9. Capture everything from the Serial Monitor and show it to me.

Thanks